However, since the AP LP was an order of magnitude quieter than the
other LP at all frequencies, and only somewhat more audible at 400Hz
than at other frequencies, does this not suggest that the coupling is
pretty good? Agreed that 400Hz seems less good... The graphite platter
has a natural resonance of 2KHz, the cast iron subplatter of 500Hz.
Settled on this configuration after other platter pads sounded muddy by comparison. Sounds like the platter pad is robbing energy from the platter and vice versa. That is a simple way to kill resonance. Empire used to do something like that with their two-piece platters in their 598 and 698 years ago. do you guys ever just sit back and enjoy the music?:)
Yup! And I enjoy it more when the system is really neutral (and so does my GF). That is why getting the platter pad right is important- you can't fix things downstream if the cartridge isn't able to do its job properly! Look at this beauty:
https://www.technics.com/us/news/20190107-sl-1500c/ Sweet- may well be the next go-to entry level machine. |
Technics seem to want the whole of the turntable market. Fair enough, but it was the stalwarts such as Pro-ject that kept the faith during the darkest days of vinyl.
This really is quickly becoming a golden age of vinyl playback. Seriously, who saw this coming 20 years ago? |
FYI, just put the pre owned Soundsmith zephyr Star on my notts 294 and it sounds fantastic through 3 tracks of Hugh masakalas hope. |
Good to hear Joe.
Debating my next cart and so far it's down to a Soundsmith or Kiseki for the Nottingham. |
Uber,
my my dad has a friend who has a notts, either space with heavy kit or hyperspace fitted with a purple heart. The rest of the system is close to what hwd has set up in their listening room. I really need to go listen and report back. I will give updates as I learn more about the zephyrs sound as well. |
Essrand:
I own the AMR DP 777se and owned a SL1200 GAE for two wonderful years. I understand your point, a DP 777/ DP 777 se can make lesser analog rigs a waste of time. I had them both maxed out and ran the following cartridges on the GAE, London Ref, Audio Technica ART 1000, Denon 103r, Ana Mighty Sound modified Denon 103r (103.3) and a Kiseki Purple Heart (a friend loaned me the Kiseki, not a fan of this one). I own or owned and used the Luxman EQ 500, SPL Phonos and iPhono 2 with the GAE.
It is a superior sounding table once the bearing is fully run-in. I would say that my AMR with an optimized music server (HQPlayer), linear power supply and more optimization’s than I care to mention and the GAE were on par with each other. They both made music and often times it would come down to the mastering job on a particular record. For instance, Sade seems to have been mastered to vinyl far better than CD, while the 45 of “Jacintha Is Her Name” seems to have been treated very very well in the vinyl realm as well as the CD (of course the 15ips tape is better than both).
I only sold my GAE because I wanted to play with an idler and I do not need three tables. I thought it would be cool to have the idler next to my SP10 MK3. Had a Commonwealth 12D/3 which is a great table, but I chose a Garrard 401.
My buddies have some expensive tables and I’ve not heard any of their tables flat out beat the GAE. I thought the Dohmann Helix ($40k) and the GAE sounded very similar. In fact you can find earlier posts I’ve made where I stated that the Dohmann was the one belt table I’ve heard that I really liked and could happily own.
You cant lose with a SL 1200 G.
If there is one thing that I personally believe is a must change to bring out the best of the Technics it is the deletion of that horrid platter-mat they have been stuffing in the box with their tables since the 70’s. That mat was horrid with my SP10 MK3 and it was horrid with my GAE. I ended up using a delrin (relatively sure it’s delrin) mat by Artisan Fidelity. The stock mat sounds muddy and sucks the life out of the music, it’s terrible. I did try one of my friends custom copper mats (he owns a GAE) that he is developing specifically for the G/GAE and it did indeed sound excellent. I tried my Artisan Fidelity custom copper mat that was made for my SP 10 MK3 on the GAE, did NOT like that at all. I think it was too heavy, again, that mat was a one-off for my MK3.
Whatever you decide, I hope you enjoy. It’s a lot of fun. I listen to a great deal of music and really enjoy my analog and digital. |
audiofun,
what didnt you like about the purple heart? |
Joegator81:
I don’t really have anything against the Kiseki, I just found it a little to soft and warm for my taste. I can definitely see how this cartridge can work in some systems. I think it works well with my buddies rig because his table, the Grand Prix Monaco, in my opinion can be a bit lean sounding and harmonically reticent, he agrees with my assessment. The Kiseki brings a bit more decay to instruments on his table. It is a more refined sound than a stock Denon 103 but whereas I find a 103/103r cartridge to get the feet moving, the Kiseki is a bit more languid. I much prefer my modified 103r.
Of course this is a case (as is all of these opinions) of courses for horses. |
Audiofun,
thanks for the insight. I think the more opinions the better. Much appreciated.
Joe |
|
Thanks Audiofun.
It is really valuable input especially from a AMR DP-777 owner who understands where I am coming from.
Your post more than anything is now making me consider the Technics (even though I have to buy it out of the country, no Technics dealers here).
|
essrand:
Glad I could offer something to the conversation that you found useful. I did just listen to a SP10R in an Artisan Fidelity plinth with a Schroeder CB1-L arm :) that was quite nice. The bearing only had about 300 hours on it and I’ve found that motor structure to require 700 hours for full run-in. I may start a thread with my impressions but don’t want to hi-jack this one.
I think the 1200G is just now starting to get the respect it deserves. It really is a table that one can run a +$5k cartridge on and with the commensurate phono stage build a startling good analog rig around. What I’m saying is that to get more table, you are going to have to spend quite a bit more and the usual suspects that people like to mention in the same breath as the Technics AINT gonna cut it!
|
If anybody is moved by this thread to buy RP8, today I got an email from one of the big music direct retailers offering about a third off the price of them. Cheers,
Spencer |
So, I received the Oracle mat and the Project record weight for my Technics SL1200G. I found that the whole presentation is enhanced with the bass being much more solid. My question to Ralph or others, should I remove the sticky backing on the underside of mat and stick to my platter or leave the covering on? I'm afraid if I stick the mat down, I won't be able to easily remove it if I need to remove the platter. What do you guys and girls think? |
I use a funk firm mat it came with some sticky clear double sided tape in little circles at 4 spots that do not hold the mat down real tight I can remove it easily, I think they are there to keep it from slipping. Does the Oracle have a complete coverage? If it does I would be worried about using it, maybe you could do small pieces of double sided tape |
stereo5,
I have a SL1200G that Ralph modded for me with a Triplanar tonearm. I too use the Oracle Hard Acrylic mat that Ralph suggested. To answer your question; I have used the Oracle mat without removing the sticky back. My mat is not, stuck down to the brass platter. IMO, sticking the Oracle Mat to the brass platter is not necessary.
Ralph,might disagree with me, just to get every last bit of SQ that this might allow. I do not think it necessary.
I tried, the stock rubber mat, a new felt mat from my LP12, An old cork mat, an X- treme carbon fiber mat and some type of firm gel mat The Oracle mat provides great sonics through the entire spectrum. Highs are clear and extended without being harsh, Mids are right on. Bass with my Lyra is tight, textured and more solid.
I placed a small piece of blue tape on the edge of the mat and on the brass platter and marked them to detect any movement / slippage. Nothing has moved since I placed the mat in June 2017.
I also tried the brass record weight from my Kuzma TT, A SOTA reflex clamp, a Stillpoints LP1 record weight and finally settled on a 315 gr HRS record weight.
The Oracle mat and HRS record weight work well for me.
If you decide to stick the Oracle mat to the brass platter; you will need to drill 3 holes in it to access the 3 bolts holding the brass platter if you need to, in the future. It would be hard to remove the Oracle Mat without damage if you stick it to the brass platter.
|
Thanks. I thought the same thing. I doubt the mat will slip as it is quite a tight fit over the spindle. I am going to leave it as is as it sounds so good. That HRS weight must have been Uber expensive.
|
So, I received the Oracle mat and the Project record weight for my
Technics SL1200G. I found that the whole presentation is enhanced with
the bass being much more solid. My question to Ralph or others, should I
remove the sticky backing on the underside of mat and stick to my
platter or leave the covering on? I'm afraid if I stick the mat down, I
won't be able to easily remove it if I need to remove the platter.
What do you guys and girls think? Here is my recommendation: Do not install the three screws that are used to fix the platter to the motor spindle. Remove the sticky back and apply the pad to the platter. The platter is thus still removable and already has a snug fit on the motor spindle so no worries. But you will find that the sound improves- the coupling of the platter to the pad is important. This will allow the platter pad to work better with the damping system that already exists on the platter. Yes, you'll have to destroy the platter pad to remove it. But I think you will find that the resulting turntable is so good that it takes on challengers much more expensive; IOW it will be years or never that you will have any need to remove the pad. |
Atmasphere, you do not fasten the platter to the motor assembly on the 1200G? |
Atmasphere, you do not fasten the platter to the motor assembly on the 1200G? No- IMO/IME the platter pad is more important and you can't get to the screws if its in place. |
