For classical music lovers best amp for large orchestral forces?

What about an ARC 75SE…? They come on the used market often and it may give you an opportunity to see if the upgrade to an 80s or 160s is worth it…? I had a gryphon Diablo 300 and did just that. The Gryphon had incredible head room and iron fist bass control, but it was a little too dark and clinical for me. The ARC amp was buttery and lovely and not at all harsh with plenty of party for loud passages. I sold the gryphon, bought a used REF 6SE and a brand new 160s and, well… I’m a happy boy. My speakers are Sonus Faber Serafino’s.

I don’t know your speakers, but my Amp Journey took me from McIntosh to Gryphon to Audio Research.

good luck…!

You’ve got to love it when people say they want to spend X dollars and get suggestions for components costing several multiples of X. Either some people are very careless readers or they are so wealthy that  $10 or $20k is an insignificant rounding error. 🙄

What sources are you using? Is this both with digital and analogue sources?

I can’t speak to your speakers and matching, but my Boulder 1160 attached to my Wilson Alexia 2s will blow your mind at the end of Mahler 2. The timpani shake your chest. The organ will rattle your brain. I love it. 

@roxy1927 

hi there. I hear you loud and clear. For my profession I get to sit in a front violin chair in a great symphony orchestra. I listen to all music, jazz, rock, chamber music and also orchestral. There is no denying orchestral music reveals where ones system is at. It tells the story. I only in the last 2 years got into this because during covid I wasn’t performing. I was introduced to one of the worlds great stereo set up people and he has helped me build what is turning out to be a great system. I recently purchased a store demo VTL S-400 ii. It is a fabulous amp. Beyond fabulous, makes my integrated Luxman 590 II sound like a noisy plastic toy. For real. I will be making a major upgrade eventually from my modified AR pre, to CH precision. A great/quiet  pre is so important for classical. For orchestral you just want an amp that gets out of its own way but has a proper decay harmonically. The VtL i bought has that in spades. Reason is I have learned and spoken to Bea Lamm who is the ears behind VTL. She loves classical and we had an interesting conversation. No doubt Pass has some homogenization in the sound. Not sure 8k will take you where you want to go with orchestral. It certainly did not for me. I have also found through much trial that the quieter the system is the more orchestral loves it. For me starting with basic cables (just to hear the transformation) and introducing better and better cables one at a time to see if that was indeed useful has also helped classical in a huge way. in that regard I have heard such a huge transition from so much noise in a system to what my wife and I are finally calling a quiet system. We also found the streamer to be a major issue from a roon nucleus plus with nordost linear power supply (which wasn’t cheap) to a tremendous Wadax server. That also helped clean out and separate voices in orchestral as well. Sorry for the long post.

+1 for horizontal bi-amping with active crossover. Better yet tri-amp!

I am curious how you determined that the Pass was the issue. Compression and separation can come from each source.  You can always have the units modified.  It can be as simple upgrading resistors, capacitors, adding filter chokes, etc. Power supplies make a big difference in this area.

Happy Listening.

I just looked at the specs of the Epicon 8s, and while their 89dB sensitivity is relatively benign the nominal impedance is listed as 5 Ohms.  I can’t remember the last time I saw an impedance level that low, and if nominal is 5 you can bet minimum impedance goes quite a bit lower than that, which would make them a very tough load and may help explain why you’re sensing some compression with demanding material at higher volumes.  I’d call Dali and see what they think as then at least you’ll know for sure.  Just my $0.02 FWIW. 

Maybe move up the Pass line to a 250.8 that should have plenty of power to handle the music.

Congratulations on the ARC Ref 6SE. I have one… I love it.

The answer to your question is easy: Audio Reseach Reference 320m. I have an Reference 160m it is simply stunning and so complementary to the 6SE… and the Ref CD9SE… the stuff just works together so well. My next amp will be the Ref 320m.

My analog end has a ARC Ref 3 Phonostage… fantastic phono stage.

@roxy1927,

I would try horizontal BI- AMPING the speakers with an active crossover. It will improve the sound quality from top to bottom immensely. See the article below:

Mike

i agree that xa25 is unlikely the root cause of the compression, i too am curious which dali’s the op has and what size of room are they playing in...

the xa25, despite its lowish official power rating, has substantial power and headroom -- that said, nelson and crew have many other, much more powerful amps up the line...

I think Class A solid state is a good choice for their ample power reserves as long as it has enough power to begin with   If you like the sound of your Pass but need more power I’d take a look at the Clayton Audio S100 that produces 100Wpc into 8 Ohms and costs $7k new.  Some feel Clayton amps actually sound better than Pass, and I think they offer greater value because you’re not paying up for things like casework bling, marketing $$$, etc.  Anyway, just another option to consider FWIW, and best of luck in your search.  FYI, here are a couple links you may find helpful...

http://www.claytonamp.com/claytonaudio.html

https://www.enjoythemusic.com/superioraudio/equipment/0314/clayton_audio_s100_power_amplifier.htm

You want a big solid state amp. You will know the right one, it will be big, heavy, and expensive. I’d go at least 250wpc.

You wanted recommendations: Parasound JC1s or maybe a Bryson 14B or 4B.

Epicon 8.

I am assuming you have identified the amp as the cause of that compression (it often is). 

Which Dalis do you have?