Hi CT, sadly no. He's still burning it in. He used the AR as a transport and a Berkeley Alpha DAC, plus he adjusted the speakers. Richfield, thank you for making me aware that those are the mark 1 I heard.
With the change in setup and adding in the Berkely DAC the speakers improved dramatically. This time I was engaged. I spent the 2+ hours listening to music and not the speakers. This audition pushed them up to the top 3 in my search. I think I still liked the Coltrane Tenors more, but it was very close. Unfortunately there is no conceivable way to A/B them. The Dynaudio Consequence Ultimate are also in the top 3 but I need to hear them with proper powered amplification before I can make a call on them.
I found the Vandy 7 a tad veiled on the upper registers. It was subtle and didn't really effect my overall impression. They just didn't extend with the accuracy and finesse that the Coltrane Tenor did. Interestingly, it was the same on the low end. The Tenors maintained a better sense of control, impact, extension and finesse in the lower registers than the Vandy. I think the forward firing long excursion twin 8's with down firing port helped to keep the room further from the equation then the down firing, side vented Vandy's. I felt the rumble and heard all the notes, they were right and proper and had both accurate rise and decay but I didn't get that punch in the chest when expected like I did with the Tenors. I also felt that on rare occasions the base became disconnected from the rest of the music, like I could hear that it was being amplified by a different amplifier; the tone subtly shifted and it became identifiable that there was a subwoofer and monitor, and not just a speaker. Other then that, they did everything right.
I can say without hesitation that John knows how to set up a room and he is a great guy who really loves this stuff, and loves music!
After my recent audition I could easily say that I could live forever with either the Tenor or the Vandy 7/2 (I can only assume the Vandy 7/2 would correct at least some of my issues). Which is great because it gives me choices and flexibility to negotiate and see where the better deal lies.
I will be going back to hear the Dynaudio CU next Friday with solid state. And I need to hear the Avalon Isis as well, but the store can't get me in until early September (sigh).
Then there's the T&F Isis, the BMC Arcadia, The Goldmund Wisnon wants me to hear and a few others. Without jumping on a plane, hearing any of those (other then the Goldmund) just won't happen. And if I find several I love without needing to fly somewhere then I'm not going to spend the time and money to fly. Of course, if I hear something in the future that i like more I can always flip and upgrade. But with the performance I hear out of the Tenor, Vandy 7 and potentially Dynaudio CU and Avalon Isis I can't imagine I would get any better elsewhere.
I'm going to call the T&F distributor and speak with him. I'm not driving 3.5 hours to hear the RA when I'm positive it won't give me the base extension I'm after (I emailed and spoke with Mr. Friedl and he agreed that the Isis would probably suit my needs better although the RA would sound great without that bottomless extension). And there is no place to hear the BMC Arcadia without flying to hear it (which is a shame because I negotiated a killer deal for a pair if I wanted them).
And I'm also processing Wisnon's relentless suggestions as they come in. Lol. Man that guy knows about a lot of gear!!!! |
Matt, I would definitley not use a source with usb to judge anything. |
Matt, I believe Bob has a pair of Isis in TX you could fly down and hear.... |
Matt, call me tomorrow if you are able to. I'm heading to Japan on Wed until the 31st. Glad it went well and that you had fun. That's what it's supposed to be like. Richfield can speak about the differences between the two Vandersteens. I listened to over 50 different speakers over the course of a year or more and once I heard the Vandersteens, I really started to focus on what I wanted. That was when I was able to say no to 99% of the stuff I heard. Glad that you have choices. |
08-15-15: Mattnshilp
I found the Vandy 7 a tad veiled on the upper registers. It was subtle and didn't really effect my overall impression. They just didn't extend with the accuracy and finesse that the Coltrane Tenor did. Interestingly, it was the same on the low end. The Tenors maintained a better sense of control, impact, extension and finesse in the lower registers than the Vandy. I think the forward firing long excursion twin 8's with down firing port helped to keep the room further from the equation then the down firing, side vented Vandy's. I felt the rumble and heard all the notes, they were right and proper and had both accurate rise and decay but I didn't get that punch in the chest when expected like I did with the Tenors. I also felt that on rare occasions the base became disconnected from the rest of the music, like I could hear that it was being amplified by a different amplifier; the tone subtly shifted and it became identifiable that there was a subwoofer and monitor, and not just a speaker. Other then that, they did everything right.
Every speaker with power woofers I have heard has that same subtle discontinuity. Time to bend over Matt and accept reality. The Tenors appear to be your speakers...... |
Lmao Agear. You may be right. But I won't go gently into that good night!
As I proved when I started this thread, I have a pathologic need to hear as much as I can before feeling comfortable with a decision. Although DAC's can get expensive, they are easy to ship. Speakers, not so much......
I'd really like to hear a pair of Avalon Isis, BMC Arcadias, T&F Isis and re-hear the classicly redesigned Dynaudio Consequence Ultimate with solid state gear before making that final decision. And Wisnon will probably send me an envelope of Anthrax if I don't try to hear the Goldmunds (just a joke if the government is reading this, or if you just have a complete lack of any sense of humor).
If I could sell my MM3's and Muzik's I'd have the money to bring in the Arcadia and maybe the T&F Isis. But speakers are much harder to resell then DAC's and way harder to ship. So I can't use my same model that I applied to my DAC search of: Buy/Try/Sell.
I asked the T&F inporter again if I can do an in home audition if I'm willing to pay for freight. No answer yet. BMC said no way since they are almost 200 pounds each plus external crossovers. I understand that. As I said, I have a great deal for the Arcadia's on the table.
I have to admit that I went to a generous owner of Salk SS8's in PA to hear them and they were very impressive. I have an opportunity to get into a fully upgraded pair of SS10's for a very good price. They are not up to the other speakers I am looking at, but if I decide I don't like the Dynaudio's when I go hear them, I might just buy the SS10's and keep looking; and wait until the Muzik and MM3 are sold and then sell the SS10's and go for my final speaker. It would buy me time to sell what I have and time to hear what I want to hear before spending the big dollars. Remember that with my Muziks now packed up for sale and the MM3's safely in crates in my garage I literally have no speakers for my room. I have many fine qualities, but patience is not one of them. I need my room up and running. |
Gaia forbid... Matt, I sure do not wish you to "Go gentle into that good night" of integrated powered subs, not even after listening to the immortal song by Igor Stravinsky *grins!*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yioysm8a6Js
G. |
08-15-15: Mattnshilp
And Wisnon will probably send me an envelope of Anthrax if I don't try to hear the Goldmunds (just a joke if the government is reading this, or if you just have a complete lack of any sense of humor). Well, now they will be due to NSA algorithms. Thanks Matt.... |
NSA? You mean the National Stereo Association? Aren't we all members already???
:) |
I must admit that although they get a tad boomy at times in my room and they don't extend as low or impactful as I want, the Nola Metro Gold I have on loan are wonderfully musical and engaging. I had a great midnight to 2am listening session with them last night. Probably so good because I couldn't play at my usual listening level. Needed to keep it down. It was wonderful.
So many good speakers. Just hard to find one with everything. |
08-16-15: Mattnshilp
I must admit that although they get a tad boomy at times in my room and they don't extend as low or impactful as I want, the Nola Metro Gold I have on loan are wonderfully musical and engaging. I had a great midnight to 2am listening session with them last night. Probably so good because I couldn't play at my usual listening level. Needed to keep it down. It was wonderful. That's the booze talking.... |
I'm not sure if discontinuity is the correct term your looking for but the Vandy Sevens in my room have no such thing. Its exactly the opposite. There is such a seemless blend of bass with the lower midrange and of course that can be adjusted if there is not the blend you desire due to your room. The bass on the Sevens is one of their many strong points and have such incredible pitch definition that I think Matt is looking for. I think the veiled sound in the upper regester you mentioned is due to the ARC transport and the Berkeley DAC2. The Berkely in my system also was not quite as dynamic and didn't have the quality of midrange timbre or treble extension that my Bricasti M1 has. |
Matt, I have to agree with Richfield on the upper register. I had a bit of that on my Treo's (only on a couple of recordings) when I first got them. that was with my old DAC set up. Since I got the OSDE/se I've felt that continuity was their strong point. I personally dislike the ARC digital gear. I don't feel it's in the same ballpark as what you have or the Bricasti, which you know I also feel strongly about.
The thing about Johnny is that he does analog. That's what he is set up for IMHO. I've heard the 7's in a few other applications from others homes and I have a few friends who have them and they feel they're the best speaker they've heard and like you they auditioned so many 50=200k speakers it made MY head spin, lol. LOL...You have now made me want to go listen to a few other speakers on your list as I like to keep up on top gear like the rest of the guys in this thread. Thanks for sharing. |
Everyone hears differently I guess or has different acuity. Next.... |
Anyone have any experience with the PMC MB2 SE, MB2 XBD SE or BB5 SE?? |
I haven't heard any of those PMC models, but they use a unique transmission line loading that generally loads the room well but differently than sealed or other vented designs. Should be worth your effort to try them in your room if given the opportunity. |
|
Matt one more to broaden your horizons. I think its front ported:
http://www.foersteraudiotechnik.de/prod_fa73_en.htm |
Gear, these are the ones I would love for Matt to hear and report back on. Useful refernce point.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eU4sEIpj5M
The Prologos Mk2 wireless, not the Prologos+ mk2.
The "normal" prologos is their most dynamic speaker and is capable of max spl of 120db. It has 2 Telos amps and Alize Dacs built into each box, and Proteus/Leonardo (DSP/DRC)software implemented. |
Norman, what is the price tag? The Tenor's made Matt blush. Goldmund really bends u over. I would not necessarily want their amps and/or dac. Friends who have heard their stuff on several occasions always went away feeling it was little on the Swiss/clinical side.... |
The PL Mk2 is $70K with mech grounding stands.
They are NOT clinical according to my pal and the 6moons reviews...more on the Musical side. Based on my demo of the Anatta with the claimed PLogos sound signature backs up that claim. The Anattas are a big OUCH at $250K a pair.
Remember, the Wireless all in ones wont sound the same as separates and my pal said that wireless also thrashed the wired setup with the same speaker.
Wired as in Preamp to speakers as opposed to only just wifi.
The point is not for Matt to buy them, but more to get a reference point for that kind of sound possibility. Plus he will have fun on that small adventure. |
$70k for PL Mk2 are cheap if that includes speakers, amp and DAC; and allows me to sell most of my cables. The Tenors are more and are "just" speakers. My curiosity is piqued. I'll call Bob next week.
I arranged to get down to hear the Dynaudio Consequence Ultimate again this Friday and then will go listen to the Avalon Time and Isis right after.
I also got approval to "borrow" the T&F Isis if I cover freight. I will call the distributor and discuss voicing to confirm the speaker is for me since he felt that the speakers I like thus far have a very different sound then the Isis.
I'll hopefully be a bit closer in my quest by Saturday.
I'm waiting to hear back from PMC if there is someone local to listen to their SE speaker line with.
Wow, what an experience! |
Seems the Trenner Friedl distributor is being upfront and honest. When I heard the TF Ra box it was uniquely different sounding from virtually every other speaker I heard at the show in similar rooms. If their ISIS shares a house sound it will be very lifelike, emotionally connecting and excel in presence. In comparison most speakers sound canned and somewhat sterile. The chosen ancillary equipment obviously matters.
Charles, |
Matt heading off to Japan for two weeks. Wish i could follow this closer, lol. Great luck my friend and enjoy. |
Good stuff Matt.
It may ony be YOUR opinion, but its still very valuable to the rest of us. This demo expedition presents us with useful reference points.
The crowning glory will be if I am ever in your neck of the woods to hear your system and so hone in more closely to your auditory tastes. |
The new ProLogos Mk2 Wireless has redesigned software and is supposed to be a real stepup up from Mk1(now obsolete) but costs a cool $15K more. Indeed, they dont say Mk2, as its the only one now available.
Yes, each box includes the same drivers found in the $600K Apologues and has 2 Telos amps built in and Alize Dacs with wireless receivers:
The blurb...
"The Goldmund ProLogos is the most dynamic speaker ever produced by Goldmund, with a stereo capability of more than 120dB / 1M, coming from a diminutive box of half a meter high."
"The Goldmund ProLogos active version uses two Telos Amplifiers of a newest design in each speaker, with a very high power transformer. It provides the highest Acoustical Grounding ratio ever achieved in any Goldmund product, which guarantees extreme control of the drivers by the electronics at high playback level.
The Goldmund ProLogos active version incorporates a complete correction of amplitude, phase and time with its new Leonardo2 DSP program. It is ultra-compact (500x288x392mm) and fully built in metal."
Goldmund speakers are designed entirely in the software domain with the outstanding Proteus sotware, which is also capable of DRC without the use of microphones. Proteus can accept input of up to 44,000 parameters.
The only thing to really cause a gulp, apart from the retail price is how these small Monitors can cause such thunderous/explosive high quality sound (SPL max of 120db). |
I know Lampizator Lucasz is a big Goldmund fan: And last thing - one might say that I have a prejudice against Goldmund - but I don't. I simply cant stand the bullshit of their marketing. I think that everybody and every business has a right to bullshit people just a little, but goldmund is really pushing it to the edge. http://lampizator.eu/Munich/Munich%20High%20End.htmlVery funny stuff.... |
Gear, I agree. Not a fan of Goldmund spinner or TT tech, but I guess they were pushed to have a complete line for their very exclusive clientele and back then, a Spinner was mandatory and with less than 40 people in total, they had to outsource mechanical stuff like this and still keep the fancy pricing.
To me they are a Speaker and Amp company (they even made a tube amp and its displayed in the lobby of their HQ). they are very competent in digital as well. Nowadays, their software is top notch as they cherry pick the best acoustical Phds and combine that with university an corporate collaborations and hence their leadership position in Wireless. However, like all small companies they will have their vulnarabilities and perhaps 4D sound in Home Cinema is such an area?
Before I actually did a couple demos there, I thought they were all bling and little audiophile substance. Now I know better, they are ALL substance and the bling is only about their target market. Hopefully, one day Job will make their version of the Prologos wireless for real world prices. I am sure you will get 90% of the SQ for 20% of the price. By then, the Goldmund label will have new fancy cosmetic styling and Job will get the boxy look without the mechanical grounding stands. LoL |
I agree Norman. I have read enough about Goldmund to know they are a serious company. I had read L's extended tirade about the 2009 Munich show before and found it amusingly transparent.
A lot of what they are fiddling with is the future. There is no doubt. |
This Goldmund situation is disturbing as I'm way out my element. Are any of you able to distill the function of these speakers? Maybe start with the device which transmits the left/right digital(?) output to the receiver on the speaker. Is this technology audiophile approved? So then there's a DAC in each speaker and, as I gather, a DSP crossover rather than hardware. Whew. Wow. This set-up would be a game changer. Aside from Goldmund, who else in the hi-end is pursuing it?
-Josh |
Hi Josh.
A few companies are going in the direction of all in one solutions. Diavalet, Goldmund and Kyron come to mind. There are others that are just not coming to me right now. They must stand on their own feet in comparison to separate systems, and do with great success in many cases. To some, it's a step off of the upgrade train; no more cable obsessing, etc. To others, it's an inconceivable blasphemy. Listen, learn and decide. That's what I'm doing. You can't look at any part as an individual entity since it is designs as a whole system.
I am heading tomorrow to hear the Dynaudio Consequence Ultimate and the Avalon Isis. I also have finalized an in home audition of the T&F Isis and potentially the PMC MB2 SE. I'll keep you posted on those as more info becomes available. |
Jh901,
Essentially correct.
The Goldmund speakers are all in one systems and can be driven just by a computerr with the transmitting dongle. The speakers have Telos amps, Dacs and wireless receivers built in and are already DSP matched between amps and speakers and uses active digital crossovers for perfect synergy. Speakers are completely designed via computers based on an Advanced modelling software called Proteus that is constantly being upgraded. Goldmund uses no human intervention is speaker design, its all computer modelled to exacting standards and they can predict the outcome perfectly.
You can also step up with a Goldmund digital Preamp, now called a "hub" and this can have DRC corrections built in and also works wired or wireless to the speakers. Apparently, wireless sounds BETTER! Only wires needed are the electric plugs to power each speaker and that can be hidden in the flooring/under carpets, etc.
Downside is that they are pricey, and the Metis Tower wireless costs $18K and have 5inch woofers. The 120db (SPL) Prologos is $70K!
Others doing similar stuff are the Kii Audio, Kii 3 from Bruno Putzey of Mola-Mola/N-Core/Grimm fame.€10K a pair. DSP up the wazoo and claimed bass response of 18hz!
You also have the Devialet Phantom (much lower end offering) the white and the silver for about $3-4.5K a pair. These are shaped like orbs. Not sure if the Linn Exakt speaker systems are fully equivalent to these.
No doubt the future is here, and a pal of mine sold everything save his "first born" to finance a pair of Prologos wireless and says he is DONE after 45 years of search. Selling/sold his vinyl and R2R collection!!!! |
08-21-15: Wisnon
No doubt the future is here, and a pal of mine sold everything save his "first born" to finance a pair of Prologos wireless and says he is DONE after 45 years of search. Selling/sold his vinyl and R2R collection!!!! Selling his Lampizator too? Is he showing signs of early dementia? |
Has anyone heard that burmester 151 at any of the recent shows or any where else. It's seems to be an all in solution? |
Goldmund ProLogos Plus Wireless
Ok, so let's say that Matt has a digital transport such as Antipodes and doesn't utilized Goldmund's room correction device. Which digital output is used for the dongle(s)?
Once the digital signal is received (by L/R speakers), then what happens prior to pre/power amplification? Specifically, how is PCM and DSD handled? What does the DSP do?
Are the pre/power amps, which are mounted in the speaker cabinet, well designed compared to others at the $20,000 price point?
Are the drivers well designed compared to other speakers at roughly the $30,000 price point?
I'm really hoping Matt will be able to home demo. I'm extremely skeptical. Seventy grand will buy quite an impressive traditional component system. I'd fully expect a system at that price to absolutely wipe the floor with mine (Cary electronics/Focal speakers- less than half price).
-Josh |
No, he has not used his Lampi in ages since he went Emerald Physics then Goldmund DSP electronics.
He still keeps his old Lampi for sentiment. LoL |
08-22-15: Wisnon
No, he has not used his Lampi in ages since he went Emerald Physics then Goldmund DSP electronics. If EP was his prior frame of reference, that explains some of the hyperbole.... |
08-22-15: Jh901
I'm really hoping Matt will be able to home demo. I'm extremely skeptical. Seventy grand will buy quite an impressive traditional component system. Me too Josh. This whole thread started in the name of digital, and we all know the lengths that Steve Nugent, Lucas and others go to make it sound palatable. The idea that you can equal or better that with a Swiss version of Bang & Olufsen on steroids is magical thinking and an example of the advertising hyperbole that Lucas was alluding to from his Munich blog. This magical Logos system has not floored people at shows. Why not? Here is some Audiofederation feedback (he can be fairly blunt): Hi SMajor,
Yeah, I guess we do end up with a lot of large and elaborate setups. Not always but… yeah… :-)
Hmmmmm… ‘better sound’ …. hmmmmm…. Goldmund has what we call a sophisticated sound. We like this flavor of sound, Neli especially so. High resolution, good micro-dynamics, both across the frequency spectrum. Quick and dexterous.
If you like this kind of sound then this system does a reasonably good job at it [I have no idea what the price here is, so if is $1M, do not buy it. If it is $10K, order it up NOW].
If you do not know what sound you like – get yourself to a show and do some listening. But if you just want to get SOMETHING, and you are liking what you read about Goldmund, then by all means…
If you do not know what we mean by ‘sophisticated sound’ then this sound here is kind of like a planer speaker, for example if you have heard decent solid-state on Magnepan, but more detail in the lower frequencies and not quite as much microdynamics [but more than most other box speaker systems].
If there is any complaint with the sound here it is the slight amount of sterility. But, as you may know, I say that about just about all 100% solid-state systems. The Goldmund system actually does a decent job at being musical compared to most solid-state, including lots of outrageously priced things out there.
I’m sure Goldmund also makes separates and they will sound better if they cost more and sound not as good if they cost less. That is just the way manufacturers setup their product lines. But we also see the appeal in simple clean-looking setups. Really. We do. :-)
Hope this helps!
Take care,
-Mike
SMajor October 16, 2014 http://audiofederation.com/blog/2014/10/13/goldmund-rmaf-2014 Matt, any updates? You have been a little quiet.... |
Wisnon, I listened for a long time to the Goldmunds and found them very good. But I would never buy them as they leave me cold. They are easy to use, attractive, and have great frequency extension. But they are only good music; one never gets involved with them or feels the emotion of the music or taps ones toes. They are flat out boring. I do often read while listening and love it when the music grabs me and forces me to put down my book. They are perfectly suited for streaming elevator music. |
Tbg,
A friend of mine and who's opinion I've found very trustworthy over many years and listening encounters said the same concerning Goldmund. He finds them precise in an analytical/clinical manner. No organic character, soul or emotion stimulating ability at all, just cold. I have no personal experience with them at all. Tastes do differ amongst us and some will find their sonic attributes and character ideal for their preferences. They have obviously remained a successful business.
Charles, |
Wisnon, I listened for a long time to the Goldmunds and found them very good. But I would never buy them as they leave me cold. They are easy to use, attractive, and have great frequency extension. But they are only good music; one never gets involved with them or feels the emotion of the music or taps ones toes. They are flat out boring. I do often read while listening and love it when the music grabs me and forces me to put down my book. They are perfectly suited for streaming elevator music. |
Hi all. Sorry, was up in Tanglewood yesterday seeing the yearly Movie Soundtrck concert. John Williams was supposed to conduct but he developed back problems. It was amazing.
I went Friday and hear the Dynaudio Consequence Ultimate and the Avalon Isis. CU for the second time in a better room and with much better gear, Avalon Isis for the first time and setup in a private dedicated room with all top tear Spectral gear.
The CU pushed every button just right. The base was limitless, taught, clean, accurate, dynamic and with proper decay. Quite bluntly the best base I have heard, ever. The mids were magical, engaging and proper with a sense of texture and layering that only the Tenors have shown me. Complexity and subtlety at the same time. The highs are correct, extended, with no sense of harshness or shout. The soundstage was huge and very deep and imaging was accurate and it all Added up to a 3 dimensional experience. I really really liked them. They were accurate, without being hifi and musical without being warm or colored.
The Isis were, quite simply, too big for the room they were in and for my room as well. The Time would have been a much better model choice for my needs and for the room size. But what I heard impressed me in many ways and taught me much at the same time. I thought the 60" pulled the image too high and it felt awkward and unnatural, especially hearing the piano floating 3' above the floor. The tone was proper enjoyable but the 1" diamond tweeter struggled to extend without losing its magic and the twin massive woofers overwhelmed the room and were a bit tubby and lacked a sense of pace and rhythm. I think that was both room and equipment related though. The image was a bit far back for my tastes. I was frequently impressed by its scale and specific attributes I heard, but not once truly engaged and lost in the moment. I have heard the Time is a tad more revealing then the Isis, and I truly wish I had heard those as well. But extrapolating the Isis to the Time, with a similar driver complement but smaller in scale, I can get a pretty good idea of what they are all about.
The Avalon and Coltrane Tenor use similar drivers in a similar configuration and, to my ears, represent similar goals and styles. I preferred why the Coltranes do.
I will speak with Bob this coming week to get my ears on the Goldmund to give you guys and myself an opinion.
I also am trying to arrange an in home audition for the T&F Isis and maybe the PMC as well.
I was practically mesmerized by the Dynaudio Consequence Ultimate though. And it has catapulted to #1 by a pretty nice margin. |
I am not surprised Matt. The Esotar is my favorite tweeter and that speaker is time and phase aligned which always makes music. Are you sure its not too much speaker for your room? It extends down the 17Hz and is big....? |
I heard them in a completely untreated 17x20 room with 8' ceilings. And they sounded fan-dam-tastic!
They are a modified bottom port/isobaric design and are very very room friendly. 17" wide and 25" deep. I think they will be ok. Not as petite at the Tenors. I'll let you know since I arranged a trade for my MM3's plus some cash for a pristine pair. I'm hoping they will be here within 2 weeks.
Then I can A/B them directly with the T&F Isis and the PMC MB2. I have to say that if they sound as good as they did when I last heard them, I may make the official decision to not even try the Isis or BM2. We shall see.
But this could be the one. |
I forgot to mention that the 6 drivers integrated better then anything I have ever heard. From ultra bottom to uber top they were seamless. Truly seamless. It sounded like a single driver speaker. And no, that strange upside down driver configuration does not drag the image down. It's right where it's supposed to be and sounds incredible.... |
That sounds good Matt. I love their drivers, and a lot of peeps seem to like that bad boy speaker. I think your journey may be done (other than hearing the Isis). In an ideal world, it would be fun to own both! The Trenner stuff is designed for normal living spaces. I used to be a fan of the show "Pimp My Ride," and if you are familiar with it, the rapper Xzibit would always make the proclamation "you have officially been pimped" after they finished with their car: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUPQ1t-0o8oI think that is you finally. You have been pimped.... |
Don't waste your time on the Goldman's very a musical. |
Guys, the Wireless are completely different to separates. |
I said the ProLogos, not the Plus! |
Norman, the audiofederation blurb is about the plus. Wireless will not magically deliver the goods. Matt will fill us in I am sure....:)... |
