frogman-Steve Kahn is one of those guys like Larry Carlton who played on a ton of albums. One of those musicians who came up as straight ahead was going in many different directions. Killer guitar player. O-Heres a dude you may be familiar with. He was just a few years younger than Wes. His playing was considered maybe a little "out of the box"even though he was a true "straight ahead" player. This guy was part of that elite group in the 50-60's "wrecking crew" Howard Roberts. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howard_Roberts"Howard Roberts is a Dirty Guitar Player" is another essential guitar album. I believe George Benson mentions him as one of his personal likes. Listening to the music, its straight ahead, but with tinges of...? I played my minty '63 mono copy along with dinner. Cool stuff. Im imagining guys in a cool shark skin suits, gals in tight dresses hangin in some smokey club. |
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orpheus10-
Howard is one of those guys many have heard, but not aware of. As Wiki mentions, he did so many of those show music themes in the 60-70's along with the wrecking crew stuff.
Interesting you linked Dorothy Ashby. On a recommendation by my local record store a few years ago,I purchased that album.
Its got a new age vibe to it, maybe ahead of its time. I've listened to it a few times, but haven't connected with the music. Time to revisit.
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We have mentioned H.R. couple of times, but its nothing wrong to do it one more time, maybe somebody will search for his music after reading that and I am very glad that now here are more people writing about jazz music they like Here is another guy, that nobody has mentioned before. Clifford Scott, sax player, recorded only few jazz albums This one is from 1963. where he played alto and tenor. He was backed by Les McCann on piano, Joe Pass on guitar, Herbie Lewis on bass and Paul Humphrey on drums. https://youtu.be/Fnhxt8IJEAQ |
Ah, Clifford Scott! We can always count on you to bring the almost forgotten players to our attention, Alex. What a tenor sound! The reason he probably hasn't been mentioned here is that he is known less as a jazz player (although he was a good one in the Texas tenor style) and more as the guy who defined rock and roll saxophone and played on many early r&r hits. Remember this one?: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bl4eOjNxIxg |
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Frogman, I was just thinking what you posted; Alex posts those forgotten musicians, while I have been posting the best, which any aficionado should already have in his collection. But that was for the benefit of people viewing this thread who were not genuine aficionados. In the future, I will assume any one coming to this thread is a genuine "aficionado", or they can read back posts to come up to date. In reference to "Honky Tonk Part II"; one would have to have been on another planet not to have heard it in 1956; that was when "Chi Town" was the hippist place on Earth. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGmTHTacq7cHow about cruising "North Shore Drive", coming into view of the skyline, in the back seat of a blue and white convertible 56 Chevy, with an armful of the prettiest teenager ever born (my girl friend). https://www.google.com/search?q=56+convertible+chevy&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X...Alex, I didn't remember his name, but I will never forget his sound; enjoy all the good music and the memories it brings. |
Tablejockey, I appreciate your honesty; when I strike out, let me know it. Nobody was pleased by my "Rubiyat" post and it wasn't new to anyone. (Thinking out loud), trying for a new direction, I will not go for the best. Maybe good stuff by the best artists that you may not have heard, but for certain, it can not be a "repeat", I feel like I'm listening to my own echo. "Sonny Criss" is an artist I don't think has been submitted. The first thing I notice about "Sonny Criss" is that he has a unique tone; it's like a foggy blue night. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qckz-Jy1qQSonny Criss lived in LA, but I would not consider him a West Coast musician, because his preferences in music were more from the East. Never the less, if you live in LA, some of it rubs off whether you like it or not, I suppose that made him sort of a nice hybrid. The reason the music has a "West Coast" flavor, is because the musicians he had to choose from in order to cut an album were from LA; consequently, it had West Coast sound. Here's one I definitely like by "Sonny Criss", check it out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4CoFpdrYtY |
Tablejockey, while your top priority is LP's; how do you rate CD's with no LP available?
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Orpheus, just wanted to add that is almost impossible to have all the 'known' and the 'unknown' artists and albums in one collection, so, please, just continue to post whatever comes to your mind. Believe me, there are gaps (certainly in mine) knowledge and I am always very glad to hear something 'new', no matter, or even better, if its from some 'well known' player.
By the way, liked both posts of Sonny Criss,will have to listen more of him.
Thanks. |
Alex, that worked out very well for both of us; did you hear how "hybridized" that music was, it wasn't hard-bop, or West Coast, but a combination of both, and a lot of things that sounded good. I'm sure I've got more of Sonny Criss in the collection.
His horn has that "far away" sound I've been trying to find, will continue the search.
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Alex, I've been in a "Sonny Criss" groove, and I'm liking it; he's so comfortable with himself, and never tries to get out of recognized boundaries, he also likes to be surrounded by other jazz masters. Back to the album "Criss Craft", the one with the boat on it, plus the "Isle of Celia". Allmusic gave it a review of 4 1/2 stars, which I agree with. Sonny Criss - alto saxophone Dolo Coker - piano Ray Crawford - guitar Larry Gales - bass Jimmie Smith - drums Those musicians play as if they could read each others mind; this music is an aficionados dream, it just flows from one cut to the next, with no desire to change any thing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqyyyIO4ZlQThe tone on his sax, and this group of musicians were made for this song. Now for the vocal by Nancy Wilson https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clt-KRtGTUwAnd the best music goes on. |
Great links on this page guys, thanks.
With nearly 200 pages, I’ve got some catching up to do.
O-so Dorothy didn’t grow on you? I gave it another whirl(had to dig deep to find her) and like it a little more this time. It’s an album to mix things up, when doing a "straight ahead" session.
Having not heard Sonny before, I checked who played guitar on his albums. Barney Kessel, Tal Farlow, Joe Pass...I’m sure there’s more.
I’m adding him to my list. Great pick O...thanks.
This is why I will NEVER be able to stop collecting Jazz. Endless discovery and reason to keep my bin diving jumpsuit ready!
Sonny did a cover of "Angel Eyes." You may already have Ella’s version. If not, I strongly recommend you check out a particular version.
"Let No Man Write My Epitaph" is the soundtrack to a 1961 movie. Great movie by the way. This album is just Ella and piano. Seek out the MONO LP if you can.
One of those records, once the non believers hear, they understand what the fuss is all about. Serious music for your cart/phono stage.
My CD buying stopped in the 90’s, and its a modest collection of the usual suspects, similar to the DVD Jazz Icons collection. Complete with those "outakes/alternate version" discs...and Grant Green!
I noticed Lionel Hampton is one of the "Icon,selections." I played my CD with "Flying Home." 17:04 minutes at a volume to get the tubes cookin’
Haven’t found a clean copy of this gem...yet.
This morning with coffee-Tal Farlow peeling the frets off his guitar on a Concord label promo album.
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I was just perusing some CD's debating whether or not to review them. I know Alex has been through the extensive review we did of Mary Lou Williams, but you might not be familiar with her works Tablejockey?
Since what I have lined up for review is "classic jazz" there's nothing else to question.
Mary Lou in or out?
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orpheus10-Mary Lou isn't in my collection. Over the years I've heard her music,but never picked up an album.
A write up on a favorite is welcome.
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It's only been fairly recent that I got into Mary Lou; that's because I thought she was of another generation that I couldn't relate to, but I discovered differently. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4THBVc47ug https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0e8AOox_prEThese two posts remind me of old black and white photographs that are so old they're turning brown, but they have a special significance I can't quite put my finger on. Tell me what you can find in her music? |
Tablejockey, as you are mentionong the guitar players more than other insrumentalists I will use the opportunity and ask you to listen the excellent last post of Sonny Criss that Orpheus posted. There you will hear Ray Crawford on guitar, we have mentioned him earlier, hope nobody will object as I will post couple of links, in random order,where he played. It is all great music First, with Ahmed Jamal, from 1955, drumless trio https://youtu.be/ZmvwCTMO1Lg?list=PLF1lyo_kLguCy4_Q5RoyyRduydlNUs-JLWith Curtys Amy 'Katanga' from 1963. https://youtu.be/wLxxeBRqqKwThan, with Jimmy Smith 'Bluesmith' album from 1972. https://youtu.be/cSgqS7yy5JMHis only album as leader, recorded 1961.'Smooth Groove' with great line up, but the label broke before it was released https://youtu.be/fka0tp0WGPs |
0rpheus10- I left out mentioning you're giving me reason to revisit albums that have been collecting dust.
Nancy does an album with pianist George Shearing that includes "All Night Long"
Fantastic album-"The Swingins' Mutual." Highly recomended.
Also worth checking out, if not mentioned already-Nancy and Cannonball Adderly.
A great album to play while having dinner with that special someone.
Since I brought up George, he also did an album with the Montgomery brothers, Wes included. "George Shearing and The Montgomery Brothers" I just played my copy and it reminded me to look for one in better condition!
You're assessment of Mary Lou is spot on. The music does sound a little "dated" Not in bad way, but perhaps the melodies and song structure reflect what was popular for that period. Maybe that's why I never seeked out her music. Having spent some earlier years learning the keys, I can appreciate her playing, that's about it. Can't put a finger on why exactly I'm not drawn to the music.
alexatpos-nice stuff linked. Thanks. I gravitate towards Jazz with guitarists since i'm a long time player enthusiast. Reading a few early posts, i see there's a player or two in here as well.
Indeed, Ray Crawford is another fine player. Not much written about Ray. I seen his name mentioned over the years in mags, that's about it.
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For me personally, Mary Lou's music has a very unusual appeal; like a memory that you can't quite remember, because maybe you were too young, but it gives you a pleasant feeling.
Music affects us in more ways than we can put into words, maybe that's why we enjoy it so much, and seek to be able to hear the inner depths of every song.
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Kenny Burrell was such a prodigious artist, that I'm sure I don't even come close to having all his best works. He is the next recommendation. I suggest we submit our favorite works by him that will include his work as a sideman as well; that's how I first became acquainted with his guitar. Here's one of my favorites from favorite LP. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mP0flneNfaQ&list=PLC6556E715379CC6D |
O-some timing here...
Before revisiting this thread, I randomly have been grabbing LP's to play with breakfast. My treasured 63 mono copy of Blue and this one...
Kenny and Jimmy Smith-"Blues Bashin" I get my Hammond B3 fix.
MB is one of those rare albums IMO, every cut is great.
Do you have "The Dynamic Duo" Wes & Jimmy?
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Chico Hamilton is an unusual artist; when he hit's it's a knockout, but when he misses; you take it from there. I was listening to one where he hit; "Headhunters", it's on LP, but worth looking for. Here's a very nice one that's known and liked; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2hivG5Cc4z4Here's one that may not be well known, but I like it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3EUVFB7NUwAlex, I don't why, but I have been assuming you have these in your collection, and hesitant to post them. I won't make that assumption in the future. Pass on those bargain CD's |
Frustration with bad liner notes/quality control!
I suspect we all find this from time to time, but it seems like a company as large as Columbia could do a better job -- or maybe it is because they are so big!?
Monk is a long time favorite and I have more than 20 of his albums. Recently I rediscovered I have two copies of "Who's Afraid of The Big Band Monk?". A ridiculous cover but interesting music.
One copy is likely an original release (red label w/ dark yellow lettering), since it has a "Radio Station Service" sticker on the cover. The other has identical jacket info, including KG 32892 number, but heavier vinyl (180 g?) and the more current red label with black printing and COLUMBIA at the top in white. Both are two record sets, one from a "1964" concert, the other from 1968.
However, while the earlier release numbers the sides 1-4, the newer album numbers each record 1-2. That's not so bad except the gate-fold album continues to identify the cuts for sides 1-4 on the newer album. In addition, both copies list incorrect information identifying musicians and the arranger for two of the four sides.
Two of the four sides were taken from the earlier release, "Big Band and Quartet in Concert" (CS 8964), identified as Dec. 30, 1963, which I had to reference to straighten out the confusion of the later double album.
Now certainly the occasional misprint or even mis-information can slip through. But when an album is reissued, and with sufficient concern to utilize heavier vinyl, why wouldn't more care be exercised to correct the printed information? And then they compounded the liner note errors by mis-numbering the new pressings! At least I enjoyed the music.
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@dlcockrum - Was traveling and unable to reply promptly but a belated "THANKS" for the Bruce Katz "Transformation" recommendation. Found it on Tidal. I'm enjoying the music (melodious, accessible yet not superficial) and the sonics are great. Excellent recording all around. Returning the favor (perhaps)... you might enjoy "The New Standard" by Jamie Saft. Here are two sample tracks (7 & 8): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvi4iKz-AOI&ab_channel=JamieSaft-Topichttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFKzC8DrGGw&ab_channel=JamieSaft-TopicI do prefer the tonal balance of the Transformation recording vs The New Standard. Bass and drums in TNS sound a bit heavy handed to me. A curiosity...I was struck by a similarity in the opening (and repeated) organ riff used in Track 2 of Transformation and that used in Bubblehouse from Medeski Martin & Wood's "Shack-man". Had wondered who borrowed from whom, but given Transformation apparently dates from 1994 and Shack-man from 1996, I'm guessing John Medeski was the "borrower". Imitation: the sincerest form of flattery, I suppose. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGWjkIm7JaU&ab_channel=fujentiDepending on draw back power for re-listening, Transformation might have to be a purchase. Thanks again. |
It’s difficult for players of this caliber to make a record that is less than good. Sometimes the stars align and there such a high level of musical synergy that the playing is exceptional and truly inspired. This is one of those records, imo. Interesting in that it is the product of two different sessions and two different rhythm sessions with Philly Joe Jones being the one constant and he sounds incredible. The writing is exceptional and the soloing always tells an interesting story. Check out "Carolyn" by Lee Morgan; what a great and interesting tune! One of the best recordings of classic jazz that I have ever heard. Badass jazz: https://m.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLUJ7V33M1wR14_Yqgv0AwCaCxxKXSKbOu |
frogman-that is some good stuff. Just plain....cool.
It also reminds me of something you might hear in a B/W film noir crime movie.
O- I was unwinding this evening with "Wes Montgomery in the wee small hours."
Reading the back cover, I discovered Kenny Burrell is a sideman.
Only Wes and maybe a couple guys can make a "songwriter" tune -"Somewhere" from West Side Story, just sound beautiful. I'm not into orchestra backed tunes, and Wes is essentially just playing the vocal lines with single notes. Really, there's nothing going on here, but the times Wes isnt being "Wes" it STILL sounds good!
This is one of those albums Jazz purists discount since it's full of orchestration.
I think this is one of his "paycheck" albums.
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Glad you liked it; it’s a real classic. That particular issue of the record includes two alternate takes and that is the reason I posted that version; the original does not. That clip I posted suggests that Hank Mobley and Lee Morgan were co-leaders on the date. They were not, it was Mobley’s date, but it’s interesting to note that Morgan contributed half the tunes on the record. Some of my favorite Lee Morgan on record. He sounds fantastic and I find the contrast between his fiery style and Donald Byrd’s more "careful" approach very interesting. You mention Leonard Bernstein. Next year (actually beginning August of this year) will see the centennial celebration of Bernstein, one of the (perhaps the) greatest American composers (not to mention conductor and educator). Fantastic musician whose music bridges the gaps between Classical, Jazz and pop. Iconic figure in music. I agree with you about that version of "Somewhere"; just beautiful. This is one of my favorite Bernstein tunes from one of my favorite records: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0enbmhunOooAnd, of course: https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLoaL3AV63h0NdjdUwmwKsSG2mih1T6rNb&v=YxkJ4_Gpxoo |
West Side Story is a musical with a book by Arthur Laurents, music by Leonard Bernstein, lyrics by Stephen Sondheim and conception and choreography by Jerome Robbins.[1] It was inspired by William Shakespeare's play Romeo and Juliet.
The story is set in the Upper West Side neighborhood in New York City in the mid-1950s, an ethnic, blue-collar neighborhood (in the early 1960s much of the neighborhood would be cleared in an urban renewal project for the Lincoln Center, changing the neighborhood's character).[2][3] The musical explores the rivalry between the Jets and the Sharks, two teenage street gangs of different ethnic backgrounds. The members of the Sharks, from Puerto Rico, are taunted by the Jets, a white gang.[4] The young protagonist, Tony, a former member of the Jets and best friend of the gang leader, Riff, falls in love with Maria, the sister of Bernardo, the leader of the Sharks. The dark theme, sophisticated music, extended dance scenes, and focus on social problems marked a turning point in American musical theatre. Bernstein's score for the musical includes "Something's Coming", "Maria", "America", "Somewhere", "Tonight", "Jet Song", "I Feel Pretty", "A Boy Like That", "One Hand, One Heart", "Gee, Officer Krupke", and "Cool".
The original 1957 Broadway production, directed and choreographed by Jerome Robbins and produced by Robert E. Griffith and Harold Prince, marked Sondheim's Broadway debut. It ran for 732 performances before going on tour. The production was nominated for six Tony Awards including Best Musical in 1957,[5] but the award for Best Musical went to Meredith Willson's The Music Man. Robbins won the Tony Award for his choreography and Oliver Smith won for his scenic designs. The show had an even longer-running London production, a number of revivals and international productions. A 1961 musical film of the same name, directed by Robert Wise and Robbins, starred Natalie Wood, Richard Beymer, Rita Moreno, George Chakiris and Russ Tamblyn. The film was nominated for eleven Academy Awards and won ten, including George Chakiris for Supporting Actor, Rita Moreno for Supporting Actress, and Best Picture.
Before it was a play or movie, it was an LP with just beautiful music.
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O-10, a correction if I may. It was a Broadway musical ("play") first. The cast album was the first recording of the music and the movie came after. There have been subsequent Broadway revivals and recordings of the music. |
Frogman, I heard the music from an LP no later than 57 now that I remember, I guess that was from the play.
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Since you're a musician, maybe you can explain to us who wonder why "The Music Man" won the award for best musical?
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I don’t think that being a musician is what might qualify me to explain since the reasons have more to do with societal issues than musical; although the musical are certainly part of the reason. The reasons why are probably the same as the reasons that the musical had a lot of difficulty getting financial backers and suffered some production false starts: many thought that the themes of the story were dark and unsettling. After all, what would 1957 audiences prefer to hear? Perky, easily hummable tunes like "76 Trombones" about a traveling band instrument salesman? Or, exotic sounding (for the time) songs that spoke about gang violence, interracial love and ends in tragedy? Like many great works it was "ahead of its time"; or, as Schubert recently wrote, "had the courage to be in the time". |
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I agree about Peterson frogman. I've owned that LP for years, along with the Andre Previn Trio version which I enjoy also. But Oscar's lightening fingers and ability to infuse emotion keep that atop anything I've heard from other artists.
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Don't know the Previn. I'll check it out, thanks. |
frogman-good of you to mention the Oscar Peterson album. Haven't played this album
in years.
Oscar Peterson and Joe Pass did a live album titled,"The Good Life" on the Pablo label.This album is one of the most "live sounding" albums I've heard. Fantastic recording.
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"o", thanks for posting. That is from the Previn album I have.
Not sure if this is true but I read someplace that Previn's "My Fair Lady" was the top selling jazz LP for a number of years. I have both but prefer "West Side Story", probably because I simply like the music better.
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Fantastic clips and heard the sad news a little while ago on the radio. Beautiful player with a wonderful and unique time feel. Unfortunate that she hasn’t been covered in this thread and just one example of why it’s maddening when general negative comments are made about "modern" jazz vs classic jazz. Different time, different musical sensibility and often equally high level of craft. Loved the live clip. And in 5! |
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From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. I posted this for those who are unfamiliar with "Geri Allen"; namely me and a few others. Born June 12, 1957 Pontiac, Michigan, U.S. Origin Detroit, Michigan, U.S. Died June 27, 2017 (aged 60) Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, U.S. Genres Jazz, post-bop, blues music, funk, gospel Occupation(s) Musician Professor Record producer Instruments Piano Years active 1982–2017 Labels Motema Music Polygram Storyville Blue Note Telarc Associated acts Timeline Website www.GeriAllen.comGeri Allen with Trio 3. Geri Allen (June 12, 1957 – June 27, 2017) was an American composer, educator, and jazz pianist, raised in Detroit, Michigan, and educated in the Detroit Public Schools.[1] Allen worked with many jazz musicians, including Ornette Coleman, Ron Carter, Tony Williams, Dave Holland, Jack DeJohnette, and Charles Lloyd. She cited her primary influences to be her parents, Mount Vernell Allen Jr, and Barbara Jean Allen, and her primary musical influences to be mentors Marcus Belgrave, Donald Walden, and Betty Carter, as well as pianists Herbie Hancock, Mary Lou Williams, Hank Jones, Alice Coltrane, Cecil Taylor, Thelonious Monk, McCoy Tyner, Bud Powell, and mentor Dr. Billy Taylor. Allen was an Associate Professor of Music and the Director of the Jazz Studies Program at the University of Pittsburgh. Geri Allen was one hell of a musician, and I will become familiar with her works. Well aficionados, I've given you a lot of information on Geri Allen, and those who are enticed to get more familiar with her works, can go to work. Enjoy the music. |
There are an infinite amount of factors that determine the music we like, most of which we have no control over; go with the flow and don't fight the feeling.
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