Canare 4S11

Thanks, I'll stay balanced to the amp. Upstream components are SE.

@lowrider57 

I would go balanced- but that’s just my preference. I’m using Canare L-4E6S for all my balanced interconnects and have had no regrets.

@designsfx , That's a good point about the circuit. The amp is Atma-sphere fully-balanced differential and an Audio Note preamp using transformers.

Regarding the Mutec, I sent you a PM. I'm loving how it improved my digital in so many ways; jitter control and basically a fuller sound. I'll add comments to the Mutec thread.

Thanks @mofimadness . The length is only 1.5m but I enjoyed what seemed to be a blacker background and higher S/N. I should mention I did a shootout between Audio Envy and Zavfino balanced. The Audio Envy was too warm and their Pro series (a custom order) was excellent but brought the soundstage too far forward, like I was sitting in row one of the concert hall. Zavfino OCC copper and silver was good but after hours of break-in, the highs dominated at the expense of the midrange. I was missing the sweet mids of the woodwinds and French horns, and I'm using all Amperex in my dac and pre.

 

 

I really like the XLR connectors!  🤗

@lowrider57 

I’ve always preferred using balanced in my system but to me the difference between balanced and single ended has more to do with the implementation of the circuit within the device in addition to the difference in gain.

on a side note- how’s your Mutec working for you?

My number one nemesis in high-end audio has always been "brightness", so I understand.

IMHO, the Canare will be  a little more "polite" than the Mogami, but you'll need to try them for sure.

Balanced connections are usually cleaner, with less noise.  That's the purpose for a true balanced connection, is to keep the noise out, especially on longer runs of cable.

Most audio systems use shorter cables lengths, so the difference is subtle, but can be impactful...

I've returned to ask about Canare interconnects. In my system I use Canare 4S11 speaker cables and Silent Source ICs. Due to a component change I wanted a more neutral cable so I installed Mogami 2534 Star Quad from preamp to amp and the result was just what I wanted. It was more immediate and transparent, however, this cable presents an unlimited high-end which made my brain hurt. I have hyperacusis and am sensitive to high frequencies. Would Canare be a better option? I'm very pleased with my 4S11 speaker cables.

 

Also, does anybody know if there is a difference in sonics between using balanced cables vs SE RCA? Take away the fact that a balanced circuit has higher gain, does a SE connection sound the same? I can use either.

 

 

Just to add my two cents.

 

I have Martin Logan 13as, a Pass Int 60, and a Chord Dave. I, too, have settled on Canare 4s11 after trying a number of audiophile brands and pro brands. It’s neutral but musical. I have only had it running for a week of regular listening and it sounds great. I tried Mogami 3103 which was a little too bright for me, as well as Belkin 5T00UP which was a lot too bright with me. Granted I have ESLs which can be bright. I also tried lots of Nordost and Audioquest, and also some boutique brands and like the Canare the best.

 

I am also a big headphone guy and have some expensive headphone cables (JPS Superconductor for my Abyss). That cable makes sense for that headphone because it was tuned just for it. Because it’s all about synergy, I’m finding if I buy an expensive speaker cable, it’s a lot less likely it will perfectly synergize with my system, because they, for the most part, are tuned to add or subtract something. Or, the Uber expensive cable will sound great with some music, and not so good with others - because that’s what happens when you put on an arbitrary eq profile - which I think is essentially what audiophile cables do.

 

I’d classify all the pro cables as neutral, even if there are differences. Try all of them and pick your favorite; the Belden and Mogami May work better if you have a laid back system or like your sound slightly tilted up. The Canare is neutral with a slight (and I mean slight), tilt down - which is why I think it works so well in so many systems. Also, if it sounds good with some music - it’s probably going to sound good with all your music (even less than stellar recordings), because it is coming from a place of neutrality.

 

if there are audiophile cables with a similar tuning to the Canare, but do other things - please let me know because I haven’t found them. Canare 4s11 is fantastic cable.

 

Yep work fine. 

Has anyone tried their Bi-Wire! I just ordered a pair of single and a pair of Bi-Wires from Worlds Best Cables on Amazon. Should be here by Thursday evening.

JD

@mofimadness 

My pic came from one of the Canare sites but it was confusing since they also had a pic of a coax cable used for ICs. 

I got the correct number from you. Thanks.

That looks like Canare L-4E6, but some of the various brands have cable that look a lot alike.

 

 

@mofimadness 

Is this what a Canare IC looks like?

 

 

I use Canare L-2 and L-4 cable to make interconnects for friends and family under the Alien Audio name.  They're "Out Of This World" :-)

I've never sold any, but they are very, very good...

It is never mentioned, but I have really come to appreciate my interconnects made with Canare L-4E6S wire, which is also a star quad configuration.  They are ridiculously inexpensive, I purchased mine from Redco ages ago.

Other interconnects I have used or are currently using are Mogami, Magnan, Cardas and Morrow.

canare is really good cable, its low cost is a bonus

when it comes to cabling, more expensive options are sometimes better, but usually just different... totally depends on what your system needs, what sonic traits you value, what cabling you are changing from

anecdotal evidence from singular users here stating 'this is best' should be discounted - even if they are being honest, it is what is 'best' for them, their gear, their room, their taste

Canare  & Mogami  manufacture some fine  wire and  rather than argue I suggest experimenting.  I am not only an audiophile but was a composer musician in my youth and  have used low to high-end cables from  Goertz , Synergistic Research,  Nordost, CRL, Acoustic Zen, Acrolink, Cardas and  Oyaide. All  excellent companies IMHO.
In this hobby it behooves one to try patiently rather than criticizing out of embarrassment, ignorance or the insecurity of being duped for over paying high prices for boutique cable. Which admittedly I have done,  and not just cable.

Oh I have. And still own the Canare speaker cables I posted on the link above. Scroll up. Admittedly, they are not my primary speaker cables, but I keep them as a benchmark for any speaker cables I try.

Two runs, as I bi-wire. Here is a copy/paste from my Ghent receipt:

DescriptionUnit priceQtyAmountItem Name: S01(A)---Canare 4S12F Speaker Cables 4x13AWG (Ba---Spa)
Item# 
Length: 2.0m
$56.00 USD2$56.00 USDSubtotal$112.00 USDShipping and handling$0.00 USDInsurance$0.00 USDTax$0.00 USDTotal$112.00 USDPayment$112.00 USD

@thyname


unless you have heard the Canare 4S11 cable, you have no clue as to what you are talking about. The Canare replaced a pair of Groneberg Quattro Reference Cables that cost me $1500 per run were replaced by the Canare at less than $200 a pair. The difference was obvious from the first note. I liked it so much that I re-wired both of my systems with the Canare.

A friend with a Pass amp and preamp driving Magnepan 3.7i speakers liked them so much in my system that he bought them as well for his system. We are both extremely satisfied.

Hmmmmm…. This sounds like something that the snake oil screechers would call Snake Oil, as according to them, nothing of that stuff really matters, inaudible, etc. etc.

But, I guess because the price is cheap / reasonable, it’s not considered  snake oil?

I don't think Home Depot sells cable designs like Canare. Did you look at the wrap of the conductors or only the outer jacket?

Electromagnetic interference (EMI) can radiate from these speaker lines directly into adjacent low voltage cables (i.e. microphone, video lines, etc.). Canare solves this problem by using a 4-conductor "Star Quad" configuration in all of our 4S Series speaker cables. Because every conductor is located the same distance from the center, the opposing magnetic fields are cancelled out. Attenuation of magnetic field radiation is superior when compared to a standard 2-conductor speaker wire.

With all due respect, you are a bit naive. First thing I learned when I got into the high-end audio business over 45 years ago...price sometimes makes no difference.

I guess this is the case where you're right, and a whole lot of people are wrong.  

I may be a bit naive, but if somebody is saying a $1/per foot cable can beat a $1500 cable, that is a bit of a snake oil in itself.

With all due respect, you are a bit naive.  First thing I learned when I got into the high-end audio business over 45 years ago...price sometimes makes no difference.

I don't think Home Depot sells cable designs like Canare. Did you look at the wrap of the conductors or only the outer jacket?

Electromagnetic interference (EMI) can radiate from these speaker lines directly into adjacent low voltage cables (i.e. microphone, video lines, etc.). Canare solves this problem by using a 4-conductor "Star Quad" configuration in all of our 4S Series speaker cables. Because every conductor is located the same distance from the center, the opposing magnetic fields are cancelled out. Attenuation of magnetic field radiation is superior when compared to a standard 2-conductor speaker wire.

I replaced my $2500 cables with Canare 4S11.

I am not sure why all the hypes about the Canare.  It looks just like an ordinary set of cable that you can purchase at Home Depot.  If something is too good to be true, then there's a reason for doubt.  

I may be a bit naive, but if somebody is saying a $1/per foot cable can beat a $1500 cable, that is a bit of a snake oil in itself.

For terminated Canare speaker cables, this Chinese reputable seller has some good options:

http://www.ghentaudio.com/part/index-sp.html

4S12F and 4S8

Guys,

I may order some Furez SC to hear how they sound in relation to OCC.

Wig

The Canare 4S11G is a custom, special order product that has a 500M minimum order, (well, that's the way it used to be anyway).

Maybe a group buy?  :-)

Why are multiple audiophiles reporting that they are using the inferior version of an already inexpensive cable? Why go with 4S11 instead of 4S11G? Is it availability? Not knowing? 

I just purchase 50' of the Furez cable to try out. May run double shotgun. Also have some Canare 4S11.

I was always under the impression that the higher the price, the better the cable.  The fact that a $130.00 pair of speaker cables bested a $1500.00 pair should be a lesson for everyone regarding price VS performance. 

You don’t always get what you pay for, and that’s true for other components as well. 

i have a set shotgun biwire and another non biwire set i use in my Vintage room, excellent neutral wire i got from Blue Jeans here in Seattle. a super value. great thread

exceptionally good sounding wire at a ridiculously low cost

biwire ready too...

I just bought some Canare 4S11 at this place for $1.16 per foot.  The lowest price by far that I found anywhere!  https://www.performanceaudio.com/accessories/cables-connectors/bulk-wire-cable/speaker-wire.html

At $1.55/foot (Markertek), for a star-quad configuration, 11 awg aggregate conductors (4 @ 14 awg) per polarity, and polyethylene dielectric, 4S11 is certainly a bargain and it would probably take a lot of money to do significantly better.

The other bargain SC at barely over $1/foot is the Furez FZ124AS 12-4, which is a quad of 12 awg cables providing an even larger 9 awg aggregate conductor to each polarity. These feature a rope lay construction using both 27 awg and 36 awg, 4-nines, OFC wires, and foamed polyethylene insulation (FPE - which is unusual for budget cables). I am surprised more folks are not trying this one out - let us know what you hear if you do try it.
Furez FZ124AS

I moved my amp between the speakers and went with Canare 4S11 from bluejeans cable. The best cable is no cable.. these are a close second, especially with short runs.  

The highs are smooth, smooth, smooth!

How good are the highs, loud,bright,metallic,soft,smoothe, best for soft dome tweeter or metal tweeter, any brand of speakers they work really good with ?

Correction, I use two runs of 4S11 on each amp post utilizing both spade and banana input for each post in a 11 gauge form to take advantage of Star Quad geometry for EMI rejection. Shotgun biwire but there is four runs of cable to each 4S11 so not sure if this qualified it as a double shotgun configuration.

@jeffrey75...thanks for kind words. Glad you tried them!  They really are incredible.

@mofimadness  +1
Your posts, years ago, helped shape my decision to use the 4S11 and I have never looked back. I use a double barrel shotgun configuration and the cables have been put thru cryo process.

@stereo5...my pleasure sir!  Glad to have helped.

@mofimadness ……………………….

You gave me so many great tips.    Thank you for giving me your experience with the cable.  My system(s) are sounding really good today.

@stereo5...I'm so glad you put in the time and effort on these! 

I've been touting this cable for years and years on here, but never had any luck because most people think because they are so inexpensive and/or require a long break-in period, they can't be any good.

Over the years, I've become friends with a couple of guys from Canare.  Even they don't know why they take so long to break-in, but if you're willing to put the time on them, they are richly rewarding.

I run mine in a shot-gun configuration and they are even better.  See this thread about how I do it.

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/need-20-25-foot-spk-cables/post?postid=1846157#1846157

This is the final report on the Canare 4S11 cables.  I let the 25 foot pair break in on my secondary system for almost 19 days 24/7.  At the 445 hour mark, I reinserted them into my main system.  I first removed the $1500.00 Groneberg Quattro Reference speaker cables and coiled them up under the floor in case I decided to go back to them. After my son helped me install the Canare cables (I had to make larger holes in the floor for the banana plugs to fit) and routing them perfectly, I am happy to say my system now sounds much better.  I no longer have the softness in highs I had with the Groneberg cable and the bass is tighter and deeper.  I was always under the impression that the higher the price, the better the cable.  The fact that a $130.00 pair of speaker cables bested a $1500.00 pair should be a lesson for everyone regarding price VS performance.    Now I have the Canare in both of my systems and I am one happy audiophile. 

Thank you for taking the time to report on this.  It is refreshing to hear someone warrant the inexpensive cables based on sound quality.

Good to hear. You might be surprised how good the Canare Digital coax cable is with their own True 75 ohm RCA plugs or BNC if you equipment has that’s even better. Had one probably twenty years ago, well maybe not that many years ago but close I bet. No idea where it is but I just might have to pick one up again. I recall it was a very smooth cable but that was many years ago on old digital equipment so I might have to see how it fares against my Nordost Silver Shadow that probably cost 5-10x the price.

At the 265 hour mark, I am still loving the 4S11 cables.  I have temporarily disconnected them to break in another 25 foot pair of 4S11 cables.  Once some playing time are on these, they will go into my main system and I will reconnect the previously broken in pair of 4S11 to my secondary system.  So far, I see no negatives.