Next Best Upgrade for Tidal MQA?


I’m trying to decide what my next best upgrade is going to be to improve my streaming music quality (predominantly Tidal, and Tidal MQA, when available).

Current setup:
KEF R11
Custom Deep Sea Sound 18” subs (2)
Marantz SR7012 AVR
Bluesound Node 2i
MyTek Liberty DAC
Parasound A21+

I’m wondering if I’ll get a bigger jump from inserting a Parasound JC2 BP as a pre-amp or replacing the DAC/Streamer with a MyTek Brooklyn Bridge? Or is there something else out there in the $2500-4000 range that will help make a significant jump?

Help and thoughts appreciated!

128x128bruxesq
Hey vinyl-guy and OP, sorry I'm just starting to post here that the callout function doesn't seem to be working in Edge.

To OP, I think the difficulty here is you've got a complex stack, you seem to like the sound of it and you're wanting to get "more" out of streamed, hi-res files, so targeting that specifically.  We could go down a rabbit hole if we say "let's spend a few grand," haha, and I'm sure you've been there.  This year, I've made some pretty drastic changes in my setup...the importance of some factors were not communicated to me well (or I didn't pick up on it) but was open to try new things.  I'm not really sold on MQA, and honestly, I've found that straight redbook is fine if it's handled by a superlative DAC.  I run an MScaler and a TT2, and I like being able to use the TT2 as a preamp.  I have also run the MScaler via optical into a Devialet Expert Pro.  Seems bizarre, right?  Well, I found that, between the minor upscaling and the WTA process, it would be a combination I would suggest...the handling of the transients, I've had guests comment that it seems as if they're hearing tracks they love as they were meant to be for the first time.  I have never used it with the Mytek. 

I don't have a background in this, but think of it this way: when we're listening to digital music, regardless of the resolution, there is some element of estimation that is happening to convert that signal from the digital domain to analog.  Filters, different processes, and so on.  The MScaler sneaks up on you, whether paired with a Chord DAC or other DAC.  Depending on the recording, the way in which it works with incoming signal results in estimations that generate a much more believable output.  This is not me trying to say "other DACs are trash" but I cannot imagine putting together a system without it now. While it doesn't do the MQA thing, I don't think it will matter to you if it works well in your system. 

Vinyl, I let Roon do an unfold but I don't really seek out MQA support as factor when choosing a DAC because it would mean giving up the MScaler for a final unfold, which I feel is far less valuable.  I think a false assumption made about the MScaler is that you need to be running it at 705/768 and that confers the benefit.  That's possibly the least-important element.  It's the management of transients.  

Full disclosure, I don't want to really list the whole chain but I have an optimized digital transport I built to stream with Roon, and right now I'm running a pair of Focal powered monitors (40th aniv) from the balanced outputs on the back of the TT2/MScaler stack.  Clean power all around.  Vovox XLRs but considering trying something else.  Is it a little hyper-analytical?  Yes and I love it, because it's quite euphonic as well.  Off-axis isn't great.  But I'm shocked at this little setup and what I'm hearing. And a lot of what I'm hearing confirms the benefits I seem to hear with the use of the MScaler elsewhere. 
You could improve the sound from your Node2i by fitting a Network Acoustics ENO Ag/Cu network filter.
1- Good Tube Preamp definitely. It will be significant upgrade in SQ. Modwright LS-100, Modwright LS-36.5, BAT, or Cary Audio could be in your price range. 2 - Node 2i is entry level streamer. You could upgrade it with some thing like Lumin U1 Mini which is transport streamer so you could use it with your existing DAC or maybe Lumin D2, Teac NT-505 with MQA DAC on board will be upgrade to.  3 - If used staff acceptable you could upgrade both options. It not go with new tube preamp. 
some tube units, couple ss

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisa5hcf-conrad-johnson-premier-17ls-tube -- has ht bypass they call it 'epl'

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisa5418-audio-by-van-alstine-transcendence-10-sl-tube -- lower cost option to 'try' tubes - don't let price fool you, it is excellent sounding - not sure if it has ht bypass

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisa3a50-ps-audio-bhk-signature-preamp-tube -- has ht bypass

..................................................................................................................................... 

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisa46dg-classe-audio-cp-500-bal-single-ended-preamp-gorgeous-soli... -- you'll need to check on the ht bypass

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisa5784-parasound-halo-jc-2-bp-solid-state
I would try cable upgrades.  Best I could afford. At this stage I believe the bang for the buck would be much higher than component upgrades. AC cables first. 

 Further, the biggest upgrade ever in my system was CS2 footers.  Not sure if these can be had on a trial basis. 

Best of luck, and enjoy the chase. 
@jjss49 

Appreciate the follow-up - what preamp thoughts do you have?

@vinylshadow 

I took his comment to mean, forget about MQA support in your system, try this upscaler instead.
@bruxesq

1 - stick to replacing the marantz with a proper preamp
2 - be careful when posters with a grand total of 2 posts tell you you should buy a $4000 digital appendage like an m scaler (don't get me wrong... a m scaler is a good piece, i have one, but it should not be your priority... not even close...)
@alephresearch2

How do you "disregard MQA"?

I have an unusual configuration for TIDAL.
Android with UAPP+Bit Perfect>OTG cable> USB to SPDIF converter>Straight Wire 75 ohm coaxial cable> Classe SSP-800 DAC. I can get 24/96 Bit Perfect first MQA unfold.
It sounds good but I would not mind "disregarding MQA" to get a straight up 24/96 (FLAC?) but I did not think you could get 24/96 without MQA. Did I misunderstand your statement? Thanks.

My source is Bluesound Vault streaming Tidal and Quboz. Sends signal to JC2BP and then A21. Have yet to hear a DAC/streamer that beats out Vault plus JC2BP combo in shootout. DAC/streamer costs were in 2-4K range I believe. JC2BP is fine.
I also have a Marantz AVR for HT purposes but run a Primaluna integrated for the mains and only use the Marantz via HT bypass. Getting rid of the Marantz for your mains will definitely be a successful upgrade. Also I use the internal DAC within Bluesound Node 2i and have no issues with sound quality running through the tubes.... the MQA files sound legit, dope, or whatever the kids say these days. 

 ***I literally only use the Marantz to drive the center channel for movies and NPR on Sundays for "Wait, Wait, don't tell me" Otherwise it just collects dust. 
If you own a Pc you use for music the Jcat Femto ethernet card 
is a must , a dramatic improvement for it not only has precision low noise regulators but isolates the noisy computer from the Audio streaming signal ,but the Femto clock brings a much better cleaner audio signal using the top Crystek Femto clock.
Am I understanding your post to mean that you would suggest an investment in an M-Scaler over an upgraded preamp, even with a non-Chord DAC (such as my MyTek Liberty)?

I'm not a blind fanboy of MQA, but to my ears, the format is generally a win.  I have found some MQA albums to have weird soundstaging compared to the Redbook version, but that's been rare.

If I have your comment correct, your suggestion is an interesting one for sure.
I’m sure this will not go over well, but I use Tidal and Qobuz both, Tidal was nice enough to send me tickets for a show at the Hollywood Bowl, I think they’re great, but I disregard MQA.  I’ve spent this lockdown time with the MScaler and have placed it in different arrangements with non-Chord DACs.  You may find that, via optical, the WTA thing will work its magic up to 24/192, and I believe the entire filter is still employed even if you’re not at the maximum rate.  I think it lends a certain realism to music and will work well with non-Chord DACs.
pretty minimal, but depends on model

for example the conrad johnson et5 runs just a single tube... they don't even vent the top panel...
@brux

tubed gear has a magic... thousands of us around the world would never have a high end system without at least tubes in one stage...we are not all deaf!

try it... you may well join the club!

rogue is well reputed, i have not had one... you may need to do a little searching if you must have the HT bypass, but they are out there... i know conrad johnsons have them in their linestages, which are truly excellent btw...
Never had tube gear before.

First blush, looks like the Rogue Audio RP-7 might be worth looking into?

Before buying the KEFs, I nearly pulled the trigger on Wilson Yvette’s, but decided that I didn’t want to risk that expensive gear on my (at the time) 3 and 6 year olds. However, what I loved about the Yvette’s was the soul behind the music. The R11’s are the closest I’ve come to conveying that sound at a risk-worthy price, while also having some other strengths (e.g. the Beastie Boys sounded terrible on the Yvette’s, but great on the R11). The point of that long explanation - maybe a tube preamp can bring a bit more of that soul?
@brux

ok, got it. i agree w jack d - priority 1 is get that marantz avr out of there - it is definitely the weak link

lots of good clean line stages out there, any one of them will improve the purity of sound by replacing the marantz receiver

you seem to like the clean and lean school of sound, more detail, rather than the other school which i would call the 'rich and saturated full fat cream' school... in which case i would say... the mytek dac is definitely in that school already, stick with it

most of the time folks who stream (and stream tidal) say that they want music that is richer in tone, more full and rounded (i.e. more analog in flavor), in which case I would suggest any of a number of different dacs

in your case, upgrade the preamp, remove the marantz, and see how you feel

happy to suggest various good pre’s... parasound jc2 is a good one if you like the brand, maybe even try a tubed unit see if that sound is something you like (dunno if you have had tube gear before)

good luck have fun
I would want some more warmth and body to the sound to balance out the Mytek and the Parasound, but that's just me.  
I’m generally happy with the sound, but always chasing the cleaner, clearer, better separation, more dynamic, more lifelike...

To answer the question differently, I have a perceived weakness in the Marantz, and then to a lesser extent the DAC, and to an even lesser extent the Streamer... 

I recently went from the A23+ to the A21+ and it was a big jump, so I think there may be headroom in replacing some of the other components.

Suggestions on a tube preamp? Why tube?
All of the Mytek DAC products are going to have a similar house sound so swapping one Mytek for another won't really change anything.  I would look at adding a tube preamp in place of the Marantz. 
info provided is useful, but you need to say what is it about the sound of your system do you want improved while streaming...