You might have to use an actual car buffer, the rotating wheel with some speed and use a good amount of polish carefull not to burn the finish or if there is a clear coat. But basically by hand sounds like you will not have the pressure or speed to remove, I am no expert but it fixes pretty good swirls and scraps in a mercedes benz finish and since you already have a screwed up finish it can't hurt if you do it carefully not to damage.
HELP...Bubble Wrap Marks in PIANO BLACK Speakers??
I just purchased a pair of Piano Black speakers here on Audiogon. I received them today (9/12/06) nicely packed and carefully wrapped with bubble wrap. As I unpacked & unraveled the bubble wrap from each speaker, I noticed the bubble wrap left round shaped dot marks on the Piano Black finish of each speaker. It is not something that can be felt with the finger, so I thought it would wash off easily.
I tried cleaning with water, Windex & Orange BLAST Auto/Shop degreaser. Nothing worked. Then I tried Liquid Glass auto polish and Zymol cleaner wax. Still, I can't remove the bubble wrap markings. I even tried 70% rubbing alcohol in a tiny back corner. That did not work either.
I'm getting a bit nervous now, since these speakers were stored several months in this wrapping and they're all covered with the marks like leopard spots. I don't know if the marks will come out now, or how the Seller will respond to this. He is aware of the marks, but not that I can't get them out. I'd really like to remove the marks and to keep the speakers. Does anyone have suggestions for a cleaner for this?
I tried cleaning with water, Windex & Orange BLAST Auto/Shop degreaser. Nothing worked. Then I tried Liquid Glass auto polish and Zymol cleaner wax. Still, I can't remove the bubble wrap markings. I even tried 70% rubbing alcohol in a tiny back corner. That did not work either.
I'm getting a bit nervous now, since these speakers were stored several months in this wrapping and they're all covered with the marks like leopard spots. I don't know if the marks will come out now, or how the Seller will respond to this. He is aware of the marks, but not that I can't get them out. I'd really like to remove the marks and to keep the speakers. Does anyone have suggestions for a cleaner for this?
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I don't have an answer, but if I had this problem, I would try contacting either the speaker manufacturer or a piano company such as Steinway and ask for suggestions. But I do know from experience that piano black finishes scratch very easily - even from light pressure - with the wrong cloth or cleaner. Hope this helps |
Tekhifi: Are the speakers new? or have they been recently refinished. Was this the original finish? Contact the manufacturer . Can you find what type of finish is it i.e. thermoplastic (nitrocellulose or acrylic) or urethane. Is the finish hard enough if you pressure it with a fingernail does it get marked? Do you know if this was on the speakers before you acquired them? If thermoplastic you can carefully heat one of the spots with a hair drier to see if the mark disminishes. CAREFUL you can cause harm if overheat try in a not that visible spot like the speakers back near the floor side. Possible options are 1- polish them off 2- refinish the speaker . your comments |
Did any of the remedies tried make ANY improvement? Black finish is beautiful but a nightmare to keep from marks and superficial scratches. I have a black ebony piano and have had good luck with a good mildly abrasive car cleaner. It may be the bubble wrap etched into the finish for some reason.Was the original owner aware if these were on the finish before shipping? |
This may be of no relevance, but... My Verdier Platine TT is piano black, and when I had the armboard drilled, we used a paper towel wrapped around the armboard to protect it while we were using a vise and drill press. Soon as we removed the armboard, we noticed that there were marks on the armboard corresponding to the small bumps on the paper towel. These could not be felt or polished out, but the next day they were all gone. It seems the piano finish as used on the Verdier table tends to absorb moisture from items contacting it, and given a chance to air dry, the moisture evaporated from the finish. You might want to carefully try a hair drier on low heat to see if it has any effect. Hope this is your problem. |
I have wrapped my piano black Apogee speakers twice in plastic wrap in the past(when purchased used from audiogon member & house remodel) with no problems. The plastic does leave a temporary swirl like mark in a few spots but after a cleaning with Windex there look like new! I think the bubble wrap might have had some sort of residue on it that left the permanent marks on the speakers. What brand/model are they? VMPS RM40? Good luck! |
STOP! Don't try anything else on your speakers. You have what are called "pack marks" in the trade and the only way to remove them is to buff them out. A buffing/polishing machine is best, but it can be done by hand. I'd start with 3M Imperial Microfinishing Compound-Liquid. If that doesn't get them out you'll have to step down to 3M Super Duty Rubbing Compound, but try not to go there. Finish with 3M Foam Polishing Pad Glaze. If at all possible have this done by a refinishing/restoration shop for the best results. |
I had a similar problem and I used 3M Imperial Microfinishing glaze that contains no silicone or wax.. Part No. 05992 This is not always available but try to check this out with a car store. It is a little bit pricey and if you cannot obtain it, and all others failed, let me know.. I may be able to give you a small amount.. |
I think the suggestion about a mild abrasive may be right. If these are indeed a piano black paint finish over veneer, then some car polish may be just the trick. I once owned a pair of Roman Audio Centurions with the Galaxy Cream finish and the manufacturer suggested car wax to maintain them. I would try a little on a rag in an unobtrusive area to see what the results might be. Oz |
Thanks Guys: All good suggestions, but they didn't work. The speakers are serveral years old, so it is a hard finish. I was told different types of wool are used on buffing wheels and I'm afraid in the wrong hands more damage can be done to the finish and/or drivers. I am reluctant to try a hair dryer in fear of baking the marks on. And lastly, I'm not sure this is women's work (LOL). Keep the suggestions coming, please. |
In somewhat similar but not exact situations, I have been able to remove residue or small marks with BRASSO. It is an extremely mild abrasive and the distilate helps in the cleaning. I believe it will work and as long as you do not apply too much pressure, it works as a fine polish for most everything including lacquer finishes, plastic, and of course metal. There is no downside unless you apply too much pressure at one time. Polish slowly and patiently. There is one downside. If the original finish is flat, using the BRASSO will polish it to gloss. |
I don't have any experience with the particular problem you're having but assuming the finish is some sort of synthetic lacquer or similar you might try something like the Novus plastic polishes. It comes in three grades and can be used progressively. I've used it for years on plexiglass and acrylic on both boats and motorcycles. Novus polishes |
I would return them to the seller, any furniture grade finish should be protected by a non-marring packaging, and unfortunately the speakers were not. If the seller did not disclose this nor did they inspect the speakers before selling, it should be their problem to handle. I would not mess with it any more as the seller will likely not accept them back if you degrade the finish in your attempts to fix it. Any fine furniture store will tell you you never use reactive materials such as plastic on a gloss finish. Movers always use cloth pads and/or soft pile lined burlap to protect expensive furniture. |
if you don't want to return the speakers, your only other choice is to re-finish them. Because I doubt the stains will go away. You can actually contact places that fix and re-finish pianos and ask them what they think. There could have been some sort of reaction between the bubble wrap and th speaker finish that the stains you see now are below the paint |
I own Wilson Sophia 2's. They come wrapped in a plastic peel-off coat. They warn you to not leave this plastic sheet coating on to long. Temp and humidity up and downs may be why the bubble imprints are there in the first place,thus,tough to remove. Also, maybe the bubble-wrap was "dirty" to some extent before hand?? I think these may have been wrapped longer than stated, before shipping? I too would be angry, and then some!!!! |
I have no clue how the bubble wrap can leave permanent marks on the piano finish of the speakers. Since you have tried various methods without any degrees of success, I would stop trying. You won't know as you may do more harm than good. As some posters have suggested, it may be wise to contact a piano store that refurbishes/reconditions used pianos. They would have a better idea on how to solve your problem. Normally they would grind of visible scratches and respray using special paint. If you do not want all this hassle you might want to contact the seller. |
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The bubble wrap petrochemicals have reacted with the lacquer or the lacquer was not completely cured when it was wrapped (takes several weeks to cure and it must be able to breathe and bubble wrap could prevent the surface breathing)...a polishing tool may help...don't use abrasive ....simply buff buff buff buff gently using broad strokes over the entire surface (don't concentrate on the damaged point alone)...if that doesn't work then the damage has affected more than just the surface layers of the lacquer ....you need to get a pro piano restorer to look at it as you may need many new coats of lacquer...a lengthy job to repair unfortunately. |
Just a note, normally the professional that refurbishes pianos would advise against a total repaint job since they wouldn't look good compared to original even though they have done a good job. In most cases they would try to grind off and polish the finish to get rid of visible scratches. A paint job is for very serious defects or damage. I sympathize with your situation. Let us know when you have overcome your predicament. |
