As far as being able to do it, I would say yes. This would be a true Bi-wire set up, but in your case, you would be doubling the cable to the same post. Would there be a sonic difference? Probably. How different depends on your equipment.
As far as terminations, I have heard many opinions. Some prefer Bare Wire as the most the most revealing. Though the banana/spade combo should work well. |
Yes. Until I found the best single cable for my system, I had it bi-wired using two different makes to achieve the best sound. I just made sure to use bananas for one run and spades for the other. Or, you can use bare wire and spades, or bare wire and bananas, but I wouldn't try both with spades. I don't think you'd get a good enough grip that way.
In the end, it tended to be a bit "phasey", for lack of a better word, but it sounded nice.
All the best,
Nonoise
|
sure you can, but the question I have is why? |
stuartk
If you double the wire as you have suggested then the result electrically is that is you halve the impedance of the cable. This may tighten the bass response since the impedance of the cable is halved.
Try it, and use your own judgement.
|
Good comments by the others. I would add that the only situation in which I would definitely avoid doing that is if the cable happens to be one of the few cable types that have ultra-high capacitance, such as Goertz, or the old Polk Cobra cable. Paralleling two identical runs, as you are proposing, will double the cable capacitance seen by the amplifier, and if the capacitance of the cable is very high to begin with that could result in adverse effects up to and including oscillations and amplifier damage.
With the great majority of speaker cables, however, the doubled capacitance will not be of any significance, and the halving of resistance and inductance that will result will (at least slightly) work in the direction of improving the accuracy of transmission of the signal, as well as resulting in a slight increase in woofer damping. Of course, those differences may not always be subjectively preferable, so as suggested above it may be a good idea to try it both ways.
Regards,
-- Al
|
Thanks for your comments.
1) Al: the maker of this particular cable combines two runs of it into a shotgun for their more expensive product, so I'm assuming it's OK.
2) the reason I asked this question, is that I've gotten conflicting opinions re: bi-wiring: one says I have to use tow different gauges of wire for woofers and tweeters, while another says I can use the same gauge. If I can use the existing cable to bi-wire, I will do that. I'm just not clera about what I can or can't do in this regard. |
Hi Stuart,
There’s no problem either bi-wiring or paralleling the same gauges or different gauges. All of those approaches will function well, aside from the caveat I mentioned about cables having ultra-high capacitance (which appears to be inapplicable in this case). Opinions and experiences will differ regarding which approach is likely to be most optimal from a sonic standpoint, and figure to be dependent on the particular equipment, room, and listener. In many cases it might not make much if any difference at all.
So if you feel so inclined, try it both ways. Or if not just enjoy!
Regards,
-- Al
|
Thanks a lot for your helpful response, Al; it's much appreciated! |
You’re welcome! One more point: Be very careful not to mix up + and -. Specifically, when two speaker cables are connected in parallel if + and - are interchanged at one end (and only one end) of one of the two cables (but not both cables), the result will be a direct short across the the amplifier’s + and - output terminals. Which of course would definitely not be healthy for the amp.
Regards,
-- Al
|
Yikes! I will be extra careful! |
You will be fine. As you noted you are producing what cable makers call shotgun cables. They double the wire and either combine them in two terminations or four terminations. I would just mark the end of each wire with a color tape to make sure you don't short anything out
Alan |
I use double-cables two ways:
a) For amps that I've owned having two sets of speaker outputs (Adcom and Krell) I have bi-wired by using both of these outputs and two sets of cables to bi-wirable speakers, like my B&W805D.
b) For speakers that are NOT bi-wirable (my Thiel CS3.7) I run two sets of speaker cables and double them up on the speaker terminals. I'm doing this with two sets of Nordost Heimdall cables that I made from a single, really long run. I found that this added a little something to the sound. I think the additional cable mass makes a difference. Perhaps this is in line with Nordost's move toward more cable mass in their newer models. |
I am told by Ron Hedrich of Marigo Labs, legendary (in some circles) designer and engineer of cables and resonance/vibration control thingies, that it works, but make sure it's the same exact constructed cable. Also as stated by others, spade banana at each end. Which sounds like what you are wanting to do. Marigo also said it would make for better sonics to use biwire cable. With wire running cable length, not just attached at the speaker end. Hope this helps.
|
True bi-amping of speakers from different amps to different drivers, ie woofers and mains, would show a doubling of resistance when adding them together, which is not the case, because they are still the same to each set of drivers. Bi-wiring accomplishes nothing. That means that no improvements or degradations will be heard,k unless, of course, the wires were too small or too resistive to begin with. Simply doubling wires to the same terminals does not double the impedance. It halves it. However, since he mentioned he was using shorter wires, for example say to half the original length, the impedance would be the same as before, and for other lengths, easy calculable with simple multiplication and division skills. |
Simply doubling wires to the same terminals does not double the impedance. It halves it. However, since he mentioned he was using shorter wires, for example say to half the original length, the impedance would be the same as before. Dan, I’m not sure I follow the last quoted sentence. Cutting the length in half would cut the resistance, inductance, and capacitance in half. If the wires are then doubled to the same terminals (i.e., paralleled) that would cut the resistance and inductance in half again, to 1/4 of the value of the original single run that was twice as long, while doubling the capacitance to the original value. Regards, -- Al |
I've been a member of Audiogon for many years, but don't usually follow the forums. Recently they started sending me weekly updates on "
Top new discussions
".
Maybe you all know, or the OPs system is posted somewhere, I looked, couldn't find it.
I'm surprised nobody asked what cables they are and what speakers. Depending on the cables this would be simple to give a reasonably definitive answer.
So, if this topic is still active, could you answer those questions?
|
Hello there,
I did try bi-wiring my speakers with a combination of different cable brands (VdH C122 with bananas and Kimber Cable 8TC with spades)
While the Kimbers worked fine by themselves and were my main cables for almost 4 years, the addition of the VdH´s gave the mix a bit more body and calm. There is certainly a sonic effect by bi-wiring. It all comes down to your system and personal taste I believe. Trying cost nothing and can be lots of fun! Enjoy
|
2 cables to each post is called Shotgun Very worthwhile
|
I've done it for yrs with very good results. I have two pairs of the same gauge, same maker. Bigger,cleaner sound with out it beine bloated or heavy soundind. Seems to work best with big power amps,200 wpc or more. |
