I am in the market for a new phono cartridge. I can run up to $1400 but would prefer not to if i can get the performance I want.
I listen to predominantly Jazz on vinyl, though some rock, folk and classical also gets spun
I recently heard a Hana SL and Rega Apheta at a dealers—different decks, same room and system. Both sounded good although the Apheta was not as heavy sounding and at the same time sounded more “present”. I wasn’t really looking at the Apheta, but it was available to listen to.
The room is accoustically live with lots of glass and hard surfaces but all sounds good.
System: Naim Atom, Bryston TT, Parasound JC jr phono stage (so huge loading flexibility and gain up to the 60’s), Totem Acoustics Signature Ones, Transparent cables. Current cart: Denon 103r with 250 hours on it, so it is winding down.
I have enjoyed the Denon. But wondering about that all elusive “more.”
on paper spec, nobody touches the Grados for channel separation, but not sure how essential a criterion that should be. Especially since I worked hard to tame some RFI from a nearby antenna and the Grados I have heard said are not well-shielded.
Since my Totems only drop down to 45 Hz, I suppose absolute resolution on the low end could be sacrificed for other sonic goods.
Chakster, the article you sent wouldn’t dissuade me at all from purchasing product from Ortofon. At least not from my authorized dealer. That said, I’m not sure that’s the cartridge I want, even though I’ve owned their products before.
We share something on here just to help people i believe, it’s up to you what cartridge do you need. I have NOS Ortofon MC2000 and it was amazing cartridge, still superb, it was made in the mid 80’s (high compliance MC, not for everyone with such a low output). Very rare model, admired by many experienced users on here.
Regarding the new Ortofon: When cartridge pins on the new expensive Ortofon models fell off this is too bad, don’t you think so ? This is bad quality control, they are making too many cartridges. Your dealer will replace such cartridge with a new one? Are you sure? Another member who posted about this problem could NOT solve it with his dealer.
Why not SoundSmith if you looking only for new cartridges ?
Did you watch his lecture, have you seen the lowest mass MC in comparison to the highest mass MI ? The difference is huge if favor to the MI (even with highest moving mass which is still very low copared to any MC). Do yourself a favor: In this video after 27:00 timeline.
As for stylus wear, I am sceptical. I suspect that the cleanliness of records is extremely important.
I recall a study which indicated that the gunk in record grooves was equal parts fluff, grease, and diamond dust - pretty much an ideal grinding compound. Then I went ultrasonic for cleaning, which, as a bonus, made a big difference to the sound.
I suggest a quality torque screwdriver. Yep, I'm serious.
My higher end Koetsu was disappointingly similar to my old MM until I bought one. Then it blossomed into Koetsu Magic.
What did it do for me? Most importantly, both screws could be tightened to the same torque. That permitted me to set azimuth properly. A Linn engineer discussed this at some length years ago, and I found that his recommendations were right on. Now my MM sounds better too!
Chakster, the article you sent wouldn’t dissuade me at all from purchasing product from Ortofon. At least not from my authorized dealer. That said, I’m not sure that’s the cartridge I want, even though I’ve owned their products before.
Terry9, I do have Chris Feickert’s set up tool, an old record of test tones and a phone speed app (plus obious thinks like a level). Any other tools for cartridge alignment and tt set up you think i should have?
Hi The preamp you have will accommodate almost anything. In my experience the relationship between the compliance of the phono cartridge and the mass and rigidity of the tonearm is paramount. If you find a correct match moving coil cartridges eliminate one of the steps in conversion of mechanical to electrical energy and I generally prefer them
So i went to my preferred dealer and listened to an Ortofon Cadenza Bronze on a Brinkman powered by the big Parasound into some Kef Blade 2’s and a phono stage I’d bever hears of before, etc. not sure I was hearing the cadenza alone, but it all certainly sounded good.
Roberjerman, i use Last before every side. And a brush for periodic hard scrubbing. I once dug deep into some very scientific studies on styli wear. Along with pictures and other data, one study said 500 hours regardless of stylus profile or brand. It should under high resolution wear after different hours of use. A cartridge can still sound great but be eating the vinyl according to that study.
I suspect that differences in set-up are greater than differences between cartridges at similar price points. Which means that you might want to spend your bucks on set-up tools first. Just my 0.01 cents.
I have BP#2, Dynavector 10x5, Hana SL, Art9, and Scheu SL. Art9 has best resolution, tone, energy, best in my stable. The Scheu has slight advantage over Hana SL, but not huge, like difference between Art9. Same listening preferences, jazz, rock.
Limited perspective, but recommend Art9 or second place Hana SL
Chakster, thanks for those suggestions. BTW, Sending it to SS gives an option of either a ruby or boron cantilever, with a nude contact line or optimized contour nude contact line stylus for relatively little money. With that information, and based on your concerns about conical tips, do you still think that getting the Denon worked on makes no sense? If so, why?
It will definitely improve the sound of oldschool denon designed in the 60’s, no doubt. But it will be a refurbished MC cartridge, instead you could buy SoundSmith MI cartridge with best cantilever and stylus. You can watch his lecture and Peter will explain why MI are better than MC, he rebuild many thousands MC cartridges, but his own carts are MI, guess why? You will find the answer in his lecture.
When you ship anything to SoundSmith for rebuild it will take up to 5 month to get it back. If you want to try something different (better than your stock denon) look for vintage MM/MI or vintage MC with best cantilevers and best styli.
I have a boron-tipped 103 in a wood body. I took my garrard 301 into Soundsmith for a tuneup and the tech said it was easily the equal of a $100+cartridge
I'll second the ditch the Denon theme, not an overly great cart but a good performer for the money and not worth re-tipping ,IMO, just get a better cart.
+I'll also second the ART9 its a fantastic cart for the money, also the hana sl cart is quite good for the money.
Depending on your arm compliance also look at the Van den Hull MC 10 its their entry level cart but is a wonderfully detailed cart and has the fantastic VDH stylus. I'd say its better then the Art 9 and anything Hana has to offer, I've heard all three (in my system) and own an older version of the VDH Mc10.
The venerable 103 is the Toyota Corolla of cartridges! A good daily driver that performs up to specs and is affordable! A good recommendation is the Hana SL with the Shibata tip ($750). A superior stlyus profile that will extract "more" from those tiny grooves!
You should be getting more than 250 hours use from the 103. Get a bottle of Stylast and apply it before playing an LP side. Afterwards use a piece of Magic Eraser to clean the tip. This should extend stylus life considerably!
The Audio-Technica ART -9 is a great suggestion. The Ortofon Quintet Black S is another cartridge that punches way above its price point. read reviews and get a listen if you can which is admittedly hard. I would never get a cartridge re tipped by anyone but the manufacturer of that cartridge. You would never know what you are getting. I have never had a cartridge re tipped and I have never worn out a stylus probably because another cartridge comes along that I want to try. Eventually you have a bunch of cartridges none of which are worn out. There are always two or three that you like best the others I give away. Vintage cartridges? I suppose you can rebuild them but technology moves on and I have no desire to go backwards.
OK , It was a bit in the face, dealer said would change with time which might be or not .More than most I really think a good cart can outdo a great one if it is set up perfectly and the great one is not . It looked like the P6 had VTA adjustment as well .
Thanks schubert. After the 97 degree day we had here yesterday, Christmas seems far off, but glad you have something to look forward to. I will check if any of rhe local shops have that on a table. The Rega isn't a bad comparison to the Bryston as both go the relatively low mass unsprung engineering path though with different approaches to resonance control.
Chakster, thanks for those suggestions. BTW, Sending it to SS gives an option of either a ruby or boron cantilever, with a nude contact line or optimized contour nude contact line stylus for relatively little money. With that information, and based on your concerns about conical tips, do you still think that getting the Denon worked on makes no sense? If so, why?
I heard the top of the new Sumiko MM line, the $600 Sumiko Amethyst, at a dealer on Totem Hawk , very nice tone and instumental seperation . Was mounted on a Rega P6 which was also nice. Also, which is important to me, it is a very easy cart to mount and adjust . On my me to me Christmas list .
When you’re listening to a cartridge with conical tip you loose a lot in resolution, no matter what arm or phono stage, speakers etc. Conical tip is the worst ever stylus tip, this is entry level and pretty much oldschool. The life span of that tip is too short.
First you have to know your arm effective mass when you’re looking for a cartridge for it.
Do not waste your time with Denon retipping/refurbishing, just buy a whole new cartridge with better stylus profile, better cantilever and overall better sound quality. If you like SoundSmith just buy his own MI cartridge!
If you want a low compliance MC it can be Fidelity-Research PMC-3 with Air-Core Coil, Contact Line stylus.
If you want a decent mid compliance MM it can be Audio-Technica AT-ML150 OCC with Gold-Plated Beryllium cantilever and MicroLine tip.
... just to name a few, but there are many more (depends on your budget) and dealers will never offer you those carts in the shops! The world of cartridges is much bigger than Hanna, Denon and usual suspects, some vintage cartridges are superior to all of them, do not ignore them.
If you do decide to go with the purchase of a new MC cartridge, be sure to listen to an Audio-Technica ART9. To my ears it is as good as any cartridge I've heard, owned or currently own, which includes cartridges up to 13-14 times its price.
Find a fine vintage MM or MI cartridge and if there are doubts about its condition, have it re-tipped by SS. Short of spending many thousands on an MC cartridge, you will be in great shape. And I am not even sure that spending many thousands on an MC cartridge would be better, sound-wise. (By the way, any decent "stereo" cartridge that lives up to that label will give you more than adequate channel separation; that would be the last thing I'd worry about in terms of specs.)
So the oprions for Denon upgrades include SS, Zu and another one who’s name I can’t recall. Fstein, it is a good idea for me to keep in mind. Why do you suggest this? Also, do they preserve a conical tip or use a diff stylus profile?
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