tomthiel
These wood species tend to change hues with time and UV exposure. Wondering how the factory mitigated that?
Thiel Owners
Guys-
I just scored a sweet pair of CS 2.4SE loudspeakers. Anyone else currently or previously owned this model?
Owners of the CS 2.4 or CS 2.7 are free to chime in as well. Thiel are excellent w/ both tubed or solid-state gear!
Keep me posted & Happy Listening!
I just scored a sweet pair of CS 2.4SE loudspeakers. Anyone else currently or previously owned this model?
Owners of the CS 2.4 or CS 2.7 are free to chime in as well. Thiel are excellent w/ both tubed or solid-state gear!
Keep me posted & Happy Listening!
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foamcutter Welcome! Good to see you here. Yes, I have seen those very speakers per your query. Those white woofers are quite rare. If you like the presentation and sound of CS 1.5, the CS 1.6 is a measure better. The CS 1.7 is significantly better.
What gear and cabling is in your System? Happy Listening! |
I thought this might be of some interest to followers of this thread, though this paper is nearly 10 years old, it just recently came to my attention: for those that want to take a deeper dive into the subject: https://www.keele-omholt-technologies.com/papers.php more discussion:
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Greetings Thiel fans, I wanted to update you on a modification that i made (with the great help of my friend Bob M. who did most of the leg work on this). This was inspired by a suggestion that Rob Gillum had made to us in putting some three ohm resistors in front of the mid and tweeter in the 3.7’s. Rather than add one three ohm resistor we put two parallel going to both mid and tweeter. This would reduce the nominal impedance by 1.5 since they were in parallel. The result was a easier to listen to top end with a bit more naturalness to it. Rob gave us the idea and Bob did some digging and came up with the idea of running them in parallel rather than Use a 1.5 resistor. of course YMMV. this is what we added and it took 8 total. Dayton Audio DPR10-3.0 3 Ohm 10 Watt Precision 1% Audio Grade Resistor. Parts Express. I would not do this unless i was pretty proficient with a soldering gun. i would use solid silver and it takes two to make it doable, one to hold the driver and one to solder. when using the resistors in parallel, be sure to twist them together.
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ronkent - Regarding your mod. Be aware that the 3.7 mod that Rob suggested applies to only some speakers, not all. There was a QC problem with FST that required Thiel to test and characterize all incoming 3.7 coaxes and apply padding resistors as needed to bring the amplitude to standard. There were also harmonic distortion problems, which were failed and rebuilt in-house. When reworking drivers, CSS would add the resistors directly to the input terminals, or as in this case specify where to put them in the crossover. Later, the coaxes were built to proper spec and noted with black trim rings. The 3.7 has an octave-to-octave balance within ± 0.5dB. So, you don’t want to pad it down unless it is out of spec, which is possible. Note also that the mod as described here (padding both mid and tweeter) would effectively raise the woofer level a couple of dB. Moving the speaker closer to a boundary wall should accomplish the same thing. Also, any perceived brightness could be caused by harmonic distortion rather than simple excess amplitude. In that case padding down would reduce the gross amount of distorted output, but not cure the cause. Roxy54 - for the record, with the 1987 CS3.5 we converted from 60/40 solder to silver solder for all our speakers. Our choice was the aerospace standard Alpha SAC-305 which is 96.5% tin, 3% silver, and 0.5% copper. It is not only permanent, but is technically superior. The improvements are audible. It requires higher melting temperature, but achievable with a 140 watt soldering gun. |
hi Tom, thank you so much for your response to my post about the mods i did to the coax of the 3.7's. To clarify it was Rob G who suggested this tweak if we found the top end to be a bit bright and he sent me four 3 ohm resistors to try along with some silver solder. My friend Bob is much more proficient and comfortable working with a soldering gun and tried different iterations on his 3.7's. After using the ones Rob had sent he also tried some from Parts Express (see above) in the same value. Thought the padding was too much and then tried using them in parallel (becoming 1.5 ohm) which he really liked. Same here. We both have extremely good gear with me using a Coda 16 amp, a BAT VK-80 preamp, and a digital front end by PS Audio., What i heard is along the lines of what you described. If I could put it in layman's language (i am not very technical), if i had tone controls in my system, it would be as if i turned the treble down one click and the bass up one click. It really made the system more enjoyable than it already was and it was great. The VP of BAT (Steve) visited my home last fall (before the mod) and was incredibly impressed with the sound i was getting out of a speaker from 2008. So impressed that he actually may get a pair of the 3.7's someday. Others may not like the way the resistors changed the sound but for myself and my friend Bob, it was a move in the right direction. Thanks for all you do Tom. It is greatly appreciated.
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hi VR68, that is so interesting. I am going to study that more intently. and TomThiel, thank you so much. I am not that adept at doing that kind of project but will tell my friend Bob about it. Maybe the truth is that he and I both just like a bit of "tone control" here and a slightly muted treble? I just find the sound a bit easier to listen to, especially at higher volumes. |
Hi all, This has likely been addressed already, but the 276 pages of this thread are a bit daunting. My question is, what is the upgrade path for Thiel speakers? After getting my hands on the CS 1.2’s, I’m hooked and would like to know which pair I should have my eyes on next. Absolutely loving the 1.2’s, but the beast must be fed. |
spacebird - the number before the decimal point is the model. Higher is bigger. The number behind the decimal point is the iteration. Higher is more recent. More recent products incorporate all the learned advancements (that can be afforded). Next up the ladder for you, if you have a larger room or want bigger bass or louder playback might be a CS2.2, 2.3,2.4. The 2.4 is a stellar sweet-spot. I'm working on a product summery / timeline to help make the product journey clearer. Welcome. |
hi Spacebird, I have owned five generations of Thiel speakers since 1985. 2.0 (1985), 2.2 (1989), 2.4 (2007), 2.7 (2014), and now the 3.7’s (2019) I would second Tom’s suggestion, but if you can swing it, go for the 2.4’s. A truly wonderful speaker and a big jump in sound quality of the two that proceeded it in my system. |
@andy2 , I agree with @jafant in that often times it's with the recording. I can't comment on your hearing. But after the recording, I suspect it's more likely room and/or placement issues rather than your gear. |
Hi this is my first post here. I am curious if anyone has the xover schematic or picture for CS7.2. I just got my 7.2 to replace my long used 3.6. In my view, 7.2 is an huge improvement over 3.6 in all aspects. The only thing that i wanted to know more is on its highs which seems to be softer than 3.6. It is i think of better sounding high but a bit lower in loudness to my liking. I am not sure if it is indeed designed like this or whether there is part of xover parts that have aged. Just curious and appreciate for everyone feedback and help. |
mchan888Hello and welcome. This past summer I site recorded piano, bass, percussion and drums with my single-take, minimalist 2-mic documentary system, direct to SD at 32bit-192kHz. Earthworks QTC50s flat to 50kHz, no compression, eq, limiting, etc. Live to playback tweaking in the same space at the same time. We migrated from 3.6 monitors to 7.2s, my first up-close comparison of those models. I agree with your assessment. The 7.2 are the pinnacle of Jim’s work.
The 7.2 treble is not reticent. And its dispersion pattern is quite similar to the 3.6. So, if they sound dissimilar in your room, I suggest you lightly touch each tweeter while playing music to learn whether they’re both playing. If so, we’ll dig deeper. I have the schematics and welcome your PM to sort it out.
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Thanks Jafant and Tom. |
mchan888,
Congrats on obtaining a pair of CS 7.2 speakers. ' I'm right there with Tom that something is going on as the CS 7.2 has ample extension in the higher frequencies. Placement will be slightly different than your CS 3.6. This was a big factor with my CS 7.2 was ear placement to appropriate driver. It will be different than your 3.6. Another area to go over is amps and electronics. I have a few pairs of Thiels and everyone has a different amp I prefer. You dial them in with the right room (Thiels are very unforgiving with bad set uo/room) andyouwillbe grinning ear to ear. They are that good. |
The amp reference was not intended to address the dip in highs. It was to merely to poin=t out you can extract more from the big Thiels with the right amps. Big clean Class A for sure. In my setup I have them about 10' apart, 3' from back wall and 4.5' from side walls. Maybe a cap/resister fail if driver is working.
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