Haven't heard, but interested in what responses you get.
I'm drawn to the looks of those slotted apertures on the LS5/5 and wonder if the theory behind them works(?).
Though I'm not in the market for another speaker the LS5/5 is weirdly desirable to me as an historical curio alone. |
op the harbeth mon 40 series has always had a forward (but excellently detailed and nuanced) midrange... it is characteristic of that speaker, despite it huge size and excellent capability also in the treble and bass regions @tobes you can search bbc ls5/5, there is plenty written about the bbc speaker development program that created the various models... see link below for the seminal white paper written on the ls5/5 design... the cabinet slit is to manage horizontal directivity, but like any other design choice, it comes with tradeoffs (sec 4.1) http://downloads.bbc.co.uk/rd/pubs/reports/1967-57.pdfthe nearest relative to the ls5/5 is the modern spendor sp100/classic 100 series |
@jjss49 i have indeed read the seminal papers and understand the concept of the slots.
my question really is posed to someone who has heard both the speakers. |
Looking at the graphs in the BBC paper there doesn't appear to be any advantage to using the slot for the bass driver when utilised in the 3-way design(?).
Hard to tell from the graphs if there is much advantage to using the mid-slot either.
Anyway I suppose the proof is in the listening.
Looks like Graham must have done away with the 4db bass boost via preamp EQ with their iteration.
The design does look very retro-cool though.
Will be interested to hear of any comparisons to the M40.
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Heard Harbeth 40's and just too forward sounding to me YMMV. Could never live with a speaker like that. |
@redwoodaudio owns or has owned the Grahams. AFAIK, the only person on A'gon who has them in house.
I wouldn't describe the Harbeths as forward, certainly not according to how I understanding that adjective. By small increments Harbeths have been moving towards a more "modern" sound. The 40.3XD does not sound exactly the same as the 40.2, and the 40.2 is a little more room friendly than the 40.1
Same can be said of the progression of the Spendors from SP100 versions to Classic 100.
Having wanted to hear them but never had the opportunity, not sure where the Grahams fall in all this.
Given recent price increases, from my perspective bargains are to be had with gently used Spendor SP100 Mk II's and Harbeth 40.2's.
Check my system to see that I'm speaking from direct acquaintance. |
Can’t help with the comparison as I’ve only ever directly compared the 30.2 with Graham’s LS5/9 back to back in my house. Consistently preferred the Grahams in that case due to better treble extension and air. That’s why I bought the LS5/5s, which I bought without an audition of either them or the 40.2/3s. I am LOVING the LS5/5s but would probably feel similarly about the 40.2s if I’d gone with them.
He’s a dealer for Graham, so he’s not exactly a neutral party here, but Erik from Gig Harbor Audio has heard the best of all Graham’s, Harbeths, and Spendors, and sold me the LS5/5s. PM me for more info… |
I can say this- Listened to the Graham $18k and $23k speakers
in August.
I heard the 30.2 and 40.2 at Axpona or RMAF in 2019.
Preferred the 30.2 over the 40.2. Same sized hotel room
for both and was probably too small for the 40.2s.
As for the Grahams. Flawless sound and very neutral.
Although at these prices I think there may be better out there.
I appreciate engagement. |
the reality is, all these are tip top speakers in the bbc heritage, produced by two of illustrious current producers
thus in a good setup, with proper accompanying componentry, good room, any and all will sound brilliant (save the mon 30, which will still need low bass support from sub(s))
op has asked a hard question - which is how two such competing 20k+ speakers sound different each other - and we all know there is only one way to really know... (even competing displays in different rooms in a high end show wouldn’t answer that question properly) |
Sorry i dint mean to ask a hard question - it was a real desire to know the diff :) i find there is little in terms of comparisons between thr top end BBC (ish) type speakers. So its the usual questions for around $22k Which one is the better buy? How do they compare? Etc etc. its becoming increasingly hard to hear these speakers back to back so the only option is to ask, and then try to set up a comparison for one self.
For $20k Grahams aren’t ubiquitously reviewed....specially the 5/5’s.
Hence the hard q :) |
I recently dropped some money on a nice lampizator dac, absolare integrated amp, and some good cables, having first spent big money on the LS5/5s earlier this year. The LS5/5s are like a giant clear window into the rest of the system. You’ll enjoy them with merely very good gear like I did for a while, but they are almost overwhelmingly invisible and real with a clean very powerful signal in a good room. Truly full-range and very ‘alive’ without fatigue. No second guessing. |
@echoz hard questions are absolutely allowed, and welcome... though convenient and good answers may be hard to come by the following review may help a bit... as i mentioned earlier, the modern iteration of the spendor sp100 is the closest analog to the ls5/5 by graham, minus the vertical face slots... (i currently have the prior gen sp100 r2 and i had the mon 40.1 in the past, i would say this review is reasonably on target) http://highfidelity.pl/@main-1106&lang=en |
I listened to the Spendor Classic 100 in an excellent dealer's system (in the UK) and know the 40.2's well. This is not a direct orange-to-orange comparison, because the 40.2's were followed by the Anniversary and now the 40.3XD. I found the Spendor's slightly more muscular and vigorous, but would have been more than happy to own them. Same afternoon compared with Spendor D series and for me the Classic's were head and shoulders better. Like I said, no experience of Graham, more's the pity. |
Sorry , but for my money I'd buy the British built ATC
SCM50 SL
passive classic series speakers, for 20K.
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Hi @alucard19 - appreciate your pov. Have u heard the Ls5/5 and the Harbeths as well ? |
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Sorry , but for my money I'd buy the British built ATC SCM50 SL passive classic series speakers, for 20K. not for mine... |
@echoz - I have heard both the Ls5/5 and the Harbeth 40.3 and in my opinion the Harbeth's don't project as uniformly as well as the Ls5/5 doesalso I prefer my music a bit louder, while the ATC SCM50 SL handle more power I feel they are also better suited for orchestra and electronic music which is a bit more detail oriented.But we each have our own tastes, I have listened at great lengths to the ATC speakers and for me they check all of the boxes for my style of music and my system.
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@alucard19 now that is a proper curve ball :)
so based on your listening its atc scm50 > ls5/5 > 40.3 |
The hardest speaker to manage to listen to is the Spendor Classic
100. It is a no-show at the few, rare stocking dealers in the USA. Love the old BC1s.
I have heard the all the Harbeths and personally prefer the HLS 5+
followed by the 30.2 and the 40.2 comes in 3rd. Just my ears.
Heard the ATC 40 passives a few times and they were the people's choice in our Speakerfest 2019 event. Heard them again in May and they
are super clear. Poorer recordings really can't be listened to.
Grahams are Eric's choice from Gig Harbor Audio- one of my favorite haunts. Last month I listened for a good while to his top models.
So Mr. Echo I suggest a trip to the Great NW and a visit to Gig Harbor
Audio-Graham and Hawthorne Stereo-for Harbeth.
Someone once told be the truly best sound comes from Stirling
speakers. May have to visit London to hear those.
Final word-Harbeths resell pretty fast.
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@echoz You really need to listen to various makes and models in person; it's too risky basing a purchase of this magnitude on votes in a thread.
I don't dispute what @chorus heard, but here's my contrasting experience. Listened to SHL5+ at Hawthorne in Seattle, in that brick-walled room with top-end Naim, and found them unbearably bright. Heard 30.2 at CAF and thought them very good though inevitably with restricted bottom end. Heard 40.2's at Deja Vu in Washington DC and immediately fell in love with them. As I said, I was in England when I heard the Spendor Classics.
Inevitably, YMMV.
If you do start to try to hear some models, add the Yamaha NS-5000 to your list. |
I dont think anybody is debating that there is nothing like listening. However given the current circumstances its not possible to listen.....hence the question to compare. @twoleftears - u purchased the 40.2 but couldnt listen to the 5/5 and that is unfortunate.
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This was a couple of years ago. At that time I think the only pair of 5/5's this side of the Atlantic was in Canada. And don't think I didn't think about it... |
@echoz - you’ll probably love any of these speakers at this level of bbc monitor style and probably love the ATCs as well. These are strong speakers that all will like and most will love. No weaknesses of the smaller siblings, which are all great natural sounding monitors regardless. |
As a Quad 57 owner for over 30 years, I finally gave up on them and purchased a pair of Harbeth 40.1's. Listening at the apex of an approximate isosceles triangle(about 10 ft. on each side) the 40.1's are almost as transparent as the Quads but of course can play much louder. Augmented by a good subwoofer and with DSpeaker bass correction, the resulting sound on vinyl can be spectacular(assuming a good vinyl recording) |
[OFF-TOPIC, sorry - I don’t see a way to contact a member with private message for off-topic questions - any tip?] @ken7, How did you (physically) connect your DSpeaker box to your amp/or/preamp, and to the suwoofer? I am considering this little affordable box to correct a subwoofer (yet to find) to partner my Harbeth M30.2 Anniversary.Thanks |
@redwoodaudio could you please PM me? I can't so it, I don't know why
or can you write me an email (my address is dvlever@gmail.com)?
I have a question about Ls 5/5
thanks
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I don’t dispute what @chorus heard, but here’s my contrasting experience. Listened to SHL5+ at Hawthorne in Seattle, in that brick-walled room with top-end Naim, and found them unbearably bright.
Old post. I have SHL5+ with mid range Naim. The Harbeth sounded most dynamic and lively with the Naim. Lusher, reduced treble energy and more laidback presentation with other amps. I prefer the presentation of the Harbeth with Naim.
I also favor the SHL5+ over M40 and 40.1 versions(I only heard these models) mainly for its versatility and sound quality. I find the bass output of the 40s to be not agile enough for my preferences. The bass of the M40s is full and deep but it isn’t quick enough. The bass of the SHL5+ shows better speed, sounding quicker and tighter. It’s lighter on its feet and goes sufficiently deep, good enough for me.
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