Hi Jean
Do you use Syrah for your Merlots? I am contemplating to switch my gears to all tubes. I have Coincident Total Eclipses,14 ohm/94 db. Do you think Merlots/Syrah is a good match for my speakers? How's your experience with Merlots? Are Mick's Amps as good as his preamps? Thanks.
Chih |
Mick just let me know that my Syrah is finished and will ship today. Yippie! It will be a strange feeling when I get it, not having to wait in anticipation anymore - I may have to order some power amps now to get that nice anticipation feeling again ;-) Echoing Chih38's question, I do wonder how Mick's power amps stack up. |
Outlier,
Congradulations on the Syrah shipping!! When did you order it?? Mick received my order in June, so I am hoping for a Xmas present! ( or Thanksgiving??) |
Outlier,
Congrats! It ships really fast considering the distance. I know what you mean about no more anticipation. Waiting for my Syrah was always somewhere on my mind. Don't worry, now all you will think about is getting home from work so you can listen to your 'new' music system.
Ever have so many people tell you how great a movie is that you work your expectations really high then when you see it, it can't possibly live up to all you thought it would be and you are somewhat dissapointed? Well, that's definitely not the case with the Supratek. It really all it's cracked up to be. The Real Deal. I started listening and it was a revelation...I kept mumbling to myself.."I never knew music could sound like this..." I suppose I have heard most adjectives to describe music reproduction and understand most of them, at least on an intellectual level. I now know I never knew what 'inner detail' and 'micro-dynamics' really are. Until now. It has vastly improved my entire system. I really have much more appreciation for the importance of a good preamp.
I think it's important to get some good tubes also. I got several and am working my way through them.
Enjoy,
Patrick |
Good to hear it ships fast - I live in Silicon Valley (like BWhite), so hopefully I'll share the same fast shipping experience he had of three or four days
Noble110, to answer your question, I ordered my preamp in and around April 24th (the day I got word of my new job - I went for the Supratek as a bit of a celebratary gift).
Rockhead, good to hear you're still loving your Syrah. I can't wait as I have to put my brand new turntable through its paces as well (and I'm a vinyl newbie). Fun tims ahead, but it never ends - I'm eyeing up my cables now as upgrade candidates ;-) |
I received mine in San Jose in about 4 days (that was last November). Be prepared for an invoice a couple of weeks later on from FedEx for Import Duty charges (mine were $105). Some people get charged some don't.
I only wish I had room for my Syrah anymore--had to move out of my dedicated room and now it doesn't see much action. It is a really nice piece of equipment both aesthetically and musically.
RobertM |
I got my Syrah today (just three days - very fast). Well as others have said, I don't wan't to comment too much on the sonics as it's just breaking in. It's sounding very very nice so far. Even thought it's early days, I can't help but comment on a few noticeable good impressions - a few adjectives I'd use would be clean, resolved and musical. And, it's beautiful. I managed to break my stylus today, so I can't comment on the phono section just yet ;-) I have to get a new stylus from the UK now so will be able to sample the phono section in about two weeks. I think NOS tubes are likely a must - for the 6SN7 secion anyway. I replaced the two 6SN7s with a couple of standard Sylvania GTBs and there was a good improvement (it's still amazing without the NOS tubes, but you might as well swing for the upgraded ones as they're relatively cheap.) I'll be looking for some better 6SN7s and 5881s. |
Hey, I think I read a post here some time ago about the suggestion to start a Supratek forum somewhere.
It could be done easily in Yahoo Groups and the information on tube rolling and tweaks would be great. I would be very curious to hear what tubes everyone has rolled so far and the results.
What are the best 5881/6L6GC's that anyone has tried. Did they make much of a sonic difference? If I remember correctly, Mick told me that the 5881/6L6GC's don't make much of a sonic difference, but my memory may be faulty. I have used Svetlana 6L6GC's since day one and I also have a NOS pair of Sylvania's I haven't tried yet. I cancelled an order for NOS RCA Black Plates after reading many guys in the Tube Asylum said they are over-rated and over-priced. Anyone here try them?
And can anyone comment on whether you have heard any difference in 5881/6L6GC's. Obviously, the 6SN7's can make a huge difference and btw, how about the 5AR4 rectifier tube?
Does anyone know if the KT66 can be substituted for the 5881/6L6GC's? I know I can email Mick, but I thought someone here may have already asked him. I am sure he is busy and the last thing he needs is for me to bug him about tubes. However, if no one has the answer, I will shoot an email off to him.
BTW, I remember Todd Krieger said his Supratek power supply ran really hot with NOS Ken Rad VT231's, but that is what I am using and both units are only mildly warm.
I did place my Chardonnay on a big block of Styrofoam and the isolation definitely enhanced the clarity. (I recently put all of my components on thick Syrofoam bases and the difference was very obvious.) Each time I isolated another component with Styrofoam, I could hear a difference. Most passages that were unintelligible before the Styro became discernable after everything was placed on the foam bases. (This has been much more effective than other isolation devices I have tried.)
Oh yeah, another thing that helped immensely was to get my cables up off the carpet. Came up with a really good tweak for that!
Anyway, I have rambled enough, but it would be great if someone would take the initiative to start a Supratek group. (And don't suggest that I do it, I don't have time!)
Well, wait a minute let me think about this....
hold on... let me go over to Yahoo and see how long it will take to set the group up.
Oh, awh right. I did it. I guess I can't ask someone else to do what I am not willing to do. Here is the address, just go to the group and join, then begin posting.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SupratekOwners/
Aloha,
Warren |
Anyone know of used Syrah on the market? as impossible as that might seem :)
I'm looking for a good deal on a preamp, and this seems like one that would be hard to beat! |
Dennis,
I have been following this thread for 6 months and in that time I have seen 1 Syrah and 1 Cortese for sale. Neither were discounted from full price and both sold quickly.
I know I wouldn't sell mine, even at a tidy profit, and suspect most owners feel the same.
Regards,
Patrick |
Does the Syrah have balanced input/output or just RCA? Does the design favor one over the other (usually if a pre has both, isn't the balanced favored)? What is the gain on the syrah? |
Hello,
I've had the Syrah for about a year now and my favorite tubes are the Sylvania 6SN7W metal base, Tung Sol 5881, and Mullard GZ33. They all make a difference, most significantly in that order. Some people say the metal base sounds the same as the non-metal base but I disagree. It was a worthwhile improvement in my case. Does anyone have recommendations for replacement tubes in the phono section? |
I'm joining the crowd of people who own a Syrah. Put my order in today, just the "standard" piece, not that it's standard in anyway! Mick said that he's sold about 150 units so far, and that soon, will have to charge $3000 because of improvements he keeps making. For now, they are still only $2500.
He says that his production time has gotten down to 3 months, but I'm preparing to wait 5 or 6 months. Until then, I'll be using the pre on my VTL IT85 (basically a VTL 2.5) with my new VAC 70/70, which is also coming this week. |
anybody use sspoweramp insted tube also if somebody try with high power ssamp,let me hear you guys! |
Betcha,
I use the Syrah with a class D Spectron Musician II. While not SS, it is high powered-rated at 600w/channel into my 6-ohm speakers. (500 into 8-ohm) I do like the sound of SS or Class D into a tubed pre, but 1) Since I own this combo, what else would I say? and 2)I have never heard an all tube set-up so what the heck would I know anyway?
I really need some local audio nuts...sigh.
Regards,
Patrick |
Hi Betcha,I am using my Chardonay with a Plinius SA-250 MK IV right now and it's sounds great. I have to admit I was a bit sceptical initially because of the input/output impedance factor, but it turns out to be a great match. The Plinius has a 47k Ohms input impedance and the Chardonay has an output adjustment with it's balanced and single ended output. It took me a couple of days to find the right setting and once I did it was simply magical. |
Thank you Rmml,what preamp did you have before and sound difference between two preamp. |
Hi Betcha, I am Using a Audio Research 100.2 SS amp with my Syrah. The amp is 100 wpc and sounds very sweet. I feel I get the sound of a good natural sounding tube amp without the hassles. I used to have an Audible Illusions M3A preamp, which I thought was great until I got my Syrah. The Syrah has a much more natural sound to it. The AA over emphisized bass compared th the Syrah which intigrates the highs, midrange, and bass much better. |
Well before the Syrah and the Plinius I used to have a Sonic Frontiers Line 2SE and a Krell FPB 200. I sold both of them when my Chardonay arrived. Comparing the two preamps was a little hard since both preamps were used on different amplifiers, given I was able to used the Chardonay with the Krell for a few days, but the Chardonay was not really broken in at the time. Anyway what I can tell you is the difference between the two combinations.
The SF and Krell were great and I've enjoyed it for almost a couple of years, but the Supratek and Plinius are a few notches higher IMO, more air and life are the words that come to mind.
I'm listening to it as I type this and I have a big smile on my face (Patricia Barber "NIghtclub"on the EMC 1). |
You guys are so nice. I am going to upgrade pre,poweramp soon so I have any chance to listen syrah with ssamp. I live in montreal canada. |
Well, the Cortese arrived and I am speachless! But let me try to share my total and complete joy with any of you who may still be sitting on the fense. GET OFF THE FENSE AND ORDER THIS THING. Never had I heard music reproduction that is so REAL. Everyting I play (intilally-CD and SACD sources) just comes to life. There is more inner detail, dynamics (will scare the you know what out of you when you first experience a "rim shot" through the Cortese), tight and impactful low end, but with a natural bloom that is so often missing in most equipment I've tried, an extended top end that goes out there with such beauty, and the midrange--WHOW.
So Mick tells me that he's been playing with the phono circuitry and related components and that I really needed to get a TT. Well, I thought my vinyl days were done years ago. NOT. I picked up a Music Hall-7 table (didn't want to go to deep - too soon) and DOUBLE WHOW. Can't seem to buy vinyl fast enough. I'm hooked! Does anyone out there have a suggEstion for an upgrade MC cartridge to use in the MH-7 that would have a lower output than the cartridge that came with it (2.5mv)? It is working but Mick suggested that I'm at the upper limits of the imput sensitvity of the phono stage. |
Very interesting product.
I haven't heard or seen it, but I'm sure most of the magic
you folks are hearing is the octal base 6SN7s in the line
stage. MFA used these and their mil spec counter part the 5692 in their preamps.
Interesting that the designer didn't use a 6SL7/5691 in his phono stage.
Aloha. |
Hi Betcha--
I am among those pairing the Syrah with solid state--I use Bel Canto EVO 200.2 mono blocks and am very happy with this configuration. Like a lot of others, I can't help but wonder about Mick's power amps--could they possibly be as good as the preamps?
Mike, I have a similar situation with my analog set-up. I have a Dynavecter 20XH, a very fine cartridge, but possibly not the best match with the Syrah due to its high output. I am thinking of switching to a Shelter 501.
I know it's been said repeatedly in this thread, but the Supratek has, more than any other piece of gear I own, brought an unbelievable musicality to my system. I literally cannot wait to get home at the end of the day and listen some more.
BTW, the Ken Rads (black glass) do make a noticeable improvement. Now I'm waiting on some Tung Sol 5881s and Sylvania Metal base 6SN7Ws to play around with. Hard to imagine things will get much better though...
|
Betcha, I am using my new Cotese with Spectral DMA360 mono blocks and they work GREAT together.
The Supra pre-s have all the necessary gain to drive anything and due to being transformer coupled outputs, there shouldn't be any impedance mismatches. All I can say is that my entire system has literally come to life. |
I've followed this long thread with great interest. Has anyone used the Supratek Merlot power amp, or tried it and chosen something else?
Peter |
Slowhand, ASA, Mike, Bwhite, Rockhead and the rest of you guys have convinced me, so I'm on the bandwagon waiting for Miss Sarah. Besides, I needed a new pre-amp after the power supply on my CAT just went, a few electrolytics went a bit beyond their useful life. Very good timing and just the excuse I needed to push me over the top. |
Tubegroover, you won't regret it. If it were double the price I would do it again.
Somebody posted in the wanted section (no screen names allowed) that they wanted to buy a Supratek. It was posted from Washington, DC. If that person is reading this thread thought I would let you know I live in Northern Virginia and although there's no chance I'm selling, you are welcome to stop by and have a listen. Email me.
Regards,
Patrick
p.s. tube rolling experience is welcome over at the Yahoo group Fiddler started for Supratek owners. Scroll up for the link. |
Patrick, I'm the guy from DC, and I've gone ahead and put an order in for a new Syrah. Guess I should take that "wanted" down... especially since I'm now committed to waiting! I figure it'll be worth whatever little improvements Mick has made over the months. |
Okee Doke Dennis. If you change your mind, the offer is open.
Regards,
Patrick |
Can someone tell me what the tube compliment is in the Syrah? On Mick's site, it says 417/5842 for the phono, then 6SN7 and 5881. Even if there is two of each (which I'm assuming there is), the picture has *8 tubes*, not 6. What is the other tube pair?
thanks... |
The other tube is a 6GK5 as part of the phono section. |
Hello, I´m new in this forum. I´m from Madrid (Spain).
I´ve just ordered a Cortese, line stage version, with several modifications and I´d like to know what you think about it.
- Balanced and unbalanced inputs and outputs, with provision for biamping with both, the balanced and unbalanced output.
- Power supply connector on power supply (to add later a phono stage.
- A headphone socket.
Mick was agree wiht all of it, I´m sure he can do it without compromise the Cortese´s sound.
I don´t know many things about valves and I´m not sure if I´m asking too much.
What about the cables he recommends, the TMC?
Thanks, guys. |
Jpms, While I am sure that Mick can complete the modifications you've requested, I think you'll have better results with a stock unit. While many of the mods seem minor, they can impact the original design and impart negative side effects.
In all honesty, I would especially stay away from having Mick do XLR connectors on your preamp. The circuit was designed specifically for single ended operation not a balanced signal. Mick tried this on two of my preamps and the results were not good - at all. A local technician told me it would likely cost $500 to trace the problems and fix. Mick charged me $50 for the option, so.. I didn't feel it was fair to have the problem fixed at Micks expense. On my preamp, I have the wrong end (Mick used the Input connectors as the output) and connected some extra transformers for the balancing of the signal. This is the second preamp that *I* have had that he did this on. On the second one, he wanted to fix the problem but then made the same mistake. Oops. Using the XLR's causes my preamp to make huge loud noises when switched to XLR.
While I am rather pissed off about the XLR "issues" I have had, I think that Mick's design is one of the best in the world. The sound is spectacular from a well built unit and quite frankly will by itself transform a system.
Just settle for RCA. Its very good. While very snug and nice to use, balanced connectors are over-rated unless you're running VERY long lengths of cable. If your amplifier only has balanced inputs and is a "fully balanced" design you might want to think twice about attempting to use the Supratek SINGLE ENDED DESIGN with that amp. Even if the Supratek has XLR connections - that does not mean its a balanced signal. In this case, I think you would lose performance with a single ended preamp.
Biamping is possible with a stock Cortese or Syrah because they have two sets of outputs. I am sure Mick could put three without a glitch though.
The extra power supply connection on the preamp shouldn't be a problem but you might want to seriously re-think buying a Cortese line stage only. His phono is even better than the line stage and its a pain in the butt to have him upgrade. I'm going through this now myself.
When I originally purchased my preamp, I didn't think I'd get into vinyl. Now... I've tasted what it sounds like in a high end system and its so good that IMHO, you would be better off asking Mick to remove the line stage and just give you the PHONO - get rid of digital all together!! I am kidding of course but the extra 1,500 for the phono at time of purchase will save you $$$$ in the long run for shipping / duty fees, time, etc. Something to think about.
The TMC cables are a pain to deal with. They sound "okay" but not fantastic. They will save you a lot of money but are so stiff that it makes them difficult to work with. When you read about them being stiff and imagine something in your head based on your past experience with what you think to be stiff cables... take that thought, and then multiply that by two. They are that stiff... In fact, if I move them, they will push my Supratek right out of the rack and onto the floor. |
Thanks, Bwhite.
I agree with you. I was so fascinated about the Supratek comments and look, that I ordered it too fast. Of course I don´t regret, but I should consider the modifications I asked for.
About XLR connections I asked for it because my CD player and amplifier (Wadia and Jeff Rowland)are truly balanced, but both of them could be used in single ended design.
I can live without XLR.
I´m going to ask for the phono also at the same time. It looks hard to get a Supratek and I never rejected the possibility to have a TT.
I´ve sended a message to the Yahoo Supratek forum (twice, sorry) explaining a little more about my system and some other questions.
- What about power cords?. Don´t you think that a good pc could help to restore the unpolluted sound Mick probably has where he lives?.
Thanks again. |
Gentlemen,
After following this thread for a long time, I must admit to being intrigued.
1) Does anyone have a headphone jack already or is Jpms the first to order it? If you have it, how do you find it? If not, are there technical difficulties to put one in? (I would have thought the process similar to putting in a third set of RCAs)
2) What are the volume controls on the Syrah and Cortese? Pots? Stepped attenuators?
3) What are the remote functions? Is it possible to get a remote for the Syrah?
Thanks in advance,
Travis |
Is any one using the Syrah or Cortese with CD's only.
If so how does it sound. Is the magin in Vinyl,
Very interested,
Thanks
Jeffrey |
T_Bone, I can only answer your question related to remote control. I got one with my Syrah. The price was an extra $150. The remote is somewhat 'tacky' - it's a plastic off-the-shelf type learning remote with just a few buttons to control volume up and down, and mute (which just quickly reduces the volume to zero). There is no channel change funcionality on the remote - only volume. There are two channel change buttons on the remote, but they operate as simply a fine tune on the volue (slight up and slight down). Still, it's worth it if you're like me and need to change volume frequently and value the convenience.
I've been with my Syrah over a week now and can't say enough good things about it. Its magical.
Best,
John. |
Hello. Questions I did to Mick ...
- When I asked Mick to put a headphone socket on the Cortese his answer was:
> " The output impedance of the Cortese is about 200 ohms- there are some good headphones able to be driven by this- check your headphones. It is possible to put a headphone socket on the back or top, but not enough room to put a seperate driver in the chassis"..."It doesn't hurt at all, one socket for the HD600 is possible".
- Does it have remote control?
> "Yes -remote volume only. Up/down, fine up/down, mute , works out to 30 feet"
- Does the new line stage version have XLR inputs and outputs?.In such a case is it really balanced?
> "Outputs only- yes it is truly balanced using transformer not op-amps or solid state".
- Couldn´t it have XLR inputs?. That way I could use the full potential of my Wadia.
> "Yes I can do that"
- Could I have also provision for bi amping with the balanced output?
> "Yes. I will have to make up a custom chassis but that is not a problem".
Of course, I trust him, but I agree whith Bwhite that simpler could be better in such a subtle preamplifier. If I can live without those changes, I think that at the end, it would be better. That way, there is more respect to the Mick´s original creation and less "caprice" from my self.
That means, the best possible sound. |
My Supratek Chardonay is fitted with a balanced output and it works just fine, it even came with an output level adjustment knob so I was able to fine tune it with the input of my amp. The output level works on both single ended and balanced output. |
Rmml... That is great to know. Looks like Mick has managed to fix some of the earlier issues concerning variations on the original design. That is outstanding! Mick is making improvements to his design and processes - this is a good thing for all of us. |
Can someone tell me how would be a combination of Supratek Cortese and KR Enterprise Kronzilla single ended Mono Blocks?
Thanks. |
Jpms -- having experienced the Krons not the Cortese, I can only extrapolate. First, check out the input impedance for the Krons & refer to the output impedance of the Cortese.
As I have heard them, the Kronz provide brute power &, I expect, *should* be happy with the sonics of a Cortese, as these are reported from respectable ears. However, make sure the Cortese has an adequate and quiet power line (a dedicated line?) as the KR seem to happily amplify ANYTHING you feed them -- i.e. they are hardly the politest/most forgiving/etc, amps out there! Cheers! |
Rmml, why would you want an additional potentiometer (output level adjustment knob) in the signal path?
I like the way my Ayre K-3x works for output level adjustment. If you need more or less output/gain, Ayre will mail you the specific resistor that you install in your preamp. I told them I needed 6db less gain and they emailed me the resistor.
KF |
Tok20000
I really don't know if what Mick used was a potentiometer or not, but if I'm not mistaken all of the Supratek preamps has an output level adjustment in one form or another.It's just that on mine Mick incorporated it on both RCA and XLR outputs.
If your asking why would I want something added inline that could potentially degrade the sound, of course not. As far as I know my preamp sounds great as it totally beat out my Sonic Frontiers Line 2 SE and all my other preamps I had before it. |
It would be interesting to see what device this is. If it is a knob (analogue knob), it should be a potentiometer of sorts. If it were say a stepped knob, it could be a path of resistors. Anyway, you might want to ask Mick and see what he has to say.
KF |
I am very interested in the Suprateks, but haven't seen much as to how they match with SS amplifiers. Anyone using one of these preamps with an SS amp? |
Hi Boschtb,
They match great with SS amps. Many of us who own Suprateks are using them with SS amps. I am using the Audio Research 100.2 SS amp, and it is a match made in heaven! |
Slowhand, I notice that the input impedance of the AR 100.2 is significantly higher than that on my bryston (150kohm unbalanced and even higher balanced). The Bryston's input impedance is 50kohm unbalanced and 20kohm balance. Will the lower input impedance adversely affect the matching of the Bryston with the Supratek? Thanks. Tom |
I've had my Syrah up and running for about two weeks now and it's glorious. However, one problem I've found is that I'm getting quite a bit of hum from the phono stage setting. I'm a newbie to vinyl, so am not sure whether the phono stage is buring in, or whether there are some ground issues. Even after disconnecting my turntable from the Syrah (interconnects and ground cable), the hum is still fully there. It could be that the Syrah is close to the floor - it's on a wooden slab on the floor, with three brass cones seperating the Syrah from the wood. Also, I just got new FIM Gold power cords on my power amps, so maybe they're just burning in, and having an impact on noise at this point. I just rearranged my components, so it's hard to attribute sounds & hum to any particular change I made. The hum was there when I first got the preamp (in phono section only), but seemed to dissipate over time. Now it seems to be back in full force though. HOpefully, the hum will go away following further break-in, but I wanted to check whether others have experienced the same issue. I'm keen to get the vinyl rig going with minimum hum and background noise. Thanks! |
Outlier, shpouldn't be burn in or PC's on amps, etc. - that's too noticeable for that. Etthan contacted me and said he was having hum problems too, so you may want to talk with him about what he's doing. Its usually grounding issues or phono cord issues, ie not shielded enough. You may want to look into things there (good phono stages are invariably quite sensitive, some more than others).
Hum is a perennial hobgobblin in phono stages and every analog enthusiasist sighs relief when he/she doesn't have any - and sometimes you just don't know where its coming from! You just have to slog away, talk to other people like you're doing, and keep at it. However, if it is the phono stage itself then the manufacturer needs to address that. Finding another analog system to plug it in that is already stable is always a good idea, although not dispositive.
Keep us updated please. |
