Just got a pair of thiel cs 3.5 that were highly abused driver wise. All driver but the one bass driver need replacing. Any other replacements that are optimal besides the David Louis audio reference tweeter and the scanspeaker midrange replacement on madisound? What about the woofers as well? Thankfully finish and the baffles are in like new condition.
Thiel Owners
Guys-
I just scored a sweet pair of CS 2.4SE loudspeakers. Anyone else currently or previously owned this model?
Owners of the CS 2.4 or CS 2.7 are free to chime in as well. Thiel are excellent w/ both tubed or solid-state gear!
Keep me posted & Happy Listening!
I just scored a sweet pair of CS 2.4SE loudspeakers. Anyone else currently or previously owned this model?
Owners of the CS 2.4 or CS 2.7 are free to chime in as well. Thiel are excellent w/ both tubed or solid-state gear!
Keep me posted & Happy Listening!
13,808 responses Add your response
thoft - sit tight for some first-hand experience here.For my part, I tested the Madisound "drop in" and it is so different that I would never consider it. Anybody want to comment? The tweeter you want is the rebuild of that particular version of the Dynaudio D28. Regarding woofers, that was highly specialized. I think Rob Gillum at Coherent Source Service can rebuild yours. I haven't heard of anything else that works. Remember that these drivers each cover a huge range and the various contouring circuits are specifically tuned to the resonances and anomalies of a particular driver. Generic replacements just don't work. But take courage, we will eventually have a stellar solution for you. Comments please. |
Woofers are pretty common on eBay and tweeters can be rebuilt (Brian at Holt Hill Audio http://holthill.com/
got his hands on some genuine D28 diaphragms recently). Mids are tough, the best advice I can offer is just to be patient. They do show up for sale occasionally. |
So no one has found a proper midrange replacement? I’ll probably do some graphical comparisons. There’s gotta be something close something better is somewhere. I did find some David Louis audio reference tweeters however. http://https//www.ebay.com/itm/pair-davidlouis-audio-tweeter-reference-on-Dynaudio-replace-T330-D260-D28-110MM/322436721536?hash=item4b12b9eb80:g:Zw4AAOSwg0pZYyB7 thoughts? |
My main system is a pair of imf tls 80, the audire forte with 200,000 uf capacitance 😉 and the Pioneer SA-9100 Running as pre. Cable wise is the MIT MH750 cables in the system. second one will be a luxman pre so th an adcom gfa 5800 and these thiels once I do the midrange drop in and try out those tweeters. Will use midrange until something pops up or maybe nudge a few buttons as I managed to do for the ol dahlquist I had and get a speaker company to make an exact replacement driver but that’s $$$$$$$ |
@thoft This is the unit Rob is selling at Coherent for 250.00 ea. Although still expensive at 190.00 ea, it’s what is recommended from Rob as being the closest match to original. https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/approx-5-midrange/scan-speak-13m-midrange-replacement-speaker/ Check out the Thiel section, there is another driver they suggest, but I’m not sure how much of a difference it would make https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/speaker-replacement |
I did see that but peter seems to be more optimistic about the David Louis tweeters. Anyhow something I noticed new on my amp is that my positive terminal spins. Is this just a tighten and you’re fine or does it need to be replaced issue? For some reason when I turn on the right channel it also pops in the left I turn on the left and it makes a pop again. The speaker connection loose issue or a different issue altogether? |
I have the 2.7s and some jl audio e110 subwoofers....but haven't really set them up yet. Been too lazy and the 2.7s sound so good on their own. I've had the 2.7s back in my system for months (sidelining my JA Perspectives for now) and just love the things. I'm sooo glad I jumped on this pair of 2.7s a couple years ago. They've become rare as the proverbial hen's teeth, and in my favored ebony finish, this was a unicorn find on the used market. |
biannuzzi22 - I have some experience with the SS1 and SS2. Repair is an issue, I haven't found schematics yet. Low-level noise is an issue; if you need black quiet, maybe not. Performance is unique; the user has no control over amplitude. Jim's gig was to play back what's recorded. Some folks want more bass, which you can get by messing with the room boundary controls. The room boundary compensation really works. With the PXO, the main speakers work as hard as if solo, so you won't gain additional output capability. I find their performance outstanding with the Passive OXs. I'm told that the active integrator is another league up. Biggest gains are with the smaller models having less extended bass. The 2.7 will get only a final bottom fundamental - surprisingly little content, but surprisingly satisfying musically. As previously discussed in this forum, I really like stereo subs. We're not supposed to have directionality at those very low frequencies, but a pair sounds somehow more real (for only twice the price!). If solo, try to get it near the center. I use the subs with dynamic, big music and turn it off for solo and small ensemble vocal which has little to no sub bass, and the quiet is nice. |
In case anyone is interested: TMR has listed a pair of CS 3.6 speakers in dark cherry. Listed condition as 8 out of 10. Asking $1399 + $299 for shipping. https://tmraudio.com/speakers/floorstanding-speakers/thiel-cs3-6-floorstanding-speakers-dark-cherry-pair-cs-3-6/ |
Hi guys, I'm experimenting my last idea to cancel/reduce vibrations between 3.6s and floor, built on my own a kind of cubic spacers made by ten layers of two millimeters glued lead sheets , so I got twenty millimeters of total tickness. Put three under each speaker and bonded to loudspeaker base by means very strong 3M tape. Spikes removed of course. Lead material is very low resonating so I expected it to acts as sort of mechanical filter at certain frequencies. My listening impressions so far is more bass clarity and overall transparency, nice finding, very nice. |
Silvanik - thanks for the report. There is definitely real stuff going on regarding floor coupling. Our initial insight (before spikes were a thing), regarded the recoil effect, how the cabinet swayed caused mostly by the woofer recoil. That motion is large in reference to tweeter wavelengths and causes time smear which is audible in a time-coherent system. But the actual coupling only became noticeable when we moved from the farmhouse to the real factory with concrete floors. The presentation got much drier and lean in the mid-bass. The farmhouse floor was resonating very nicely - I much preferred the musical presentation on the wood joist floor. Whatever you're doing, keep it up and let us know any further developments. |
@jafant I just had 16 ga speaker wire when my system was mid-fi (B&W, NAD, Rotel, Tecnics). Moving up to the high end, I found a great deal on used Cardas Neutral Reference. Ayre really likes Cardas, so that greatly influenced my decision. Now running Golden Reference (also previously owned). I’ve heard many other brands at dealers and RMAF but only Cardas in my own system. If Cardas is too rich for your wallet, maybe consider AQ? |
My new thiel woofer from eBay came in. They have the positive terminal labeled and the negative terminal blank. Takes all the guess work out. However, it seems one screw broke off inside the baffle so yeah. I don’t think that’s coming out. Anyways new woofer in and the old woofer out. Now to donate that woofer to rob. The voice coil glue is seperated from the cone. |
Thoft - a story for you. The 3.5 woofer is custom from Vifa, and built to handle a lot of power. However, the first production batch had nearly 50% woofer failures in the field. Turned out that Denmark had banned epoxy for health reasons and the substituted polyurethane didn't handle the heat. Very big deal, especially since customers had been waiting months for the model release. We got to the bottom of it rather quickly and our dealers were really supportive. Each replacement driver was sent with a copy of Michael Hedges Arial Boundaries album as an apology. Those albums were the best PR money we ever spent! Michael heard about it and thanked us with an autographed first pressing. Great album. Sweet lemonade from bitter lemons. |
| Post removed |
Thoft - The 3.5 was introduced early 1986 and sold approximately 5,000 pairs until replaced by the 3.6 in 1992. Those first woofers failed immediately and were recalled and replaced free of any charge (plus the Hedges album). But heat failure presented constant trouble with all Thiel models, especially the equalized 01, CS3 and 3.5. Slow roll offs use more power and the equalizer worked the woofer far harder than any normal demands would place on it. Now I'll conjecture a little. I don't know whether that voice coil is underhung - I kinda doubt it since Jim's involvement in finite element analysis only started around the mid 80s when the 3.5 was coming out. Irregardless, underhung voice coils produce 90% less distortion (of some forms), but their short, multi-layer (4 layers!) geometry inherently stores heat. Add to that extra heat the eddy current problems with aluminum voice coil formers which took Jim to using Nomex (which doesn't conduct heat) and you have a stacked deck for heat failures. Your separation is most likely from heat build-up for all these reasons. A re-cone has more advanced adhesives. In my Thiel Renaissance (admittedly very slow) redevelopment work, thermal management is a serious area of attention. I have measured wire temperatures at over 200°F and they are quite probably considerably higher locally. I'm excited about a solution (which I'll describe at the proper time) which dumps a lot of heat out of the crossover and drivers. |
