I owned the 07x | LA4 + HPA4 | Holo Serene preamp | Schitt Mjolnir v3 at one time and paired it with the CODA #16. Actually, the 07x may have been paired with the CODA #8. A bit of a blur now.
The 07x did not have the detail that the LA4 and the Holo Serene provided me. It was also noisier than those 2 and I could hear noise on very quiet passages. Once I heard that I always focused on that so the 07x had to go. A lot of people on here have said I am crazy with that observation.
My 07x was rebuilt by Doug at CODA due to this issue since it was noisier than the dealer’s unit. We had them side-by-side and compared. However, even after Doug replaced every single component on my 07x, except the case, I still found it lacking in comparison to the LA4 and the Serene.
The LA4 is indeed not holographic and will not add to the sound. However, my speakers have a bit of warmth and that is all I want. If you want a bit more warmth from your preamp, the Holo Serene will provide a bit more than the LA4.
A good way to figure out if you like the LA4 is to do a 30-day home trial from Benchmark. The Serene is almost identical sonically, except for a bit more warmth.
My Schitt Mjolnir v3 is a Class A preamp and it is rather good, better than the 07x for me. It has no remote and is very warm. I do not like it paired with the #16, It is too much of a good thing, but I think a lot of others would like it over the LA4 and Serene paired with the #16.
The thing with the LA4 and Serene is that the other components really dictate how your system will sound. For example, the CODA #16 system is not that great with the warm-ish Schitt Yggi+ LIM DAC. However, it is amazing with the more neutral Yggi+ OG DAC.
BTW - I mistakenly thought your amp was the CODA #16. I had the NAD M22 v2 in the house for 30-days paired with the LA4. I hated the sound and luckily was able to return it.
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Hey jimbones,
Take a look at my Stereo Times review on the 07x which will give you the details of why this is one of my favorite solid state preamplifiers.
Teajay
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I know this is an older thread but I wanted to discuss a bit. I have a summer system and a winter system. CJ Tubes for winter (ET5 and P12 amp) and I have a NAD M23 amp for summer that I would like to pair with a SS pre. I am considering the Coda 07x to use with the NAD. If I like it enough I might even use it with the P12 in the winter. A buddy lent me his Parasound JC2 and Benchmark LA4. The JC2 had incredible bass probably the best I have heard but the highs had a bit of grain to it. The LA4 was crystal clear but was flat sounding. Like everyone says it appears to be neutral. Note I did have to float the ground on the LA4 as I was getting some hum. It is a quiet unit. Thoughts? I dont mind (in fact prefer) a Pre with some character.
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I have a 96db speaker currently use an OTL and very happy too.
I was looking for a SS amp from a flavour pov of great low LF. Anyone have an opinion on the S 5.5 since I dont need a lot of power it looks like the ticket for me.
I've been a Pass Labs owner in the past and I find the sound boring vs say Karan Acoustics which I owned too.
I've since departed from SS completely and gone down the high sensativity speaker and low power amp way. Looking to have a good SS now.
Would be glad to know opinions of others on the S5.5 50watt pure class a amps.
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@smodtactical
The Modded Altec Lansing 1570B mono blocks have 165 watts each. They run (2) 811A power triodes. The high voltage Peerless transformers are what makes them special. No one makes these anymore.
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I see your speakers are about 88 db. Do the altecs drive it well? What kind of power output do they have?
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@smodtactical
They are both Incredible sounding amps just different flavors. The tubes provide greater depth and size of sound stage. The tube sound is more dense and maybe I’m just listening to a beautiful distortion but I love it. My preference for tubes doesn’t take anything away from the Coda. It’s the best sounding SS amp I’ve ever heard.
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@lancelock how do your tube amps compare to the 16 ?
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@jaymark
congratulations I don’t think you will be disappointed.
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@lancelock maybe my fixation on the Coda #16's size and weight was perhaps looking for a reason to move on to the #8. However, my wife grudgingly gave me the green light to spring for the Coda #16. So, 110# be damned, I will be getting the 16.
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@jaymark
The #16 is not as big as as my old Plinius amp for example, but don’t let that fool you. Like your X250.5 it weighs 110 lbs.
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@jaymark the #16 is not big at all. I was really surprised at how small it actually is. It is bigger than the #8 but given the specs of the #16 I thought it would be much bigger.
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@lancelock how do u park the Coda 16 ? Move it around? It seems like it is a monster size/weight wise.
Well, the question is moot cause the X250.5 weighs 110#. I should be able to handle it. Now, the price tag....
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Damn the Coda #16 seems awfully enticing....
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@decooney
i have not tried any other Van Alstine amps. I bought that one from David Janszen
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@lancelock by chance did you ever try the other Vision SET 400 class A/B design by AVA?
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@rlovendale
the #16 sounds better to me than both of those SS amps. I thought the Plinius was too warm. The AVA FET400, even though not class A was a decent sounding amp with excellent bass but not on the level of the Coda #16.
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@decooney
60’s vintage Altec Lansing 1570B built by John Tucker (Exempler Audio) they use (2) 811A tubes in each mono block and produce 165 watts per channel. These mods surpass Tom Tutay’s mods. Sounds like a high powered SET.
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@lancelock I absolutely love my Coda #16. It is the best SS amp I’ve ever owned. The only thing that could make me part with it would be the custom built tube mono blocks that will be arriving this week and that’s a maybe.
Uh oh, you did it now. Just kidding, or maybe not. 😉 It’s what I run again now after 35+ years with ss amps. What output tubes?
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How do the Plinius SA-103 and the AVA FET400 compare to the #16?
I loved the SA-103 when I demoed at a dealer, and haven’t heard an AVA amp.
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@smodtactical
Of that bunch I can firmly put the #16 at the top of the heap but a special shout-out to the 35 year old Mirror Image Audio 1.1 SB for competing with the best current day amps. My friend (Dave Rayden) used to own the company.
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@smodtactical
SS Amp’s I’ve owned:
Coda #16 (current amp)
Coda #8
Benchmark AHB2
Van Alstine AVA FET400
Plinius SA103
Mirror Image Audio 1.1 SB
Musical Fidelity M6PRX
AGD Audion’s
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@smodtactical There is a dealer in Winnipeg that sells CODA. I have spoken with him in the past and he maybe willing to send you a demo 07x.
I was not able to quickly find his contact info in my emails or a search of ad's on USAM. CODA can get you his info and other Canadian dealers.
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@zlone From what other owner’s have told me about the Holo Audio Serene and also from the measurements. It seems to me very similar to the Benchmark LA4. I have been told the Serene has a touch more warmth.
I can tell you that the LA4 and the CODA #8 were amazing together. I spent a year flipping back and forth between the Benchmark AHB2, Benchmark LA4, CODA #8, and CODA 07x. That is, I used them in various permutations. All combinations of the gear matched so nicely to my ears. I got rid of some of the gear because I thought it was a little to crazy to do this. I only sold the CODA #8 (reluctantly) because I wanted to buy the RAAL VM-1a headphone amp. In hindsight it was a great move.
I also owned the Schitt Freya+ for a few months and I was very happy to find it pairing nicely with my RAAL SR1a headphones and the Benchmark AHB2. I had a tough time making the AHB2 work with the RAAL SR1a, even though the SR1a designer used the AHB2 when developing it. The Freya+ was a great tone control to the bright SR1a and neutral AHB2.
Today, I am using the LA4 and AHB2 monos with the SR1a headphone (on my 2-channel) setup. I cannot believe it works because it was awful before. However, this time I am using the Musetec 005 DAC which seems to be the magic sauce that holds it together. The Musetec 005 is not good with my RAAL VM-1a headphone amp (surprising).
The Blades are a decade+ in the making for me. Either no space, no money, or new baby.
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I'd love to do a shootout between 07x and VAC Ren V.
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@lancelock what other high end amps have you owned?
@yyzsantabarbara if i could get a demo id love to put it up against my arc ref5se. I did talk to one audiophile who said he liked the ARC LS27 more than his 07x but of course I have to hear for myself.
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I’ve been reading about the outboard power supply upgrade for the 07x for two or more years now, but have seen no concrete evidence of it nor heard any rumblings from Coda themselves. I wouldn’t hold my breath.
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@yyzsantabarbara It sounds like we have some similar tastes, I am running LS50's with a Coda #8 and a Freya + pre. What caught my eye was your pending choice of the Holo Serene as your next preamp, it is what I am eyeing as well as an upgrade to the Freya. I look forward to your review of that piece. Meanwhile, I will have to live vicariously through you and your Blades, no room for those on this end.
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For you 07x owners reading this thread. There is a separate power supply upgrade coming out for the 07x. I am sure it will increase the performance. Prior owners can use it, not sure how that would work..
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I absolutely love my Coda #16. It is the best SS amp I’ve ever owned. The only thing that could make me part with it would be the custom built tube mono blocks that will be arriving this week and that’s a maybe.
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I would say the 07x is not as nuetral as my preferred Benchmark LA4. I bet the majority opinion would be to favor the 07x over the LA4.
I saw you were asking about preamps in the other thread. I think you will really like the 07x.
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Interesting how you find the no 16 more neutral but the coda pre more tubey.
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The CODA #16 is really an excellent amp. One of the very best amps I have ever heard. It reminded me of my Benchmark AHB2 on the top end, so clean and smooth. I did not spend much time with the #16, though I knew immediately that I preferred it to the #8 that I owned.
The dealer that I am working with for the KEF Blade feels that the CODA is a bit warmer than the KRELL XD amps. I disagree with him on that. The KRELL XD amp is not an amp that I am normally attracted too sonically. However, after owning the K-300i for a year and now the KRELL 175XD (up for sale) I realized that I ALWAYS have a great time listening to music on these amps.
The sound is very smooth, with enough details, and a bit rounder on top. I also think the bass is very strong. The pairing with the new KEF speakers is something that I have done for a year, with LS50 Meta. So I know that is a great pairing. My dealer also says that is how he prefers the Blades paired. So that is why I am going with the KRELL over the CODA.
My office system has Benchmark AHB2 monos and the CODA #16 is also on the neutral side, so the KRELL is a change of pace from that sonic signature. Another reason for getting the KRELL XD for the Livingroom system.
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@yyzsantabarbara seems like an awesome system
What did you like more about the Krell XD over the no 16. Or why did you choose the XD over no 16 ?
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@smodtactical I did not buy the CODA #16, I instead bought the CODA 07x preamp and CODA #8 amp. I also bought the KRELL Duo 175XD amp. I sold all of that gear, except the KRELL Duo 175XD which went up for sale yesterday. I am going to get another KRELL XD amp with more power. It has not been determined yet by me which KRELL amp to get.
The next KRELL amp will be for KEF Blade 2 META. The other speaker choice was the Yamaha NS5000, which you own. I went with the Blade because I am finally able to fit it into a proper room. The NS5000 would also be great in this room, but I am going with the Blade. A safer choice would be the NS5000 because of my young son, but if the speaker gets damaged, too bad.
The CODA #16 is very similar to the amp I am selling. The Duo 175XD is all Class A, similar to the mostly Class A #16. When I heard the #16 with the CODA 07x preamp I was thinking that sonically it is very similar to the Duo 175XD amp. The #8 and #16 diverge more sonically to my ears.
A shootout between those amps you listed will of course be subjective to listener preference. My preference from those 3 would be the CODA #16. It is not as warm as the other 2 and likely the most powerful. I would still take the KRELL Duo amps over those 3 since they just seem to work best for my ears. Does not mean it is the best.
I have had the KRELL K-300i integrated (an XD amp, now sold) and the KRELL DUO 175XD. The next amp will be my last amp and it will be a KRELL XD.
The system I am putting together for the Livingroom will be:
- KEF Blade 2 Meta (not sure the color)
- KRELL XD amp (not sure the power)
- Holo Audio Serene preamp (similar to my office Benchmark LA4 preamp)
- Musetec 005 DAC (have 2 of these now)
- Analysis Plus Solo Crystal Oval 8 speaker cable
My Office system, where the KRELL DUO 175XD was used, is competed and will not be touched.
BTW - the CODA #16 is more than powerful enough for the Blade 2 Meta
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@yyzsantabarbara So how you liking the No. 16? Any plans on moving to something else? I really wish i could see a shootout between the 16, the x350.8 and the m900u.
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Oh, and by the way, that’s precisely why the 575 XD’s on sale at AudioMart might even present a more compelling solution for you. That would certainly be the final wrap on a system to the end of days. And who knows, Dennis may be able to help you on the purchase of a brand new set of blocks though not sure.
Best,
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You bet! Dennis is one of the single, most knowledgeable and reputable authorities on high end audio I’ve ever spoken with, and his views issue from a world of experience selling nothing but the finest components. I don’t believe he has a dog in the fight and speaks from the heart. I hope this was helpful to you!
Cheers,
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@krell_fan1 Thanks for the contact info on Dennis. I spent an hour in conversation with him. We agreed for the most part, except his opinion that the CODA #16 was slightly warmer than the KRELL. I thought the KRELL was slightly warmer than the CODA though I only heard the #16 for a bit and owned the CODA #8.
He said the KRELLL 375XD monos would be killer on the Blade 2 Meta, better than the KRELL 175XD I have in the house (power wise). He also said the CODA #16 would be killer on the Blade 2 Meta, but a bit warmer than the KRELL.
I was very impressed by this guy. Thanks for the contact info.
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Hey, yyzsantabarbara! For your benefit to assist you in your decision making process I am pasting in this comment on Krell mono blocks you’re considering. This comes from a moderator on a FB Krell member group.
“I have a pair of Solo 375 XD’s and despite them not having a crazy oversized power supply as typical in older Krell models, they are performers and can handle most anything you throw at them. Controlled and accurate bass, warm mids and highs. Non-fatiguing.
In fact, I MIGHT be on the verge of buying a pair of 575 XD’s to biamply my Egglestonworks Viginti. 575 XD’s on bass with 375 XD’s on the mids and highs.
All connected via CAST.
I would not go down the line to anything else, personally. XD is currently they best sounding amps Krell has made, to date.”
good luck to you in your decision process.
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I know Walter very well and have met David. Stand up guy Walter is 100%. He is no longer at Krell, sadly. I checked out that listing and the MSRP is actually less than the new price of $11,250 each or 22.5k for the pair. I get that you cannot get more than 600wpc with that 575 XD. But do you really NEED more than 600 wpc? At 14K all in for those 575 mono blocks that’s a steal. And I believe warranty is transferrable. Talk to Dennis at Leesburg Listening Room in VA. He’s also a dealer for Bryston and Bricasti. I think he’d tell you that the 575 XD mops the floor with that Bryston unit that puts out 1000 wpc. And I don’t know Bricasti gear at all. It recall him saying it (575 XD) was as good as anything he’d ever hesrd and assume he was including those very pricey Bricasti amps. The M28 are rated @ 400 wpc into 4 ohms and retail for 30,000. They (Krell 575) are likely to sound as good if not somewhat better the No 16 but in all fairness I’ve never heard one. I DO know that Krell is killing it with their 300i. Can’t make them fast enough. And I don’t think ANYONE is making a better multi channel amp than Krell.I have their Chorus 5200 and it’s amazing.
Happy to know you’ve dug the 175 XD. I LOVE my 300XD and will likely hang tight until and when I can HEAR a No 16. That said, if I had the space to accommodate those two mono blocks for only 14K they’d have been bought by now, FOR SURE. It wouldn’t bother me if I subsequently heard the i400 and found that it were perhaps “2%” better or something nominal like that. No way is it gonna sound 10% better, IMHO. Dennis has heard. He could tell you. -:)
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For the money, there may be no better option, though many would state my Krell DUO 300 XD might sound as good or better.
When I heard the CODA #16 I thought it sounded a lot like my KRELL DUO 175XD. The 175XD cannot go down into 2 Ohm as strongly as the CODA. I heard a bit of that when I had my Thiel CS3.7 speakers and thought the CODA #8 drove them harder.
I liked the Benchmark AHB2 and the KRELL DUO 175XD overall more than the CODA #8 with the Thiel CS3.7. The CODA #16 is sonically a slightly cooler 175XD and slightly warmer AHB2. A real great amp. If I owned the CODA #16 when I had the hard to drive Thiel CS3.7 I am 100% sure it would have been my favorite on the Thiel.
With regards, to the dealer. The fact that he likes the PASS more than the KRELL means he prefers a different sound than me. So I really do not take his opinion to match my tastes. Different strokes. An amp that is warm is really not my personal preference. The KRELL XD does a great job of not going over my warm threshold.
Luckily for me, if needed, I have an ’extra’ KRELL 175XD amp that I can use temporarily with the Blade 2 Meta while I go and listen to the i400.
Walter Schofield and Dave Goodman helped me select the 175XD for the Thiel CS3.7. Very helpful and KRELL also made me a custom power cord for the 175XD.
I have been watching this for a while, but wanted to wait for the i400.
Krell Solo 375 XD For Sale - US Audio Mart
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Hmm. Interesting. I am not really familiar with Pass so cannot speak with any authority. I DO know at least TWO Krell dealers who heard the new 35K amplifier at a trade show and were blown away, claiming it to be the single greatest amplifier they'd heard at any price. As you know with CODA, power is not the end all. Current supply and other variables count as much if not more. There is magic in the XD platform that has to due with how the designer tweaked the impedance, but from what I hear, there is FAR more magic in the new i400. from Krell. What it is I do not know. -:)
All that said, this is what I would likely do, IF you indeed take this one dealer at his word that the XD is not as "warm:" pass on Krell XD 100% if you are OK to place all your trust in one man whom you've never met. Personally I feel it is warm and have owned the 300 FBPcx and the 400 FPBcx. I like the XD better. BUT...all THAT said, I totally trust and believe in the magic of No 16 CODA based on what I have read and the few dealers with whom I spoke, and would not hesitate to purchase it. For the money, there may be no better option, though many would state my Krell DUO 300 XD might sound as good or better. I dunno. And FOR SURE those mono block 575 XD's will blow you away. Of that I am sure. I just haven't heard the CODA but DO take all at their word it is FABULOUS. So if it about the money, buy CODA. I would for the money! But if you want the very best amplifier EVER you could certainly try to listen to those 575 XD blocks bc many believe they crush anything out there. But they cost a LOT more than the CODA No16. Otherwise if it is NOT about the money, wait on that new 35K Krell. I have met the engineer, David Goodman, and the man is a genius. And the fellow who ran Krell until recently said it was like something the world never heard before. And I always trusted his judgement. David Goodman has done something special with that amp.
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@krell_fan1 I spoke with a KRELL dealer today in WA about the new amp. His partner had demoed the KRELL KSA i400 at a WA show and loved it. The guy I spoke to found the KRELL XD not as warm as he prefers (he is more of a PASS fan). He had not heard the new KRELL i400. I told him the KRELL XD was at the upper limit of warmth for my ears, I do not favor PASS and I love my KRELL 175XD.
We got to talking about different amps for the Blade 2 Meta and I am tending to think that the massive current of the CODA #16 is enough in stereo mode for the Blade 2 Meta. That is at moderate volume I would get a similar sound as a 400 watt amp (maybe the 400 watt KRELL i400 is different)
I may fly up to WA and demo the KRELL i400 with the Blade Meta but the CODA #16 looks like a great choice for the Blade 2 Meta.
The dealer in WA also tried 4 Benchmark mono amps on the KEF Blade Meta. There is a photo of that session on the internet. He preferred the PASS to the mega watt AHB2 setup.
I am going to talk with Doug Dale about what you lose when you go mono with the CODA #16. Something to have in the back pocket if needed.
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yyzsantabarbara; I know a few ppl who’ve heard the new Krell amp and yep, for sure it’ll knock your socks off I’m told. Then again, if you’ve got any concern about how some of the existing KRELL amps might drive your KEF blades, fear not. Dennis at Leesburg Listening Room is a dealer for both lines and would tell you that the existing Krell 575 mono blocks will drive those Blades into blissful oblivion with ease. Here is a link to that mono block. Hard to imagine anything sounding much better. Maybe that new piece might ……
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@rlovendale I was thinking of 2 #16's in mono but I was wondering if that would be the optimal sound from the #16. I believe most amps (except AHB2) increase distortion and other negative factors when switched from stereo to mono. I will discuss this with Doug Dale at CODA.
My hesitation on the cheaper CODA #16 is the 150 watts vs the 400 watts on the KRELL in stereo form. In terms of sonics, I know I love the CODA #16 and assume the KRELL KSA i400 will knock my socks off too (based on the KRELL XD lower models I owned).
At this point I am leaning more towards the KRELL but I do not know how it pairs with the KEF Blade 2 Meta. Does that extra power make a difference. I read about a dealer in Redmond, WA that carries both the KEF Blade and KRELL KSA i400 (soon) but not the CODA.
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It’s worth noting that the Krell i400 is set to retail for $35,000 for the stereo version and $70,000 for monoblocks. One could buy two Coda 16.0s without meters for $26,000 MSRP and run them in bridged mode to get 600/1200W at 8/4 ohms, respectively.
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