Machina Dynamica New Dark Matter CD and Blu Ray tray treatment?

Close enough!! A for effort! PM your shipping address. 

And since it’s the nanoparticles doing the work, the color of the nanoparticle impregnated material does not need to be black. Did I win?? Did I win??

To repeat an earlier post of mine, does it rely on surface plasmon resonances for light absorption through the utilization of specific nanoparticles tuned to absorb specific wavelengths or frequency ranges?

There is a threshold for detection. Light signals less than 75% full reflected power will not be detected. This is very good news because it means we don’t have to completely eliminate the background scattered light, just reduce it sufficiently in intensity. Think if the inside of the transport compartment like a light bulb lit up by scattered light. You just want to turn the brightness down a bit.

04-04-2019 9:02pmGeoff wrote:

"When the laser beam is over a “land” the full reflected signal is registered by the photodetector for that short period of time."

Are you certain about that claim, professor? What if it is only 1/3 of the reflected signal? What happens to the remainder 2/3 of the reflected signal?

Thanks, mapman!  I am back!!

Moops, better check the bottle. The expiration date must have expired.

Could be.  

I just took it though.   See ya.   Your remaining captive audience of 1 awaits.....

Moops, did you forget to take your smart pill today? If the scattered light is always in the background then it can get into the photodetector at times when there is supposed to be no light detected, i.e., when the laser beam is over a “pit.” When the laser beam is over a “land” the full reflected signal is registered by the photodetector for that short period of time. Obviously, you don’t want any scattered light to get into the photodetector during periods when there should be no reflected signal. Follow?

It's your product.   Sounds like you don't understand it either.

moopman
BTW, anyone know the actual EM frequency range that sensors used in CD players actually detect? That would be a good start to know what will be most effective in absorbing the light, not that it is likely to matter...

>>>>Yes. I do. Now, see if you can guess what frequency range the CD laser operates at.

moopman
b) Also black matter being black only means it absorbs the light we can see, just like other black things. That alone provides no evidence that either IR or UV wavelengths are absorbed. Even if it was proven to absorb IR, and other black things not, it would not seem to matter given point a).

>>>>You said it was black, not me. 

mapman15,742 posts04-04-2019 8:48pmHere’s another pop quiz. a) Given the speed of light and the small quarters inside a CD player compartment, what difference does it make if the light, regardless of wavelength is scattered or not ? The sensor detects the light at the same time whether scattered, reflected or direct. 

>>>>You’re no fun, Moops. You just answered your own question.

Hmmmm....April 1 was on Monday. Did somebody get a belated memo?

Here’s another pop quiz. a) Given the speed of light and the small quarters inside a CD player compartment, what difference does it make if the light, regardless of wavelength is scattered or not ? The sensor detects the light at the same time whether scattered, reflected or direct.

b) Also black matter being black only means it absorbs the light we can see, just like other black things. That alone provides no evidence that either IR or UV wavelengths are absorbed. Even if it was proven to absorb IR, and other black things not, it would not seem to matter given point a).

BTW water absorbs IR frequencies. You might moisten some white matter, stick it in there, and put black matter to shame.

Not to mention that unless the compartment is totally sealed in material absorbing the laser frequencies, some nasty light might still get reflected!!!! Watch out!!

BTW, anyone know the actual EM frequency range that sensors used in CD players actually detect? That would be a good start to know what will be most effective in absorbing the light, not that it is likely to matter....

BTW rumor also has it windmills cause cancer.   Go Figure!

At least they are for me.

OUTBURSTS ARE CAPITALIZED! ALWAYS!! WITH DOUBLE EXPLANATION POINTS!!

Hey, tweak1, let’s try to keep this civil. These outbursts of yours are not constructive.

Huh? Call me stupid, but I have no idea what you are talking about.

I bought one of these kits, seeing no harm in trying something so inexpensive that had the potential to improve SQ of my system. Not many tweaks can bring about such improvement for the money expended. So the risk/reward ratio is very high. And if one does not find it to "work" to his/her satisfaction, then it’s not a great financial loss.

But any modification that affects signal processing at the very beginning point of a given source is something that should not be ignored. And the inexpensive cost of the kit makes the decision a low-barrier no-brainer.

Ignorance that borders on stupidity never ceases to amaze me, especially in hi-end audio

Arguing against when it is clear noone of those arguing plunked down $40 to see/hear, when there is nothing that cna be purchased to improve hi-end for $40, points to thr futility and stupidity of those who think they have a clue. 

I for one am thankful for Geoff's willingness to struggle on in the face of such abject stupidity  

celander OP1,194 posts04-04-2019 5:57pmBecause black is within the visible light range rather than the invisible light range. The whole point is to remove the invisible reflected light from reaching the photodetector. Or so your white paper claims.

>>>>No, the whole point is that almost all of the CD laser light AND the scattered light is invisible infrared. Only a relatively small percentage is visible (red). That’s why the black tray and the Green Pen are relatively ineffective. NDM removes visible and invisible scattered light. It’s the problem nobody knew about. That’s the whole point.

Mine arrived today, will listen before/after, anticipating something good here.  I have 3 disc spinners (in 3 systems), if I hear what I hope to hear I'll request two more sets.  

In fact, GOSO works as good as, if not better in some CD players, than NDM. Mechanism of action has not been confirmed, either.

Because black is within the visible light range rather than the invisible light range. The whole point is to remove the invisible reflected light from reaching the photodetector. Or so your white paper claims. 

God gave you two ears and one mouth for a reason.

Hey, this game is fun! 🤗

Look at your figure. 

You’re kidding, right?

This is what you said, not me.

”The laser has a different wavelength range than the photodetector, wherein the photodetector can detect both visible and invisible light.”

In any case, you didn’t answer the pop quiz, which is why the color black wouldn’t be just as good as NDM.

Where did I say the laser and the photodetector had different nominal wavelengths? I’m speaking about ranges.

The photodetector must have the ability to detect side-band wavelengths outside the “nominal wavelength.” Otherwise, it could not detect your so-called invisible light. 

You obviously misquoted me.

Only quote facts. 😁

Well, I derived all that from your website. So I guess you are equally far away.

(Deductive reasoning..)

PM me the quiz answer. I’ve shot my wad on this answer. No do-overs. Thanks, Professor. 

Celander is close. Very close. Yet so far. 😁

Hint - If the laser wavelength was different than the photodetector wavelength the whole thing wouldn’t work. Both have nominal wavelength of 780 nm. 

I think it’s called deductive reasoning. Something terribly lacking in most every day discussions.

Has absorption of invisible light by these NDM squares ever been confirmed or it is just a postulate?

Well, given my limited background about how CD players work (as I am sure Geoff can attest given my questions to him via PM), I’ll take a stab at this answer.

The laser has a different wavelength range than the photodetector, wherein the photodetector can detect both visible and invisible light. As a result, the invisible light (UV and IR) is picked up by the photodetector, thereby obscuring the data stream attributed to the visible light. Presumably, this additional light info might not be corrected by the Reed-Solomon error detection/correction codes.

The NDM squares can absorb the invisible light, removing it from being detected by the photodetector. This improves the fidelity of the photodetector in capturing a better ratio of disc-related reflected light to unrelated reflected light, thereby enhancing the photodetector’s resultant signal to noise ratio. 

rpeluso535 posts04-04-2019 2:36pmIts the reflected stray light that these bit are designed/claimed to absorb.

>>>While that’s a true statement as to what NDM is designed/claimed to do it doesn’t answer the question regarding why the color black won’t work just as well.

What method was used to measure/evaluate scattered invisible light inside a working (CD is rotating) CD player before and after application of whatever is being talked about here?

Its the reflected stray light that these bit are designed/claimed to absorb.  

Rather than me explain it how about we make that a pop quiz? Free NDM to the first one to get the right answer. 🤗

"

black

1. (of an object) Absorbing all light and reflecting none; dark and hueless."

GK what makes your Dark Matter better than other black things one might put in there or in some cases of good design are probably already there to start? Every CD tray I recall has been black to start with, so a good start there.....


Just wonderin....

Full disclosure: my previous product that addressed the invisible infrared scattered light was Dark Matter. That’s why I call the new product New Dark Matter. That was the old one. This is the new one. My other product Codename Turquoise addressed the visible red scattered light. There are both. Visible and invisible. The dude whose moniker starts with f had also inquired as to how I capture Dark Matter. I told him I surround it and tell it to come out with its hands up. Was that being too much of a smart a$$?

Out on a limb? I think you mean out on a ledge, don’t you, Moops? Don’t be so gloopy, Moopy.

I’ll go out on a limb here and say of all the Machina Dynamica products out there, the dark matter and springs have the best chance of actually doing something other than playing with your mind. But I must qualify that by saying the MD bar in general is set pretty low.

Also, even for those, if one is impressed, they might try rolling their own and comparing just for kicks or maybe even to save a few bucks.

Also if the MD products do not work, one is only set back 2 or three digits max, not too bad on the grand scale of all things high end audio.

Personally, I will pass. No offense.

I’m glad falconquest opined about Dark Matter, as opposed to Geoff’s product, New Dark Matter. 

Is there an echo in here? 😳

For someone with the name 'quest' in his UN, Im betting you never even tried NDM, but somehow feel entitled to make this comment. I call BS on YOU SIR

Someone here (but I don’t want to mention any names) whose moniker starts with an f PM’ed me asking if NDM was a quantum type product. Gentle readers, that actually is an interesting question, while I admit it does appear somewhat trollish. My answer was, it all depends on how you look at it. Now, I’m not the type of guy who throws the word quantum around frivolously. I Design and Manufacture many products that work quantum mechanically, five or six such products currently at last count. But I digress. Inasmuch as NDM involves absorption of light, both visible and invisible, is probably best described as operating by classical physics. Plus, the CD laser itself is a quantum device, a Quantum well. But the lines between quantum physics and Newtonian physics are getting rather blurry. So, I wouldn’t get too hung up on whether NDM is one or the other. I prefer not to let the Cat 🐈 out of the bag (as it were) as to how NDM works. It’s all very hush hush.

Einstein never really got on board the quantum mechanics train 🚂 God doesn’t roll dice 🎲 🎲 . But he won the Nobel Prize for his early 1905 paper explaining the Photoelectric Effect, including the idea of quantization of light, a precursor to quantum mechanics 🧰. Ironic, huh?

In 1887, Heinrich Hertz[2][3] discovered that electrodes illuminated with ultraviolet light create electric sparks more easily. In 1900, while studying black-body radiation, the German physicist Max Planck suggested that the energy carried by electromagnetic waves could only be released in "packets" of energy. In 1905, Albert Einstein published a paper advancing the hypothesis that light energy is carried in discrete quantized packets to explain experimental data from the photoelectric effect. This model contributed to the development of quantum mechanics. In 1914, Millikan’s experiment supported Einstein’s model of the photoelectric effect. Einstein was awarded the Nobel Prize in 1921 for "his discovery of the law of the photoelectric effect",[4] and Robert Millikan was awarded the Nobel Prize in 1923 for "his work on the elementary charge of electricity and on the photoelectric effect".[5]

Friends?
What are they?
Are they like having fun?
I had fun once......
It was awful......

Hmmm...I need new friends, if not old buddies.