Amp is plugged to the wall, why use a conditioner?

I cannot imagine a good balanced audio system without a good conditioner. But you need to find the right stuff. But unfortunately there are more bad and avergae ones than good ones. That is why I say: far over 90% of all the stuff in audio is not worth it's money. So for conditioners same story.

Bo,
I'm not familiar with the brand of conditioner you like but do agree that the quality level matters. I use a balanced AC power isolation transformer conditioner (BPT) and it is wonderful and superior to direct wall outlet plug in (this includes the amplifiers as well). Everything improved even dynamics. Each case is different it appears.
Charles,

There are many people who first think that it does not do a lot. This is based on no experience or they heard a poor or average conditioner. I sold many just to let people hear the difference between a direct plugin and conditioner. When you Always use the best on the market it is easy to understand why they are important. Most did not expect that it would make such a big difference. In the lower pricerange I use conditioners from Fisch Audiotechnik. These are superior compared to the cheap PS audio, Monster and other brands. Because it is no parallel filtering. It is a lot more dynamic.

I tested many conditioners and to be honnest there are a lot who just work for a part. PS Audio is a brand which is very popular. But there is one thing what I saw in the last 8 years. Many of my clients sold there regenerators. When I ask them why they sold them? They say; I was not convinced. Then I think; but first you bought it. These filters work at 8 bit. This can give a clinical sound. I understand them, I tested them a few times and no I would never want them in my system. I use a Kemp Elektroniks powersourceplus. I use it with a Purist Audio Design Dominus Praesto Revision powercable. It gives a lot more weight and drive compared to a direct use to the wall. The sound becomes so much more musical and realistic in sound. Also the focus is a lot more sharp and palpable. When I go back to a direct use to the wall I also loose resolution. There is less air and also less decay. A good conditioner is the fundament of every system. Without you loose a lot of quality in the overwhole sound. Without an exeptional good conditioner it is like a big orchestra without a conductor.

Knghifi...you are wrong my friend (and what you do with your strangled personal parts is between you and your urologist), and that's exactly why I mentioned it. Did you miss the part where I said my system sounds great? A basic understanding of current, how it works, how amps use it, and how not to get trapped into hype and nonesense are all things we need more of around here. I rest my case.

Wolf, I HOPE you are kidding. I believe Adcom ACE 515 was the 1st power conditioner I ever bought zillion years ago and it's a TOURNIQUET on current. It makes the sound like someone is grabbing your ... as you speak. I'm sure you're familiar with this movement. LOL!!!

It's currently used in my father's BASIC system as an extension cord.

Markmendenhall, the problem with noise is you don't realize it exist until removed.

I had friends over and 2 have high efficiency horns so familiar with noise. They heard excessive noise with my amps plug into the wall and one suggested Weizhi. His friend has a Shindo system and got off the bus with Weizhi.

We have all different systems and taste but try Weizhi if you have a chance.

My Adcom ACE 515 I bought new about 127 years ago keeps on truckin'. I run everything from it including a PS Audio Humbuster III that the 2 amps (a tube amp for main listening and a rarely used SS for outdoor deck entertainment). I did stick PS Power Ports in the wall...so there's that...I might be fooling myself into thinking my system sounds amazingly good, but hey...it does. I tried plugging the main tube amp in the wall but heard no difference, and the Humbuster at least makes it look like I care...and I do care...sort of...

Knghifi

Glad to hear you've solved both the current and noise issues. I must consider myself lucky, for whatever reason I don't have noise issues plugging the amps directly into the wall outlet. Everything else runs through the Shunyata conditioner, I believe the amps require the most current to operate at peak efficiency, compared to the pre, CD player, TT, etc.

Markmendenhall, I had a similar revelation last year after directly plugging everything into the wall outlets. It restored tone, current ... just sounds more natural but downside is hearing noise.

I discovered Weizhi PRS-6 passive from a local audiophile. It eliminated the noise and doesn't alter the tone or limit current ... just sounds fabulous. I have 2 PRS-6, one for mono amps and other for rest of components. Also have 2 dedicated 20 amp circuits with Maestro outlets.

here is my recent experience, fwiw: originally I plugged both my mono Jungson JA-50 80 watt class A amps into my Shunyata Hydra, along with just about everything else. In my wall I have two sets of outlets, both high end receptacles, one running off a 15 amp breaker along with other outlets, switches etc on that end of the house. The other outlet is a 20 watt high end outlet wired to a separate dedicated 20 amp breaker with 10 ga romex. I believe the standard house romex is 12 ga. Recently I unplugged the amps from the Shunyata and plugged them directly into the dedicated 20 amp circuit. Couple observations: the amps sound much more powerful and I don't have to push the volume knobs up nearly as far on the pre-amp as I used to. The bass is better and the system sounds fuller, less constrained, and less 'pushed'. I've considered buying more powerful amps for my Khorus X mk II's but no longer feel that is in any way necessary.

my amp does not sound nearly as good plugged into the Running Springs Jaco as it does plugged directly into the wall.

Gdush, you might read this...
http://10audio.com/audience_ar2p-to.htm

...and other reviews of the Audience aR2p and its ...TO variant.
http://www.audience-av.com/conditioners/conditioner_reviews.html

I've ordered a '2pTO for my 650-Watt McCormack DNA-750s. We'll see how the system sounds with and without it.
.

+1 on Running Springs.

The reviews on them often mention dynamics of the amps not being constrained. A real selling point for their line of conditioners.

I just compared a PS Audio P300 power regenerator on my front end (everything but the amp) to everything (including amp) plugged into my Running Springs Haley and there was very little difference between the two set-ups. Perhaps a slight loss in dynamics with the P300, and there was audible fan noise from the P300. Considering all the benefits attributed to power regeneration, this seems to speak very highly of the Running Springs products. Glad I was able to audition the P300 before buying.

Thank you all for the great advice.

Gdush:

I have one Furman AR-15 for two JC1 mono power amps and a HSU subwoofer; and a second one for the preamp, CD deck, and D/A. The power cords for each AR-15 are connected to the same power outlet. Cannot comment on the products you mention because the AR-15 works differently than all of them (to my knowledge).

In the Furman, the networks (including capacitor storage) are across the ac line, so they do not limit current. Current is limited only by the power cords (and breakers in the extreme).

I would also look into Running Springs Audio. Helped my system out quite a bit.

Gdush,

I have a Richard Gray 400 and I recommend it. I noticed no difference with my amp plugged into the wall directly or into the RG400. I actually have all my 2 way components connected to the RG400, and all my HT components plugged into a Monster power strip. I then plugged in the Monster strip into the RG400. Still noticed no difference. Supposedly if I plug the Monster strip into the socket next to the RG400, it will gain the same benefits as being plugged into the RG400. I haven't tried this though.

I don't consider my system the most resolving, but enough to tell the difference when swapping out components.

Just to embellish Dopogue's initial suggestion. Getting estimates for electrical work is usually free and in the end the cost is usually less than most assume.

Keep in mind that Volts Alternating Current can have many differing issues from house to house. Unfortunately the solution to these issues can only be dealt with after your utilities meter unless you ask for an increase in service amperage which may require an upgrade of cable from the dwelling to the supply. If you have aluminum cable connected after the meter or after the dwellings main breaker it should be replaced with copper.

Tell your electrician that you'd like to have this new circuit on a different pole than lighting, refrigeration, and washer dryers or in a separate breaker box. You want a dedicated 20 amp circuit with an uninterrupted run of 10 gauge wire, preferably BX metal clad conduit to two metal receptacle boxes for a total of four Isolated Ground receptacles (8 plugs). This circuit will star ground your system.

Local code may not allow or may require the use of metal VAC components.

Again, every VAC grid is different and results of an upgrade will differ. After I had similar work done I found no substantial improvement using VAC filters or regenerators. Results will still vary.

Thanks for the information.
I have a Krell HTS control amp, Sherbourn 7 channel power amp, Faroudja DV-1000 CD/DVD player, and a pair of Martin Logan Source speakers. Should I get a single conditioner for the amp and one for the rest? What models and brands will not limit current? Which are best to purify the signal? I hear the Shunyata 2 and the Richard Gray 400 are good for this. Any thoughts? How does the Monster 5100, 2000, or 7000 perform? Does anyone know the difference? Thanks Greg

Dopogue is right, it depends on the conditioner in question.The conditioner should have a amp(Kwa) rating adequate to match the needs of a given power amplifier. I use a BPT AC power isolation transformer that has a 20 amp capacity(same as my wall outlet-dedicated line).Dynamics of all of my amplifiers(3) are improved with the BPT not lessened.Every sound parameter improved without some compromise or trade off.This is true for every component in my system.
Regards,

I know for sure that my integrated amp sounds more closed in when it is plugged into a power conditioner vs. straight into my dedicated line. I keep it unplugged when it is not in use for a long time or if there are electrical storms.

Depends on the conditioner and the amp(s). Also, before doing anything else, I'd have dedicated lines installed just for the stereo system. The usual recommendation is for 20 amp lines. My Tice Power Block III put the lie to the idea that conditioners compromise power amps -- surprising the heck out of the guy who built my amps-- and the more expensive PS Audio P10 makes them sound even better. (Two of my audiobuddies also have that particular Tice, by the way, and wouldn't be without it.)

There are a lot of GOOD reasons to use a line conditioner. Irrespective of audible effects, a good line conditioner like the Furman products filter a lot of line voltage transients that can damage your equipment. These transients over time can damage sensitive transistors and amplifiers. Not sure if tube equipment is as sensitive, by it only takes a nanosecond transient to destroy solid state devices.

Some products can provide power factor correction, and provide line capacitance that helps the transient response of power amplifiers. I use a Furman Power Factor Pro on all my equipment, particularly the power amps. It reduces line voltage sag when transients hit the power amp. I use another one for the low power stuff like CD players, A/D converters, preamps and the like to isolate them from AC power effects caused by the power amps.

Some line conditioners also can regulate the AC line to smooth out brown outs. I have used the Furman AR-15 which actually has a switched transforment that keeps the output at 110 VAC even if the line drops to 90 VAC or rises to 130 VAC. I have found these can be audible, however, so I only use them on computers and other electronics, not my audio components.