New Santana Album "Africa Speaks"

Without dynamics there is no music. If you can tolerate flatlined recordings more power to you.

I'm with you my friend.

I am into dynamic range as much as the next person, likely more so. However, it is unfortunate, that many listeners who spend a considerable amount of money on audio gear ( my definition of an audiophile ), listen to recordings, putting the musical content, 2nd. If the sonics are not great, many listeners I know, will not play it. Coming from a live, un-amplified music background, the majority of recordings suffer from compression, over equalization, and so on. The recordings we buy, stream, whatever, will never be, anything like the real thing. However, I can still enjoy it all, because I put first, the musicianship, the artistry of the writing, of a piece of music, the arrangement, which is the ability, of putting it all together. This is a nice addition to my Santana catalog, and he, as far as I am concerned, has still " got it ".

Money walks, nobody talks. 

And I don’t have a spot in the small chorale mobile rack for a compressor, nor would I want one there.... but there are limits to tape and a killer A2D has far better undistorted dynamic range.

Compression for radio is just capitalism at work. So now you are pissed at the very God you pray to ?

some of us actually own compression tools and use them - with a light and deft touch, unless the artist and producer wants the heavy hand. Not normally at a small studio for economics.

also, for the vinyl freaks and RtR fans there  are many forms of compression, so intentional some not.

of course the same cuts at 33 vs 45 sound different- wonder why ?????

The title of the album is "Africa Speaks" and I didn't hear Africa Speak; Buika is Spanish, that's where she was born, and she's speaking Spanish not Swahili.

I still like Santana's guitar, it was varied enough for me; but since it had Africa in the title, the album needed more African hot sauce. Maybe he should have borrowed Blakey's drummers;


        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahBlJTNd8Xk&list=PLyHn3f7-9IUKa7Q8_Ja8H-WyX0brISR-U


      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6u5WZpSc38g&list=PLyHn3f7-9IUKa7Q8_Ja8H-WyX0brISR-U&index=2


        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tep3zOnZZc8&list=PLyHn3f7-9IUKa7Q8_Ja8H-WyX0brISR-U&index=3

OK.

Incoherent because, FOR ME, the problems with that Santana recording are not the compression. That is not what makes the music, FOR ME, much less successful than recordings such as “Abraxas”. Sure, it would sound better if it had not been compressed so much....a little. But, it would still lack memorable melodies and the excitement of “Abraxas” which was the result of its place in time. And, it would still have Santana guitar solos which, TO ME, have sounded too similar for quite some time....been there, done that, kind of vibe. I like some of his “musician of the universe” vibe infused music, but I just don’t think that this music works all that well.

The net level of dynamic compression that is the result of listening to an uncompressed recording in most car radio environments and the resulting negative impact on the music are, in my experience, no less than that experienced when listening to a more compressed recording on a high end system. That is not the make or break aspect of the total listening experience for me.

To answer your second question, sorry to answer it with another question: So, are you suggesting that you don’t get the “artist’s message” listening to a great tune while listening on your car radio where the net level of dynamic compression is also high?

Especially when they attempt musical analysis and philosophize about musical matters in incoherent ways; then, go on to focus on the after-the-fact “compression” of the music which is a production value and ultimately has little to do with the artistic merit of the artist’s message.

Two questions: 

1) Incoherent? Where? 

2) The artists message. Where is this message? Other than in the compressed music. Please explain.

That’s probably one of them old wives tales. If it doesn’t make sense it’s probably not true. They used to use 45s for AirPlay, who knows what they use now, a digital file I assume?

I had an interesting conversation with a friend, who is knowledgable in the recording arts. Have you ever noticed that on so many LPs, the first cut has inferior sound to the rest of the record, which may actually be really good? My friend tells me that it is because that first cut is compressed to smithereens because it was intended for radio play. 

Abraxas is amazing.

Frank

Especially when they attempt musical analysis and philosophize about musical matters in incoherent ways; then, go on to focus on the after-the-fact “compression” of the music which is a production value and ultimately has little to do with the artistic merit of the artist’s message.  Don’t think I would enjoy this recording the same way, but I enjoyed “Abraxas” on my Ford Capri’s crappy radio more times than I can remember.

Wow -
“circling the drain” for sure
More like down the drain.
It’s quite astonishing how enlightened some folks are.

I heard him in Vegas at House of Blues last January and really enjoyed it and then again at The Woodlands outdoor amphitheater and enjoyed The Doobie Brothers more that opened for them there.
I think I received the Africa Speaks as a “freebie” with tickets purchased.
Didn’t make it through a complete song is all I’ll say.
Maybe another spin is in order or maybe the drastic DR had something to do with it.
Chris

Looks like we found somebody with a bigger ego than Carlos....

Sorry I asked.

LMFAO
Made my night after a bad day!
Thanks so much!

Sorry I asked.

Looks like we found somebody with a bigger ego than Carlos....

Orpheus10, apparently not following his own thread asks:

"Seriously, no one even thinks to comment on the way a once great talent completely sold out to the dark side? On an audiophile site? Circling the drain, we are."
Millercarbon, could you expand, and expound on that statement; I didn’t understand what you meant?

The reason I say "apparently not following his own thread" is a couple others besides me have made the same point. You missed it, and may regret asking, but I am more than happy to expand and expound. 

Ever stop to ask yourself what exactly it is about the very best music that makes it the very best music? Maybe you have. Then again maybe not. Even if you have though I bet the one idea that never came to mind was it walks the thin line between order and chaos.

Order, because there’s rhythm. But nobody wants to hear a metronome, so we introduce a little chaos. Change it up a little. Syncopation. Tempo. Whatever. Melody, we repeat but just enough, not too much. So we have a chorus, see? Neil Diamond comes along, what is so freaking good about Done Too Soon? Its a unique song structure unlike any other. Go on, listen, you will see.

Got it? No? Dynamics. Volume. Even the best melody, most fascinating lyrics, you name it, nobody is gonna want to listen if it just drones on and on and on never varying in volume. That is not even music then. Its noise.

Which brings us to Santana. Check it out. http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list?artist=Santana&album=Africa+speaks What this is telling you is they compressed the hell out of it. (And notice, the LP compressed less than CD- and I thought records lacked dynamic range? So much for that old trope!)

Abraxas is famously good music. Was listening to it just the other night. One can’t hear this on my system and not feel Santana’s mastery over the power in that electric guitar as he takes a note from barely audible to skull searing and back again so fast you’re like did that really happen? Compare that to Supernatural or Africa, where the whole damn album from track to track every millisecond is just skull searing loud. Noise. Not music. Noise. What you have when you compress it this much. Abomination. 

Why? Now we get to the sell out. A lot of music is still played on car radios and other formats where people are doing lots of distracting stuff while absent mindedly searching and randomly switching for something cool to go in the background. Pretty much the opposite of what audiophiles do, which is why its so dismally circling the drain that hardly anyone here gets this and I have to expand and expound on what ought to be manifestly evident. Because Carlos Santana gave in to the dark side, let the producers compress his music into noise, all to get the fleeting attention of the short attention span crowd in order to sell them a few more copies of noise.

Well, you asked. So there you go.

Its pretty good but not really that new?
I streamed this on Qobuz last year?
It was refreshing compared to some of his later previous works but I do not think the recording itself is that great SQ wise.
Cant say as it will ever replace Moonflower as my top Santana album though.

After receiving the CD and listening to it a couple of times I can truly say that I'm in no hurry to play it again. Too much repetition and in your face for me.

Giving it another listen now, it is nice music but as others note does suffer from compression and dynamic loss. I don't need everything in my face so to speak.I do love the first 3 Santana Lp's.

Thank you for your comments Frogman.

Come now, the OP did ask “What do you think?”. What do I think?

I like Santana. Soulful guitar player with a distinctive sound even if, as a soloist, he strikes me as a bit of a one trick pony. I like some of his “citizen of the world” musical conceptualizations, but some of these don’t quite work for me and they strike me as both a little forced and a little “lite”. I agree with Chazro, and his Buika clip is a good example of something that pushes a lot of the same buttons conceptually; but, for me, is more successful.

Thanks for posting, OP; always good to keep up with certain artists whose latest efforts I would not have heard otherwise.

It surprises me (maybe it shouldn’t) when a simple post about something someone likes seems to bring out the “Get off my Lawn”
type of responses. 

"Seriously, no one even thinks to comment on the way a once great talent completely sold out to the dark side? On an audiophile site? Circling the drain, we are."


Millercarbon, could you expand, and expound on that statement; I didn't understand what you meant?

I listened thru Tidal. Nice with some fire and groove in spots. Not the last word in dynamics if that is all one looks for. Some great interplay for sure.

multiple negative comments on a recording never heard is small minded reverb

All I can say is WOW! 😳 

http://dr.loudness-war.info/album/list?artist=Santana&album=Africa+speaks

millercarbon ...

• "Until and unless someone trustworthy tells me Santana has stopped compressing their music to death ..."

Agreed ... This is the problem with so many recordings recommended on this and other audiophile sites. In my opinion, compression and artificial digital reverb is the ruination of commercially released recordings these days.

I do understand what people like about recordings that are drenched in artificial reverb. It makes the sound stage sound larger, but to me, it sounds as though the music is coming out of a cave. Totally artificial sound. Live music doesn't sound like that.

Frank

It seems that everyone is comparing Santana to their last favorite Santana going all the way back to "Woodstock"; that was 50 years ago, how much have you changed since Woodstock?

I've followed Santana all along since then, I understand how he's developed his universal global philosophy; he doesn't consider himself a citizen of any country, but a person in harmony with all mankind. That's in strong contrast to most people.

At the time of "Abraxas" I was into Abraxas; at this time, I'm into "Africa Speaks"; the album is quite apparent and speaks for itself; some people like chocolate while others like vanilla, that's the nature of music.

For the more discerning music-lover, Buika's the real deal!  If you can, try to follow master drummer Dafnis Prieto, prepare for lift-off!!!;)

https://youtu.be/sf0sf2VpDSI

@millercarbon

With all due respect, I must say you may be overthinking this one. Abraxas is one of the all time greats, I agree, The new one is worth a listen at the very least.

Why is it titled 'Africa Speaks'?

Cheers

Until and unless someone trustworthy tells me Santana has stopped compressing their music to death and gone back to the days of dynamically interesting albums like Abraxas, I will take a pass.

The closest anyone above comes is, "Don’t know why, but Africa Speaks took me right back to 1967." But that could mean anything.

Seriously, no one even thinks to comment on the way a once great talent completely sold out to the dark side? On an audiophile site? Circling the drain, we are.

After sampling this on A'zon I'll pass. Thanks for posting though - always looking for more good music.

Nothing can ever beat anything from Woodstock for those who were in a "Woodstock frame of mind" at that time. Since I'm one of those individuals, I simply shove that comparison aside.

This is Santana's best ever; it has the maturity and vision that comes with age and wisdom. The more you listen, the better it gets. That statement is applicable for those who speak Santana's language and know where he's coming from.

I like it and will pick a copy up ;-)

It’s hard to beat Soul Sacrifice at Woodstock.

https://youtu.be/AqZceAQSJvc

I like it. Not as much as the first three albums but I like it.

The first time I listed to Africa Speaks, I had a very strange reaction. The music is incredible. The energy and feeling is incredible. My reaction was this: it took me back to the first time I heard Axis Bold as Love. It isn’t like Axis, it just took me back to how I felt when I discovered that album.  Don’t know why, but Africa Speaks took me right back to 1967. It was like an involuntary memory, like remembrance of things past. No other music has ever done that. Powerful. 

Pretty powerful music. Not the pop sounding stuff that put him
in the public eye a few years ago. I went to the gym a month ago with this playing on my headphones, let’s just say I got a great workout. I thought to myself wow Carlos is back! 

Good album. Santana sounds reenergized. It probably doesn’t hurt that the amazing drummer is his wife.