My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!
So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series NAD M25 PARASOUND HALO PARASOUND CLASSIC KRELL TAS KRELL KAV 500 KRELL CHORUS ROTEL RMB 1095 CLASSE CT 5300 CLASSE CA 2200 CLASSE CA 5200 MCINTOSH MC 205 CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7 OUTLAW AUDIO 755 LEXICON RX7 PASS LABS XA 30.8 BUTLER AUDIO 5150 ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer. My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes) Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp. Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either. Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
Hey Jay, 2 questions 1. Do you like the m900u better than X250.8 ? 2. Have you heard about these coda amps from california? The No. 8 and No.16 reviewed by terry london. Apparently some people like them more than pass XA60.8 and X250.8.
Dgu, which ones were ugly? Then I think the Tekton’s look good, so maybe I’m not the best judge. Smo, there’s always someone who likes something better than something else, lol.
WC, this will be harsh. Your post from yesterday, 7/9, at 7:34 pm, really turned me off. You showed me, again, that you do not respect anyone else, especially those who have experiences in this field, way before you were born. You feel, buying expensive gear, connecting it, giving opinions, is something mystical or magical. You require an audience, for whatever reasons, likely from your childhood. You recently discovered SRV's " Tin Pan Alley ", and Nils Lofgren's " Keith Don't Go ", as, these recordings have been around for years, and used extensively, at audio shows, worldwide. Racks, stands, fuses, cables, have all been around for years, as well. You are still learning, which you have admitted, but at the same time, you make yourself out, to be this " higher listener ", with this hobby. I do not learn a thing from you, but do find it all, entertaining, and I do not know why. I am wondering, if you know what it is, to follow a melody, which is pretty much, the essence, of a piece of music ? How many pairs of speakers will you have set up in your room ( with only one pair connected ), and realize, you are hearing the other speakers, as well ( via the room acoustics ). I will no longer be participating in the discussions, and I do, wish you luck. I also hope, your on line used audio store, becomes a reality, because you seem to be fine obtaining gear, from dealers, at a reduced price, and selling these, for a profit ( maybe not speakers, as you mentioned ). I am not in a wonderful mood, as I write this....someone I knew, has left us, to the virus, and I am upset, living in Florida, the idiocy, of people, our governor, and yes, our president. I apologize......If I were not emotional, I would have sent this via a private message. But like you, I suppose, at this time, I needed an audience. Be well, stay safe, love you daughter, as much as you can, and, Enjoy ! Always, MrD.
@mrdecibel Thank you for your advice. I am sorry about your recent loss. I also lost a good friend a few weeks ago. Not easy. No need to go anywhere fyi. We can agree to disagree on certain things but that doesn't make this less of an interesting conversation. I don't believe we even see eye to eye with our spouses or kids :) so I appreciate your feedback.
Hey Kudos for trying those speakers. Excited to hear how they burn in.
The initial sluggishness I heard must have been due to placement because these definitely should not be sluggish. Or maybe bc DAW right behind them. If anything, their quickness is often regarded as their best feature.
I’m much more interested in seeing how these evolve than some of the other guesses that were floated. Good choice.
I have a suggestion. Try the Merrill’s with these. I have heard this exact speaker sound really fantastic with bel canto black class d. I bet the Merrill’s would do same. These babies need monoblocks!!
He will be back. There is no need to leave a fallen man behind no matter what. This hobby should be uniting all of us at least virtually since we can't physically. It should be to keep us talking and engaged and not to make us be more apart than what we already are due to this pandemic.
I realize this’ll probably never happen but you might consider keeping both the DAW and the 3.7i long term as references at wildly different price points, assuming you can get the 3.7i to come around to your liking. Reason I’m now changing my tune now knowing what it is is bc I’ve heard this speaker sound really damn good (albeit with $50k amps and a top Rel sub). But you won’t get there without a sub I’m afraid.
Congratulations on getting the Maggies. My 1st audiophile speaker in 1978 was the Tympani 1D--talk about huge soundstages. I have heard the 3 series--3, 3A, 3.3, 3.5, 3.6. The 5 foot tall 1/4 inch ribbon tweeter is probably the best tweeter in the world for HF extension and smoothness--you will love it. The main problem with these tall wide panels is that the midrange and bass panels are not as fast as the tweeter, so integration has always been a problem with the Maggies. Images are bloated and lack focus. To improve focus and clarity, I suggest using the tweeters on the inside. Toe-in the speakers so the midpoint of the large panels is facing you. The narrow tweeter has excellent dispersion, but the much wider large panels have much less dispersion, so toe-in is needed. Allow many feet between the outer edge to the side walls, and at least 8 feet from your front wall to get maximum spaciousness and detail. With your Neolith you learned the importance of providing more distance from all walls. Fortunately, your room is fairly wide so you can do this. This speaker really needs a larger room to be at its best. Perhaps reverse the speakers so the tweeters are on the outside and move the panels closer together, to keep the large panels away from the side walls as far as possible. This will tighten up the bass and maybe provide better integration with more coherence. Inches really matter, so panel placement is more critical than with dynamic speakers.
Many years ago, I heard the original 3 and model 20. The 20 was the first model to have the ribbon midrange, compared to the planar magnetic midrange of the 3, so I awaited this with eager anticipation. But the 20 was too big for the room, and it sounded bass heavy and rolled off in HF, so I much preferred the smaller 3, which was still pretty tall and wide. If you find that even this 3.7i overwhelms your room, try the small LRS for merely $650 retail. It still is substantially sized, and will present a moderate sized image. I haven’t heard it yet. Don’t laugh at its cheap price.
But for your ultimate speaker, I think you would enjoy the GTA. I know you said a while ago that you wanted to try panels, so this 3.7i is a good move. But the GTA version I heard 2-3 years ago is superior to any Maggie I have heard, and Steve tells me that the latest version is far better. It is more room friendly because it is narrower than the Maggies. You don’t absolutely need subwoofers, if you can accept the Maggies’ 32 Hz, and the GTA’s 40 Hz. Since speakers are hard to sell without losses, I would settle down with GTA and have your fun with sources, stands, electronics and cables.
Maggie's need time to loosen up and stretch, like sprinters, before they get into 5th gear. With the right amplification, they will sing. They are bass deficient so depending on your room and tastes, 2 or more subs will be required.
I look forward to seeing what will be a synergistic amp match. They are pickier about amplifiers than your average bear. Though with the quality of amps you play with, maybe not so much.
Thanks Viber 6 for your comments. I have extended an open invitation to Jay to audition the new Reference 3 GT Audioworks once they are delivered and set up at our showroom.There are huge differences in the GT’s vs. any other planars or ESL. specifically, the membrane in the GT’s don’t exhibit resonance like a conventional planar driver as most speaker companies rely solely upon Kapton or mylar. The GT membrane is a proprietary membrane that is not comprised of just mylar or Kapton. Additionally, it unlike all others Does not possess a transparency Robbing crossover on the main planar drivers, pure copper traces and A lot more anti-vibration technology not only surrounding the drivers but the actual main frame itself. it is also important to note that based on the room - many of our customers can start out with only 2-12 inch subwoofers per side and gradually add on additional subwoofers if they so desire or move to a bigger room.
Those Maggies look about as good as any I’ve seen. Still hideous, but who cares if you’ve got the dedicated room and can do what you want without your better half vetoing things. In my search I considered those 3.7i but ended up going with Spendor.
Since we’re all making recommendations, Spendor D9.2, msrp $11.5k, iconic British brand, 100% in-house design (all drivers including tweeter, crossovers, cabinet, etc, all developed and produced in house). Baby bro D7 spent 5 yrs Stereophile Recommended Components class A while Wilson Yvette class B.
Yeah, Spendor D9.2 should be your next “budget” speaker!! (If you decide to get on a speaker roll)
Ps: with these maggies,, 80db of efficiency, the gryphon pretty much put the dag Momentum s250 to bed...it was not even close to say the least how both amps behaved. The gryphon lit up the Maggie’s like a Christmas tree.. mephisto Monos...hmmm ugh
WC, great video and you described all pro's and cons of each amplifier very well. i agree with you on almost all of them but one. I agree with your comparisons about sweetness, dynamics , neutrality etc. but i beg to differ on your description calling one amp musical and not the other. what exactly musical is? true to source, true to timber.? defining musicality and the term musical can be very wide open and subjective as well.
Musical/smooth/sweet- amp you can’t change its dna no matter what other components you buy. It will always sound this way. You can use a lamp cord as a powercord and it will still sound the same.
As far as coda Amplifiers: not on my radar so far but it doesn’t mean it won’t be.
900u amplifier: I prefer it over the 350.8 or 250.8. Sounds more refined to me.
The common audiophile definition of "musical" is sweet, slightly rolled off sound which makes the music more pleasant to listen to. However, the literal definition is "revealing all of the music." The latter is what I want. Some parts of live music are startling and even unpleasant, like the sharp bursts of trumpets, HF triangle percussion, etc. These startling qualities must be revealed fully by the audio system in order to have the feeling of live music. The startle factor never crosses the boundary into distortion/harshness either in live music or the ideal system. To avoid harshness, keep the volume sane--realistically loud if appropriate but not blasting. Even if the system is musically perfect at realistic natural levels, it is not musical when blasting. Don't use sweet electronics so you can blast volumes--2 ways you kill off the true musical information via sweetness and blasting.
WC, you said, "Musical/smooth/sweet- amp you can’t change its dna no matter what other components you buy. It will always sound this way." I agree 90% with this, But your next sentence, "You can use a lamp cord as a powercord and it will still sound the same" I differ a little. My experience is that large diameter speaker cables, and Nordost Frey 2 speaker cable made the sound heavy and veiled compared to lamp cord. Still, back to my lamp cord, I rejected many amps which sounded sweet and rolled off.
Nobody would use a lamp cord with a luxman 900u. It was a figurative speech meant to simply show how strong I feel about the DNA of sweet sounding amplifiers...
I am one of the people that started people modding maggies back in the late 90s. They needed a lot of help then and still need much help now (tho they are using some better parts now).
The frame is terrible. Simply flimsy.....one of the reasons for the lack of snap and drive in the bass. You HAVE to have a superior frame or you will never be fully satisfied with them. Even with a massive dead frame it would still probably be best to brace the speaker to the ceiling. A friend did that with his Acoustats and the bass was like massive and killer.
The grill cloth veils the sound, the fuses wreck the sound (don’t need no stinkin fuse!), the input Jacks ruin the sound, the xover parts are good but nothing special, the wire is junk.
Basically, you want a total rebuild. Massive damped frame, no grill cloths, state of the art xover hardwired with state of the art wire to the drivers and the xover would be separate from the speaker and mounted so it is isolated from the floor. Since you can use my binding post bypass system on the input of the xover.......there would actually be NO connectors whatsoever (every single thing hardwired).
Now you are cooking.
This is why some people are going more and more to single driver high efficiency speakers.....(drivers running full range on open baffle). So simple and so pure. You can even attach your speaker wire directly to the wire coming from the voice coil and eliminate the connector on the speaker. I know 3 people who just ditched their systems (one quad amped, one biamped and one person got rid of his GR Research Xotica speaker) and they are all now using the 15 inch Lii Speaker on an open baffle with nothing else. Yes, you really need subs for bass below 55hz and you can carefully augment on the top end.....but these things have really really good highs and the mids and mid bass are to die for. Right now these 3 guys are so happy with them alone that they have not even added subs they already have. These drivers are $400 a pair plus shipping from China. 97db sensitive.....these are the real deal. Of course, they need at least 300 hours of hard playing to loosen up.
They make a 99 db sensitive 10 inch driver for $1000 a pair that is suppose to be a little cleaner and faster than the 15.....but not as much fun (does not move as much air). My suggestion is use the 15 on a big open baffle and either bi amp it or use a super large gauge iron core coil on it to roll it off around 300 hz.....then I would mount the 10 inch directly above it by its magnet (no baffle what so ever and mounted so the voice coils of both drivers align). The 10 inch mounted this way would naturally roll off around 300 hz......Now you have the speed and clarity from the 10s and the punch and fun of the 15s. Then add your subs underneath. $1500 for all four drivers delivered.......Some wood.....lots of bracing.....two $800 subs......for less than $3500 this would be better than most anything you can buy. Some of you already have subs....so you can start with the 15 inch drivers and after a couple of months of scraping your mouth off the floor.....get the 10s and have even more fun. With speakers like this you do not need high powered amps.....but it would not hurt. You want the cleanest 50 watts on the planet. Many are using the 2 watt Decware amps on them and are very happy. Here is a demo of the 15s mounted on nice baffle and played with 2 watt stereo amp:
His speaker wires are on the floor....bad!!! Who knows about the recording quality or type of cables, etc.....and he is not hardwiring the speaker (the binding post on the speaker is a push in type....and the tab the voice coil wire is soldered to is STEEL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!) So, if you remove the speaker post and especially the steel tab and just soldered the voice coil wire a pure copper mini tab and attached it to the phenolic post holder with some wire ties or whatever....wow! what a difference that would make.....highs much more extended and pure. No one has done this yet but I have told everyone about the steel. Plus, if you add my Ground Enhancers (expensive @ $30 he he) to the ground side of the speaker then the clarity and dynamics would be enhanced more. Anyhoo.....this demo will give you some idea of its potential.....but nothing like what can be done with it. There are other OK videos online using this driver.
Ordered the complete Crystal 10 speakers from Liiaudio 2 months ago. Just waiting for the crates to arrive. Looking forward to their 15 Speakers whenever they go into production.
WC, Seriously, the Luxman M900u amp would sound tighter, less sweet, and faster with lamp cord. No, I haven’t heard the Lux, but with every amp I have used, lamp cord has this tonal character, compared with fat cables or ribbon shape cables like Nordost Frey 2 or Straight Wire I heard. Straight Wire was David Salz’s company before he founded Wireworld. Straight Wire was nice, better in tonal brilliance and detail than many fat cables, but compared to lamp cord it was still sweeter with HF rolloff.
Since you no longer have the Lux, try lamp cord with any other amp you now have. Don’t sneer at lamp cord just because the audio community that loves to spend money and high end dealers who sell expensive wires hate it. You are now seeing the value in modestly priced speakers like the Maggie, and amps like Sim 860A V2, etc. The only negative about lamp (zip) cord is less quantity and fullness of bass, for those who go for that. But the bass is tighter with zip. Spend a dollar, and see for yourself.
Mapleshade’s designer of very thin speaker wires agrees with my sonic observations about the negative sonic qualities of fat speaker cable. A friend sent me some, and it is very close to my #16 zip cord. So you could spend a dollar for zip, or a few hundred bucks for Mapleshade if you still think that the cheapest cannot be superior to higher priced alternatives.
zip cord.......ha ha ha ha ha ha ha......i just love the syrupy sound of PVC and the syrupy sound of stranded pitch copper.....just gives me the chills thinking about it. Goosebumps and everything.....ha ha ha ha.
So your zippy sounding electrostats need syrupy warm non clarity cables? You are all ova da place.
Many many high end speaker wires are many small wires in parallel...essentially what the Nordost is.....a flat cable array with each conductor separated. So you have even smaller gauges than 16 but many of them and made with precision metals and insulators. Zip cord is not even in the same universe as this.
If you look at the cross section of the Platinum 8 speaker wire you can see why it might sound warm.....it has all these arrays of single strand silver but then the bundles are encased in two types of extra insulation. I bet if you cut the top two layers off and just used cotton strings every two inches to hold the arrays together you would have much more open sound. It might sound better again if you laid the arrays out in a flat line like the Nordost is (physically, very hard to do). Usually, less is more.
Hi. Is it an optical illusion that the front of the Maggies looks slightly curved/bowed out? Also, don't they usually have a pair of feet sticking out the front? How are yours supported?
The Lii speakers are not the best in the world.....I am sure the best Cube 10 inch full range drivers are better......you can buy the best versions for around $7K delivered.....then make the box or open baffle augmented on bottom. Read the reviews of the $18K Cube Nenuphar (yes, they charge a lot for a couple of boxes)....nothing but raves.......but for 1K and DIY you are most of the way there with the Lii. For $3K you can have the 10 inch Lii delivered in its big boxes to your door.....flat to 30hz in room....99 db
OK just so I understand. People are judging speakers and amps etc by listening to their own speakers using a low rez source. It boggles the mind. I would guess that brighter sound usually scores on this test. I wonder what HP would have thought. Having fun is a good thing but taking it seriously is something else.
4425, we obviously can’t all travel to jays place, even if he had room for a thousand people, and listen. We make do with what we have, and we have mostly all noted that we obviously are not able to hear everything jay does in his room. Before current technology we would all have to wait for our monthly stereophile subscription to show up in the mail to get our fix in this hobby. I don’t see too many people going at each other like some threads on the forum and everyone seems to enjoy it for the most part. I for one don’t see the harm in any of that, and it allows for some nice conversations. It’s apparent many of us hear different things listening to what we hear, and I enjoy reading other peoples thoughts that differ from mine, and why.
Ricevs, I respect your knowledge about wires, and your track record of modifying things with different wires to get more clarity in the sound. I am not technically competent to understand why zip cord actually sounds clearer, leaner, tighter than most fat speaker cable, despite zip's low quality materials and construction. I read about Nordost's superior construction and materials, but was completely baffled at how the Frey 2 sounded so veiled. There are many pseudoscientific theories from cable designers whose products sound veiled to me. Maybe you can help me understand the technical basis for what I hear. Pierre Sprey of Mapleshade has the same observations of the sound as me, but he doesn't offer any convincing explanations as to why his wires sound the way they do. Have you listened to Mapleshade speaker wires, and zip for yourself?
WC, I have no experience with using 2 bridged mono amps vs the original stereo amp, but your observations on how the Hegel H30 lost sound quality when bridged, makes sense. Bridging uses double the circuitry, so should be expected to sound veiled compared to the stereo which uses less circuitry. But then I don't understand why the Luxman 900u retained the quality when bridged. Maybe there is a difference in how the Hegel and the Luxman are bridged.
I agree with the tips of C Ab about using the Maggies. After break in, don't use the resistors on the tweeter. This tweeter is probably the finest for extension and smoothness, so it would be a shame to reduce its output with the resistor. Many dynamic speakers have crude tweeters which sound harsh, so many people tone them down with resistors or HF controls. There is no need to do this with the Maggie--even grey9hound liked it without knowing it is a Maggie. In the end, your Maggie will give you everything you want in upper midrange and HF--clarity and smoothness. Even if you want to blast off, you will be able to use the most revealing amp to get excitement without fatigue. I do agree that the midrange and lower freq need work, so keep the panels far away from the side walls and closer together than you usually listen, to get best focus and least inflation/bloating of images. Unlike C Ab, I would maximize the distance away from the front wall, 8 feet or more, so they are most away from all walls to simulate the effect of having a huge room. You may have to sit closer to the back wall, which introduces the back wall heavy bass risk. You can see that this involves lots of trade offs, but you will be rewarded.
Bridging uses an amp per phase. The signal path is not longer....you are just using one channel for positive and one for negative....rather than one channel doing both phases. I am sure there are many reasons an amp sounds the way it does when run bridged. Most things in audio are complicated. Simple answers = simple mind. Pure mind is good.....but simple answers to audio questions is usually incorrect.
Just woke up and read this final part of the pass labs xa200.8 review. I REALLY liked how real he was when it comes to break in time, using personal recordings rather than always Audiophile stuff and also calling out manufacturers at shows for not letting him play his music for as long as he wanted. This is one of the very few reviews that really reach out and touch me because he tells it like it is. Kudos to this reviewer:
Ricevs, Thanks for your explanation of bridged. If the R and L channels are absolutely identical mirror images, then the bridged voltage will be 2x the regular, and bridged power will be 4x regular, or 6 dB. But in real life, all the parts are slightly different, so the R and L channels won't be absolutely equal. Then the summed waveform of the bridged will be different from the waveform of either unbridged R or L channel. Suppose there is a 0.1 millisecond delay--then a 10,000 Hz signal will totally cancel out. Other freq will be distorted to different extents. So I think that at best, if R and L channels are perfectly identical, the sound bridged will be equal BUT NOT BETTER in quality to the unbridged. In the real world with slight mismatching, bridged will be inferior. Perhaps when WC found the Luxman to have the same sound quality bridged as unbridged, the R and L channels were perfectly matched, whereas in the Hegel H30 they weren't matched as well.
Most of the time, when the music requires only a few watts, there is probably no benefit in going bridged. There is also the reality that bridged amps are not comfortable at lower impedances, so even if they are capable of much more power into 8 ohms, at low impedances they might sound worse in quality.
"As it played for a minute or two the elder company representative could not contain himself, as he strode over to the system and, removing the disc, declared, “this is garbage! Garbage!” However, the damage had been done— I heard enough in that minute or two to conclude that this was a vastly overpriced and underperforming system."
I am going to go on the record and say that Magnepan is easily one of the best purchases i have made this year. I am right now simply without words to be able to articulate what i am hearing. All i can say is that this tall, wide and dipole design works amazing in my room. I am really blown away in every possible way. I feel like i am doing nearfield listening regardless of how far the speakers are and i LOVE the smoothness, lack of brightness, and lively feeling. I am so looking forward to getting my Merrill Element 118s here since the Merrill Preamp (Christine) is here now. I suspect this Merrill/Magnepan/DCS/Nordost Odin combination will send me into shock. This is just a gut feeing at this time, but 9 times out of 10 when i get this feeling it usually ends up being that way. More surprises to come guys... That is all i can say for now.
Not surprising. They’re really good speakers, especially for the price. When I demo’d them at dealer with bel canto black I was floored by how quick they were, and their tonal balance was right up my alley as well.
Yes, the instant I saw what they were I stopped watching the vid and typed here that the 118’s would be good match - then went back to finish the vid and heard you say you planned to try the 118’s. Thumbs up
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