Power Cable options for Levinson 300 series

No the 300 series does not have built in power cables. I am surprised the 33H's do but I have never seen one in person so I can't help you there.

Hmmmm, well, I had a 336 amplifier, and it was definately built in. The transport was not, and the DAC was not, and the Preamps were not, but the AMP was......

I guess the higher powered amps did but of ALL the ML amps I have seen none did. I still am suprised because of exactly what you mentioned about trying different powercords. Typically older amps or preamps had powercords built in. I know the 331 and 334 didn't so I assumed none of the others 300 series would either. Thanks for the correction.

for the high power ML amps like the 333, 336, and the monoblocks, ML wanted to make sure that the end users don't accidentally use smaller gauge powercords and break the amps or cause a fire, so they decided to go the safe route and use attached PC to ensure the amps are operating with enough current. That was the answer I got when I owned the 333. I think it came from the factory tech, but not 100 percent sure.

FrankC

Hey no sweat Sam....I didn't know that some of the 300 series had removable cords! I see on lots of the pics here, where people are selling the lower power 300 series that indeed the cords are removable!

Thanks Frank for the explanation.....makes sense I guess! Just wondering how this awesome amp, 33H, would sound with an Isoclean Supreme Focus, or the like, supplying the power!

Regards.

Do you have dedicated circuits?

I agree, with Samzx12. Before spending mega bucks on power conditioners or even powercords, get a dedicated line installed. It's relatively inexpensive. I paid like $300 for two 20amp dedicated lines about 8 years ago. One for the front end and one for the amps.

I've just started my house remodel project, and will be adding a dedicated listening room with more dedicated lines, one for the digital front end, one for the analog front end, one for the amplification, and one for the HT gear. Luckily the electrician had done something similar for some rich client before, so he doesn't think that I am crazy.

FrankC

Seriously, a few years back, the local (now defunct) store was demoing a pair of the reference Krell monoblocks like 1000w each driving a pair of the Dynaudio Evidence speakers. In the middle of the demonstration, the breaker tripped and the entire store went dark. Supposedly the store had these 30amp lines. But I guess the Krell was drawing a lot of current during some passages. It required 20 minutes before they could turn on the power again. But within few seconds of their second try, the store went dark again. I didn't want to wait another twenty minutes so I left. Imagine someone using zipcords behind those Krells. I wonder what would happen....

FrankC

I still own a 335 and it has the removable power cord that was replaced even before I plugged it into the wall the first time with a BMI Whale elite. Huge difference in soundstaging and low end reproduction. The even bigger difference sonically in my system was the addition of adding a 20 amp dedicated line for the amps. It opened up the dynamics and reduced the noise in the system even more. I would suggest trying that first?

The standard power connector in the aftermarket cable industry is the 15amp IEC connector. The 336, 33H, and the 33 cannot use a 15amp connector, because even the baby of the bunch, the 336, needs 17.71amps at 120v to reach full rated power with 8ohm loads. The 33H and 33 regenerate AC, which is an inefficient process, so they really need more current than a 15amp circuit is capable of.

There is a 20amp IEC connector available, but even that one isn't all that interesting for a 336, as 4ohm rated power requires 30.59amps at 120v. ML probably just threw in the towel and made a 10/3(?) power cord captive. For folks that use a true 20amp or 30amp circuit and outlet (which has a different power plug configuration) ML says in the owners manual to just change the plug on the captive power cord.

Frankly, I'm surprised even the 335 comes with a 15amp IEC port, because the 335 requires 20.93amps to reach rated power into 4ohm loads. I suppose ML felt they needed to support replaceable power cords for marketing reasons where it was possible.

The "right way" to power amps of this class is to run a dedicated 220v/30amp line to each amplifier, and have a dealer reconfigure the amps for that voltage.

To be perfectly honest, I've never understood amps with this much rated power. The 336 is delivering wattage equal to one horsepower per channel into 4ohm loads. Unless you have one heck of a set of speakers, with a large array of drivers with massive voice coils, this sort of power is just going to heat up speaker motors and cause poor performance. Given the potential power output, I'd recommend using at least 10ga speaker cables (8ga for longer runs) with high quality spade terminations on the amp side, and spades or locking banana plugs on the speaker side.

Thanks very much for all the input folks.......some excellent food for thought! I am going to have a closer look at my power situation for starters. I have been planning on doing this but a change of address was in my near future, so was holding off till I got in the new digs! I will definately be using some of this advice.

I'd bet ML knows a heck of alot more than us and decided the correct gauge will make a difference not some esoteric
material. The power just came down how many miles of god knows what, not to mention step down transformers and such.
Save your money and worries and spend more on the music.

Some of the numbers listed by other members are not entirely correct. 350/700/1400W rated Levinson 336 will pull in 3/6/12 amps MAXIMUM. Short dynamic passage will be handled by reserve currents in the capacitors. In normal listening level the amp will pull in 1 amp or less.

The dedicated AC circuit is still a good investment considering how affordable it is. I've installed 15A dedicated line a couple of years ago and I'm very happy with it.

Jylee, you are absolutely, positively incorrect. My power figures, every single one of them, came from the Mark Levinson owners manual for the 336. If you don't believe me, you can go to their web site and download the PDF for yourself.

In fact, even your 1 amp estimate for the 336 in normal listening is not correct. Levinson says at 120v the 336 will dissipate 3.35amps IDLING.

I must admit Levinson 336 consumes a lot of power as a class A/B design, and my numbers are somewhat underestimating. But their test figure is just that, driving test equipment given test signal. Unless the music is played in a large hall at extreme volume level using highly demanding speakers, I can't see how it could saturate standard 15A circuit.

To the OP, I'm sorry to have taken this thread down the 336 path when you were asking about the 33H. ML says the 33H dissipates 360W at idle, so the pair will sink a rather spectacular 720W at 120v just sitting there and waiting for a signal. You didn't mention your speakers, but if they are relatively inefficient ones, with impedance that falls below 4 ohms a lot, you're going to be drawing well over 1000w at the outlet regularly. The advice in this thread for dedicated 20amp circuits for each 33H is not only recommended, but nearly required.

As for swapping the power cord, I know there are lots of people that claim that power cords, or even outlets, make a difference in how your system will sound. I won't argue that here, but the 33H actually self-generates it's own AC current for the voltage gain stages. This capability is massive overkill, and goes beyond anything provided by an aftermarket power cord, and beyond what's provided by all but a few super-expensive power conditioners. You have what's, arguably, the best solution for power conditioning reasonably available.

Thanks again everyone.........no problem going down the 336 path, I used to own the 336 and many other Levinson products.

My speakers are the Genesis 4 tower speakers, Gen II. The Levinson 33H's are running the mid/tweeters only, and I can turn the volume up to 100% on the system and it sounds incredible. The speakers are 4 ohm and 91db. However, I do think it sounds a little leaner at this volume, leading me to think that what most of you are saying is exactly right.......get 20Amps to the wall for each mono block, and don't worry about the power cord. So, that is my goal.