Westborn, the new midrange in the Sasha and Sophia 3 are SB Acoustics.
The designers at SB Acoustics used to work for Scanspeak |
I have a pair of Sophia 2's and the paint on the top of the right cabinet has started to crack quite badly , I am the original owner , so these problems are still coming to the surface ( no pun intended ) , I have every confidence of a happy resolution as they are still under warranty .
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I was wondering if anyone has heard, and can compare and contrast Sophia 3 versus vandersteen 5a, or 5a carbon? |
Is 'new' midrange in the Sasha and Sophia 3 the Vifa NE180W or some variant? |
05-08-10: Elberoth2
However, based on my experience with Sophia 2 and Sasha, i can tell you that the biggest difference for me is in the HF department. Sasha tweeter is noticably different to Sophia 2 tweeter and much, MUCH better IMO. Sophia's 2 tweeter sounds grainy and 'hot' in comparison, wheres Sasha tweeter is very extended, airy and oh so smooth. Based on Elberoth2's assessment above, has anybody listened to all Sophia 2, Sophia 3 and Sasha? Would like to know if the highs of the Sophia 3 is almost on par with the Sasha, and a significant improvement over the Sophia 2. Thanks in advance. |
Went to the only dealer for Wilson in UT and had a go with the Sasha in all Mac gear (501mono's) and all I can say is WOW!! Huge soundstage and music is crisp, dynamic, and effortless.
If the new Sophia 3's sound even 80% close to the Sasha at 10k off then you could build a pretty decent front end to close the gap.
Definitley my top choice until I hear some horns.
-Joshua |
Ricred1- first nice system. As you can see, I like keeping things simple as well. On the Sophia 3s - I went back and forth between choosing Topaz and Dark Ti. My dealer's demo pair is in Dark Ti and they look great. Enjoy! |
Never met a WILSON I did not like! |
Cbd0815,
I agree with you, I had the opportunity to listen to Sasha's and Sophia 3's on two different systems. If I had enough money I would by the Sasha's, but I agree that there is a significant enough difference between the Sophia 2's and 3's to warrant the upgrade. I have decided to upgrade from the 2's to the 3's. I ordered a pair in Dark Titanium and they should arrive in a couple of weeks. |
Nice color! i hope the wait is not too long. |
Topaz and parchment grills (think I have the grill name right). Wifey has encouraged me to move away from the Darth Vader look of the Obsidian Black finish. |
Congratulations Cbd0815!! what color did you order the S3s in ? |
I'm moving in a few weeks and not about to attempt to move my Sophia 2s... So off to my dealer to check out the new Sophia 3s and Sashas. Well to cut to the chase, my new pair of Sophia 3s are on order and he is coming to get the Sophia2s. Both the Sophias and Sashas were lashed to Bolder gear, in less than an optimal listening room (too narrow front 2 back). Both systems sounded great but a little cleaner and less organic than I like.. . The real suprise was home BIG the Sophia 3s played. Much bigger than my Sophia 2s. The Sophia 3 has definitely closed the gap on the new Sasha. Only had about 20 minutes, but that was enough to lead me to upgrade. Can't wait! |
PrdPrez, thank you for sharing you insight.
Are you referring that the older Wilsons has that extra bass hump but the current model doesnt have that anymore ? in other words, itsmore balanced ? |
The Sophia3 I was listening to were hooked up to an all B.A.T. system. D5 cd player, 3i preamp, and 220 amplifier. Kubala-sosna Emotion cabling throughout.
The bass was pretty good. The speakers definitely retained the "full" quality of the Wilson sound but I didn't perceive any excessive bass. I never liked the extra hump in the low end that Wilson was fond of adding. There didn't seem to be anything extra in the low end. But then bass, more than anything else, is influenced by the room and these were in a pretty open space. So take my experience with a grain of salt. |
Looking forward to more info on the S3, although I've more or less decided to try to have one within this year. Finances willing. |
Thanks for the post, Prdprez.
Any difference in bass?
What electronics were used? |
Prdprez - Great! Looking forward to the experience. Where did you listen to them?
Thanks! |
Just spent some serious time with the new Sophia3.
A definite improvement over the series 2.
That new midrange is obviously superior in every way to the older ScanSpeak sourced mid.
The delicacy, air, and presence are all improved upon.
In fact, I'd say the new series 3 is closer to it's bigger brother, the Sasha, than it is the older series 2.
It is definitely worth the audition to anyone and everyone who appreciates Wilson speakers! |
Ppl living abroad, got a brand new pair of speakers instead. It was probably chosen by Wilson as a cheaper option for them (you only had to ship the speakers once). Cracked cabinets were scraped by distributors
** that is very comforting news!!** |
Say for those people that live in China, France or Southeast Asia. I guess, in short, they will have to live with those cracks. It is expensive to be shipping back speakers of this size to Provo Utah for repairs. AFAIK the so called 'repair' (which in fact was a cabinet swap) was only an option for US based customers. Ppl living abroad, got a brand new pair of speakers instead. It was probably chosen by Wilson as a cheaper option for them (you only had to ship the speakers once). Cracked cabinets were scraped by distributors. This is a first hand info from my local distributor and a friend living in Poland who had this very issue. He ended with a brand new pair of Sophia 2 speakers, in a different, premium color (color change was free of charge, no less !). Since then, he upgraded to Maxx 2 and recently to Maxx 3, so I can safely assume, that his confidence in the company has not been shaken. Let's face it - even the greatest companies have 'fuck ups' from time to time. Even Porsche does, and prolly RR too. The real test is, how those companies deal with them. IMO Wilson passed this test with flying colors, although it must have costed them a lot of money. I did not hesitate for a second to get my first, and then second pair of Wilson speakers. And if they continue to improve their products at a current rate in the future, I will buy them again. |
Well, it is almost the middle of June. Has anyone had the chance to listen to the Sophia 3's?
Thanks! |
Ricred
Nice, simple system!
Looking forward to owning a Sophia or Sasha someday!! someday!
Thanks for the re-assurance. |
Nolitan
Let me reiterate that I believe Wilson Audio and my dealer will do everything to correct the situation. My research has led my to conclude that the cracks were the result of a bad glue. It was isolated and it's my understanding that Wilson Audio went above and beyond to remedy the situation. I would not hesitate to buy Wilson products again and thats why I'm waiting to hear the Sophia 3's.
I agree about shipping them back to Utah, but I guess I have no choice.
The crack has not changed since it first appeared and there aren't any sonic effects. |
I'm hoping someday to own either a Sophia 3 or the Sasha.
The finish issue i've been hearing is also a concern considering the speaker of this price range.
To those who had this issue, does that crack get worst over time ?
It a rather difficult to remedy the problem if the unit does not reside in the US.
Say for those people that live in China, France or Southeast Asia. I guess, in short, they will have to live with those cracks. It is expensive to be shipping back speakers of this size to Provo Utah for repairs.
Other than this issue and my finances, I'm ready to go for a pair of these speakers. |
I have owned in succession the Sophia 1's, WP7's/WATCHDog, MAXX2 and now MAXX3. All of them had a flawless quality finish. I have never heard of or seen complaints of finish issues in talking with many other Wilson owners either, though I am sure some likely exist. I'm sure based on my own experiences, whatever issues there may have been were resolved.
Best to let those who've had first hand experiences contribute their own issues if they have them. I recall a gentleman elsewhere in this forum who was bashing an electronics company on line and calling their QC and service bad because he had a buddy, who's local friend bought some expensive amps and had them short out on delivery. It turns out (reported by the actual dealer), not mentioned was the fact they were ship-damaged or the fact the company offered to replace them sight unseen. Loose references to other threads and others experiences are just that.
Grant
Shunyata
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I belive the finish issue was an on off, and was traced down by Wilson to the bad batch of glue. It affected various models, including the Maxx II. AFAIK all customers who reported this problem got brand new enclosures or even speakers, some even got a free color change/upgrade in the process. I'm on my second pair of Wilson speakers (first Sophia 2, and now Sasha) and never had ANY prblems.
The speakers do not sound any worse than the day you bought them. If you liked the sound then, you shoud like them now as much, irrespective of the new models. |
I believe that is called 'hearsay'. It is unclear what value comes from folks who simply repeat what others write on Internet forums without the ability to offer direct evidence of their own.
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Bigpond
That makes no sense.If owners complain about finish cracks on this site time and time again I dont need to see it,I beleive them.Really makes no diff as Im not interested in buying speakers at this time and I would think long and hard before buying Wilsons.The OP asked about opinions on what to do with his "made up issues" with the finish on his Wilsons. |
To Missioncoonery,You should not make such a general statement like that about the finish without seeing at least one example for yourself! |
Hello Ricred1,
I understand very well and agree with your position! |
If you follow threads on this site, Wilson has finish issues.period!,,I really like the new Sasha speaker so im not bashing the line.I almost pulled the trigger on a pair of sophia 2s but the saleman let it slip that the new 3 would be shipped in a few months . I posted that info on this site.Several members disclaimed that which didnt really matter to me, Im glad I didnt buy them. Back to the OP,if you like Wilson them have them fixed |
Ricred1,Sorry to hear your disappointment very unlike Wilson in my opinion to have finish issues.The point you raise about the dynamics is the reason I love them so much.Maybe the dealer you purchased them from could help out with the cost of getting them back to Wilson?
I have just ordered Sophia 3's as front speakers for my Home Theatre. |
and what would you have had Wilson do....divulge product plans for products in development whose first shipment was 8-10 months and thereby stall sales for all those months? |
Weseixas
It's not poor performance, service , or quality. Prior to purchasing Sophia II's I heard rumors of Sophia 3's being in development,called Wilson directly and they denied anything was in the works. Less than 10 months later, the Sophia 3's!? I purchased the Sophia 2's with the thought of keeping them for several years, I don't have unlimited resources. Now at minimum I must pay $500 to ship them back to Wilson Audio. What ever I decide, I promise myself I won't purchase any new equipment for years. |
I have also seen it mentioned in a number of threads in regards to problems with the finish on Wilson speakers.I for one do not expect to have "finish" issues when paying 20-30 grand or more for speakers. |
06-07-10: Missioncoonery
IMO, I agree and diagree with J63..Wilsons are well documented for having finish issues.They
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Hello ,
Where is it well documented that Wilson have finishing issues?
regards, |
Ricred1,
What makes you feel let down by the high end, poor performance, service , quality?
regards, |
Missioncoonery,
The problem with buying another line is I love the Wilson Sound...especially their dynamics. |
IMO, I agree and diagree with J63..Wilsons are well documented for having finish issues.They also update or replace their line rather quickly compared to others ie Dynaudio which always hits the pocket books of those who own them.If it was my deal I would have them fix at no cost ,get them back and sell them as factory re-does.Their value will be at the peak the moment you receive them and will decline rather rapidly from that point forward.Weve already seen the prices on the Sophia2 drop from 9-10K used to 7-8 in a few weeks.I suggest buying another line...good luck |
James63
Thanks for the advice and I understand about the used market value. I'm not well off, I got to this point after 20 years as an audiophile, trading and saving over the years to get where I am. $5000 is significant to me! |
Ricred1,
Sorry to hear about your problem but it could be a good thing. The Sophia 2 will have a lot less value in the used market once the Sophia 3 flood the market. I would take the upgrade in a heartbeat. In reality if you keep your Sophia 2 five more years their value will really drop but the new Sophia 3 will hold it value much longer. Not to mention you get a new toy to love all over again.
I guess what I am trying to say is you need to take the depreciation of the Sophia 2 out of the $5000 upgrade price. It seems like a lot less money then.
But again I do not know how much $5000 dollars is to you. I just assume people will high-end gear are not too bad off... |
I was happy with my Sophia 2's; however the right speaker has developed a razor thin crack in the cabinet between the top and bottom portion of the speaker after only 10 months. Of course it's under warranty; however I have been given the option of getting the Sophia 3's for an additional $5000 or getting the cabinets rebuilt on the 2's with the original drivers and crossover installed in the new cabinets. I'm tired of spending money on highend and feel let down by the problem with my Sophia 2's. Really need feedback on how the 2's and 3's compare before I can make the best choice. I guess I will have to wait a while. |
According to Wilson, the series 3 is more than a just a cosmetic upgrade. New tweeter and midrange drivers are being used -these from the Sasha and the Maxx (I believe). Also, the crossover is also being revised. These changes are siignificant enough that there is no upgrade path for the 2's -which is unfortunate.
Nevertheless, at this point, I might as well wait a bit an listen to the 3's before I finalize my purchase decision.
Thanks,
Ritmo |
Ricred1,
I believe they just started shipping the first of June. I doubt we will see an in-depth review on them for awhile. But judging by the differences between the watt puppy 8 and Sasha I would expect the changes made in Sophia 3 to make a bigger sonic changed than Wilson has made in the past (IE. Sophia1-Sophia2). |
I have the Sophia 2's, has anyone had the opportunity to compare the 2's vs the 3's. Most upgrades seem to be marketing and offer minor sonic changes. If anyone could provide insight into the sonic differences between them I would apreciate it! |
Rapogee,
I listened extensively last weekend to the Sophia 2's. I detected a bit of vocal nasality on severel songs. On a particular CD (Chris Botti - Live in Boston) Chris Mcphee does a wonderful job on a rendition of Sinatra's - I got you under my skin. For some reason, her voice did not sound right. Again, there was an element of 'nasality' present that I never heard on this song before. I tried the same song on the Maxx 3's and this issue was not present.
The sales associate agreed there was some coloration. He said it was probably the room. Could be, but he did not offer to reset them in another room.
Again, at this point, I'm waiting for the 3's.
Hope that helps.
Mike |
Hi Ritmo,
Friendly question to you, you said you detected coloration with some female voices on the Sophia's? Please eleborate if you could since I placed my Apogee Diva's which championed that department for decades aside acknowledging how well the Wilson's were specifically on vocals.
Thanks |
Well, I spent some time this weekend listening to the Sophia 2's. At times they sounded terrific. However, I detected coloration with female voice that bothered me a bit. So, I'm passing on the 2's even though these can be purchased for a much lower price at this point.
BTW, the 2's were being driven by ARC - CD front end, Pre and Power.
At this point, I'm going to wait for the 3's. And, will still consider the Thiel 3.7's - which I have not been able to hear yet. |
James - I agree with you. I'm down to the Thiels 3.7s and the Sophia 2s or 3s. There are some good deals on the Sophia 2s but at this price point, I might as well be patient and do the comparisons - get the best of the 3 options. Early info would make the new Sophias quite compelling given the upgrades on the tweeter and midrange as well improved efficiency (at least according to the video interview). |
