Are cables additive or subtractive?

Cables can only subtract from the original signal because they are passive devices.

From a purely theoretical perspective, all audio equipment is intended to amplify, pass and reproduce the original signal unaltered.  This is obviously which results in many different approaches to achieving the best final result.

I think that noise elimination is a key.  You can obviously hear noise directly if it's significant enough, but I also think that having noise has a significant impact on the overall sound.

If a cable, for example, results in a more harsh sound, it didn't add the harshness, it either allowed noise into the signal or filtered out something else that left the harshness.

Because every cable will filter out slightly different things and/or allow different levels of noise into the signal they may all sound different.  At this point listener preference takes over and if a cable improves the sound to my ear, I will tend to think of it as additave.

Think about a cup of coffee.  Coffee is the signal and the goal of the water, temperature, process used, etc. is to make the final cup of coffee to the taste of the person drinking it.  Increasing the quality of the water or changing the amount of water used doesn't add anything to the coffee, but does change final taste.

 

@hilroy48

+1 ..,. Nailed it!

NOTE: cables are not tone controls.But as with other components in your system, their synergy / or lack of it with the rest of the cradle-to-grave systems will influence your tastes vis-à-vis Yay or Nay.

KEY POINT OPTION # 1: assuming you DO HAVE the decent / high-end hi-fi gear to start with

 

(1) cables at their best IDEALLY are neither additive nor subjective. They are just supposed to be a signal pass-through in the audio system …ergo IDEALLY neutral and transparent with a minimal to nil insertion of its own tonal effects change .

However, all audio equipment pieces in the link exhibit their own bespoke sonic signature that cannot be avoided. That includes cables.

Hence, it is an alchemy “best available” solution to experiment with different cable designs, materials, and build quality to try to get as close to that Holy Grail of system synergy AND the individual cable tonal colonization minimization effects ( if any)

- ergo. Cables can be somewhat unavoidably mildly additive or conversely subtractive DEPENDING ON YOUR BESPOKE SYSTEM SYNERGY OVERALL, …with an ultimate purist goal of elimination and creation of a theoretical complete neutrality that is difficult to achieve …. that is the ethereal “Holy Grail” highlighted above

KEY POINT OPTION # 2: assuming you DO NOT have the decent / high-end hi-fi gear to start with

- the effects of cables in the context above is greatly reduced or eliminated. The absence of system higher resolution capabilities dampen/ flatten/ minimize/ kill/ (insert your own description) the audio performance effects of cables .

-ergo…minimal to nil additive or subtractive … largely just a strong audio effects of cables “additive” versus “subtractive” being agnostic.

MY PERSONAL EXPERIENCES

i have four 2-channel systems ranging from $40K to $1K

(a) cables DO MATTER THE MOST in my top A system …and only a lengthy hands-on swap-in / swap-out experimenting over 10 years with different OEM brands and models in my OWN system (emphasis added …) got me as close as possible TO DATE in system synergy AND the elimination of cables being either additive or subtractive.( as close as possible, which is the objective of quality cables)

(b) the effects of cables in audio performance as I like it decreases as I move down the system $$ strata.

3rd PARTY SELECTIVE COMMENTS

AUDIO: SPEAKER CABLES - From Alan Shaw (owner and designer of HARBETH)

NOTE: I used to have an all-NORDOST FREY cables full loom and they were fine with my last speakers., When I changed to HARBETH 30.2XD’s, something was now curiously “off”. So I upgraded all the cables loom to CARDAS CLEAR loom, and voila … a more pleasing outcome with added slam and dynamics. It was not a subtle improvement . Go figger!

The flat multi-strand and very thin core silver coated NORDOST array were now a step down from the thick gauge all-Cu CARDAS CLEAR new array that mimics the comment below.FWIW..

” … So, the moral of the story is this: the most important factor of the loudspeaker cable that you should select is the amount of metal in the cable core. More metal means lower resistance.

If the core is round (as most are) then the correlation is simple: the fatter the diameter of the metal core the better because the electrical resistance between amp and speaker will be lower.

Thin and really thin cores should be avoided regardless of how exotic the metal material is claimed as the lack of metal in the core conductor will increase resistance. That will reduce amplifier damping, effect the frequency response of the speaker and give unpredictable results that will vary from amp/speaker combination.

Do not be fooled by the diameter of the external plastic sheath: what matters is the metal content of the core. The more the better, without exception….”

 

If this makes any sense here it is. I have Van den Hul ’The First’ ic’s. They seem to take the most away in the sound that is electronicy, edgey, glary, thin, ghosty, and leaves a more natural sound. I have some audio art 3SE’s that seem to make the music feel bouncy in a good way, rubbery, elastic, if that makes any sense, music becomes more moving, seems timing is expressed a little more in a good way, bass line??, I don’t know for sure, but they have just a tiny more edge.. I have some mit 330’s that gives a bit more body to the music but the highs seem to have a small extra bit of metallic in contrast to more wood sounding when it comes to wood instruments. I have some Madie signatures that give me some natural openness, natural transparency, natural air, but leave me a very slight whitish residue.

I think it is definitely subtractive.

Whether it is cabling, phono cartridges, CD transports or dacs. The goal is to subtract interference, subtract vibration or subtract jitter.

Our goal is to remove all the added crap to get back to a pure signal.

Unfortunately my experience is that they are contextual: their specific resistance, impedance and capacitance characteristics work well in one setting and are negative in another, This applies equally to digital and analogue connections. And the permutations from shielding, gauges, metallurgy and connectors are mindboggling. The best solution therefore is no cable. Think Uptone USPCB…

That said they are a major component in system synergy and a bl**dy money pit.