I'm going to review records in my collection, and you'll be able to decide if they're worthy of your collection. These records are what I consider "must haves" for any jazz aficionado, and would be found in their collections. I wont review any record that's not on CD, nor will I review any record if the CD is markedly inferior. Fortunately, I only found 1 case where the CD was markedly inferior to the record.
Our first album is "Moanin" by Art Blakey and The Jazz Messengers. We have Lee Morgan , trumpet; Benney Golson, tenor sax; Bobby Timmons, piano; Jymie merrit, bass; Art Blakey, drums.
The title tune "Moanin" is by Bobby Timmons, it conveys the emotion of the title like no other tune I've ever heard, even better than any words could ever convey. This music pictures a person whose down to his last nickel, and all he can do is "moan".
"Along Came Betty" is a tune by Benny Golson, it reminds me of a Betty I once knew. She was gorgeous with a jazzy personality, and she moved smooth and easy, just like this tune. Somebody find me a time machine! Maybe you knew a Betty.
While the rest of the music is just fine, those are my favorite tunes. Why don't you share your, "must have" jazz albums with us.
@stuartk @audio-b-dog , re Coleman Hawkins “Body and Soul” and Coltrane “My Favorite Things” and “virtuosity”.
Virtuosity is not an easy thing to define, in this case are we talking about technical virtuosity, or conceptual virtuosity, specifically virtuosity of harmonic understanding? While it is generally acknowledged that Hawkins influenced Coltrane, to compare Hawkins to Coltrane is an interesting, but ultimately pointless comparison if the goal is to establish some sort of superiority one way or another.
Jazz, all art, is evolutionary. The grasp of harmony by most players of Hawkins’ era was, compared to that in Coltrane’s time, pretty rudimentary. Bebop (post Swing) took matters to another level as concerns sophistication in the use of harmony. The following two past posts are from a conversation here on this very subject:
Coleman Hawkins ("Bean"); fantastic player. His 1939 solo on "Body And Soul" is considered pivotal in jazz and one which took improvisation in an entirely new direction away from the comfortable linear style of the swing era to a more modern angular style that just about every modern player would be influenced by. Btw, the album title "Beanbags" is a combination of Hawkins’ moniker "Bean" with that of co-leader Milt Jackson’s "Bags".
The importance of Coleman Hawkins cannot be overstated. His solo on his classic recording of "Body And Soul" is one of those solos (Coltrane’s solo on "Giant Steps" is another) that young jazz saxophone players study. It literally changed the landscape of the music. The traditionalists criticized that solo (andBean’s improvising, in general) as having a lot of "wrong notes". He was one of the first players that reached beyond the very "inside" colors of the harmonies. The truth is that most players at the time simply could not navigate the harmonic complexity of a tune like "Body And Soul" and would not make all the changes; instead, they "generalized" the harmonic changes as opposed to clearly outlining each and every harmony as Hawkins did. Houston Person on "Moonlight In Vermont" is an example of this "generalization" and not making all the changes. One thing is being able to play over a blues with a nice comfortable, predictable, and sparse harmonic progression; another is being able to navigate a tune with up to four harmonic changes per measure (one per beat) and still make musical sense. Hawkins was one of the first that could do that.
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While Hawkin’s solo was groundbreaking, his command of harmony was still not on the level of Coltrane’s. Hawkins is considered by some to be the first Bebop player. Coltrane’s grasp of harmony exemplifies where the evolution of Jazz was at after having gone from Bebop to Hard Bop and then beyond. So, from a conceptual standpoint Coltrane was on another level entirely. If “virtuosity” is to be defined by extreme instrumental/technical proficiency, while Hawkins was certainly a great instrumentalist, again, Coltrane was on another level entirely. Not only are his note choices in an improvisation very sophisticated in that he could play “outside” the harmony in a logical/musical way in a more sophisticated way than did Hawkins, he tested the boundaries of what was technically possible on the saxophone to a much higher degree than Hawkins did. We’re not talking only about the ability to play fast, but the ability to coax a wider palette of tonal colors; not only harmonic color, but in the timbre/tone of his sound. Hawkins stayed pretty much inside the harmonic parameters of the chord changes of a tune. Coltrane extended the parameters of the traditional use of harmony. This is in no way a criticism of Hawkins, but simply the reality of where these considerations were at in the evolution of the art. Two+ decades separate the two solos; an eternity in the evolutionary process of Jazz at the time. Hawkins was a pivotal figure in Jazz, as was Coltrane.
I have trouble with the notion of judging “soul” or level of soulfulness of any art without considering the unique and personal sensibilities of each of us as listeners (in this case) and without considering the context of the era of the creation of the art. I’m not prepared to deem one more “soulful” than the other, Remember, when Coltrane first came on the scene and players of Hawkins’s generation heard his tone and style of playing more than a few felt it was just noise. They, and Jazz in general had to catch up.
Thanks for a deeper explanation of Coleman Hawkins and John Coltrane. When I heard Hawkins playing "Body and Soul" on the Jazz series, especially with Wynton Marsalis's introduction, it blew me away. I thought it was absolutely beautiful.It's the first time I was able to get into a jazz artist from his period. I grew up on Coltrane and Davis.
Hello everyone its been a long time. I hope everyone is well. I was listening to A Love Supreme and thought about this thread and everyone posting.
Elvin Jones' 1:31 solo at the beginning of "Pursuance" is one of the greatest openings of any jazz song.
I signed in and clicked "last" and noticed Frogman's excellent virtuosity post at the top and eagerly read it very slowly. Another awesome educational frog post!
Speaking of virtuosity, and wrapping my head (trying!) around frogs post, I thought of this 1957 album by Johnny Griffen titled "A Blowin' Session featuring Griffin, Hank Mobley and yes, John Coltrane. This was one of Coltrane's first sessions after he conquered his heroin and other addictions.
The first song titled "The Way You Look Tonight" is definitely Griffin on the first extended solo and he is as fast as anyone before him and after him but speed, if I am understanding frogs post, is not the only thing virtuosity implies.
I was wondering frogman, when you have the spare time, to give this album a listen and tell us which of the solo(s), after Griffen's opening, are Coltrane's on "The Way You Look Tonight".
And if you have the time, point out Coltrane's entry into the other 3 songs - "Ball Bearing", "All The Things You Are" and "Smokestack".
I think on the first song, "The Way You Look Tonight", Coltrane plays the 3rd solo after 1. Griffin, and 2. Mobley, but I could be wrong.
Thanks frog for the fast and detailed response. Listened to a lot of Trane yesterday and I have a few observations I would like to share.
Blue Train, Coltrane's first album as a leader during his last decade on earth 100% addiction free, is basically "straight ahead hard bop" and very accessible to all.
Giant Steps is when I needed repeated listening's to "get it".
A Love Supreme took more listens to "get it" then Giant Steps.
I have listened to Ascension dozens of times and I still don't "get it".
Frogman I apologize for bothering you a second time in 24 hours but was wondering is there a "certain way" with different expectations of listening to Ascension to get the most out of it. Lord knows I have tried.
Dave Liebman, another artist I listen to that often ventures across the border into "free jazz", says of Ascension:
the album "blew everybody out of the water" and was "the torch that lit the free-jazz thing. I mean, it really begins with Cecil [Taylor] and Ornette [Coleman] in '59, but Ascension was like the patron saint saying, 'It's OK—this is valid.' I think that even had much more of an effect on everybody than A Love Supreme."
Here is an interesting rendition of My Favorite Things by Leibman's Expansions" band recorded in September, 2021.
@pjw81563, no need to apologize. First, you have a great attitude. I would say the perfect attitude. You say, “I don’t get it” and are not, as many are, too quick to dismiss it as bs or just noise. You leave room for getting it. Difficult music to be sure, but of importance and significance. You mention Liebman, one of my favorite saxophone players and a musician straight out of the Coltrane thing. Great musician and very erudite on all matters Jazz. Check this out, great insights into this topic:
Just watched the Liebman interview. Wow -- what a refreshingly down to earth and "real" statement that manages to point out aspects of Free playing that make it both appealing and difficult. This makes me want to seek out more interviews by Liebman. Very cool!
I can empathize with your difficulty. One aspect of Post Bop I enjoy is its use of certain techniques also used in Free playing but in "limited doses" within a generally melodic context. I can handle a certain amount of dissonance if it’s used as "seasoning", but when it becomes the "main course", not so much.
Thanks frogman for the response. Short but very informative Leibman interview.
Leibman talks about a few of the classical composers who have written scores with a lot of dissonance and I have sampled a lot of it this past year when I expanded my musical boundaries into the realm's of Mahler, Dvorak, Bruckner, Sibelius, Nielsen, Grieg, Shostakovich, Prokofiev, Korsakov, Borodin, Stravinsky and Tchaikovsky (basically all of the great classical composers from 1800 - 1950) along with the dissonance of Schoenberg and others of those mentioned by Leibman.
That said, I still have trouble with enjoying dissonant music whether it is classical or jazz but it is not for a lack of trying.
I would much rather listen to Nikolai Rimsky Korsakov's Sheherazade then Arnold Schoenberg's Suite, Op.29.
I would much rather listen to Coltrane's Giant Steps then Ascension.
Changing the subject but still on topic (jazz not classical), this is a great 12 minute video of musician Rick Beato sharing his short but very interesting and insightful relationship with Michael Brecker. (Elvin Jones as well). The way in which Beato emphasizes the greatness of Brecker reminded me of a few of your Brecker posts.
Wow -- that's a pretty intense example! I cannot handle that.
David Murray is an example of an artist whose recordings span a spectrum. I don't enjoy the more severe albums but I enjoy the more mellow ones, like this one:
"The main thing a musician would like to do is to give a picture to the listener of the many wonderful things he knows of and senses in the universe. That's what music is to me—it's just another way of saying this is a big, beautiful universe we live in, that's been given to us, and here's an example of just how magnificent and encompassing it is. That's what I would like to do. I think that's one of the greatest things you can do in life, and we all try to do it in some way. The musician's is through his music.
Coltrane and Eric Dolphy interviewed by Don DeMichael, as cited in "John Coltrane and Eric Dolphy Answer the Jazz Critic DownBeat
Life "encompasses" a lot. Different musicians choose to express their respective experiences of being human in different ways that may or may not be consistent with how a given listener defines "wonderful", "beautiful" or "magnificent". I guess it comes down to how much effort we’re willing to put in as individuals to try to find the "beauty" in something that initially strikes us as ugly/abrasive. There is an inevitable tension between artist and the one perceiving the art. As artists we want to be free to be genuine in our expressions. Presumably we want to facilitate some degree of communication, as well. For some, "the personal is the universal". For others, part of the craft is working with the material in ways that make the universality more explicit. It’s a balancing act.
Just listened to Patricia Barber, Cafe Blue, for the zillionth time and it still sounds fresh. I turn it up just a bit and close my eyes and I start smiling.
I have a copy of Billy Cobham's Glass Menagerie "Observations and Reflections" that I purchased maybe 40 years ago. The first and one of my favorite jazz albums. I take it out and play it every so often and it still sounds great. Unfortunately it's not on Tidal.
This young man has been making a lot of waves lately. Fantastic alto saxophone player with a somewhat “retro” sound and approach reminiscent of Cannonball. Great story telling in his solos. To think that not too long ago some thought Jazz was dead!
When I was a kid and had an opportunity to hear A Love Supreme I just didn't get it. Now that I'm older and after the youtube algorithm sent me this live jam session of the John Coltrane Quartet - Impressions - 'Live' I was stunned by the sheer scope of talent by just four men. In fact on this piece in particular it seems John Coltrane is not the most talented musician of the quartet! Elvin Jones:Drums and especially Jimmy Garrison:Bass with McCoy Tyner:Piano stand out to me, the most! Go figure!?
Thanks for the great Patrick Bartley music! I had not heard of him. I have a little Emmet Cohen and he is on one record a little, but had never chased down the alto player.
I have found this vocalist I had not heard of till recently.
Thanks for that, acman3. Loved it. Probably the most unusual (and really good) version of Giant Steps I’ve heard. Glad to get to know this interesting new singe. A nod to Stevie Wonder on the ballad singing and one can tell that he is a piano player on his scatting. Most Jazz singers, even the ones who scat, would be lost with the Giant Steps changes. Pretty impressive.
@tyray, wow, that’s guide a spread Lew Tabackin and Ralph Towner. Tabacking the traditiinalist to Towner who is anything but. Love.it.
You make an interesting comment about the rhythm section on “”Impressions”. While I’m not prepared to say Coltrane is the least talented, it’s a testament to the greatness of that trio that not only can they can play on the level of Coltrane, but “greater than the sum of the parts”.
When I first joined this forum (14 yrs ago!) my youngest son had just received a present from his grandmother. Very cute pajamas with frogs all over them and we affectionately started calling my son “frogman”. When prompted to choose a moniker to complete the process of joining the forum I thought, well…….why not?
Glad to hear you’re enjoying Towner and Tabackin. You might also enjoy exploring the music of Oregon and of the Toshiko Akioshi - Lew Tabackin Big Band.
I’d never heard of Henry Franklin. I like this!
When you said "speaking of Jazz is dead", I thought you meant:
When I was referring to Jazz is Dead I should have explained that Jazz is Dead is both a Los Angelesbased record label and a live music project founded by Adrian Younge and Ali Shaheed Muhammad. They explore and celebrate the legacy of jazz, particularly through collaborations with artists and the creation of new music inspired by the genre.
About Ben Webster, lately I’ve been listening to the double album set ’Tenor Giants’ with Ben Webster and Coleman Hawkins and it’s probably the album with the hardest swinging I’ve listened, to date. Some of the tunes even out swung a few tunes from Count Basie I’ve come to like and enjoy. And that got my attention.
I was lucky to witness the Big Band play live in the mid seventies, although at that point, I'd only recently begun my exploration of Jazz. If I could hear them now, I suspect I’d get more out of the experience.
I was lucky to witness the Big Band play live in the mid seventies, although at that point, I'd only recently begun my exploration of Jazz. If I could hear them now, I suspect I’d get more out of the experience.
Lucky you!
Tabackin is a great sax and flutist player...
I like innovative big band...
We live too far from musical civilization...
Or I live like an ermit... I dislike any crowd...
I rarely go to see live event...I would have made an exception for Tabackin...
Just listened to Emmet cohen, Vibe Provider and it was a great listen! Thanks for sharing. I also listened/watched the Live in Japan, what a fun video. Again, thanks for sharing.
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