i want a dull, caramel colored cd player any ideas

9 rw, i have reviewed the following interconnect cable:

synergistic research, audioquest, soundstring and lefenburg by capativa

i have reviewed sound fusion sound busters anti resonant devices, sim audio eclipse cd player, minimax cd player and the channel islands audio dac.

i have also written feature articles covering such subjects as synergy, neutrality, the purpose of a stereo system, accuracy and musically and knowledge, opinion and the audio experience.

currently i am in the process of reviewing sunny cable technology cable, dcca cable and solitone cable.

i have temporarily replaced my quad 63s with magnepan 1.6s because oone of the quads requires a replacement of at least one panel and the possible cost may exceed my purchase price.

by the way please read my latest post regarding the thread "adaptation level theory and component evaluation" .

following your suggestion, i have attempted to "come clean".

I want exciting, revealing, jaw dropping sound. Is that too much to ask?

Mrtennis: As you can see, other people are curious about your claim that you're a "reviewer." This has nothing to do with any of us being angry. It has to do with integrity -- and you're the one who brought it up. What were you hoping to achieve?

Regardless, what are some of the components that you have reviewed? Is that top secret, too? Thanks!

hi tvad. i guess it's my fault. i can't tell when you're kidding or being serious.

in the future, i will assume you are joking and therefore won't take offense.

read my next thread . perhaps you'll find it interesting

by the way tvad, you seem to be rather full of yourself.

the way you order people around, you should have been a construction boss.

fortunately for me, you are not my boss, not my teacher, and not my parent. i suggest you lighten up.

you take audio and this forum much too seriously.

hi tvad, are you 9rw's clone ?

again it is easier to catch a fly with honey than with vinegar.

it's up to you to find out who the other reviewers are. it doesn't matter to me who is or is not a reviewer. being a reviewer is no big deal.

if you take reviews too seriously, that's your problem.

i respect your opinion, you are entitled to it. i'll leave it to your judgement what reviews are or are not suitabl;e reading material for various endeavors.

by the way do you have an anger management problem ?

you come accross as very hostile. have i offended your sensibilities ?

didn't your mother tell you, "if you have nothing good to say, be quiet" ?

>>i would prefer to put the cart after the horse<<

But won't that block our best view of you?

hi herman.

i have not found such a player. i don't think such a player exists.

whenever reading a review, the reviewer states his/her reference system and you would note all of the components which were included as part of the review.

the only reason for you to be concerned about my unusual preference is in the event, you were unaware of a component.

however, in any review it is possible that there is at least one component which you have never encountered or heard of.

i would prefer to put the cart after the horse.

if you read a review and you are unfamiliar with a component, just ask me about it. my vast experience attending ces and other shows may be of help to you.

at this time, given the "controversy" that has ensued as a consequence of my many threads and posts, i chose not to divulge my name.

i feel i am in good company, because i am not aware of the names of other reviewers who frequently post on audiogon, who have admitted to being reviewers.

one more thing about reviews: given the nature of what a review is being aware of reviewer preferences does not help you because a professional reviewer does not let his preferences interfere with his task, which is honest reporting.

reading a review will not help you avoid a mistake. i don't take reviews seriously. they are just entertainment.

i enjoy and am challenged when i write them, but i don't take them too seriously and you shouldn't either.

sorry i can't be of more help, but i must protect myself from over zealous, dogmatic individuals who may cause trouble.

your understanding is greatly appreciated.

Mr Tennis, in another thread (just deleted by Audiogon I assume because it deteriorated into a pissing contest) you told us you were an audio reviewer. Is this the player you intend to use in your reference system for reviews?

I think it would be nice if you identify yourself so if I run across one of your reviews I can factor in your unusual preferences stated above.

get a vintage old JBL speaker

No, you have to wait three years & 10 months before you sell.

I have a totally different system now.

I mentioned the problem may be elsewhere in your system, so let me elaborate on that, especially since you think the BAT may not be the final solution.

I would first recommend that you replace your receptacle with an unplated unit like the Porter Port and eliminate any silver that may be in your system, be it power cords, spkr. cables or interconnects.

I'm not after the same sonic presentation that you are but I can't stand any harshness or brightness and have tried many combinations. As a result of my experimentations, I would think something like the HT Truthlink would work well for you in the IC dept. If you use balanced connections, simple pro audio cables will do the trick. These rec's are the first two I thought of.

PC's can play a big factor too, so those are worth examining. If you've upgraded your PC's, you might want to revert back to stock, although some aftermarket PC's can alter the presentation to the point of dulling the sound.

BTW, it took me about three yrs and ~75 cable changes to get where I am today. In the last 4 yrs, I've basically stayed with the same IC & spkr. cable manufacturer while continuing to mildly experiment w/DIY and aftermarket PC's.

Finally, the biggest contributor to your sound is probably the room itself. Definitely worth looking into, although sometimes, there are no options available to work with, eg the WAF.

i have settled on a cd player.

it may not be dull, but according to recommendations, may be one the warmer players out there and gives me the opportunity to change spectral balance by finding a suitable 6922.

the player is the BAT VK D5.

did anyone mention dipping the current cdp into a tub of maple syrup?

Get all PS Audio Prelude power cords and put 4 vibrapods under every component. These should dull the sound like nothing else. Get all Audioquest copper cables, their mid line, like Jaguar. Get Zu Cable Libtec speaker cables. Get RGPC power conditioners for your cd player and the pre-amp. All this combined should get you the results you're asking for. Bat player is a good machine, but last time I heard it, I do not recall that it sounded dull.

i'm considering a bat vk d5. i have a post requesting opinions about the sound of this cd player. the post may not appear for 4 to 8 hours.

i may have to make a decision tomorrow.

i would appreciate any ideas.

I have the same tastes in frequency response but I am always afraid to voice it because of the obvious reactions.

I finally found the older Grado cartridges and was in heaven until the CD arrived. I have thrown thousands of dollars at my system trying to replicate that sound with CD with no success. I can listen to the newer cds from the last two or three years but not most of the 2000 older cds in my collection.

I actually gave in and put an equalizer in the tape monitor loop so when my ears hurt I hit the switch.
Not the same as the Grado but at least bearable.

Please let me know if you find an answer.
Thanks, Ed Lanway, DC

phd, i thank you for your understanding.

at this point let me try to put things into context.

i have listened to many components which have been described as warm sounding , balanced, not irritating, etc.

i have been to 12 CES shows, numerous stereophile shows in NYC and i have been a member of an audio club for 20 years.

i admit that my preference is quite different than most "audiophiles".

i felt that in order to attain a sense of an organic full bodied sound, i would ask for suggestions for a "dull" presentation, figuring that if i found acd player with that attribute, i could live with it.

i also admit that i have not considered the sensibilities of other people and could have worded my request differently.

i suppose i came accross as provocative and challenging the way others like to listen to music.

so, i have been duly chastened and perhaps deserved some of the criticism.

i apologize to those whom i offended.

i have been speaking to scott nixon about modifying his tube dac to soften it a little, and hopefully that will come to pass.

i have the CAL Alpha and Delta and have been using NOS tubes. it's not a bad combination.

i found a line cord by DCCA audio which i like, which is on the warm side and hopefully with a little tweaking, can realize a sound that comes close to my Audionote CD2 with a GE 5751 black plate.

again, thanks for your understanding.

all of these postings have taught me a valuable lesson in life--don't be a bull in achina shop.

Mrtennis, aside from the entertainment value of this post, I'll bite and consider your statements as being sincere.

You are certainly entitled to the listening experience that you might enjoy most. I believe your quest has landed you in the right place. With that I propose you subscribe to the cliché "one man's junk...". Now utilizing your particular sound attributes as keywords in an Audigon discussions search I believe you will find an enormous wealth of gear bashing discussion that would certainly identify just what you might be looking for. There is one caveat however - there is always the chance that such discussions will lead you to that extremely dull sounding CDP and once you buy one based on these posters "in depth analysis", you may find that after listening for yourself it is actually very dynamic and detailed, perhaps even very musical with great soundstage and separation. Now that my friend would be very disappointing, wouldn't it?

You have to love them blankets. Sometime ago I recall a preamp shipped to me wrapped up in a dirty blanket, it arrived in perfect condition. I'm hoping on my next audio purchase to receive a set of king size sheets. Anyway it could be that sheets are the ticket as opposed to blankets for the desired sound as they may be slightly more neutral.

Mrtennis in all due respect it would of been far better to ask opinions on a warmer sounding CD player rather your intial choice of words. My first reaction to your thread was that this was either a troll or you were just being funny which in turn diminished your sincerity in my opinion. I can say one thing for sure, with all prejudice set aside, this has been a very entertaining thread & could be that some of us have misunderstood your true intentions.

Cruz, the problem with blankets (I've tried) is they might work great for the midrange, but they'd be too heavy for the for the treble and to light for the bass. I tried some blankets that were alpaca & cotton blends and they tended too wooly on the bass.

Natural fibers like silk worked to the treble, but did nothing to caramelize the midrange. Once when i was caramelizing some onions I used butter, so I spread butter on the midrange of my MBL speakers. This did not solve the problem, so I sold them here on AudiogoN The buyer told me they had a very liquid midrange, but I was going for caramel.

As it turned out heavy rayon worked for the midrange, but Cashmere was the only thing to do the trick for the bass. It has to be three ply cashmere though, Landsend and other cheap stuff will not do the trick.

I hope this helps. If it doesn't work, I would still suggest getting some crappy cables to make the CDP sound it's worst. I suggest a DIY CAT 5 if you really want something rolled off, dull and lifeless. I know those characteristics are not really caramel colored, but you might have to make do, with what you can get!

Best of luck!

>>"BTW, he does own a very nice turntable with a Grado cartridge."<<
[Reb1208]
>>>>>>>>>

Well, imho, that would rule out my suggestion of using Mullard tubes in his preamp. The combo of the warm sounding Grado cart and the Mullard tubes would be so soothing he might fall asleep.....

Still might be worth the effort to try the Mullard tube in his CDP.
===============

Mrtennis, the reason I asked your age was because of what I perceived you were trying to say in your thread. I am glad to hear I am not the only one out there who finds harsh bright high pitch sounds hurts my ears. I guess it is all part of the aging process.
Jim

I'm glad to read some constructive posts aimed at helping out Mr. Tennis. I happen to know this person and can assure you he is sincere. BTW, he does own a very nice turntable with a Grado cartridge.

I would suggest draping blankets, of varying degrees of thickness, over your speakers until you reach the desired effect.

Mr Tennis - The Jolida is actually 24/92.

Though to be honest, I don't think less "resolution" is the sound that you're looking for.

I think you are looking for a sound that is warm, with ample midbass and lowermidrange, and subdued upper frequencies that is as non offensive as possible.

The thing is - you can have this sound while still maintaining the resolution in the frequency spectrum EQ'd with equipment and room the way you want it.

More resolution means more "real," a step closer to what actual acoustic music performed in front of you right in front of you.

You sound like someone who needs a turntable.??? All of this will be moot, because there won't be any sampling or bits.

But anyway, to pursue your sound, start with any high quality, warmish cd player, and use the room and your speakers to tune to your sound. Fight that right preamp that sounds just right to you.

hi tubemiser:

i am considering a granite audio 657, a unison unico and someone suggested a jolida.

i'm beginning to realize that the best i can get, is a cd player that is balanced, without any undue emphasis upon any part of the frequency spectrum.

i am focusing on tubed cd players because there is a chance that finding a nos tube might create some subtractive coloration, especially with respect to high frequencies.

my experience at CES and Stereophile shows, tells me that 24/192 players with up sampling will only highlight the flaws of bad recordings.

most cd players today are 24/192, including the jolida, so i have to hope that the right tube can partially compensate for the high resolution of current cd players.

i also realize that most audiophiles like the high resolution format, so i ahev been criticized somewaht for taking a very unpopular position.

hopefully, as i explain myself and people get to hear some of my comments they will realize i not trying to a non conformist for its own sake.

Mr Tennis -

Do Try a Jolida CD Player. I have one. It is a very warm sounding player. Even moreso if you put a mair of Mullards in it. I would also try a Rega cd player, as they have a quite warm "house sound," which is strange to me, because their turntables are very different.

However - given your taste, I wonder why you are not an analog guy? A VPI table with a Koetsu or even Grado cartridge sounds right up your alley.

Mrtennis - Can you let us know what players are in the running in your quest for dullness? Yes, this is an unsual request. Good Luck.

I do understand what are you talking about. since day one of CD, i was thinking of them as sharp as hell medium. during the years every generation of CD players have better sharpness, resolution, details and so on, which makes them up until now pretty unlistenable and harsh. when I read reviews which have spoken about 'clear sound' of a certain CD player I know it is a signal to avoid such thing. CD's are too much clear in nature, so i don't understand why people even today are chasing clearer and more detailed sound. return of tubes is a sign of something is gone wrong with that sound.

well, i can tell how slow, soft, warm, boring, and rolled off sound has Audio Analogue Primo CD. it is 18-bit machine and it will not offend you in any way.

Maybe you could try down grading your cables since everyone knows cables are the most important part of the system, and change the sound more than anything else!~

Rather than change the source, your target would be a FR that dips at 3kHz & falls over 10kHz, with no midbass coupling b/ween the spkrs (i.e. minimise "dynamics).
What you want can easily be achieved with some room padding (1st reflections for sure) and bad spkr positioning (this will help compromise dynamics). Also, you may try padding the spkrs' tweet. Use a +5W, 8-10ohm resistor across the tweets. Proceed carefully!

OTOH, why on earth would you do that??

my point is that in life one assumes innocent until proven otherwise

That's life (or really only the platonic ideal of the justice system) -- this is the internet. Also, on the internet as in life, one should try to be cognizant of the rules of the game if one does not want to feel cheated by the experience. But we all have to start somewhere with every new venture.

if you have any constructive suggestions i would be glad to hear them

If what you're claiming is literally true, then I would guess you should probably go to an ear doctor, get tested, and maybe get fitted for a set of custom-tailored in-ear filters to make life, or at least listening, tolerable.

thank you again mr. z for a thorough explanation.

ket me see if i understand the issue you raise.

i have indicated a desire to achieve a sonic presentation which lacks credibility with some individuals. i am allegedly desiring to attain the worst sound as phd staes and that position is not believable. it would then appear to some that i am disingenuous, or insincere in my request and have other agendas.

ok, you and others are entitled to your opinion.

you are implying that i am looking for a reaction and enjoying the result, so it seems.

if i say again that i dislike high frquencies and actually enjoy listening to a presentation devoid of clarity, will you now believe me or is such a position so unlikely that you still doubt the veracity of words.

my point is that in life one assumes innocent until proven otherwise.

you are assuming the opposite, i.e, accusing me and then saying the burdrn is on me to demonstrate the opposite.

i would hope a man of your education and intelligence, which by now i have great respect would take the opposite approach, namely, not a troll, or not an instigator, or not a churl until other facts are in.

as it stands now, i have gotten a few useful suggestions, accusations and the rest, sillyness.

just as you said, i don't take it seriously, audio is just a hobby.

i don't think that i am trying to extricate myself from a situation, because there is insufficient information to justify the attribute.

i bear no ill will to anyone.

you can see my other post which asks for information about cd players under construction which are not 24/192.

you made a valid point. will most likely not find the cd player of my dreams.

i may find one which does not irritate my ears, so if you have any constructive suggestions i would be glad to hear them.

Mrtennis: Go back and reread my first post. If you were sincere, your seemingly highly satirical method of communicating it -- especially in light of your total lack of Audiogon history -- was completely out of whack. Sincere contributors, while they may joke around at times, aren't in the habit of posting threads that look for all the world like a troll. Personally, I'll stand by my very reasonable -- based on the evidence -- interpretation, and continue to think you might just be changing your tune now to wiggle out of a jam, or more likely still having your fun with a troll, until you acquire a track record around here to prove otherwise. It's nothing personal, just based on experience and what you wrote. I note I'm not the only one to take what you wrote the way I did. If I was wrong, I regret the misunderstanding, but don't feel I'm to blame for it. If you're not trying to have us on, then it's up to you not to come across like it.

thank you mr z. for yor analysis.

you assume on the basis of my original post that i wasn't serious and therefore insincere and waisting peoples time. when you assume... you know the rest.

in the future it would be wise not to assume anything. it is certainly a nicer way to behave as a human being.

since i can in no way be responsible for your behavior, i question why you are so rude ?

You could try a fullrange driver loudspeaker some of the affordable models roll off highs a bit so you get more of the dark side in your sound.

this can't be tellig....he loves everything.

if people just used logic and took my request literally at face value

Members using logic and taking your words at face value is what got us here in the first place Mrtennis. Let's revisit some of those words for a moment, shall we?

"i like a dull, veiled, laid,back, boring sound capable of putting me to sleep. i hate treble and i don't like detail. i like subtractive coloration to such an extent that all recordings sound the same...veil the sound and cut off the highs. darkness and dullsville is my motto"

Followed up by this evergreen gem,

"what evidence do you have that i am insincere ?...is there anything i said which sounds like i don't mean what i say ??"

Uhh, only everything?

[if people] tried to answer the question seriously with respect, i don't think we would be going back and forth on this

If your post seemed either serious or respectful I might agree -- as it is, going back and forth appears to be what you wanted (it's called a troll, and yes I'm indulging you)

i am really surprised so many people are reacting angrily, as if i have insulted them

Doubt anybody's actually angry or insulted. But surprised you shouldn't be if you waste people's time

an obvious answer to my question, which i am aware of is to use an equalizer and forget about the cd player.

i am surprised nobody has suggested that.

Velo62 did just that in the fifth response (now you can be surprised)

another answer/opinion would be that such a component does not exist as an amp, preamp, cd player or speaker.

Hmm, ya think?

i am slowly coming to that conclusion.

At 64? That is slow.

the reason for asking the question is the hope that i am wrong and there is a cd player that is consitent with my sonic preference, but i guess insecure audiophiles have their own agendas

Well Mrtennis, when you have an agenda of 1 -- however secure -- you really can't expect an industry to cater to it

mrtennis,

Once, using CAL Audio's Delta and Alpha player, I used a Cardas Golden Cross interconnect as digital cable. That combo had one of the most veiled and syrupy sound I've heard yet from digital.

hi jea48:

i have tried ferrite beads, they do more harm than good. i am 64 years old. i have an all tube system with quad 63 speakers.

my preference runs toward a vvary dark and veiled sound. that is my taste.

i am really surprised so many people are reacting angrily, as if i have insulted them for prefrring a sound they don't liek and perhaps implying i am questioning their judgment as to the criteria ofr good sound.

if people just used logic and took my request literally at face value and tried to answer the question seriously with respect, i don't think we would be going back and forth on this.

an obvious answer to my question, which i am aware of is to use an equalizer and forget about the cd player.

i am surprised nobody has suggested that.

another answer/opinion would be that such a component does not exist as an amp, preamp, cd player or speaker.

i am slowly coming to that conclusion.

the reason for asking the question is the hope that i am wrong and there is a cd player that is consitent with my sonic preference, but i guess insecure audiophiles have their own agendas.

gentlemen:

what right does anyone have to question my sincerity ?

it is your opinion that i want the worst sound. perhaps, you are listening to the worst sound, and i want the best sound. it's all a matter of opinion.

i'm sorry you are all taking it so personally.

evryone has the right to statisfy his/her sonic preferences without being judged by others.

remember, those who question my sincerity may at some future time have their integrity or sincerity questioned.

look in the mirror before questioning anyone's sincerity.

watch out someone may put a pin in your big ego.

Mrtennis, To give you the benefit of doubt, is your problem with your CDP that it causes your ears to hurt from the sound of your system? May I ask you your age?

Have your tried ferrite beads on the power cord of the CDP? On the ics from the CDP to the preamp?

What is the make-up of your system?