I've decided to keep 3 sets. Decided not to use them on speakers, 15' high ceiling and open left hand side of the system.
Even with bare walls, my system sounded excellent. But it's amazing how these little suckers can alter the sound. I experimented optimal locations and in Level 2, installed one extra HFT in the center front wall above the center. So now I have 3 HFT on center front wall. It added height to the image and soundstage.
I've always prefer a lively room and HFT is the icing on the cake. |
Ozzy, Glad you had a set of MIG's to put the FEQ on (all three MIGs pointing in the up position). Also the grounding plug should be directly into the wall if possible and not into a power strip, etc.
To me the FEQ unit seemed more "powerful" after three days of being on. No explanation of why it should happen. Will be interesting if you get the same impression.
Have a fun weekend of listening. |
Knghifi, I also think 3 sets is enough. Perhaps later I may try additional HFT's elsewhere in my room. But sticking Blu Tack to my speakers had better be a big improvement, which to me it wasn't.
Now I'm wondering about the XOT items that go into your speaker terminals...Anybody try them? |
I am always open minded about tweaks but also like to understand the science behind them. After reading the explanation on the SR site I must admit I am still at a lost to understand what the HFT does and how it does it. Can someone please try to explain the technology to me? In the meantime I am going to try the free trial program offered by The Cable Co. |
I offer the following, after my first few months with an FEQ:
I would experiment with other isolation devices in addition to
MIGS, to get the most from the FEQ. This makes a huge difference, as does the underlying support material (shelf or stand) you are using. Symposium Rollerblocks work very well for me, on a granite slab.
It is normal for the transformer to feel warm to the touch.
It is best not to enclose it or restrict air circulation.
I like lifting the wires off the floor, and am supporting them on
egg crates. I also clean both ends of both connectors, periodically.
I also have a Schumann Resonator at the other end of the room,
and feel it works very well with the FEQ.
Be careful not to treat the FEQ with any demagnetizing device.
It will take days for it to "settle down" and perform well again! |
Hi David,
How do the FEQs compare to the IPC units.i.e dufferences an improvement.
I found that the IPC units made a nice improvement only when i installed the HFTs and when the IPC units used alone tightened but lightened the bass, that was before the 3 sets of HFTs.
I was just wondering what is the incremental improvements with the FEQ in the system.
I too use the QOL and also rr777 and IPCs so addung another device seems rather over the top for me at the moment.
cheers |
Has anyone tried the Synergistic Research XOT's? |
The wonderfull fact about the HFT - FEQ units is they are complimentary and yet have nice effects on their own.
The FEQ Unit works on lower frequencies than the HFT's. The music becomes more full and balanced. Also and quite important is the it's effect of lowering the floor noise. Less congestion when multiple instruments are playing.
Adding the IPC units "moves" the music more into the room. I am over the top happy with the interaction of the HFT + FEQ units and the IPC Acoustic Energizers
The QOL unit adds musical information to the speakers.
The Acoustic Revive77 (Schuman Resonator) works well and there is a sense of "loss" when I turn it off.
So in my system I am not hearing an over processed sound. Instead I am hearing full glorious music. |
Synergistic Research XOT's have been ordered and are on the way. Should be here Thursday. Since my speakers are biwired I ordered two sets. I will try a set on the mid-high terminals, a set on the low terminals, and then sets on both terminals at the same time.
Should be fun and educational. |
Was the improvement as dramatic as the level 3 hfts? |
I am happiest with the Stein Speaker Match, which
integrate the top and bottom of my biwired Martin Logan Prodigys
as never before. The XOT did nothing for me,
but at least I gave them a try. (It was not a close comparison...) |
Sgordon1, Thanks, for sharing your experience with the XOT's.
David, Look forward to your opinion also on the XOT's.
What I recently found was placing an Audio Magic PEA stuck to the back of the speaker cabinet just over the crossover really made a significant improvement in sound quality of each speaker. |
The is another audiomagic gizmo, peas.
Wonder if anyone has compared the differences.
I especially like the steinmusic HA and HB modules as the intensity and effect can be adjusted.
Used in conjunction with the acoustic revive rr777, IPC energisers, Telos alphawave and quantum symphony pro gizmos. I bit the bullet a ordered the FEQ.
At least.for some there is an explainable theory behind the product.
It just gets more bizarre each time, but think there are too many little devices in the room now.LOL! |
The is another audiomagic gizmo, peas.
Wonder if anyone has compared the differences.
I especially like the steinmusic HA and HB modules as the intensity and effect can be adjusted.
Used in conjunction with the acoustic revive rr777, IPC energisers, Telos alphawave and quantum symphony pro gizmos. I bit the bullet a ordered the FEQ.
At least.for some there is an explainable theory behind the product.
It just gets more bizarre each time, but think there are too many little devices in the room now.LOL!
As for the speaker match, there have been many like walkers and audioprism. Basically a r/c network which i have experimented before does work, but differ connecting cables, type and value of resistor all change the sound. There so much more experimental of these devices that it makes for a much more subjective opinions. |
Hey guys and gals, I got my level 3 HFT's a few days ago. Works exactly like you guys said. I just got the FEQ today. I have not plugged it in yet. Can I plug the 12V AC in the transporter? The plug fits and the blue light goes on. I immediately unplugged it because I cant find anywhere that anybody can do this.
I assume the ground plan gets plugged into an unfiltered power outlet correct?
Thanks,
Joe |
At the RMAF I was told not to plug the FEQ into a Transporter. Indeed the FEQ will sound better with the ground plug going directly into a wall socket. Also the FEQ responds to being placed on footers. My experience is MIG footers are better than Herbie Isocups which are better than nothing. My FEQ unit is midway between the speakers, about a foot out from the wall. To my ears the FEQ immediately sounds good and gets better after being left on for three days.
Hopefully the Synergistic Research XOTs arrive today. Has any one noticed a change over time with the XOT's? |
SR suggests a 72 hour period before evaluating the XOT...
(now they tell me!) |
David, Did you get the XOT's ? |
I have my FEQ on top of some MIG's and I just placed an Audio Magic PEA on top of the FEQ.
The PEA adds even more slam to the FEQ. |
I have the XOT's- two sets as the horns are biwired. They effect a major change in stage with and depth. I do not hear a shift in frequency. Bass is tighter. Space between instruments does not feel as "dense". I only have 6 hours on them. I certainly heard one or two break in changes almost like an audio degaussing. Will let the system play overnight. If you have the dual speaker leads (which accept both spades and banana plugs) the XOT banana plug version sure is easy to put in and take out for evaluations.
The XOT build quality is excellent. The effect is much greater and on more aspects of the sound than the Walker product.
Not finished the evaluation but the effect the XOT's have on a system should make most serious audiophiles try them on their own system. Postage is maybe $10.00 each way.
Putting them in your system is makes you think how and why you like what you hear.
Ozzy, how many Audio Magic PEA's are you using and where?
I am using five IPC Acoustic Energizers. One behind each speaker, one at each end of the listening couch, and one directly behind where I sit. |
Man posting on Audiogon seems to be days behind.
Anyway, David I have 4 of the PEA's. One is inside my PS Audio P10 that powers my digital and home theater equipment. Then, I have 2 of them placed on the back of my speakers over the crossovers. And the last one is sitting atop of the SR FEQ. |
Well, I just received the XOT's. I have two sets due to biwiring. I only have a couple of hours with them but already I can tell a change in the soundstage. The music is really out into the room. Not forward just all over the room. Singers sound larger and more centered and seemingly involved in the music.
Now, I used to own a lot of Synergistic Top of the line products. I got irritated and sold off my cabling and conditioners due to the constant upgrading of the equipment making my current models obsolete and worth much less. Not to mention all of the extra wires needed with the "active shielding".
After I sold them off I swore I would not get anymore Synergistic products.
Well I started back with the trial of the HFT's and I was hooked once again. I've got to give them credit for being so innovative.
|
You might want to try copper sleeves over the XOT
connections. I polished the inside and outside of 1 inch pieces before putting in place. It will change the sound! |
Sgordon1 , are you putting the copper sleeves over the XOT's or over the banana/spade connections? |
Ozzy: Are you using the XOt"s in addition to the Audio Magic speaker clarifiers or instead of them? |
Yoby,
I am using pure solid core 99999 silver soft annealed bi-wired speaker cables.
On my speaker crossovers I have installed the WA quantum speaker chips, over them I have the Audio Magic PEA.
Near the end of the speaker cables I have the Audio Magic Speaker clarifiers. And then finally the Synergistic XOT's.
Each was installed seperatly with the XOT's added last.
With the SR HFT's and the FEQ unit, I have now the BEST sound I have ever heard!
Soundstage is huge, deep, the bass is really deep and well defined. There is such a lifelike image that I swear it can't get any better!
Somewhere down the line I will try removing some of the tweaks to determine just how much each one is contributing to the glorious sound. |
Wow you guys are far ahead of me.
Two AM PEA $600.00 middle guys
Two R777
Set of Hologram sticks
Bybee speaker bullets
So I must try these SR HFT guys to keep up with the young cats here. |
Wow you guys are far ahead of me.
Two AM PEA $600.00 middle guys
Two R777
Set of Hologram sticks
Bybee speaker bullets
So I must try these SR HFT guys to keep up with the young cats here. |
I'm amazed anyone with a good system likes these things. They ruined my system - degraded the imaging and sucked the life right out of the music. Truly the most awful tweak I've ever had the displeasure to endure. |
Augwest, you are one in many many many that oppose this new system. I just think you maybe not set these thins up right. And you did not have all correct quantities of these new items for the size and shape of your room. I would like to suggest maybe you try it again but this time with expert advise from your dealer or calling S.R. directly if your dealer has no clue. The first step that helped me the most was calling my dealer and S.R. and then removing and selling all my previous room correction items in my room. I sold all my GIK panels and any other room treatment. The money I got from the sale paid for all the new S.R. items I needed for my room and a saved a few 100's as well.
The directions that came with the HFT is just a guide. My positions of my (15) HFT's are much different from the instructions. Also, this new S.R. acoustic room treatment equipment consists of the HFT, FEQ, UEF, and XOT's and its truly the new SOTA room correction system at a reasonable price. A dealer would have to suggest loaning you all of these items just to see a base point on where to start and how many you will need. I actually needed (15) HFT's, (1) (FEQ) which is very finicky on how its plugged in and located for it to work properly), one pair of XOT's and (6) UEF's. A combo of (3) gray and (3) silver. (These had to be placed at critical points n my system. Mostly power cords.
I also like to add, a big odd room needs more and a smaller near field system needs much less. but gets the same results... And it needs to be set up correctly with help of a S.R. dealer. Its the combination on how much HFT, FEQ, UEF, and XOT's your system needs to get the perfect room correction that is needed. Even for experimentation by you in your system. That process takes a few days maybe weeks. Once its all dialed in the room you created will be the best SOTA room treatments/corrections and soundstage you will ever hear. I would have not have ever switched to this new room treatment system if it was not done right and if I did not get expert direction and follow up from my dealer at The Cable Company. They know exactly what to do to set these things up. Each system is set up in its own unique way and may or may not even use all the products and maybe just one or a few product from this new line of room correction products is needed.
I'm very happy with all the hard work and content adjusting until I got the exact audio performance I have been looking for years form my room to sound. Yea, I did not like the way a few position sounded in my room. It was my determination and persistence that cause me to succeed with my room.
I think many others here experienced this in their system as well as I did too with the new Synergistic Research products. Plus I had a lot of fun setting all these items up and I can change my soundstage anytime if I want to by moving the HFT's. My soundstage is now very wide, tall, removes boundaries of the front and rear wall, envelops me all around me. Its truly 3D right in front of me and all around me playing any instrument I choose from my source. I'm very pleased with these new products. |
Joeyboyni,
I have quite a few Acoustic Science tube traps in my room with the HFT/FEQ/XOT's.
Do you think I should take out the Tube Traps? |
Joeyboyni,
I have quite a few Acoustic Science tube traps in my room with the HFT/FEQ/XOT's.
Do you think I should take out the Tube Traps? |
Ozzy,
No, you do what's sounds best for you in your system. I just explained my experience and what sounded best in my system. I'm just passing on what I learned and hope it maybe useful for someone else. If you think, your room will sound better without the Tube traps then do an experiment and remove them and then place them back in and report back here what you experienced. Good or bad, I like to hear what others experience. Maybe it will save you some $$$ if you like what you hear without them. I like to hear stories where people save some cash and then maybe it will apply to me. that's all. Thanks. Joe |
Removing the Tube traps to "try" will be a pain.
I was hoping that you had experience using the HFT's without any other room treatments. |
I just received 15 of the Audio Magic "Bells".
Compared to the Synergistic Research HFT's these are much better. Better with deeper, wider soundstage. And the bass seems to be clearer and stronger.
So, with the 15 Synergistic Research HFT's I have I am using them as placement Four & Five and a few other places.
Oh yeah and the Bells are much less expensive than the HFT's. |
Now I need bells? Better than HFT? |
I just made some home made HFT/Bells. These costs a couple of bucks and they sound better than the SR version.
If you look at my system picture you can see my copper version. The SR is in the center of the picture and it is slightly larger. |
|
Ozzy, I'm impressed with the DIY HFT's! They look cooler IMO. I don't see any bells on Audio Magic's website. Are these prototypes? I had great luck with the AM PEA's and appreciate your observations last time. Works well with the ZX Pulse Gen (have this on an Oyaide 079 plugged into the ar2p-to). I actually found the Akiko Tuning stick worked on my system (I cut the AC plug off and placed it on one of my amps negative terminals). I came across your findings recently on the WA Quantum fuse chips and now I'm waiting on those to come in for the SR20's I have. Too bad that power chip didn't work on the audience! I tried an Acoustic Revive qr-8 on the top of it with a friend. Insane soundstage effect and precise imaging, but sadly the highs overtook the other frequencies and introduced harshness. On his system damping the top of the P10 has a nice all around effect (Entreq Vibb). Not sure if HRS plates will do the same (the thicker DPX model is awesome on my source). Next up, SR RED fuses! |
Audiotunesx, Thank you ! They look even better in person.
Sound wise they are as good or better than the SR units. I think its because copper has better tonal qualities. The SR units appear to me to be there tuning units used in there active shielding and are cut in half.
The Audio Magic bells are not posted on the web site yet. But, they are listed on Audiogon. Do a search for AudioMagic.
Question:
Are you saying that your friend is using dampening material on the PS Audio P10? If so, I have found that Herbies makes a DB heavy pad that can stick to the cover very well. I use them now on several pieces.
Also, what is so special about the SR Red fuses? |
Ozzy, nice stuff! My friend and I experimented with the HFT's on his system. They were very effective once several packs were used. With just one pack, the height of the soundstage (or stage position) went up too high. Voices kind of on top of you. Tone shifted towards the highs. With many packs around the room they did expand soundstage and provide higher resolution and I think tone went back to normal. Results will vary, room to room, system to system. I'm reluctant to try HFT's with the tall Magnepans. I don't think they improved tonal qualities, so it's interesting that yours do that! Copper is likely a better material. The AM kit is interesting, but still a bit of money for me. My friend also has the FEQ. All around amazing product, well worth the cost! To me it was similar to the effect of the aR2p-TO, in terms of resoltion, dynamics and soundstage. But the FEQ goes about this in a very relaxed way. My friend made his own plug in cable out of silver wire and an Oyaide 004 connector. I was shocked at the improvements. Even clearer, more soundstage/resolution/bass, no ill effects.
There's a damping product from a European company called the "Entreq Vibb Eater." Much like the HRS damping plates they are placed on top of a device. On the P10 it really helped all areas. The Vibb is a basically a leather pouch with several pounds of damping sand. It may have some EMI properties as well and pebbles, I'm not sure. The HRS plate was tremendously effective on top of my Oppo 105. It took the player to a whole new level, while somehow taking away much grain and harshness at the same time. I bought one more plate, but have yet to try if a second will add further improvements. For the money, I haven't come across such an easy effective tweak (aside from HighEnd CC's 75ohm terminator, best $20 bucks ever spent). I haven't tried any damping material inside of my components yet. I was looking at the Fo.q stuff (but the HRS plates cost just a little more). I'll take a look at Herbies offering! After experimenting with the Acoustic Revive QR-8, I feel their's got to be an effective damping product for the audience aR2p-TO. I'm also looking for a way to dampen all my Oyaide 079 connectors.
The SR Red's are a bit pricey but I'm considering buying. Unfortunately, I can't find what they actually changed. I did find out that it should sound similar to the SR20 with an increase in resolution and lower noise floor. I looked closely at the pictures and it appears the end caps are the same. So changes are likely inside the fuse. I wonder if SR added damping filler like Furutech... Has anyone tried one of these yet? |
Placement of these little devices can change the tonal qualities. If you place them too high they do seem to accent more of the higher frequencies.
Except for a few places in the room, the majority of mine are placed either at speaker height or near the floor level at the middle and behind subs and speakers.
I also have many placed on equipment. The speaker placement was ok and on most of my digital equipment there is an improvement. But, not so good on other equipment such as Amp or Preamp.
I now have 15 of the SR, 15 of the Audio Magic, and about 30 of my DIY versions.
I would rate the Audio Magic the best, with my DIY versions second and then the SR's. Again, I think it is because of the copper. |
Ozzy,
Do you have any close-up pics of yours? |
Sabai, Not yet.
Better still I'll explain how I made them.
I'm using 1/8"copper pipe caps with a copper cone inserted inside. I bought the cones from a fishing lure company. It has the right tapering and the right opening inside.
Now, Audio Magic uses a crystal inside the cone, mine does not. But, I might experiment further. |
Hi Ozzy,
Thanks for this information. Very creative. I'd like to try this out myself. If you don't mind, please let me know the diameter and the length of copper pipe you use for each segment. Also, do you have a link or specs for the copper cones? Thank you. |
For all you DIY's. I have received many emails to make these items. They are quite simple to make.
I used 1/8" copper caps with a large copper cone from a company called "Hareline" inside. Hareline makes items for fishing lures and can be bought from Amazon.
The caps however, will need to be purchased from a plumbing house. Then just simply glue the cone inside the cap. The cone is a direct drop in. I used Elmer's school glue to seal the cone inside the cap.
Audio Magic also places a crystal in the middle of there "Bells". I suppose you could use (Blu Tack)to hold a crystal in the cap before gluing the cone in it.
Personally I don't think its necessary.
When you place the cones (I used blue tack) on the wall or the equipment, place them in the middle first with one at the height of your speaker, then near the floor and perhaps one up high. If you go to high with them it may accent the higher frequencies. But do experiment.
The others were placed at the first and second reflection points on the side walls.
At the wall behind you, I placed them again in the middle, at floor level, mid and high.
Then from there you can experiment through your room and equipment. Some places they worked good and some not so good.
I must add that I also own the SR FEQ unit which is supposed to excite these things. |
Just received my FEQ. So far so good! If anyone else is skeptical like me and want to see pics of internals send me a message! |
My version, DIY: (thanks, Ozzy)
Parts...
1) copper fitting reducer 3/8 to 1/4 (about an inch long)
OR any 1/4 diameter copper pipe, bought from AC, refrigeration supplier
2) 7mm (9/32) brass fly tying coneheads, 100 count, from
Rip Lips Fishing
Process...
Clean all metal surfaces with Wright's anti-tarnish silver polish
Use a hacksaw to cut the fittings to size (cut in half, using a vise)
Place conehead on top of open (1/4) end of fitting, and, on a solid surface,
strike about five times with a hammer, forcing the larger conehead into the fitting so that the tops are level. This way, one fitting can turn into two completed units when each contains its own conehead.
Total cost is just under two dollars per unit, and no glue is needed.
And the sound? To me, a bit harsher and more "forward" than the originals.
This is not necessarily bad, as you can experiment, creating different placement patterns of the DIY and original versions, to suit your taste.
Where else can you have so much fun, for so little money?
(They can also work in your car.) |
Having developed my own version of the HFTs for my system -- thanks to comments made by Ozzy -- and with very good results -- I am surprised at the OP by Augwest. But it is unfair, given no evidence whatsoever, to assume that he has an agenda. There is nothing at all to justify this notion that attempts, in a fashion typically found on many threads, to dismiss the validity of his observations. Has anyone but him heard the HFTs in his system? So, where do others get off making this unfounded accusation?
I must premise my comments by saying that, although I have never heard the HFTs or FEQs before, I am convinced they work well for most people and are a credit to Ted Denney's efforts. But since my HFTs are stunning at $1 each I would never consider the outrageous price SR is charging for theirs. In addition, I have about 50 in my system, and counting. That would amount to $3000 worth of SR HFTs. No way I would pay such an outlandish price -- even if they performed somewhat better than mine, which I am not sure they would.
As many posters have pointed out, you really need to think for yourself here and experiment to find out what works with the HFTs in your own system. From my experience with my DIY version, I no not believe that one size fits all regarding placement and the number of "levels", which I consider as much a marketing tool as a guide.
I have stated in another thread, I find it odd that Ted Denney who claims the HFTs are the culmination of his life's work should introduce them with a Bose Wave instead of with an expensive system -- as he has done at shows when introducing all other SR products. One would have thought HFTs would have deserved a more appropriate introduction if they were the culmination of a life's work. My opinion.
Regarding marketing, I do not believe SRs statement is accurate -- that the HFTs and their identical ECT twins are transducers. Can anyone explain how they can possibly be in the same class as transducers like microphones and speakers? I believe transducer is a term SR is using for marketing purposes -- to hide the fact that the HFTs and ECTs are simple resonators.
In fact, the SR HFTs appear to be a cross between the Novum PMR out of Germany and ASI Liveline Franck Tchang's "Sugar Cubes" and resonator bowls, the precursors to the SR ART system that was mysteriously and coincidentally "discovered" during Ted Denney's 3-year solo Pacific sailing adventure  after Franck TchangÂs resonators had already been on the market. I note that SR never called their ART system a collection of transducers. They were always called resonators. And can anyone explain the difference  besides the color scheme  between the HFTs and the ECTs? They look identical, and both cost $60 each.
Has anyone had a look at the YouTubes of the 2 Peters promoting the HFTs and ECTs? Did anyone notice how they talk down to their audience as though they were talking to morons  counting each HFT 1,2,3,4,5 as they show us how to remove them from the package  showing us how to take a piece of Blu Tack from the strip and apply it to each HFT -- and showing us how to put them on the wall? Thank you, fellows. This YouTube should have been entitled HFTs for Dummies -- the YouTube that accompanies the culmination of a life's work. With Peter Breuninger nodding and nodding throughout the video like a nodding toy on your dashboard. It was a good laugh.
And what of their YouTube where they spill the ECTs into a component chassis like jelly beans without testing to see what the results are at each stage? I mean, with a lavish coating of up to 20 ECTs per component you would think this enhancement would deserve a more methodical approach.
Can you really afford to spill these ECTs into each of your components at a cost of up to $1000 or more per component? -- with the assurance they are certainly doing great things, as we surely know is true for all Synergistic Research products -- but without any proof except for their claim and good copy writing. IMO, SR has been more fortunate with the HFTs than with so many lack-luster products of yesteryear that have been duly relegated to the dustbin of high end audio history.
When Augwest says "I was assured that there was no trade-off, and that sonic degradation was impossible." I agree with his observation that this is not true. My experience has been that sonic degradation is very possible with poor placement, including some of the placements suggested by SR.
I agree with Ozzy when he says "Just don't tell the wife how much they cost each ...". They wife would find the price outrageous. And she would be right -- except for those who are able to afford throwing money at they systems.
I agree with Heyimderrick when he says "SR seems to be the one with an agenda to mute any naysayers." Lamentably, this has been the fact in the past. |
Ozzy,
How many DIY HFTs are you using? Do you use mainly front and back walls? Do you use any on components? |
