@audiofun Thanks for your kind words. I am not trying to be a jerk, but I don't feel like I was treated fairly, and I do think that's fair game for posting. Listen well! Thanks again.
review iPhono 2
I must be slow as I could not find a link to place this as a review.
So, I have written about the 1st gen iPhono in the past, comparing it to the very fine Coincident phonostage which I believe is about $6k. I preferred the iPhono but I could just as easily imagine someone else going for the Coincident unit. In that review I thought the Coincident had a better sustain, decay and bloom while the iPhono was hands down the winner in the prat department. The iPhono made my feet move, the Coincident, not so much.
Later on I added the iPower to the fray and the iPhono shored up the areas it lacked. As a former owner of the very very nice Graaf GM70 I was a bit surprised and dismayed when I finally received the iPhono and heard it once fully run-in. I would not have shelled out the thousands of dollars I paid for the GM70 and the vintage NOS tubs I purchased to make it sing, oh and the $1600 I had to spend on the Ortofon ST-80SE SUT to use with the MM inputs of the Graaf as I could not get it quiet enough to tolerate with the MC inputs. The very small $400 iPhono basically did everything the Graaf did (with the iPower that is).
My reference phonostage for the last few years (and probably many more to come) is the fabulous AMR PH77 and I’m running it with a set of Bendix 6900 tubes which elevates its performance even more than the already stellar stock configurations performance. In comparison to my PH77, I found the 1st gen iPhono to be a bit thin and during crescendos it could become a little ragged. Still, it remained in my arsenal as a handy and trusty back-up. The PH77 is of course tubed and as we tube owners know all too well, sometimes they fail and you are down for a while.
Compared to most phonostages I have heard, some of them costing up to $9k I found the 1st gen iPhono to be able to hold its own in some cases crazy as it may sound it was just plain better. I believe AMR intended the iPhono/iTube to be used in conjunction as a sort of baby AMR PH77 and I ran it that way for some time and yes, it does share that familial DNA when it comes to sonic signature.
Move forward some years and I have in my possession the iPhono2 and the iTube 2. To say that the iPhono 2 is better than its predecessor is far too simple a statement. Mr. Fremer thought it to be at least twice as good as the original. I would agree with his assessment. Out of the box with the included iPower is shows far more prowess in the areas of bass but otherwise is pretty close to the original. After about 20 hours a bit more fluidity begins to appear. Again at the 100 and about the 340 hour mark big jumps occur in the areas of fluidity and continuousness. When you get to 480 hours forget about it!
This thing sounds like it has a tube in it, and I don’t mean in that classic overly warm soft rose colored sound that I found so fantastic when I was new to high end audio. No, I am referring to a pellucid but meaty embodiment and rendering of the music. A sound one would immediately associate with MUCH costlier gear.
Most of my listening has been done with my second turntable system which is composed of a Technics SL-1200 GAE with a fully broken in Denon 103R on a LP Zupreme 15 gram headshell and my London Reference. The phono stage then feeds the iCan Pro (best pre I have heard and I have owned 2 MFA Ref units, the baby Ref and the full Ref), the Tube Research Labs GTP 2, and many more. I have had in my system for evaluation the Veloce (battery powered) the Allnic L3000 and many others. From the pre it goes to the custom active crossover and then to a Graaf Modena for the mids, a Harmonix Reimyo PAT777 for the Raal Ribbons and a pair of Acoustic Reality Thaumaturges ($25K when available) for the woofers. The speaker is called the Encore and is my own design. I simply got tired of paying for passive boxes made of MDF with wood screws going directly into the glued wood dust and sold for tens of thousands of dollars but I digress :)
The sound is at once flowing and dynamic. It grabs and holds my attention and really gets my foot tapping. The sound is MUCH more refined and fuller than the original iPhono with no hint of raggedness during large scale bombastic music. For instance it scales far more convincingly on some of the more challenging passages in Hans Zimmers wonderful soundtrack to Gladiator. The original could sound a bit blocky if you take my meaning. It did not have the ability to gracefully scale the mountain so to speak. The iPhono 2 does it with much more ease and refinement.
Here is where it gets interesting. As good as the iPhono 2 is out of the box and it is very very good (and especially after 340 hours or more) in fact far far better than the DS Audio optical cartridge system that I auditioned, it can be made to sound a good deal better. Now this is my own thing, the iFi line of SMPS’s are admittedly super quiet and much better than most SMPS such as the ones inside my apple gear, but I hate them ALL.
I do not like green eggs and.., ahem. Sorry, just flashed back to Dr. Seuss when I thought of my aversion to SMPS’s.
I mean I understand why they are used, efficient, cheaper to ship and inherently regulated. But they still hurt the sound of my system. As an aside I am actually having a custom linear PS built for my SL-1200 GAE to replace the awful SMPS that Technics installed. So to the point, I replaced the iPower with a linear regulated lab grade power supply. I don’t like hyperbole so I offer none but the result was nothing short of breath taking. There is a great deal more that can be had from that little silver box with a good (and I do mean good) linear supply.
Next I added the iTube 2 to the fray. As I mentioned before AMR always sorta intended this combo to be a baby PH77 as was or may still be mentioned on the iFi site. How to put this; everything I have said about the iPhono 2 up to this point; multiply it by 2 times again. Now you have that sorta living presence that the performers are in your vicinity. Things are rounder, more palpable and it breathes much easier. Again I powered the iTube 2 with a linear supply along with the iCan Pro. Please don’t misunderstand me, I lived with these units powered via there very good SMPS’s for quite a while and they made beautiful music BUT I knew there was much more to be had.
Like Mr. Fremer (paraphrased) stated, to get better than the iPhono 2 you are going to have spend much more and you still may not surpass this unit. I auditioned a $16K current phono stage that people rave over and my ears tell me that it cannot compete with iPhono 2/ iTube 2 combination. I will not call this a reference phono stage. It is great and I listen to it daily but I reserve titles like reference for the likes of Ypsilon, VDH Grail SB and my AMR PH77. The little combo does far more than I could have imagined. It capable of truly astounding musical reproduction on a grand scale.
Remember to let it run in for at least 100 (and I suggest 300) hours before you really start to judge it but my guess is it won’t take most people that long to know that this is special gear designed by some super gifted engineers who also happen to actually be able to HEAR. Thanks for reading and I hope this helps someone make a decision one way or the other. Happy listening.
213 responses Add your response
I have posted my experience with the iPhono2 and iFi’s customer service here: https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/my-feelings-and-incidentally-the-ifi-audio-iphono2 My story is just data for you to consider. Make of it what you will. |
Have the iphono2/itube2 combo in play for a few days now. What else to say, other than I'm completely at a loss to figure how this combo can sound so compelling for this price. And I'm comparing it to much more expensive tube/passive pre gear. Very highly impressed. More to come. Just ordered a couple of Twisted Pear Placid HD PS units. It will obviously take a while, but I will eventually get the two Placid PS units built and in the system. I'll report back then. Cheers, Crazy Bill The Eel Killer |
Great read about this little preamp. I bought it last week and was shocked how it completely transformed my audio system. The best way to describe what I’m hearing now is ’continuous sound’. Up until now, what was bothering me about my system is this graininess, this discontinuous sound. iFi iPhono 2 fixed that for me, and it did it in a rather spectacular fashion and with such aplomb. About a year or so ago I got tired of the harshness and graininess of my audio system. I had invested a lot of money (for my budget) trying to build a decent digital hi fi. Made a lot of improvements and tweaks, and the sound kept getting better and better. But the fundamental discontinuous nature, the graininess, glassiness and overall hardness of the sound stubbornly persisted. So I finally decided to switch from digital to analog. Bought me a decent turntable, a decent tonearm and a decent cartridge and SUT and phono preamp. Yes, the vinyl playback beat the digital playback, easily, but I continued being annoyed by the ’electronic’ nature of the sound. I was actually dismayed that even a fully analog front end would still deliver grainy, discontinuous sound that retained that annoying glassy, hardened metallic quality. It was only last Saturday, when I plugged in iFi iPhono 2, that I’ve heard, for the first time in my system, that glassiness and metallic overtone disappear to be replaced by silky smooth, warm, liquid sound! My questions: 1. How many hours before this phono fully breaks in? 2. Why are the manufacturers cautioning users not to replace their flimsy walwart PSU with any other PSU? 3. What is the recommended linear regulated PSU that I could use to replace the original iPhono 2 PSU? 4. Is there a way to select MM gain that would be between the 36 db and the 48 db? 5. Would iPhono benefit from isolation pads/sorbothane pads/spikes? 6. When experimenting with various RIAA settings, I can barely detect any difference; is that other people’s experience as well? On a side note: criticizing someone for enjoying a chosen component in their audio system is the same as criticizing someone for enjoying their meal/drink in a chosen porcelain dish, using chosen cutlery and glassware. We all have preferences in how we like to enjoy our meals, and it’s not only the food that matters, it is also very important the surrounding ambient and the accoutrement. Why would someone think it is any different when it comes to enjoying music, is honestly beyond me? Thanks! |
lewm, Thanks for the congratulations and your thoughtful post. I have been lurking this website for years and always enjoy reading your posts. Not sure what was going on with having to ground the output RCA’s on the iPhono2, but it was indeed weird. I agree as per your explanation, it shouldn’t be the case, but maybe something in the iPhono2 was not connected properly, or maybe it was because the provided power supply is only a 2-prong power supply without a ground prong. Either way, connecting the turntable’s phono cable ground wire to the iPhono2’s ground post did nothing, and when I tried grounding the iPhono2’s ground post to a real ground it actually made it worse. I was out of ideas and was ready to return the product, but before doing that I decided to open a ticket with iFi and see if they can figure it out. iFi said it’s almost definitely a missing ground somewhere. I had the iPhono2 hooked up to an ADC, and the ADC was connected to a computer with an optical cable. iFi thought it was because I was using an optical cable going from my ADC to the computer, which has no ground, and they recommended using a coax, so I tried that and the hum was still there. In my attempts to diagnose the hum, I took the ADC completely out of the chain and connected a pair of headphones directly to the iPhono2’s outputs, and the hum was still there. It was only when I accidentally touched a real ground off the output RCA’s that it finally went silent. What you say about the iPhono2 needing a fuse to sound its best seems a bit unfair at face value, to be honest. You could say that about any tweak for any turntable, amp, anything. My turntable doesn’t need the expensive mat I’m using, but it sounds better with it. My amp sounds better with a nice powercord than a cheap one. It’s not fair to single out the iPhono for this. Besides, the iPhono2 itself doesn’t take a fuse. It’s the linear power supply (that iFi doesn’t recommend using) that takes a fuse. We’re talking about tweaks here. As for the "quantum" thing, I completely understand the reluctance to buy into something with "quantum" in the name (except the TV show Quantum Leap, which rules). I have always been a skeptic and cannot stand the pseudoscience that various new-agers are always putting forward, laden with "sciencey"-sounding buzzwords like Quantum. There was another audiogon forum where a user said something similar - they were intrigued by the SR Black fuses, but they had reservations about Synergistic Research based on a strong disagreement with the company’s philosophy. In a previous life, I also would have immediately dismissed anything with Quantum in the name, quickly laughed, assumed charlatanism and placebo was at work, and moved on. But I only pulled the trigger on this product after reading the many testimonies on various audio forums, including several threads on audiogon. I wasn’t even a believer in fuses until a few months ago. It’s interesting that even people who believe in audio cables, power cords, power conditioners, are still reluctant to consider fuses. We all have that line where it’s like "ok, this is too much". Fuses are probably the most easily dismissed, yet significant tweak out there. After experiencing the improvement the AMR fuse made, I got curious and read at least a dozen forums, specifically searching for posts from users who have experience with multiple fuses. No one really praised the AMR that much, a couple of people said it was good and had lush midrange, but the couple of people who had both the AMR’s and the SR Blacks couldn’t stop talking about how good SR Blacks were. The guy I bought my Blacks from is an amp maker, and he had various high end fuses for sale, from AMR to Furutech to Isoclean, and his opinion was the same as what I had read on many forums - the SR Blacks are not just a little better than the other fuses, they are a lot better. Having scoured many discussions about the SR Blacks, I have personally never seen a post by somebody who tried the SR Black fuse and was not absolutely astonished by it. Even Synergistic Research puts their money where their mouth is and offers a 30 day trial with a full refund to anyone who is not satisfied, and to my knowledge, no one ever sends these things back. Mine were used, on a very good deal, and I knew that if I didn’t hear a difference or didn’t think it was worth the money, I could sell them for the same price that I bought them, so there was really no risk. I completely understand the reservation of supporting a company that one feels perpetuates pseudoscience with the terminology they use, but that’s more of a political decision than an epistemic one, and I’m personally not as invested in "identifying" as a skeptic and punishing companies for supporting pseudosciencey language as I used to be (and I totally used to be that guy). I’m just interested in what’s true. If these SR Blacks transform your system as much as people say, or if it’s all just hype, I wanted to know. So, for me, this exercise was not about which companies I support and which ones I don’t, or voting with my wallet. I was just blown away by the difference the AMR fuses made, and I wanted to see what else was possible. The SR Blacks were the most hyped fuses out there, and I could try them without financial risk, and curiosity got the better of me. While I am still an extremely skeptical person, most of the "audio skeptics" I come across reading online forums are mind-readers who assume they know the inner-workings of everyone else’s mind. They act convinced that everyone they disagree with is fooling themselves or is under the spell of the placebo effect, and this goes not just to fuses but to power cables, interconnects, speaker cables, everything. I started out being one of these people, but I’ve been surprised way too many times in this hobby to ever again dismiss something a priori. At one point I believed cables made no difference, and eventually I heard the difference myself. The same thing happened with my belief in digital cables, power cords, and most recently fuses. So while I am still very skeptical and science minded these days, I want to at least check for myself. |
@racedoc The (of course in my opinion) As i can see Trichord Dino MK3 is another phono stage designed for MC cartridges with MM as a bonus, because there is NO option to change loading for MM, which is a MUST HAVE for any good phono stage design! There is only one option for MM and this is 47k ohm, not higher. I don't know if it can be moddified, but again i'm pretty sure the RCA plug resistors is much better option, so we can use whatever load resistor value we like, not just what a manufacturer offering us. It is stupid to ignore 100k Ohm for MM, the best MM cartridges made by JVC Victor, Grace supposed to be loaded at 47-100k Ohm range and Japanese were smart to suggest these settings for the users in every manual that comes with their cartridges. But the designers of the MM phono stage nowadays are not so smart, they are more concerned about MC capabilities and completely ignoring MM capabilities which is more important. |
Mantis-Tobaggan, Congratulations are in order as you seem to have been successful in taking your audio system to heaven with you. I hope to try that some day myself. I have two systems, and I'd like to bring them both. You speak of the need to ground the output RCAs does not make sense, if you will pardon my saying so. The output ALWAYS has to be grounded. In fact, if by some chance the output jack is not grounded within the driving component, it will still be grounded to the audio ground of the component that is being driven, via the ground lead within the IC which connects to the outer (ground) contact of the RCA. Can you amplify on your experience? What is the cost of an SR Black fuse? (I just looked it up; $120 from High End Electronics.) So here we have a very good phono stage that costs less than $500, but wait, it needs a $120-fuse to sound best. My advice: don't buy any product that uses the word "Quantum" with a capital Q. That's a red (or black) flag that you are in the hands of a charlatan. I am not scoffing at the ifi phono2, by the way. I think it's a great product in its weight class and probably above. Audiofun, If you are referring to the DSA phono stages, it is indeed quite likely that something was defective when you auditioned it or them. Those are very fine solid state phono stages; it would be very surprising if the ifi 2 outperforms them, just based on the cost differential and the honesty with which the DSA stuff is constructed and offered to the public (as compared for example to most "audiophile" fuses). From your description, I offer the possibility that the two channels were 180 degrees out of phase with each other. |
Mantis-toboggan: I’m just seeing this as I grew tired of some of the foolishness. I appreciate your words, thank you. My whole goal was just to share my experience with a superior and affordable phono stage. I appreciated the intelligence of how you and racedoc presented your impressions regardless of whether or not I agree with those impressions. At the end of the day we all have our likes and dislikes. You have probably cost me money :) because now I have to buy some of the SR Black fuses and compare them to the AMR mk2 fuses. If the SR Blacks are better, in they go :) I’m really glad you are enjoying your unit and more importantly, your music! |
Racedoc: Hi, you are welcome. I have no experience with the Tidal gear, but it is beautiful and I would hope that it betters many phono stages based on the pricing differential alone. Obviously I have no opinion as I have not had the pleasure of hearing the Tidal gear, perhaps one day :) I have heard the DS and we definitely differ. The DS was probably the single worse phono stage I have ever heard. I found it to be very phasey with respect to surface noise artifacts. The surface noise was separate and distinctly out of phase from the rest of the music. The surface noise was always left of center and out front, it was really weird. The sound was thin and anemic, just plain bad. I have suspected and I hope that the unit was faulty because I am not exaggerating, it was terrible. I really have to believe that unit was not operating correctly, especially in light of your listening impressions. I have not heard the Trichord, sounds interesting. Thanks for your insights, they are appreciated. |
Hi audiofun, thank you for your review of the iPhono 2! Due to the fact that I had a fully broken in iPhono 2 for a longer lasting test in my stereo system, unfortunately I have to disagree in a few points. Despite the fact that the iPhono 2 is one of the best phono stages in it price range it firstly had no chance in some aspects (like surface noise, 3D, tone colours...) compared to my reference (internal Tidal phono stage). Secondly I compared it (like you) with my DS Audio systems (DS-002 and DS-W1) and these are audiophile miles ahead of what is possible with the iPhono 2 (for this comparison I used a ZYX 4D - Atmos and a Shindo SPU). Thirdly the iPhono 2 was now replaced with a similiar priced phono stage which bettered the iPhono 2 in all relevant aspects by smaller to significant margins. The (of course in my opinion) clear winner in that price range is the Trichord Dino Mk3. Especially with the optional Dino+ PSU it is my clear favoured "best bang for the buck". |
It's really too bad that this otherwise great thread has been derailed with a bunch of sound and fury. I have been enjoying the iPhono2 immensely since my last post. I now have well over 700 hours on it, still using the Pyramid LPS. I also got the Blue Circle stuff I have been eyeing for a while. Picked up a Blue Circle Fx2 X0e powerline conditioner, as well as a Blue Cicle balanced power module. Oh man, filtering out the noise from the powerlines made a tremendous difference in the sound - it removed this high frequency glare that I didn't even realize was in the sound. I'm convinced that the brightness that some people experience with the iPhono2 is a result of dirty power lines. So I heard a huge improvement with the Blue Circle powerline conditioner and balanced power module, but I cannot stress the importance of the fuse you are using, and the astounding difference it makes to the sound. I was so blown away by the way the AMR fuse completely changed the sound signature and overall presentation and imaging (honestly it sounds like I am listening to a different turntable and cartridge) ,so I kept reading and went down the fuse rabbit hole. In December I got a good deal on some SR Black fuses, so I put one in the LPS and also in the Blue Circle balanced power module. And the difference was once again jaw-dropping. The SR Black fuses are absolutely incredible, and my system sounds nothing like it did back when I was using the provided power supply. I am in heaven right now, enjoying my system more than ever :D I also modded the Pyramid LPS with an "Asylum Cord" power cord (Belden 19364 cable and a Marinco 5266 plug, both cryo treated), and also replaced the wire going from the fuse to the on/off switch with some cryo treated Neotech UPOCC hook-up wire. Also made a higher quality power cord for the iPhono2 as well, using some stranded Neotech OCC wire. These items only cost a few dollars, but have brought the sound up to yet another level. I honestly can't believe what I am hearing. Honestly I can't thank you enough, audiofun. All the advice you've provided here has been absolutely spot on. The reported problems with the iPhono2 are nothing more than a faulty batch of power supplies, but it seems there were a bunch of dudes with axes to grind ready to pounce. Reading all these disappointed dudes' experiences on stevehoffman forum is disappointing, but funnily enough I had my own weird experience with the iPhono2 and almost returned it. I would defend the product to the death now, but at one point I was so pissed off at it. I couldn't get this grounding hum to go away no matter what I did; grounding the grounding post didn't work, I tried grounding every item connected to it in every possible combination and nothing worked. I was convinced the thing was defective and almost returned it, but wanted to give it one last real attempt. I touched a real ground off the outer shell of the output RCA's (the ground of the output signal), and finally the thing was silent. So I just wrapped a ground wire around them and it was silent ever since, and also stopped running hot. I've had it for almost 2 years now, it's been turned on 24/7 the entire time and it's doing great. Anyway, this business with having to ground the output RCA's was only with the supplied power supply. With the Linear Power Supply, the output rca's don't need to be grounded, and also the thing never runs hot anymore. It's just luke warm to the touch. Seriously, I am pretty sure all those problems with it running hot and having weird hums are from the power supply, and some of the guys who returned it probably could have got it to work if they tried long enough, but I can't really blame them. iFi had a bad batch of power supplies or something. Mine seems fine but it only worked when I grounded the output RCA's. And mine is a pre-order unit, so it was one of the very first shipped. I can't say enough about how awesome this thing is, and I am so incredibly grateful that I didn't return it. But to be fair, the grumblers have a point in that iFi actually has some pretty strict wording on their website about using only the provided power supply, so really, the people who are complaining are the ones who have are following the manufacturer's instructions, and they are also not getting anywhere close to getting the best sound out of their units. And all of us who use linear power supplies are praising the units, but we're actually going against the manufacturer's recommendations. It's kind of ironic that we're praising the thing and they're roasting it. |
Dear Doug, i've been trying iPhono2 and in my opinion it's too bright, the bass can't compete with the more expensive phono stages. But as i said i'm a big fan of MM cartridges. With LOMC cartridges iPhono impressed me more, but still not as good to buy it for myself. After reading many comments i quickly realized it can be problematic, nothing is perfect, but little bugs can be fixed. In case with MADE IN CHINA iPhono2 the bugs can not be fixed even after 3rd return from the customers. This is BS! This product must be avoided. Actually the whole philosophy behind the iFi is so stupid in my opinion, people ended up with so many devices in the signal pass, tons of switches and so on and on, everything boxed like the Apple iPhone (WTF?). I can't remember the price of this terrible unit, but for $774 USD (including shipping) anyone can buy JLTi phono stage made in Australia by Joe Rassmussen, he was a partner of Allen Wright (a co-designer of the JLTi when it was made in Switzerland). They are respected people in audiophiles world. I just bought JLTi and i just don't get that hype about iPhono, do yourself a favour, check the JLTi if you're looking for reasonably priced and great sounding phono stage. I'm sure there are many more phono stages available, but i have not tried them. I can only speaks for JLTi because they are in the same price range with that terrible Chinese iPhono. Here is more about JLTi: " The name denotes that this is a Solid State device using something that is called Diamond Transistor Theory, rarely used on High-End Audio products. The most simple and linear audio voltage amplification device is a Vacuum Triode which consists of three electrodes only. They are the Grid (input), Cathode (grounding) and Anode (output). On the other hand, the Solid State Transistor is a current device but is nowhere near as linear as the Triode. It consists of Base (input), Emitter (grounding) and Collector (output). The idea behind a Diamond Transistor is actually a composite circuit that emulates the near perfect and linear Transistor as a current device with the same three electrodes in the circuit then becomes the equivalent of the Base, Emitter and Collector followed by a Unity Gain Buffer. " As the oppisite to Raul, i use tube amps with vintage Telefunken, Sylvania tubes at the moment. BUT i don't use tube phono stages! The most "tube sounding" phono stage in my arsenal is WLM Phonata (Made in Austria) with specific MOS-FET transistors. But this phono stage is much more expensive. |
rauliruegas: Occasionally a product built at a certain price point will far exceed its marketed value in terms of quality and performance. Stereo cartridges are an example. The reverse is also true, a product built at a very high price point may not perform as well as a much less expensive product. Marketing is marketing and "buyer beware" of the marketing hype we face constantly. This crap happens all the time in audio and in part explains why the used market is huge. And of course there is the personal taste matter that drives many to buy and to sell a piece of gear produced at a given price point. Hearing it may turn out to be unsatisfactory. I believe the iphono2 is not BS and it impresses me with the overall quality of sound and presentation. I won't list the many adjectives that describe it but will say I believe it is worth more than its current price. I realize you have a tremendous knowledge base for audio equipment and music. But have you listened to the iphono2? I don't recall reading that you have so I conclude that your opinion is based on the little phono preamps price point. Don't you agree that price is not sufficient enough to form such a strong opinion? As I have said, if my second iphono2 dies then that will be the end of it for me and I will look at other options. But as it stands now, the thing sounds very very good in my system. Regards, Doug |
Dear @dougolsen : In this same thread @chakster posted this link: http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/heads-up-ifi-phono-2.627504/page-7 he has more information on that bs iPhono2. You have to remember that it's designed to a price point marketing strategy and that's what you receives for that. No giant killer but a bs of phono stage. It can't be in different way it does not matters what the op thinks about. R. |
Started to play an LP yesterday morning and experienced unlistenable distortion from the iphono2. Unplugged it for a few minutes, plugged it back in and the music was fine. I'm not optimistic that this is a one time glitch that continued break in will clear up. But it has worked well and for several hours since early yesterday. I've read that others heard distortion from their iphono2 as well among other issues. This is my second unit, the first ran too hot to touch and was returned. I've reported the issue to AMR and await their comments. If they recommend returning it I will not be ordering a third iphono2. This is disappointing because I feel the iphono2 is a very very good sounding and versatile phono preamp. |
Since my last postings I have moved on from the iPhono2. I have to say I had no problems with it, It never ran more than warm.If it does there’s definitely a problem. No hum issues etc. I also had the SBooster PS. At the time of purchase My Heed Quasar crapped out, also I got the Iphono2 on Fremer’s recommendation. Did not know it was made in China either. I also had an iTube2 here, was not impressed with it, too much manipulation for my taste. I have had many, like 12 different Phono Pre’s here really way too many Phono's over the years. Phono’s seem to be the easiest price wise to manipulate your system.For the cost the SBooster was minimal in sound differences.My .02 worth. You need to buy what’s best for your system and pocket. It always does not work out , just look at the used sales. |
dougolsen: No problem. The modicum of brightness that I attribute to the iPhono 2 is due solely and entirely to the SMPS. Anyone who has read my posts knows I am not a fan of SMPS's as I have never heard a SMPS perform at the level of a competently designed LPS. My my system is resolving and sensitive enough that I can hear the deleterious effects of a SMPS simply by plugging one in near the vicinity of my rig. Glad to hear the unit is performing and sound good, it will continue to get better as it burns in. |
audiofun: No questions, just a report and thank you. The replacement iphono2 is breaking in and is only a slightly warm. I leave it on 24 hrs. I cobbled up wiring with bananas on one end to connect to the Pyramid. The barrel connector is on the other end and plugged into the iphono2. Pyramid fan is disabled and the AMR fuse is in place. It runs warm on the top, that's it. The first thing I noticed is the iphono2 top end brightness is tamed and the sound is very smooth. It has just four hours on it. Thank you so much for your advice. I appreciate that you were willing to help this neophyte. Doug |
Raul: Please understand that unless you are writing for the benefit of others or just to hear your fingers clack the kbd, you should stop addressing anything to my attention. I promise as God lives I did not read your last post. I just saw your name and wrote this in response. I am not interested in anything you have to write and therefore will not read any of your rantings. I am in this for the fun and enjoyment of my system, not to read the ravings of someone I don’t know. I could not care less about your thoughts as they relate to audio or anything else. Sorry if my message is curt but I wanted to be clear and concise. |
Dear @audiofun : I have to admire you because your in this thread touted pedigreé that you posted somewhere. Certainly I'm not wrong as you said but problem is that you don't read very well my posts ( 10K+.). As you said it's a " shame of phono stage " : For that price ate least we have to look for the only reason a phono stage has that name and this is because the inverse RIAA eq and here at any price we have to look at least for an accurate inverse RIAA eq. curve in both channels ( mirrored ones. ). You " shame of phono " ( your words. ) failed on both targets mentioned but thaose are not the only desired but not acomplished targets in a high price " shame of phono ". we have to wait that the unit comes with an external power supply ( I understand the 77 has not. Maybe I'm wrong, please confirm about. ), that be a balanced fully diferential design, with a truly low output impedance ( that unit in fundamental bass range measures the very high 3Kohms ! . No excuse about. ), that both channels measures the same and go on and on.......... Exist no audio " giant killers " as many of us could think ( iPhono 2 or Denon 103. ) what exist is very low audio/music knowledge and skills levels. Each one system is a and reflect those audio/music true levels. I already said it: money is important but audio music/knowledge levels is way more important. Your touted pedigree was not confirmed through this thread and through your system where you have 6 different performance levels ( not matched. ) in your amp six channels and where you are satisfied with the performance level the Anna shows through the iphono2. All that does not means that AMR/iFI products are good because are not only reflects your true audio/music knowledge levels and that your money level is way higher than that audio/music ........a confirmation of this is that you spended additional 2K Bendix in that true shame of phono. Yes your targets are way different to mine that's to stay truer/nearer to the recording. That's you and your privileges. We all have to learn day by day, I always try to do it and your thread helps me about. Regards and enjoy the music not distortions, R. |
dougolsen: You are on the right track. Cut off the cable from the old supply (I know I don't have to say this but better safe than sorry) with the wall-wart unplugged. You a DMM (digital multimeter) or a continuity test with probesl to determine which wire of the barrel connector is hot. The outer barrel will be your return (ground) and the center of the barrel connector (stick the probe into the opening of the barrel connector) is your hot. The hot will go to the red binding post of the power supply. |
audiofun: I'm sorry to bother you again but I am over my head. How the h**l do I connect the iphono2 to the Pyramid power supply. I believe I have an extra wall wart around with the right size male end that can plug into the iphono2. I can cut off the wall wart, strip the two wires and if I can tell which is positive and negative I can hook it up to the Pyramid. I just need to know if I'm on the right track here. BTW the iphono2 has been running for about 45 minutes and is quite cool. I'm optimistic about this one and will only change dip switches after turning off the iphono2 just to be on the safe side. Thx, Doug Olsen |
audiofun: I have a Pyramid PS26KX Power Supply 6-15 VDC 22A coming Wednesday. Unfortunately I think I ordered the incorrect AMR fuses which are 15A 6.3 slow blow from Tweek Geek. Being electronically "challenged" do I need the 20A fuses for the Pyramid instead of the 15A that just arrived? Thanks, Doug |
dougolsen: When you get your unit back and all is good, you may eventually want to try a Sbooster BOTW P&P ECO for a nice increase in performance. I aslo have the Sbooster Ultra attachment which connects to the split-current module. I have found the ultra attachment (an additional in-line noise filter) to cause the sound to become dulled or too polite. I actually don't use my ultra attachment. I would suggest changing the fuse inside the Sbooster to something a little better than the glass fuse it ships with. I have an AMR Mk2 fuse. |
@dougolsen This is exactly what i’ve been worried about, this phono stage was made in China. But you will not get the right answer here from the OP, i hope you can find more helpful info on another forum: http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/heads-up-ifi-phono-2.627504/page-7 The question is what would you do with this "magic iPhono" when the warranty expired? There is a guy who returned 2 items to get 3rd one with the same problem, he gave up after all. The stories are all over internet forums. I'm sorry to hear you're on the same iFi boat. |
Raul: Man your going to burst a blood vessel. Wrong again, the PH77 was $12k and with my Bendix and MU 6900 tubes more like $14k. I'm going to listen to my shame of a phono stage :) get some help dougolsen: i have not not seen that behavior. I'd take them up on the offer if you see this behavior again. |
audiofun Puzzling iphono2! I swapped cartridges a couple times changing settings as required for gain & load. On the third attempt, no sound and I could not find the reason. Finally turned off the iphono2 for 30 minutes to cool down then restarted and had sound. I don't get it. Also, it ran hot all day into the evening when my extended listening session ended. I checked early this AM and the darn thing was barely warm and still is. I don't get this either. I reported the hot issue with iFi and the tech support guy said to return it. I'm not doing that yet because I want to observe what happens over the next couple days. Besides I already have about 20 hours use and it sounds pretty amazing. Are these two issues mentioned, normal behavior or do you believe I have a problematic unit? I'll appreciate your advice. Regards, Doug Olsen |
Dear @chakster / @audiofun : I know you in this phono stage regards and I can say you have not any agenda vs iFI productos as OP could think. audiofun have really in deep " seed "/stycky on AMR/iFI products, this is something that makes no common sense for me if we take the very " high pedigree " he has as a music lover, audiophile and experienced engineering. Obviously that each one of us have different target in our home audio system/room overall set-up, that mine is to stay truer to the recording. From this point of view/target neither ( PH-77/iPhono2/SPL. ) can acomplish that target. The more expensive PH77 and other that be an hybrid active device, that per sé precludes the target achievement, fail in a " shame " way ( for a 10K+ price tag. ) to meet the main PS characteristic ( other than gain. ) that’s to has an inverse RIAA eq. curve with at least no more than 0.1db deviation from 20hz to 20khz ( any decent low price PS does it. ). This megabuck unit comes with specs that says it has a way high swing of 0.6dbs ! ! and its little SS brother a high 0.4dbs. Btw, the PH77 measured even worst than that manufacturer spec. Incredible for say the least and that was only for the standard RIAA but those gentlemans tooks its time ( marketing. ) to design its units with other over 20 curve alternatives even one that they " invented " because it never existed: the DMM !, go figure. The AMR unit and the iPhono2 both are designed and marketed to a price point and with the 77 things goes beyond price point because the design has not the caliber of those over 10K+ price tag. If I remember and even that for very good reasons I don’t support tubes one hybrid unit that I have respect for its designer comes with a RIAA swing of only 0.14db. My unit measures swing is 0.02db and I know that some people do not like to speak about specs but it’s really important to know where we are stand up. OP, I know that that is what you like, it’s what fulfill your needs. Good for you. Btw, that iFI TubeState trade mark is a signal manipulation it does not matters what you or otehr gentlemans can think, for me is a manipulation: iFI says in that way in its site as you can read in the link I posted. No, my unit design has not SIGNATURE and was not designed looking for some kind of sound as you could think. Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS, R. |
@kalali I can assure you I would not remember how something sounded a year or so ago unless I put it away and pick it up a year later and the change is very dramatic and in my face. Not if I use it along the way.Just as an aside, I do agree some break in time helps the passive components like capacitors to open up. But that's like 20-40 hours. Exactly, but this is a difference between component "A" and component "B". When it comes to component "A" in january and same component "A" in december it's not that easy, could be an illusion. That's the point to document it, simply record it. |
@clearthink It sounds like you believe in miracles and faith-based phony "science" how could you not have read the very many thoughtful posts submitted here by those who have indeed firsthand observed such differences in the Music Reproduction Systems. Are you talking about phono stages here? I have a few of them purchased new and didn’t noticed any big/huge difference after years of using them, despite the fact that i like them from the first hour. But i’m curious about it and that’s why i would prefer to check some facts, not a faulty memories, the fact is the recording made with "new" device and later made with same "used" device. I’m not a fan of this digital comparison, but that’s the only way to make sure what is the difference and how big is the difference? Why we can’t find tests like that for one component ??? It would be very interesting. |
@audiofun just a common sense my friend, i'm not a seller or manufacturer of the phono stages and i already stated that i did tried the iPhono2. You may pray for every device you are buying, and you're on another expensive phono stage right now as i can see. But buyin 3-5 phono stages is not for everyone and that's why i just tried to say the iPhono is not an exceptional device. To throw away $700 may be "down to the earth price" as you call it, but for many people it is not so cheap and luckily we have good manufacturers who are also trying to keep down the price for quality products as the opposite to those who sells $10 000 phono stage dusted by $700 iPhono2. It was fine for MC, but not for the very low output MC. This stage is not designed well even for MM cartridges, it's pretty obvious (no way to change load resistange for MM) and the overall sound is too bright compared to some other well designed phono stages. You're just ignoring reasonably priced phono stages available on the market from a well knows designers, and ONLY comparing your iPhono to some very expensive ones (which doesn't makes them better, right?). I assume you're using MC cartridges. Surely you can ignore everyone who criticize the iPhono (for defective power supplies, for the bright sound, for the lack of the proper settings for MM. For the stupid tone controls with incorrect additional RIAA curves, supposed to be the right ones for Decca, Colombia, but they are not the right ones and never used by those respected lables...). You can call it "an agenda against iFi", but this is bul***it. The most simplified phono stages are the best ones and they shouldn't cost much, the iPhono is not that simple. It's fine when low priced unit surpass the overpriced units, but the Chinese Made iPhono (what a st**id name btw) is not an expentional phono stage people can buy for reasonable price. The hype was caused by Fremer's review, but you're ignoring the fact that any used phono stage is much cheaper than new. Not every audiophile is ready to spend $100 000+ on the system. I was sceptical about it iPhono after i've come across some negative feedbacks online, but at least i tried it in my system to make sure. A friend gave me his brand new iPhono2. I'm honest and i have pointed out the weak parts of the iPhono, i was not impressed like you, but it is my opinion and my system. My principle is not to make a mistakes as i can't buy new phono stage every month, my budget is limited. At least it was good for MC cartridge. Everyone is free to ignore my opinion. |
clearthink: Do yourself a favor and ignore certain noise that is on this thread. This "noise" seems to have an agenda against iFi and infects this thread I created to share my experiences with an exceptional device at a down to earth price. I think it is "shill" side-band noise :) kalali: No problem at all. I actually make many many recordings of devices at 24/96 when I am comparing items especially when it comes to cartridges on my turntables where the down time would be far too long to make a serious judgement/decision. |
chakster:"Do you believe in miracles? It’s a common thing for a believers to burn-in everythings with special devices, while normal people just listen to the music I’ve never heard/seen anyone did so. " It sounds like you believe in miracles and faith-based phony "science" how could you not have read the very many thoughtful posts submitted here by those who have indeed firsthand observed such differences in the Music Reproduction Systems. |
Thanks. I didn't mean to open up the debate about whether or not burn in makes a difference. Some do some don't. It was the perceived duration that just struck me as odd. I can assure you I would not remember how something sounded a year or so ago unless I put it away and pick it up a year later and the change is very dramatic and in my face. Not if I use it along the way. Just as an aside, I do agree some break in time helps the passive components like capacitors to open up. But that's like 20-40 hours. |
@kalali Never heard any gear requiring this much break in time. Is this a common thing for phono preamps in general or unique to this particular item? Do you believe in miracles? It’s a common thing for a believers to burn-in everythings with special devices, while normal people just listen to the music, if there is an improvement you will hear it in the process. But to prove it there must be recordings (made before and after), if there is a big difference it will be noticable on recording made with this device. I’ve never heard/seen anyone did so. You can not remember how the phono stage sounded 100-700hrs ago. Our brain can not hold this imformation for such a long time to compare it with new information received later on. When we get used to certain things we like it on another level, but it does not mean that the sound quality is improved much after 100-700 hrs. Sometimes it’s our mood and some other factors, but not a true comparison of sound. If every device change the nature of sound that much in burn in process, then i would ONLY buy used devices according to this logic they are the best sounding! |
Kalali: it will sound good out of the box, better at 100 hours. I gave you the amount of time where I noticed no more gains. I would listen to the unit but during working hours, I would burn it in or during times I was away from home. I break a lot of things in using that method. This is just my observations in my system. |
