The best CD Player for the money

This quote led me to believe a recommendation of sorts was implied. Now that I'm familiar with your style and intent (which I approve of) I'll be more circumspect in drawing the usual conclusions. :-)

All the best,
Nonoise
Nonoise (Reviews | Threads | Answers | This Thread)

Very Nicely put Nonoise

hi nonoise:

i do have a unique reviewing style. i pride my self in not revealing my preferences in a review.

i just reviewed another player which will be appearing on audiophilia.com, which i will probably buy. i will explain my reasons for doing so.

hi audiolabyrinth:

i did not say that i favored the marantz over the vincent.

the two brands have a differnt house sound.

the vincent has a tube circuit which is tube sensitive. i have tried many combinations of tubes. i have owned the cd-s6 for 6 years and reviewed the cd-s7 dac.

i also reviewed the marantz sa-14s1.

i know its sound. i will not say one is better than the other. it is like apples and oranges. it is a matter of taste.

when you are a reviewer, you become less judgmental about sound, and let others decide which is better.

you have strong opinions that i respect. please try not to misinterpret what i say in the future.

this message is for ghosthouse:

i finished the TEAC review. it should be on the web site shortly.

I'll definitely check. Thanks Roy.

hi ghosthouse:

the review of the teac cd-3000 is on the website.

my take on the Marantz vs the teac:

the teac, while "neutral", is somewhat smoother in the Redbook mode.

they are about equal playing high resolution files, and the Marantz is a better SACD performer.

Mr. Tennis - Thanks for notifying of the Teac review. I've read it a couple of times. A lot of information conveyed. I do have a question. As I read, I see use of comparative adjectives throughout the article. In several places it's obvious comparisons are between the Teac's playback modes (e.g., redbook Vs SACD). In other places, not quite as clear. In the below excerpt from the "redbook listening session", is the sound from the Teac being compared to "CD players [you] auditioned recently"; i.e. the Vincent and Marantz? That seems the case but please confirm.

"I observed greater density of the strings, greater impact, greater fullness and greater extension in the bass region. The instrument also sounded larger in size. The piano sounded fuller and had more weight…."

Thanks in advance.

PS - RH,
Do you still intend to purchase the Teac?
I'll be interested in your reasons [as promised earlier :-) ] if you are.

at this juncture, I will not purchase the marantz, and because of the Vincent's limitations--no SACD or acceptance of high resolution files, and the fact that I own three other tubed players, I will not purchase the Vincent.

my issue with the TEAC is that it lacks liquidity. It is ruthlessly revealing of recordings, but may be invaluable when reviewing other components.

if I were to buy the TEAC it would depend upon the price.

Thanks, RH - fair enough. Happy to say I did purchase the TEAC. Got a great price on a demo (<<$2000) from Quest for Sound. In addition, Stephen allowed me to do an in-home trial with no obligation other than shipping. My previous experience with CDPs is nowhere near as extensive as yours nor with such sophisticated gear. I'd moved from a Cambridge Audio (D500?)SE to Upgrade Company modified Denon DVR2910 to the Teac. The Teac took a LOT of time to break in and early on I almost sent it back due to "lack of bass". Lot's of detail but not much warmth. Adequate burn-in time certainly took care of that concern. I'm really not sure what is meant by "liquidity" or how this would translate into something missing from my own listening experience. Bad CDs still sound bad although the up sampling feature seems to help in this regard. Todd Rundgren's remastered "A Wizard a True Star" is just about impossible to listen to. Upsampling helped with this recording. Lucinda Williams, "World Without Tears" redbook CD serves as a good example of a great recording that's even more enjoyable played by the Teac. For me, there is just "more" there…more presence of instruments, soundstage, air, bass. Plenty of mid-range bass and warmth because it's there on the CD. Another positive was listening to the SACD version of Peter Gabriel's "Up". Hearing it from the Teac was a goose-bump inducing, hair-raising experience….and I mean that in a good way. An uncanny sort of in the room presence. I was drawn to the Teac initially based on design. Dual DACs, twin power supply, high rez capable, digital in options (used with V-Link USB converter it has made the V-DAC I was using redundant), balanced XLR out terminals. These considerations checked off some boxes for me that the candidate Marantz players (8004 or 15S2B) did not. Cosmetically the Teac (mine in silver) is a beautiful unit and I like the design approach…not fussy, almost minimalist but providing exactly the needed functionality. Set up is extremely easy compared to some of the very well-regarded hi value offerings that also do video. Couple of things that "bug" me about it: 2 second delay between tracks on SACD. This interrupts the music when one track fades continuously into another with out intentional recorded gap between the tracks; also (minor) no way to open the loading tray from the remote. FWI - running the Teac with tube pre and amps (Consonance Cyber 50 & 800SEs). Will also use it with a Hegel 200 (anxious to try balanced IC). Speakers are Totem Forest. ICs right now are Anti-cables. Do plan to try some others.

For Audiolabyrinth as to why would someone buy the Teac and not the entry level Esoteric? For some of us, a $4000 price differential can be a strong inducement.

Ghosthouse,
I'm glad you like your TEAC. As you know, I went for the Marantz but in the end, it's all about what gets you down the path.

As revealing as these players are, with respect to the higher cost brands I think most of the added costs are in the casing and hardware (vault like transport mechanisms, isolation techniques, etc.). When one gets down to the end result (the actual sound) it all boils down to perspective and preference as one is only different and not necessarily better.

All the best,
Nonoise

@ Ghosthouse, Hi, Thats what I was looking for, the price difference between the Esoteric K-07 and the Teac cd-3000, Now all has made since, I understand when it comes to cost, cheers.

Hi Audiolabyrinth - my apologies for a bit of a testy reply to your question about why the Teac vs Esoteric. I had assumed you knew the pricing on the two pieces.

Nonoise - I was really looking hard at Marantz. Your input certainly a factor in that. If you don't mind, what ICs are you running between yours and amp or pre?

hi ghosthouse:

I could not find the quote you cited. I would say however, that I was not making a comparative statement between the teac and the Marantz and Vincent.

if you could cite the part of the review you cited, it would be easier to give a definitive answer.

given the information, I would guess the explanation is either one of the following:

a comparison between redbook and sacd or redbook and hrx

or

a general statement of a comparative nature relative to a number of cd players I have auditioned, but not suggesting that the teac exhibited these properties but that the Marantz or Vincent did not.
so , without further information, I would say it was a general comment comparing the teac to all other players I auditioned prior to reviewing the teac.

I would however, say that it is more likely that I am comparing redbook to another layer.

I would like to comment about the Marantz vs the tac.

I found the Marantz, while highly resolved, sometimes it was distracting and seemed that the level of detail exceeded that which one would experience when listening to
live music.

for me the teac is ideal for reviewing, because it is an honest player.

it removes a source of coloration that other players have.

i'm not sure. I may buy it myself. my ps audio perfect wave dac is in repair.

I would like to compare the ps audio pwt and pwt to the teac, in redwood mode.

one other issue with respect to the Vincent I do not understand.

the sound of the cd player changes from day to day.

yesterday it sounded very full bodied and today it sounded more detailed. I had played a cd for 48 hours prior to listening to the Vincent, and then observed the tube warmth. I turned it off and listened again today. the tube warmth disappeared.

by the way, you need to use a CD mat with the teac. i'd suggest the millennial mat. it really improves the treble response. the millennial mat is a carbon fiber mat.

Roy - Thanks for the follow up. Again, the excerpt I quoted is below, though there were several places where comparisons were being made. As I mentioned in my earlier post, I could pretty much tell when the comparison was between redbook (aka hybrid layer?) and SACD or hi rez and something else.

This excerpt (it actually starts with "I also noticed changes in the sound of the acoustic bass….") can be found in the latter half of the second paragraph of the review section headed "Listening Session - Redbook".

"I observed greater density of the strings, greater impact, greater fullness and greater extension in the bass region. The instrument also sounded larger in size. The piano sounded fuller and had more weight….".

So my question was, "Compared to what?"

Thanks for the advice on the mat. I will look into that. Good luck figuring out the cause of changes you are hearing with the Vincent.

Hi Ghosthouse,
The ICs I'm using are the Darwin Silver ICs (not the Ascensions). They really opened up the sound, so to speak, laying bare most everything. If it's coloration, shading or a tone control of sorts, these will not do. They are (in my system) very coherent.

All the best,
Nonoise

Hi, I already said the vincent will take atleast 500 hours to break-in, and the sound to fully intergrate and the bass slam to come thru, cheers.

if the quote was found in the Redbook section , than my statement applied to a collection of digital hardware that I had auditioned prior to the review. it was not meant specifically as a comparison between specific cd players, but rather a collective memory of the music sounding "better" on the reviewed component than it did on other digital products I had auditioned to date.

@ Nonoise, Hi, some how I missed your post about the chassis build quality of the vincent, you are correct, the vincent does have thinner metal and will perform better with tunning, I like that!, being able to change your sound with out electricity is always cool to me!, I have owned digital with built like a tank chassis that sounded bad, no matter what i did, tunning was not available on a chassis like that, it did not work!, the last time I had exsperience with marantz, I did not see any one eighth to quarter inch thickness to the chassis, It is my conclusion, that resonance tunning will work to good effect on any marantz digital player, new or old,, cheers.

I'm currently using a ModWright Sony 5400ES with upgraded tubes. I tried many CDP's and I like this one the best. It beat out my Esoteric unit. I have not tried ModWright's Oppo BDP-105 with digital inputs and newer power supply. That will probably be my replacement in the near future cause I'm eventually going to need a DAC. I want to create a music server.

Cary 306/200 on the used market.

Why has there been so few who recommended the old Philips-based Revox B226? I own one. When converted to run tube outputs amping (eliminating from the PCB any opamps), it will give any 24/96 or any 24/192 CDP a run for their money. One can keep the original oversampling coz it doesn't hurt too much the sound.

I guess that many of us have been around the block a few times, and there are probably a few units out there that are worth recommending. In my day, the three most memorable units in my system at the time, were the Musical fidelity X-Ray, the Cayin CD17, and the Rega Apollo. As it stands, I am currently looking for a new unit since the Cayin has shit the bed. Probably no fix for her. All I know is that I would like to go to a tube based output, with a robust build.
A close second would be to use one of these players along with multi-input dac. Oh boy

ARE U STILL LOOKING FOR THAT CD PLAYER

I've been happy with my Musical Fidelity A3.2 CD for many years. 24/96 up sampling and a Sony based mechanism and pick up. Was previously a Stereophile recommended class A player and can be had on the cheap now for about $500. OR get a cheap transport (Sony DVP-S7000?)and a nice DAC from Schiit?

The Emotiva ERC-3. Good build and good sound. Long warranty. With music servers coming more the music option for playback for many, looking for a good, last cd player makes good sense too me.

The OPPO players would be nice as well.

I guess the question is still relevant among streaming and computer audio,

I listened to a EMM Labs CDSA-SE and it took less then 5 minutes to realize what a fantastic digital player it is especially for a used price of $4,000.00, look for the later models with the German built transport .

I have listened to the popular players of the day even the modified ones at all prices used from $2000.00 and up then $10,000.00 plus players,, just for the fun of it.

The striking performance of the EMM Labs along with the used going price IS to my ears the best game in town by a good margin.

Well not sure about the best cd for the money hard way to analyze the sound, I use a sim moon audio 300D Dac and a Cambridge audio Azure 540cd player as a ttransporter. I have a love hate relationship with it , not sure how important the digital cable I use kimber d30 $135 canadin and wireworld equinox 7s as a front end was going or thinking of upgrade the equinox 7s for there Eclipse 7s ,, dillema , mybe a better Transporter , as the300D is a good Dac , any ssuggestions , best OWLY

There is no really good reason to stop listing peoples regarding value based opinions regarding CD players. Thus I say "party on Garth."
BTW I am currently using a 9-10 year old Music Hall MMF-25 which is still playing better than well in all aspects of its function.
My better CD players are still in my now Ex's house, and she is making it difficult to get them back Another knife in my back!

I vote for the RCD-101. It sounds better than the previous Signature Series player (SCD-010) which which was awesome! I rate it above MSB and many other dacs like DCS, Emm etc for musicality.

Any of you guys listening to an upper-level high end spinner...like Vitus, Soulution, Audia Flight...?

I would love to hear (read) about these players timbre, pitch, soundstage, PRat. Happy Listening!

I have the Oppos 103 D and miss my old Meridian 506.
I think Meridians are the most musical players

Hi Jafant, I have heard the previous model Vitus RCD-100 & SCD-010, Soulution 540 and the Audia Flight CD One M. Of those, the Vitus RCD-100 seemed most happy to be placed with other amps due to its neutrality, smooth sound and overall balance. That said, most of this group sound better paired with amps from their own family of amps for best synergy.

Vitus aims to make his players sound like real music, and to be able to sit down to a long listening session without fatigue. The sound is surprisingly non-digital, but rather gives a nod to good vinyl in some areas such as tonality, body & dynamics. I heard the Vitus SIA-025, SCD-010 & Magico Q1's with Siltech Royal Sig Series cables & was quite shocked. The sound was amazingly pure, liquid (tube-like) and musical. I'd never before heard any ss digital-based system present such a tube-like, analogue sound. The latest SCD-025 model is quite a bit better across the board than the previous SCD-010 and uses an all-modular architecture like the SL-102 preamp. Vitus is also due to release a new DSD USB board for the 025 in October.

The Soulution 540 sounds very smooth, stable, resolving & has a very low noise floor. I heard the 540 paired with a Soulution 710 driving Magico S5's & was impressed by the control, smooth sound & undeniable synergy. But with the previous series atleast (the latest series are supposed to be better) I couldn't quite get away from the perception the music wasn't completely natural. Maybe it is all those boards, parts and smps inside the chassis?

The Audia Flight CD-One M is a well built player & sounds quite smooth, accurate (resolving), clean and neutral in tonal balance. Although it is made in Italy, it is reminiscent of Canadian brands like Classe. If I had one minor criticism it would be this player leans toward the accuracy camp which makes is sound a tad analytical. My previous JVC XL-Z1050 for example sounded a bit smoother/more relaxed. I recall from a review I have tucked away that was through "sins of omission" (ie: gently rolling off the frequency extremes to achieve a smoother sound). And the JVC was very enjoyable to listen to.

Of that group (bearing in mind I have not heard the new Soulution 541) the Vitus SCD-025 is the one I could most easily live with. The previous model SCD-010 sounded tube-like, but much purer, more analogue-sounding and more sophisticated than my previous modded/re-tubed Ayon CD-5s. The current 025 is simply much better across the board. Thanks to it's 4 efficient UI-core psu's it has terrific dynamics, slam & PRAT. This player is fast and agile, but not in an "in your face" way. It sounds very natural and transparent thanks in part to its wide bandwidth & excellent dac, but most important of all music is presented with lifelike imagery, body and 'life'. It is about communicating the soul and intent of the music.

Esoteric DV-50 is still an outstanding player and an absolute steal used.

Thank You! Melbguy1-

this info was very helpful. I cannot await to demo these players for myself. Which gear is in your present system?

Do you attend Audio shows? Any additional info is always welcomed. Keep me posted and happy listening!
JA

YW Jafant. I use a Vitus SIA-025 integrated, Aesthetix Romulus front end, Magico S5's, Gigawatt PC-3 SE Evo conditioner, Jorma Prime & Statement cables and extensive Stillpoints isolation. I plan on upgrading my front end soon, mostly likely to an Vitus SCD-025 for synergy.

I attend the Australian Audio & AV show when it is in Melbourne. That's the only high end show in Australia - not in the same league as Munich obviously, but not a bad show. Cheers.

You are a lucky soul- Melbguy1- that is an incredible system you own.

I concur about the Romulus spinner (for its price) it is a keeper. As a 'cable guy' I have always wanted to demo Jorma cords.

The Magico S3 & S5 are on my short-list to audition as well.

Any one here using the spinner by Audionet offered by GTT Audio/Video?

Thanks for your kind words Jafant. The Romulus surprised me, for the money it sounds very natural and accomplished.

If you can get an audition of Jorma cables, I think you'd be impressed. Jorma sounds natural, organic and harmonically rich (especially Prime). Origo is more neutral.

Melbguy1-Great info and amazing system.
The Magico Mini is also on my list...the Vitus is a little beyond my reach, but I am intrigued with the Romulus.
Have you used it as a stand alone DAC? I am loading up my new server and a one box solution with AES/BSU as well as USB inputs would be a great fit.

I love my Modwright Sony 5400 and have heard great things about the Ear Acute 3 and Romulus CD players...

@Budburma, Thanks for your kind words. I've been reading up on the Mini 2's recently . They were an all-out effort by Magico at the time to build a statement stand-mount & even today look extremely solid and beautifully built. There is only about a $2k difference 2nd hand between the Mini 1's & Mini 2's, so i'd wait for a pair of Mini 2's to come up at the right price.

I use my Romulus as a cdp & haven't used the dac with any external sources. But the Romulus is essentially a full Pandora dac with a drive which is exactly the way Hans Ole approached the SCD-010/025.

I'm also aiming to reduce my box count & focus on digital. Initially when I get my SCD-025 I will run it as a cdp, but I plan on adding a high end server in future & using the SCD-025 mainly as a dac feeding the server, or for gtg's.

@Melbguy1-The Minis's astonishingly substantial and graceful in appearance at the same time. I am sure they are also a sonic force with which to be reckoned.

Previously, my AMR CD77.1 served as player and USB DAC and was very capable. I am not convinced that USB is the best interface. I have a new server, a bespoke Music Vault Diamond with an ingenious solution straight to AES/BSU. It rip with dB Poweramp and uses JRiver for playback. It seems to be an excellent solution for a one box solution and Neal provides absolutely excelsior service.

The Romulus has my attention now and I'll start the due diligence motor up! I do love the AMR sound though and may stay with the DP777SE.

Bud, I also noticed there are a pair of rare Marten Coltrane Alto standmounts up for sale on the 'Gon at the moment which I rate as better overall than the Q1's going for a bargain price of $9k. The Alto's were $24k when then last sold in 2006 & use a carbon/kevlar monocoque cabinet, so basically the best material you can buy. They also go lower than the Mini 2's and are not critical with room placement. Some audiophile is going to be happy.

Technically serving music via NAS over ethernet is the best solution so long as your renderer is optimized for that. But for a server transport running to an external dac, the best solution is twin AES/EBU cables like the Aurender W20.

If you're looking at the Romulus, take a few mins to have a read of Grannyring's system. He has done some pretty awesome mods on his player.

About four years ago I upgraded to the NAD Masters series components and was quite surprised at how the M5 SACD player made my regular "Redbook" CDs sound better, later learning something about the differences in DACs.

Last year I got on to Audiogon and snagged a McIntosh MCD500 (just before the MCD550 was introduced) and have been really happy with the new SACD player. The "eight channel" ESS DAC chips they use in those units sound very good, very smooth, yet extract so much detail from the source. I suspect the MCD550 sounds even better!

These units are quite "pricey", but if you snag a good, used model, you should be as happy as I am with mine, at a more reasonable price.

Melguy1!
Off goes the Romulus?!
Maybe a barrelstack of VCaps to change your mind? Just kidding, we all know
everything changes and "consistency is the last refuge of the unimaginative." or, "the hobgoblin of small minds...."

@Budburma, yeah time for a change. The Romulus is amazing at it's price point. But I have a pretty special spinner waiting in the wings to replace it. Hint: it is made in Denmark!

Wish I could pick it up. I think that by the time it was shipped and converted I could almost buy a new one.
Danes don't lie. At least that's they say. I gues they could be lying about that though!
Let's see....
GamuT-nope, not that pricey
Bow...are they still extant?
Gryphon-Darth Vader stylin' high end...
Dali..Dynaudio, nope, speakers. Did Dynaudio move?
I'm out of ammo.

Have you ever considered MSB Technologies? Their technology looks pretty amazing.

Hi Bud, yes "The Beast" uses an MSB Diamond dac & I can tell you the Vitus RCD-101's dac kills it, and the dac is the SCD-025 is even better. Also being a bit old school, I never really took a liking to the pancake chassis of that gear.

OPPO 105D

This is astonishing! This thread has been going for nearly 15 years!! :)

I have a Cambridge Audio 751BD universal player for my transport. Purchased a demo model for $899 CDN in 2013, I think?? Great unit! Very versatile although I now use it in tandem with a Bryston BDA-1 DAC and that totally blows away the 751BD's built in DAC, IMHO.

I have the Cambridge Audio 851C on my radar now though. It's been getting some excellent reviews. Anyone here familiar with that model yet?

I recently purchased a anthem cd-1 made by sonic frontiers for 450 has tube for out put stage for the money and sound you cant find a better player