Cbw723
I plan to buy a Mac mini, cheap laptop, and set-up a backup storage bank. My son will help me as he is well versed.
I will post a question on the Ayre vs other DAC's. I like a full, rich sound that is not at all fatiguing.
Thanks much.
Bill |
One giant benefit that Jim Smith didn't mention was the access to radio stations from around the world. If you love CD's and never rip a CD to a hard drive, think of a computer like a tuner that can dial into literally thousands of radio stations: every college station, every public radio station, jazz stations from Paris, Madrid, Rio, San Fransisco, and on and on.
Regarding buying CD's: Sorry to hear about those having a hard time buying CD's but the thrift stores in my town are chock full of used discs. There is also a constant stream of people on Craigslist selling their collections as they rip them to their computer. This may be the benefit of living in a college town. |
Good luck, Bill. As with everything else in audio, it may take some finessing to get the sound you like, but I think once you do, you'll love the instant access to all of your (digital) music.
If you are going with a Mac Mini, you'll find information all over the web on how to best configure it for use as a music server.
Post a thread and let us know how it goes. |
I think the death blow to the dedicated CD player will be the laser mechanism manufacturers. CD only readers are becoming more scarce everyday. There's very little money in it to the big guys, IMO. They'll all make mutli format only readers sooner than later. The universal players aren't nearly as beloved by people like us.
I highly doubt the CD player will completely vanish for a very long time. Then again, I see the turntable outlasting the CDP, and quite easily. Albums are so much cooler to people than CDs and will hold their retro value far longer than a small disc.
I think entry level CDPs like the NADs will die off first, followed by the $1-$4k or so market. All that'll be left will be above or around that. Hopefully not, but that's what my logic tells me. |
Along with the theme of this thread, I think the way music gets distributed will dramatically change. I think it'll be downloaded from the artists site directly eventually. I say this because a lot of them currently have their concerts available for download on their sites. They're generally available in mp3 and FLAC. They also have album artwork and CD labels. For an example, check out Live Metallica dot com. Pearl Jam one ups it by adding the option of having a CD created for you. Last I looked, Phish has their concerts available in high-res. Prices are z bit absurd though. The others I've seen are around $10 for mp3 and $12 for FLAC.
I think it's a matter of time until they ask themselves why can't they do that with studio recordings too. I'd love high-res downloads direct from the artist. So long as I have a way of making a hard copy backup though. |
I have looked around quite a bit here and on the web (particularly on "Computer Audiophile" for a good succinct article explaining how to get the highest fidelity out of a computer-based system. Can anyone who has already implemented one and/or done the research direct me to a good article that breaks it down? Or can people describe what solutions they have come up with that works? It seems to me that burning your CDs onto a hard drive or music server in AIFF is the way to go (but why is that better than WAV, or is it?) The hard drive then feeds a computer (usually an Apple product) that then feeds a DAC which in turn feeds the preamp. Are so-called music servers better than your basic hard drive and, if so, why? What is the ideal solution for commanding the system (as in, pick out and tell it what song to play next)? Is there any loss of fidelity with the wireless systems, like, say, the Modwright Transporter? And, if you had a Mac Mini, is there any loss of fidelity for it to read off the hard drive wirelessly or is it better to have a direct connection? |
Neophyle: There are numerous ways to go with computer audio. My suggestion is go the path of least resistance as you start out and keep it simple. A mistake I made when I started was to complicate the process with multi zones with a NAS (network hard drive) and then an incompatible hard drive among other things. Forget all the wireless stuff for a while.
Start out with a mac mini and two harddrives. I chose OWC (http://www.macsales.com/) for the hard drives due to MAC centric technical service and warranty. A few more bucks but worth it to me. Probably a good place to buy the Mini as well. BTW, I bought mine on Craigslist for $300.
With regards to usb converters, usb cable, digital cables, and DAC... well... that's another thread but I suggest to go cheap at first and live with it for a while. |
Neophyle,
I hear you. I'm navigating those same waters and it's taking me time. Fortunately I'm patient!
The Computer Audiophile website is good for this. They've put together a "Computer Audiophile CD Ripping Strategy and Methodology" (found at http://www.computeraudiophile.com/content/Computer-Audiophile-CD-Ripping-Strategy-and-Methodology), which I'm following to get started.
They also have setup guides (eg: JC River and Windows 7), but I haven't looked into those yet. It's a good place to get going.
BTW, an apparently very easy way to get into computer audio is with a Squeezebox Touch, which allows to stream wirelessly, play hi-rez, listen to internet radio, etc for $300. This is the initial route I'm taking.
I hope this helps. |
Is there viability to downloading music in a hi-rez format, burning to a DVD and then playing back on a hi-rez player? I have absolutely no experience in this area, or with computer based audio storage/playback, but I am considering getting started in 2011. |
As much as I hate the idea, the CD player is coming to the end of the road. Manufacturers will not put money into R&D if people cease to purchase the physical copies. The hard-core of us that continue to purchase CDs are nowhere near enough to prolong their lifetime - we remain in an ever decreasing minority.
Pretty much sums up my life and my preferences - I'm in a minority of a minority.
Vinyl will inevitably continue as it does not have a technological parallel. |
I think vinyl will probably stick around for quite some time, too. But if 96K and 192K downloads become more available for a wide selection of music, vinyl will probably become even more marginalized than it is now. |
I have a Burmester 069 reference cd player and as much as I have tried out computer based solutions with all different kind of tweaks, software and settings I still have never come close to the realism, the detail level and sheer musicality I get through my 069. I am not saying that to defend the purchase of this very expensive player, it´s just how it is. If it was the other way around I would have been willing to let it go. |
Cappuccino, what is the price of an 069? One might make an argument it is the best digital source out there, so does is it not like saying digital is not as good as reel-reel? |
Not necessarily.
I bought my first "high end" turntable back in the 80's when vinyl was on the way out and CDs in becasue I had a big investment in records that I needed to protect and preserve.
That Linn Axis has served me exceptionally well and is still doing its thing today, even though I do not play my records tehse days nearly as often as I used to. But when I do, that investment I made in teh Linn 25 years ago is still paying dividends.
Same true perhaps for CDs today. If you have a lot, you need to play them with something. A good CD player is the easy option, though those who are up to it may be better served going the computer audio/music server route. |
if you believe that the cd player, dacs, and transports, are in an evanescent phase, buy them while you can, as well as the cds themselves.
you will thus generate a collection of cds and have enough hardware to listen to them.
of course if you believe that computers and other technologies are the preferable to cd players and the like, the demise of said cd players is academic.
by the way niacin, are you a proponent of b-vitamins as a panacea for certain unhealthful conditions of the humna body ? if so, i would be interested in your words on the subject. |
For those who don't choose wisely YES. |
Mrtennis - My advice - consume as much of the mighty B3 as possible :) |
Mechans,
IMO, DAT killed the cassette. |
Just bought Burmester 001 cd player,could not be happier.Also have Thorens tt,that I kept for all these years when Lp's were
supposedly 'dead',along with thousand or more Lp's.Now its same thing with cd's,but again have them thousand or more,will
stick to them same as I stick to records.Anyway,having music in Pc is ok with someone,but I guess if you are seriously into
something you will prefer to have it and hold it in the hand,just like the books,the ones I like i keep them at home,not in the virtual world.Than there is matter of searching,and buying some realy rare editions,that's something that some music file never will be equal,so buying and having a great cd player goes in the same category with other stuff that are not maybe rational,like vintage or sports cars,great single malts,books or realy good looking women that makes you spend much money,but you do it with a smile,because thats the spice of life |
BTW, now is probably a good time to buy a high end CD player if you need one to get the most out of your existing CD collection for the foreseeable future because the prices for the players labeled "high end" will continue to go up over time (much like good turntables have over the last 25 years or so) as it becomes more and more of a niche market.
The flip side is that the technology will continue to only become better and cheaper so the real value of a "high end" player may diminish as a result of inexpensive players offering better competition.
Also, always watch out for snake oil. Higher price generally means better build quality and aesthetics but does not always translate into better sound/performance.
|
There are more hi end C.D. players being made now than ever . C.D. sales have slumped , but has the sales of hi end C.D.players ? |
My guess is the market for CDs and players of all types is saturated in the US and other leading edge economies but still growing in less industrialized and emerging economies.
Regarding high end players specifically my guess is that sales are fairly level or somewhat down in general overall. |
I would not buy stock in a company that only made CD players. Makers of FM tuners must be reading the handwriting on the walls. The future seems to be downloads, whether it be music, movies or TV shows. My audio system made a huge leap forward when I stored my CD's on my computer. Now, my favorite FM station is available via my Apple remote app. (and sounding much better than my FM tuner). I will be able to simplify my system and get better sound. Will miss the tuners signal strength meter, but such is life. |
I dont see a future for very expensive machines that are CD only. But there will still be demand for stuff that can play a CD. Tons of "software". Used CDs can be had for a song, they are more durable than the LP record so shopping for used ones has less anxiety involved. The CD player or equivalent will be a part of systems for some time into the future. Unless you are willing to replace what you got with some sort of expensive hi rez. replacements. That is why alot of people kept up with LPs, they cannot get a CD of the same stuff, or figure why bother if the LP is in fine condition. I just bought a mid priced player with the seller eating the first 18 months of depreciation at a substantial savings over new. And broken in. BUt mint condx. My 12 year old player gave up and tech advancements dictate this might sound better. I dont give a dam for lo rez digital formats and hi rez is more scarce. |
Lewinskih01,
Thanks for the great recommendation to read "Computer Audiophile CD Ripping Strategy and Methodology" (found at www.computeraudiophile)
For anyone interested on ripping their CD library onto a hard drive this is essential reading and will save you much time in the future. I wish that I had found it earlier. |
The end is near... no actually it is already here.
I moved to a Apple computer about 5 years ago (they have toslink stock), at the time I A/B it with a number of good (not great) CD players.... I no longer even own a CD player.
I use a DAC1-HDR as my DAC. |
There will always be a market for hi end cd players. Ripping a CD to a hard drive on a computer is different than playing the same cd on a high end cd player. In effect, you are using the DVD drive on a computer as your transport and not all cd transports are the same.
Hi end cd players, not all, but some like Burmester's cd players, have modified cd drive mechanisms that minimize mechanical vibration and interference to ensure that the laser picks up every bit of information accurately and completely. That would yield more information being fed to DAC. That in turn gives music more nuance, atmosphere, air/space and etc.
For example, I have burmester 061. the same WAV file that I ripped to my computer and using 061's DAC still sounds inferior than the same CD that plays through the 061.
However, you will need a hi end DAC to hear the difference.
Next time... What you can try is.... Using a regular cd player and outputs its signal to burmest's mighty 069, then listen to the same cd on the 069. You will realize hi end cd player will be around.
Unless someone makes an audiophile computer that has a very good cd mechinism... On top of that, figure a way to minimize electrical, signal, and noise interference,signal crosstalk, EMI within all the components in the computer.... Than maybe a computer can sound as good as a hi end cd player. Oh and if the hard drive is very fragmented and the file is all over the hard drive..... Can we say jitter? |
It is over. RIP CD players and CDs. You served us well in the end.
Did anyone actually try the original CD destruction tests? I seem to remember the adverts smearing CDs with jam or hitting them with a hammer then playing them. Oh the 1980s... Must have had great error correction back then!
I guess the next test will be to see how many thousand years in landfill sites it will take to decompose. |
Wayneker, the CD drive in a computer is capable of retrieving the data on a CD perfectly. Not close to perfectly. Perfectly. Anything less, like a single bit out of place, and the OS you just loaded could be useless. While you can elect to bypass the error correction when ripping CDs, it isn't advisable. It is only within the software, where the data is converted from one representation to another, or in playback, that differences can arise.
And fragmentation has nothing to do with jitter. A modern disk drive can deliver data to memory far, far faster than is required for audio playback, no matter how the data is distributed. Again, the process results in perfect transfer -- not a single bit is allowed to be misplaced as it is lined up in memory.
As to noise, crosstalk, EMI, etc., they apply equally to a CD player. While it may be some time before someone creates a special purpose computer optimized for audio, the current general purpose ones are doing a pretty good job. Pro audio is almost completely computerized at this point. Long before you buy them, the music on your CDs has been through more computers than you can shake a stick at. |
Agree with deframentation, I realized that.
However, I don't know if a computer can really retrieve every bit. If that's the case, I don't know why the same CD on Burmester 069 sounds better than the same files coming from a computer linked to 069's DAC. 069 has a modified CD drive use belt drive technology with error tolerance down to less than 1/3000 of an inch on both the spindle and every mechanism on the drive system. The belt drive keeps CD spinning's vibration to minimum hence, able to retrieve everything. It's not snake oil, there really is a difference!
As to noise, crosstalk, EMI etc... 069 is shielded, every circuitry is specific designed for that purpose..... I sincerely urge you to go listen to 069, wadia 971 CD transport, 931 master clock, and 922 mono DAC combo, dCS SACD/CD player or Esoteric CD/SACD players with the same CD and compare it to a computer as source... |
After reading these posts, I still think I made the right decision. I just had my Esoteric UX-1pi modified by APL to include many 32-bit 2nd generation DACs and lots of other bills and whistles, including digital in and out. It is now an "M" (for APLers reading this). Although at some point I will probably reduce my CD's to a server of some sort so I can be better organized and find my music more easily, I have no plans on discontinuing to use my Esoteric transport. There IS a difference between transport and computer sourcing, and as long as I can still hear that difference, my money (and my CD's) are on the Esoteric. |
Hi Fplanner2010,
what differences do you hear in your transport versus your server?
I have yet to hear a laser reading data from a cd sounding better than data from cache. In every case I found the laser in real time sounding a bit masked or vague in comparison. Not dissimilar to the addition of a really good clock.
I know Esoteric make great transports, but it is so out of date now as a way to transfer data. Surely what you are hearing is an issue with the computer set up or interface to your DAC? |
The problem is not cache vs laser... Is the quality of the reading system between a high end cd player and a run of the mill DVD player on a computer.
I agree, there is a difference between a high end cd player and computer. Assuming the cd player has a digital in, making a comparison is easy. Not all high end players are worth the money. Having said that, the DAC on esoteric, burmester, dCS, wadia and etc are of high enough quality that when linked to a computer, one would still prefer playing the actual cd.
The difference? Accuracy, texture, spatial presentation, imagine, atmosphere, dynamics..... However, it depends on the player u are using. Burmester 069 is by far the best I have heard. Just go test it out.
I can not vouch for every hi end cd player or transport, only those from burmester, esoteric, dCS, and wadia.... A lot of other high end cd player are not up to the same standard. The difference will also depends on the listener. For example, to untrained ears like my parents , they can't even hear the difference between a 3000 dollar speakers and 30000 dollar speakers. Having said that, u can't easily tell the difference without critically listening and comparing hi end cd player and computer source using the same DAC. Some of the differences are very subtle and may even escape you, that doesn't mean it's not there. |
I skiped the whole cd player bit went from vinyl(still using) to a music sever. Down loaded some hd music, best sounding the smithereens do tommy, ripped alot of cds and off you go. Even through the dcs debussy, not vinyl, but getting closer. Oh and as far as the starter of this post suggested the end of the LP, the fact is, Vinly is the only growing sales of music! Not gone away anytime soon. |
The end is near. That is why I stopped modding CD transports in 2009. That is why I removed my CD/DVD transport from my rack. Computer audio is finally approaching the best vinyl SQ, and not just hi-res either.
Steve N.
Empirical Audio |
Chadeffect:
Wayneker2176 answered your question much better than I could. I am gradually dipping my toes into computer audio, but am in no hurry. I figure time is on my side here, as there appear to be new digital software and connection breakthroughs fairly often. As the technology matures and standardizes, I may become more interested. For now, guess I'll just have to "make do".
FWIW - my re-worked Esoteric now has 20 2nd generation 32bit AKM DACs/side, fully differential, transformer coupled tube Class A output stage featuring the vintage E182CC tubes and Lundahl audio transformers. It also accepts up to 192KHz/24bit from external digital sources. The interface is Coaxial. I'm pretty happy, "making do". :-) |
Hi Wayneker2176,Fplanner2010,
I find it hard to believe you are finding better texture, spacial info and especially dynamics from a CD in real time than by a well set up computer server. But I am sure you hear what you hear.
I have had 2 generations of DCS stacks. Elgar plus up to the Scarlatti stack. Even though with my Scarlatti rig I used the older transport. The addition of the computer was awesome. I dont miss CDs/transport at all.
What is always difficult in these audiophile conversations is to know what people perceive as better. Also maybe any happy coincidence of euphonic attributes in the system can alter an opinion of what is better.
From my perspective after many years of highend CD playback, I found direct from memory via firewire with Amarra from a mac into my DAC to perform beyond anything I have had before. All the qualities you mention are there. Amazing clarity, dynamics,purity, and all the texture that is in the recording is there.(Some recordings I have are direct from the studio. I was in the session. All exported in the digital domain from the DAW. Bounced to stereo Aiffs or WAVS files at the native sample rate)
This talk of CD drives in computers is nonsense. If they could not transfer the data properly none of our computers would work. Obviously all data imported to my HD via CD is in Read until write mode with various software non compressed. Nothing added or taken away. All cables and power supplies are as good as they can reasonably be.
Fplanner2010 you mention the use of coaxial (I assume the jittery s/pdif) which is a consumer digital in/out. Isnt that 75ohm system only capable of 24/96k in stereo if that? I am a bit confused as you mention 24/192. Sorry it has been a while and I have only really used AES/EBU 110 ohm digital ins/outs in the past. |
Wayneker, the bits coming off the CD are the same. Some ripping software, like XLD, allows you to compare a checksum of your rip to a database. Thousands of ripped CDs are checked this way, and the resulting files are bit-for-bit identical (or the program grumbles).
You don't say how you linked your 069 to the computer. There are a lot of ways for the signal to go wrong between the computer's hard drive and the DAC. The biggest culprit is probably jitter, followed by the playback software. How did you go from computer to DAC? |
I have linked the computer to DAC by using toslink and coaxial. I have even used my computer as the cd transport to play CDs rather than files linking to a DAC. none of these method sounds as good as burmester 069.
I think most people forgot how important a clean power source is for music. Burmester 069 has 2 boxes and one of the boxes houses 069's power supply. It has all the trickeries to clean, stabilize, de-noise the electricity coming from the wall. (look up burmester 948 and 038) You should be able to find pictures of 069's internal.... It's no wonder that it's one of the best hi end cd player, it's no wonder it sounds better than a computer. |
Well... The comparison I have had with my friends were blind A/B test. I don't know what else to explain the difference. If not the better laser pick up mechanism, if not the better circuitry, if not the better power supplies, what else could it be?
Even used a computer to play CDs linked to 069 with blind A/B test at my dealer, still.
If any run in the mill DVD player you can get for 100 dollar can play CDs just as good a high end cd player playing bit for bit.... There will be no market for hi fi system! Than all cd transport including DVD players in computer should be just as good.... Why are people still spending money on R&D on cd transports? I mean a bit is a bit.... All one needs is a DAC. But thats far from the truth. Maybe there are just other factors that high end cd players bring to the table. Iike 069's huge power supply and other things? |
As our assumption for bit perfect rip. Just google, not all drives are the same.... In addition.... Read the link below...
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=54113&hl=
http://www.digital-inn.de/exact-audio-copy-english/36620-different-drives-different-crcs.html |
Wayneker2176,
I think your sonic issues are more to do with your computer set up and the type of digital connection you use. Dont use the CD ROM as a transport(!). Use the computer as a library playing from memory.
I know of no modern hard drives that sound bad! If you are worried then get SSD with no moving parts. Forget S/pdif and toslink. Jittery crap by comparison to FW or a good USB protocol.
You need to forget the Hifi hype. Which part of you really believes that some small hifi manufacturer can compete with giant highly resourced "real" tech companies? You are paying for 20mm think face plates and small production runs.
Rip your CDs in a non compressed format (i.e Aiff or WAV) with a read until right software. Try some playback software like Pure vinyl or Amarra or whatever. Get a decent interface if you want to keep your current DAC, but you may well be better off getting a new generation DAC which takes firewire or USB straight. Weiss make some great ones which are expensive, but there are cheaper ones made by others that use USB. I myself use the new Weiss.
The rest is BS. It is just pure data storage and number crunching. The transport as you use it is a thing of the past. All you want is the data to be passed to a brilliant number cruncher which then has a nice output section to your amp.
There is no way your transport sounds better. The old expensive guard will be forgotten ($15,000 transports!) unless you just want it for designer style. I am sure there are many on the GON who can help guide you with the right bits.
Sorry for the rant, but I have been there. I got rid of all that expensive stuff because it could not compete or was no better. No other reason. Get rid of it before you are stuck with it. |
It could very well due to my computer set up. I use a Mac Pro with iTune ripping CD to WAV files.
Why not use CD ROM as a transport? If the CD/DVD ROM can read bit perfect data, why should it matter if I use it as a transport? Since playing CDs on it and ripping CDs from it should yield the same data.
I haven't been able to find a DAC good enough with FW or asynchronous USB than the DAC on my CD player.
As with Hifi hype.... I don't blindly believe anything...... I do blind A/B test. I have to say, some hi end music server are able to deliver the same quality of music when hooked up to the same DAC on... let's say 069... As with "real" tech companies..... I was an investment banker working in Taiwan's technology sector.... I know all the cost, material, and etc going in to a CD/DVD ROM player..... The cost of material with labor is less than $80!!! I am sorry.... it's not just a price bias.... It just doesn't compare to Burmester 069.... Although, I have to say.... some of the "supposed" hi end CD players are pure snake oil!!!!! However, I stand firm on Burmester 069! Blind A/B test with 5 of my friends..... Even if some of them can't describe the difference, all of us prefers CDs on Burmester 069.
You need to forget the Hifi hype. Which part of you really believes that some small hifi manufacturer can compete with giant highly resourced "real" tech companies? You are paying for 20mm think face plates and small production runs.
What are the softwares one can use on a Mac? I use iTune....
I am not suer if the rest is all BS.... like I said.... a non-compromise power supply like the one that comes with Burmester 069 makes a huge difference! The cheaper (US$30000) 089 can't even touch the 069!! |
"If the CD/DVD ROM can read bit perfect data, why should it matter if I use it as a transport?"
Because that's a much bigger if reading real time from an optical drive in general than with files stored on a computer hard drive. |
Hi Wayneker2176,
It is possible you just like something in the presentation of your 069. Job done.
But I would suggest for your Mac there are a few ripping softwares you could try. MAX is free and can convert to anything you like too. If you are a Mac guy then use Aiffs. It keeps all the artwork/metadata together unlike WAVs. Which makes looking through your library a pleasant experience.
Itunes sound is not as good as say Armarra, or pure vinyl, but maybe even that will change. Some of this may well be lost on you though if you are using a jittery optical or s/pdif to your DAC. On a DAC like yours it may not have that last bit of refinement from these inputs.
I doubt very much an optical or s/pdif could compete with FW.
What I meant by the price issue is that the software makes the hardware less important in your transport. Spend what you like, but I would save it for the DAC. The data being read from HD is just easier to process and all the errors have been dealt with by your nice new and hopefully free ripping software!
I would have a look at Weiss line and see how you get on. There are a few DACs starting to pop up now. A friend of mine swears by the expensive but good MSB diamond USB DAC. Its not a "looker" but it did sound very nice. |
Hello, this is very interesting and exiting thread.
I am following steps of the Wayneker2176 member here and pop a question.
Did anyone besides Chadeffect ACTUALLY compared the hi-end computer based front end (all top notch software like pure music, Amarra and others that outputs bit perfect files plus top of the line DACs) with Hi-End CD players like Esoteric x-03, x-01 limited , meridian 808.2, Wadia 581,781, DCS and others.
The convenience of the computer frond end is obvious. Some people go as far as connecting Mac mini with Ipad as a display, using apple-based applications. This is very cool.
But how about sound? Does the computer based front-end set-up sound really on the level of those hi-end CD players?
For example the Esoteric released the K-01 and K-03 players that now have (besides their known great transport) isolated on its own platform the USB input port with up to 24/196k transfer rate capability. Are playing the red book CD thru its transport will sound better or worse than ripping that same CD on the Apple Mac computer (bookpro or mac mini with SS drive) and playing it back using pure music or other engines thru the same Esoteric DAC utilizing that USB port? |
"The rest is BS. It is just pure data storage and number crunching."
Dont believe this. There are a LOT of affects in both ripping S/W, Playback S/W and the hardware playback device that affect sound quality. Do some more reading on the forums and you will realize this. There would be no market for devices like:
http://www.mach2music.com
Which makes a big sonic impact on audio streams
Or music playback software like Amarra, Pure Music or AyreWave, which all make itunes sound better. These deal with CODEC floating-point rounding and dithering correctly. iTunes does not.
Or ripping S/W like dbpoweramp and XLD, which are used with Accurate-Rip on the web to insure not only bit-perfect data but correct control and offset information in the frames.
Those in the know, have done all of these tweaks. If you are new to this, then there is a lot to learn.
Steve N.
Empirical Audio |
"I have linked the computer to DAC by using toslink and coaxial. I have even used my computer as the cd transport to play CDs rather than files linking to a DAC. none of these method sounds as good as burmester 069."
No surprise. You are probably playing back using iTunes on a PC or WMP. Complete junk.
You must jump through a few hoops in order to get the SQ that you need to beat your CD player. That's right not just match, but BEAT.
1) Rip with C2 correcting CDROM drive
2) Rip using dbpoweramp or XLD (Mac) with Accurate-Rip enabled.
3) playback using Foobar with Kernel Streaming on PC or Amarra/Pure Music/Ayrewave on a Mac. Playback from memory and SSD is even better
4) Avoid Toslink - get a good quality USB to S/PDIF coax converter or a USB DAC - should preferably use async protocol and have good clocks
For digital the clock is everything
Steve N.
Empirical Audio |
You must jump through a few hoops in order to get the SQ that you need to beat your CD player. That's right not just match, but BEAT. And same applies to a CD transport; you must jump through a few hoops in order to BEAT any computer audio currently available. 3) playback using Foobar with Kernel Streaming on PC or Amarra/Pure Music/Ayrewave on a Mac. Playback from memory and SSD is even better IMO, the J. River Media Center with ASIO4ALL (on Win 7, 64bit) offers better audio quality compared to Foobar with KS and any Apple-based playback. Playing from memory makes things even worse. Best, Alex Peychev |
This talk of CD drives in computers is nonsense. If they could not transfer the data properly none of our computers would work. So you really believe that transferring data correctly is the only requirement for "perfect audio quality"? Every CD player has C1 and C2 error correction built-in. This said, with a brand new clean CD, there are no errors coming even from a boom-box CD drive. But why it does not sound as good as a high-end transport then? Is it only clocking? Is it only jitter? Fplanner2010 you mention the use of coaxial (I assume the jittery s/pdif) which is a consumer digital in/out. Isnt that 75ohm system only capable of 24/96k in stereo if that? I am a bit confused as you mention 24/192. Sorry it has been a while and I have only really used AES/EBU 110 ohm digital ins/outs in the past. The "jittery" S/PDIF in Fplanner2010 NWO-M is used in a non-jittery way. :-) And no, it is not limited to 96/24; it is 192/24. Best, Alex Peychev |
