Phono Stages with External Power Supplies...Worth It?

Let me know what you would want for the  Lounge LCR MKIII if you want to sell it.

Fundamentally speaking, separating the processing of the weakest signal from the EMI of an AC power supply is highly desired. Go in that direction if you can. 

I too must be of the older group who thinks:
Preamp = phono and line
Line stage = line only
Phono amp = phono only
Passive preamp = evil box of magic

fsonicsmith,  You must be one of the younger guys around here.  For most of my audiophile life (i.e., since the early 1970s), the term "preamplifier" meant a device that included a linestage and a phono stage, all in one. So, when you mentioned the Ref6 in the same breath with the Steelhead, I initially assumed it was what some now call a "full function" preamplifier, a linestage cum phono stage, because I am stuck in the past perhaps.  I then did some reading on the Ref6 and found that it is indeed "only" a linestage and also that it costs roughly twice as much as the Steelhead. I apologize for that. Given its cost and sophistication, I am sure the Ref6 is great at doing its job. But I don't see how you can compare its SQ to that of the Steelhead, unless you are saying that you prefer it to the sound of the output stage of the Steelhead, if the latter is used as a full function preamplifier.  The little bit of tweaking that I did to my unit affects mainly the output stage; I wouldn't want to touch the RIAA correction circuits. (I use mine as a full function preamplifier.)
 
I beg to differ with you on the relative functions of a linestage vs a phono stage.  The latter is a much trickier proposition, circuit-wise.  Much more complex.  Phono stages do more amplification of the input signal than any other piece of gear in the chain, including the amplifier.  Whereas, in most cases the input (from a phono stage, CDP, etc) to a linestage needs no further amplification in order to drive an amplifier.  Gain added in the linestage is usually needless and, as you say, is then attenuated at the output. Which is why I would say that the power supply of a phono stage is more critical to its excellence or lack thereof. 

I love my Steelhead too, but I love it much more since I tweaked it a tiny bit.  Evanna Manley seems to be a very "hip" person; I am not sure she would say that what I did would void any warranty, but as my Steelhead is several years old, I am guessing I have no warranty to worry about. I can well understand that you may be concerned on those grounds about your unit.

Has anyone suggested listening and deciding for yourself whether it is worth it? ;)
This more than anything else will tell you.

Any dealer worth his salt will be happy to swap them out for you at the dealership or lend you both for lengthy home demo. Either way you will know for sure rather than acting on random opinion?

fsonicsmith, I am surprised you would place the AR Ref6 above the Steelhead, but if you are a "solder slinger", like me, I can suggest some very small changes to the Steelhead that make it sound worlds better. Either PM me or indicate here if you want the information and my suggestions.

Lewm; I don't. They are two separate categories. The Steelhead is a phono stage and the ARC Red 6 is a preamp. I used them as examples only. At the outset of my post, I mentioned that preamps and phono stages are very similar and they are. They both take a low voltage signal and apply attenuation to them. They are both very susceptible to EFI/MFI from transformers. Further, I love my Steelhead and if Mike Fremer is correct that it is no longer reference quality, I don't care. I would never mod it. The folks at Manley are incredible with their product support and I would never jeopardize my warranty and their support with mods. 

In my years of dealing with Naim equipment, I found that adding a power supply made a huge improvement in the sound.  Not just "smoother" or "more musical" or stuff like that.  It made the music sound more musically complete, like going from standard TV to hi-res.  That may not be the case with your particular piece, but you should absolutely try one with a return privilege.  I was talking about power supplies with Peter Qvortrup from Audio Note and he told me that many people have severe space limitations, dictating 1-box solutions, but otherwise, he always prefers a separate large PS.  Enjoy. 

I'd suggest buy it sans PS and see how you like it. The real question is, will you always wonder? 

@lewm incorrect. Merely asking for thoughts on external power supplies in a general sense

fsonicsmith, I am surprised you would place the AR Ref6 above the Steelhead, but if you are a "solder slinger", like me, I can suggest some very small changes to the Steelhead that make it sound worlds better.  Either PM me or indicate here if you want the information and my suggestions.

gochurchgo, Sounds like you want emotional support for the decision to do without the external PS, which seems to be your preference, not based on performance but on space allocation, which is fine.  Someone else pointed out that you can always "upgrade" to the external supply at a later date, if you should feel you need it.  That sounds like the "win-win" solution for your particular needs.

@fsonicsmith that makes perfect sense. Thsnks

@stereo5 I’ve yet to run across anyone NOT running the reference version. It’s not a money issue as my budget is $2k it’s more that I’ll be downsizing to studio apartments when I get empty nested so I’m trying to have my endgame system not have 27 boxes.  Part of me thinks to skip on the reference and go with the standard to then make my stereo Khartago into monos. 

It all depends. With both preamps and phono stages, separating the PSU from the line circuitry is in theory optimal. Let me emphasize in "THEORY". This is because there are phono stages and preamps with built-in transformers and capacitors (PSU's) that are superior to others that have separate with the PSU tied to the line stage via umbilical. Separating the boxes is expensive. So the short answer is that with anything less than state of the art, you are generally better off with a one box solution but not always. Generally. My Manley Steelhead has a separate PSU but there are likely (scratch that, definitely) better phono stages that are one-box. My ARC Ref 6 preamp is one-box but there is little or nothing on this planet (IMveryHO) that beats it. But then, there is the Ref 10 that sounds different, but not necessarily better. 

im Assuming the external power supply is to remedy noise. If so then would running MM carts sort of make that less necessary? 40db gain vs 55-60?

Looking at this more from a general application stand point.

From what I have read in the Odyssey Forum on The Audio Circle, it is a very worthwhile and noticeable improvement. 

You've asked an impossible question.  To answer it intelligently, one would need to know much more about the differences in the power supplies between the version with the external box and the version with the on-board PS.  Can you do some research and give us more to chew on?  It's true that a large fraction of the premium you will have to pay to get the outboard PS is due to the mere fact that you are getting an extra chassis.  However, regardless of all else, having the external PS usually leads to lower noise. But if the base unit is already "quiet", maybe the extra cost is not merited.  

Can't say about the Odyessey power supply but I've ordered the $900 Gold Note PSU for the $1250 PH10 phono unit. Is it worth it? Several users say yes, hope I find it the case myself.

Get the $1200 version if funds are a little tight. Apparently, you can upgrade for the extra $700 without penalty down the road. However, you may regret not extending the card initially. Generally, a beefier PS brings small improvements in stage, tighter bass, increased dynamics and lower noise floor.
There is one for sale here for $800 obo which you could upgrade and save some $.