jim
re Liszt/Schubert Song transcriptions
my favorite rendition is Lazar Berman
i have it on an old Discover International label
along with Schubert Sonata D 960 (discussed earlier)
and his interpretation of Rachmaninoff interpreting Rubinstein's
transcription of Beethoven's Marche Turque
I can send you a link if you like.
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Happy International Women’s Day all .
Remember Amy Beach , one of the greatest American composers regardless of gender .
Everything she wrote is a joy to listen to , a favorite of mine " Gaelic Symphony " + "Piano Concerto" on Naxos is/ Schermerhorn / Nashville Sym .
Her many chamber pieces are beautiful as well.
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Another controversial pianist besides Nyiregyházi, but in a completely different way, is Glenn Gould, one of my idols. Sheer genius to my mind. And a technique to match ANYONE!
Just listening to his recording of the late Beethoven sonatas recorded in 1956 when he was just starting out. Despite some idiosyncrasies, he gets to the heart of the music even at such a young age. Intellectually probing, intensely emotional with incredible technical execution.
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So much Bolet!
The Complete RCA and Columbia Album Collection (10 cds)
The Great Pianists Series, 4 cds in all
Rarest: half of a Russian album where he plays Liszt including Hungarian Rhapsody, Libestraum and Consolations.
Richter is the other half of the album, Liszt Concertos.
And they are all so well recorded.
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I doubt that Schoenberg would had written about Arrau and ask to Klemperer to cross the Atlantic ocean to listen to him...It is impossible to understand Nyiregyházi with the analytic brain and look for perfection...It is necessary to listen to the heart and the force of emotions...Nobody listen the same it seems... |
@twoleftears Yes Bolet was another Titan of the keyboard , I will always remember a fabulous Rachmaninov 3rd piano concerto from him in the City halls in Glasgow and after it he came back on and his encore was the Bach / Busoni chaconne, it brought the house down. Do you have his disc of the Schubert / Liszt song transcriptions he deserves to be remembered for that alone. |
Hey, what about Bolet? I have a few recordings of him that I really like. |
Yes Jim.With you there re Arrau, the epitome of classical piano.
He really took us there, and he so loved driving the bus.
As for Cortot, I love the "million dollar trio" - with Casals and Thibaud,especially their Beethoven and Schubert. I keep a photo of the threeyoung men, so confident. They were the Beatles of their time.
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I some time ago listened to and read about Nyiregyhazy and came to the conclusion of are we talking about the same person here, because the Nyiregyhazy portrayed here and the one I listened to were totally different. I came to the conclusion that this man didn't care a jot about a concert technique as his playing is all over the place just like Cortot another pianist viewed through rose tinted lenses. I shall stick with Arrau who along with` Horowitz kept a good technique into their eighties.
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I was somehow banned for the past several days, and now this has apparently been corrected
thank you Tammy
My comment which was banned is simple.
thanks to mahgister for introducing
Nyiregyhazy
there is a lot of him on youtube and i like some of it a lot
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To conclude I will only add that if Bach is the first proof of the existence of God(dixit Emil Cioran) I will say that Nyiregyhazy playing is the second proof for me... |
By the way another one of my idols is : Ervin Nyiregyházi,he is perhaps the greatest pianist that ever be with Scriabin,Rachmaninoff,Liszt,Barrere,Sofronitsky,Moravec,Feinberg,Neuhaus and not many more...If you doubt it, read the letter that Schoenberg wrote to the young Klemperer, after listening a concert of him... I dont think that Schoenberg takes times to notice any pianist ,as great as it is, and write a raving piece about it, mostly when the pianist interpretation contradict his own esthetic like Nyiregyhasi; his letter begins in incredulity and ends in an extasy with an invitation for Klemperer to comes and listening to him...Then you will know that it is not my own single opinion...Listen to that and your heart will melt or open without limit.... Liszt indeed was a great great composer,it takes a Nyiregyhazi to play it...Manifestation of divinity at this level in the art of interpretation are rare indeed...I am in love with Liszt now more than ever, guess why? He plays here Oberman valley of Liszt, in the slowest and the thunderous heartfelt version of this opus that exist on earth: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dLk6vqaxU1Y&list=PLnQJF3Qi_4_CLUPjzY3hqtkR1OBfPKOYYEven Richter in the same piece cannot touch the stellar power of this god, any other pianist is truly at most only a giant compared to this god indeed... |
I apologize for my confusion Rvpiano.... For sure Ivan and not Hans Moravec that think robot will think in some days to come... For Ivan Moravec I had listen to all his cd, and he is in a class of his own, an aquarellist able to nuance with astounding singing perfection... If you compare any of his interpretation with any other great pianist you will hear his unique touch...He is equal to the greatest … You are right Newbee, we are in the same club...My best to you...
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mahgister, FWIW, I think God prefers all of Moravec's music. He didn't record a lot but what he did is well worth hearing. I can recommend some more if your interested.
twoleftears, I'm not sure what caused you to reach your conclusions, but I think it may be an illusion caused by some folks who have been around music for generations and have substantial familiarity with a lot of the great performers and the music in which they may excel. In the beginning I think most folks are repertoire based and become more artist oriented later after knowledge of the standard repertoire has been acquired.
For example, I happen to like Massenet's PC also (I have the same Hyperion version as you.) I also happen to like a newer pianist, Jean-Efflam Bavouzet. I found a CD in which he performs some Ravel, Debussy, and the Massenet. I bought it and was not disappointed, in either composers music, but especially his Debussy. I went on to purchase all of his Debussy recordings as well. I like his style a great deal and will now likely follow most all of his recordings for something else that I might enjoy. Oh, and I liked his Massenet much more than Ossonce's. BTW that is a Chandos CD if you're interested. |
Mahgister,
Are you sure you don’t mean IVAN Moravec?
A HANS Moravec is into robotics. |
Chopin Nocturnes with Hans Moravec, pianist with so "delicate" color control that God prefer this version... |
Teed up for this afternoon is Ignaz Brull. Thank you, Hyperion! Concerto #1 kind of ho-hum. Some nice moments in the slow movement. The separate Andante rather better. Now the opening of #2 is quite stirring.
And here's a related general observation, FWIW. I see clearly that my collecting (CDs) and listening is primarily repertoire based. Certainly, performers matter a great deal, but I look at the performers once I'm looking for recordings of a particular piece. Looking at posts on this thread, it seems as if most others take the opposite approach: they have a bunch of favorite performers, and repertoire comes second (different repertoires are what certain performers specialize in). Discuss??
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@gdnrbob
I also tried Fideliser but got fed up with it and Instead bought some soft ware through Sam Laufer. It was form Mark Porzilli the guy who dreamt up the Memory player and your machine is probably using it also. That soft ware was the one that really made my PC sing, I remember that during the installation Mark himself did it and he had partitioned a part of my hard drive into a 4 gig. space to put your music files that you were going to play. I was astonished the first time I played a file and I even remember the file "Mahler's second Symphony" off a DSD file cut from an SACD disc with The LSO cond, by Valery Gergiev . It absolutely blew me away The opening was earth shattering and the last movement opening was cataclysmic . The amount of headroom that recording had just had to be heard to be believed. That was a great day I had listening to files one after another and where the software scores is the increase in clarity right through the frequency range. The area most apparent was the treble it has a beautiful purity to it and it was worth the money just for that alone.
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Who knew that Massenet wrote a piano concerto? Clearly I'd forgotten, as I have the Hyperion CD. I'm enjoying it enormously; it is a bit all over the place, musically speaking, but enjoyable nonetheless, and the recording is splendid. |
@jim204,
I may have mentioned it, but I use something called Fidelizer, which seems to do much the same as O&O.
I might just give it a try and compare the two software platforms.
I am also in the middle of trying a new streamer- Laufer Teknik’s Mini-baby brother to The Memory Player, which uses some proprietary software to provide higher resolution of digital signals.
B |
For any of you guys who like me listen to your music via a PC I have a superb little app for you. It is absolutely free and works a treat. It comes from a software company called O and O software and is called Windows 10 Shut Up . It silences all the background chatter on Windows 10 while you are listening to your music and with all the rubbish silenced your music sounds cleaner and more dynamic. Because your processor is not under so much stress it can concentrate so to speak on the programs that you are using at the time. Do at least give it a try because as stated previously it is free and off your pc in a couple of mouse clicks |
Right you are, schubert.
I guess those five are a pretty safe bet.
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Radu Lupu , Murray Perahia,Mitsuko Uchida and Alfred Berendel are some of the go-to Schubert players . As for sound Phillips went all out for
Uchida , a wonderful pianist .The best single piano recording I have heard of Schubert is his "Wandererfantasie" Op.D760 with Maurizio Pollini on
DG .which is a 1973 recording that has remastered very well in my Hears .Schubert’s two Piano Trios are some of the most beautiful music ever written ,an excellent recording in all respects is the Beaux Arts effort onPhillips .
woops rv, I see you got in as I was righting ! Hmm , great minds think alike and that .I thought of Richter too but he's had a lot on not so great sound put on him.
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Thanks for tip.
As far as Schubert pianists go, there are many.
Brendel, Lupu, Richter and Perahia are a good place to start.
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Finally getting into Schubert. Stumbled on Krystian Zimerman CD on Tidal, Piano Sonatas 959 and 960. I can't get enough. Does anyone know any other pianist who is known for Schubert? Preferably high quality recording. Also, RVpiano, check out Khatia buniatishvili's new Schubert CD which is partially available on Tidal and Amazon. I'm totally mesmerized by her playing Standchen S. 560. Ständchen, S. 560 (Trans. from Schwanengesang No. 4, D. 957) |
Guess I'm ready to make a fool of myself.
Trying to cull my classical CD collection has been a chore. Over the past several decades, my wife and I managed to acquire multiple performances of things we liked - - symphonies, operas, concertos, chorales, etc.
Just now, I've been selecting what to keep of the various Verdi Requiem recordings, and what to pass on to our community library.
We had managed to collect performances by Karajan, Solti, Toscanini, Reiner, Shaw, Giulini and Barenboim. Of these, I narrowed it down to the Shaw (Atlanta), Reiner, Giulini (Berlin) and Barenboim (La Scala), each for a different reason as clearly, each had a different approach to the Requiem.
Shaw's is an "In Your Face!" rendition, with both the chorus and soloists clearly recorded above the orchestra. Reiner's opening is inordinately slow, with the chorus barely discernible above the orchestra. Giulini's latest, a 1989 recording in Berlin, shows how his interpretation has changed over almost 60 years since his first in 1960. Finally, Barenboim's current 2012 recording is the only one made with a live audience.
Both Karajan and Barenboim recorded in La Scala, with the La Scala Orchestra and Chorus; however, Karajan's was all about Karajan, and the absence of a live audience permitted pauses in recording and patching recorded segments into the final product. To satisfy my curiosity, I purchased the DVDs for both the Karajan and Barenboim performances. IMO, no contest. For me, Barenboim.s was the better meld of Soloists, Orchestra, Chorus, Conductor and Venue.
Next CD-winnowing project: Go through the Puccini and Verdi operas. My mother used to tell me: "Verdi wrote for the mind, while Puccini wrote from the heart." I'm going to assess those operas with that as a judgement criterion.
Thanks for reading this far
George |
I use a program called Fidelizer. It doesn't cost much, but I have to say it does improve sound quality on my PC streamed music.-And, the designer offers frequent upgrades at no charge. It does something much like the O and O software Jim204 just pointed out-getting Windows to run the audio at higher importance.
Bob |
Thanks jim, ANYTHING that can knock out Windows 10 is a gift from above !
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hi guys I don't know if any of you know of this program but I have found it and it is free. I have been using O and O software for a few years and have just found a really good piece of software they have with the catchy title Windows 10 shut up. What it does is it switches off things that run in the background of Windows 10 and makes a big contribution to cleaning up your apps that play your music. You can use it in a couple of ways you either use it with all options ticked to get full benefit or in stages to see which one works for you and the good thing is it is completely reversible at the click of a mouse. Do try it as I said before you have nothing to lose as it is completely free. |
Brayeagle,
Don’t worry about making a fool of yourself.
We do it all the time. |
I didn't appreciate Mahler until listening to stereo LPs.
I'm new to this group, and probably will make a fool of myself. And, horror upon horrors, I have no particular preference for composers. I was taught music should be judged on its own, and not by who wrote it. Performance of a piece is another matter.
I'm an Old Fud, whose introduction to classical music was listening to Enrico Caruso on 78 rpm Victor Red Seals, played on a wind-up Victrola using cactus needles - - and whose first opera was Carmen, in the Met, with Risa Stevens. |
I found Mahler's 8th on a cassette earlier today, recorded from a CSO broadcast from sometime in the '90's. Levine is conducting. Not going to be a reference (tape is a bit off) but giving it a listen now anyway. First movement finished and... it's a bit nuts isn't it? Now an interview with Levine, how nice. I found a few other broadcasts I recorded so it should be fun going through them.
I've added Bruckner 7th to my exploration list, as well as
Puccini’s" La Boheme" (I'm sure I've heard it before). I'll check to see if I have any of Beethoven's trios. Also, someone mentioned Leo Janacek so I'll add him too.
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Point taken .It was not obvious to me . I thought you were just some self appointed expert out of their mind dismissing the Mozart and later Haydn symphonies as well .
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Richter--Dvorak. Wow!! These older recordings can sound truly excellent. Not only great piano playing, but I'm focusing even more on the fabulous wide, deep, full measure sound stage. Not only a great performance but a great recording. |
Herr Professor, since you are a self proclaimed history professor perhaps you would like to revisit the basis for your statement that I 'schooled you' for putting Mozart and Brahms above LvB and Mahler.
At 10:03 AM on 2/18/2019, I posted my personal views about Mahler's symphonies and said that " Mahler only competes with Sibelius and Beethoven in my pantheon of the greatest composers of symphonies".
At 12:28 PM on 2/18/19, you posted in response (?) "Really? Mozart and Brahms are better. And at their best, cases can be made for Haydn, Schubert and Bruckner.
Clearly you were trying to 'school me'. For stating, what was obviously, my opinion.
Since you are admittedly not a musicologist one must assume that you were just voicing your opinion. However, as you are aware, most folks reading your posts may not be aware of your background and believe that your pronouncement(s) was a statement of fact.
Perhaps you would like, for the sake of historical accuracy, in the future to append to your posts of such things something like 'in my humble opinion', or if that is not achievable something as simple as 'I believe' or 'I think', if your do. |
learsfool. Perhaps it was on another post, but I did recommend Bruckner ,
and would have R. Strauss if I had not been schooled by Herr newbee
for putting Mozart and Brahms above LvB and Mahler .I learned that Bruckner was too "precious " , Schubert’s 9th was over done and Haydn is to be dismissed out of hand . In fact all symphonies before LvB are to be .
I do appreciated being corrected .
In Europe Claudio is the man for Mahler beyond doubt . Rightly so .
Few of my favorite moderns , fool that I am, in no order are,Bartok, R.Strauss, Vaughan Williams, Hindemith , Janacek and Bruckner .
FWIW , I have a Bruckner set "Skrowaczewski / Rundfunk -Saarbrucken" that I dearly love . Those smaller German radio banks played together forever and often , this great conductor had them at their peak and sometimes lesser is more .
St. Paul is a hot spot for Early Music , I’d as soon listen to Henry Purcell as anybody .
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Big +1 on Giulini's 7th w/ Vienna PO, and I would add his 9th with the CSO, still one of my fav's. |
Wow- I have been away from this board for a few weeks and there have been some interesting discussions here!
I don't think anyone responded to Pete, who asked about programs for cataloging a collection. I found the ones I looked at wanting for classical, so I just use an Excel file with columns for everything I want to list.
Mahler's symphonies are amazing - I would urge anyone who hasn't to try the performances of Claudio Abbado, both older and newer. For instance, many prefer Abbado's 5th with Chicago to Solti's from the same era, including myself. His more recent work with the Lucerne Festival Orchestra was amazing as well. The best Mahler conductor of our time, IMO.
Speaking of showing off audio systems with Mahler, my choice is always the first 20 minutes or so of the second movement of the Mahler 8th, with Solti and Vienna, recorded by London. This is an excellent test/show off vehicle for your system, for a lot of different things, from one extreme dynamic to another, and one register extreme to the other as well, along with a huge variety of timbres.
Very interesting discussions about different composers, too. There are a few I personally would put above Beethoven for sheer compositional craft - Mozart and Bach from earlier in his era, and from nearer our own era, Bartok and Stravinsky. Of the later romantics, Wagner and R. Strauss are his equal for sheer craft as well. Wagner of course much more limited as far as variety in genres, lol! But Mozart and R. Strauss are the two who wrote a truly great work in pretty much every genre of the art (if we stretch to include tone poems in the case of Strauss).
As far as great symphonists go, obviously most of those don't apply. I agree with the Sibelius choice, Mozart and Haydn must also be mentioned, Brahms, Dvorak, and it must also be said, and I'm surprised Schubert didn't mention this having lived there, but in Europe Bruckner is often considered second only to Beethoven as a symphonist. He is still under-appreciated here in the US. Try the Giulini Bruckner 7th with Vienna if you have never heard that recording. The writing in the coda of the slow movement for the horns and Wagner tubas was in tribute to Wagner, who died while Bruckner was composing that movement. One of the most beautiful and moving moments in the entire symphonic repertoire. |
Liking #2 as I write, still on first movement. Listening to the Donohoe/Barshai EMI recording, which seems very good. An excellent breadth and depth of soundstage, and seems to get the balance between piano and orchestra just right, which many piano concerto recordings don't (generally spotlighting the soloist). |
The first piano concerto is truly a classic and allows the soloist to show his/her stuff.
The second and third never seem to capture that. Both have slow movements that border on maudlin.
The second has a nice final movement, technically super difficult, but doesn't allow the soloist to make it his/her own, like the first.
My 2 cents...
-Listening to DeBeriot Violin concertos as I write.
B |
I felt that way too, years ago when I first heard it.
But, I’m so tired of hearing #1, it sounds fresher to my ears. It’s not a bad piece at all. It takes some getting used to. Very different from #1.
#2 is especially good. |
So what's up with Tchaikovsky #3? Will some piano expert explain it to me? It just sounds so anomalous (and to my ears, wrong), after #1. |
I ran across Weinberg a couple years ago and I wondered if he is enjoyed now. Apparently lost to Soviet history for a long time and friend but not student of Shostakovich (liner notes.) I found the ECM disc with Kremerata Baltica/Gidon Kremer to be enjoyable. This has Sonatas and Symphony #10 which I have to listen to again.
Meanwhile I did discover I have Mahler's First (Bernstein) so I will definitely listen this week. I enjoyed the 6th as mentioned. I thought I had the 9th but don't seem to find it.
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I have found Miecsyslaw Weinberg somehow while scavenging on Tidal. I have enjoyed most everything I heard, especially his Concertos.
Since I have never heard of him and only one reference on Audiogon, I was wondering why? Any thoughts on this composer? |
The full glory that is Martha Argerich in Tchaikovsky #1, that never sounded better than on the latest iteration of my system (hint: GIK). |
elizabeth,
I’ve been sitting here trying to think of the basic difference between
elegant Mozart and pedal to the metal LvB , which is hard at my age .
.When Beethoven hits his last note one thinks " that’s how its done !!!" .
When Mozart is done one can only think "it could be done no other way ."
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No problem at all rvpiano !The only reason I went on and on was I respect you as a musician . At one time I was part of the " family " of the second best band in Berlin
and knew well most of them . As a History Prof . I saw that their total
immersion in their craft left them with little knowledge of the society around them . Some were aware of that as Germany makes a
BIG effort to tell history like it is in a much more truthful way than we do .I talked to a lot of them about the world around as it related to them .
Some thanked me .
As I saw it musicians are like the best doctors and others in the most demanding professions . They live in a bubble, which is great for the music, but not always for them .
P.S . My buy of the Beaux Arts box was one of my better buys .That Pressler is a one-off .
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Unless you are just using Classical as a time period about 90% of all
those enamored of this would give this title to Bach .If you are Mozart gets more votes . Not to say a good case can’t be made and is for Beethoven .
IMO Brahms tops LvB in most things other than his String Quartets .
More refined and elegant , listen to both violin concertos back to back.Listen to Clarinet Quintet Op 115 etc .
Of course at the end of the day, you like what you like .
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