Thanks for all the reply. I decided to give the used Naim Unitiserve a try. For similar amount of money, I can buy a Bluesound Vault 2. The Vault 2 is a 3-year newer product than the Naim, but I hope the Naim has better quality parts and produce better sound. However, it is the SSD version with only 16 GB of internal memory. I guess this is because SSD is still new and expensive at that time (7 years ago). I will try to connect to my NAS. If that doesn’t work, it can take USB drives as input. My library is not big, only 76GB. I can buy a 1 TB drive and attached to it. In fact, I can attach USB drive for Bluesound Node 2i, but maybe because it is quite new, the used price is not much cheaper than this Naim. I think it is worthwhile to pay more just to get the CD ripper.
Anyway, hopefully everything works. Once again thanks for sharing the knowledge and experience. I will update back on how it goes. |
@gelle i think $700 is too expensive. I only need a simple player that allows me to browse songs, set up playlist, and play/stop/pause/skip .... etc. |
@gte357s If your a Roon user, just buy a Nucleus and call it a day. |
I found a Naim Unitiserve and a Bluesound Vault 2 (not 2i) in the used market in Canada. Both are “servers” with internal storage, so, I don’t need to worry about connecting to a NAS. Which one is better? The Naim is more expensive at retail, but it is also older. Since we are dealing with computer technology here, a couple years old may make a big difference. Any comment on which one is better? |
@mahler123 A Mac mini doesn’t have a screen, what do you use to set up the playlist and play music? Is there an amp that can be installed on iPhone or iPad to do that? Or you need to hook it up to a monitor? |
I’m not a computer moron (pretty close tho), but regardless I absolutely HATE troubleshooting computer crap. HATE HATE HATE. If that sounds like you, I’d just bite the bullet, ditch the frustrating NAS, and get a server/streamer like the Innuos Zen Mklll. Why? In addition to avoiding computer operational, configuration, and other optimization nightmares, the Zen is already self contained and optimized to be an audio server/streamer that minimizes noise and maximizes performance. Done. No more frustrating troubleshooting battles or headaches. Also, loading CDs into the Zen Mini couldn’t be easier, but once you start streaming something like Qobuz you’ll probably find yourself rarely playing your own music (that’s my experience anyway) as most of it’s available on Qobuz anyway — some of it maybe even available at higher res. And the Mini can be significantly upgraded later as funds allow with a better power supply and/or separate DAC. Anyway, that’s my $0.02 FWIW. Best of luck in your quest.
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I would second the recommendation to look at Roon. Roon in extremely easy to setup (the networking bits “just work”) and It has the perfect architecture that you are looking for (Nas for storage, Central DB, control from phone, play through hardware streamer, best sound quality etc).
Mainly, You can start with the pieces you already have, and grow into the final perfect setup, as you add each piece of the puzzle mentioned above.
For now, setup Roon on the laptop (or on the Nas, if it’s powerful enough), pointing to music on the Nas, and Use the laptop itself acts as the streamer. This allows you to control the music from your phone or any other computer in the house.
When you are ready, add a dedicated streamer (Bluesound Node 2i), so the laptop (Roon core) isn’t tethered to the streamer, this improves sound quality, and looks cleaner.
Eventually you can move the Roon Core to a dedicated pc (Intel Nuc) or repurpose the laptop when you upgrade to be a dedicated Roon Core, for 24/7 uptime, and potentially better cpu.
That will then be a great setup with few compromises.
I too balked at the lifetime price of Roon for many years, but eventually realized all the other options were compromises, and was spending more money on piecemeal upgrades. Even though that delay in thinking cost me the price jump to 700, I have no regrets, except the thought that if I was going to pay for lifetime anyway, there was no point in delaying.. |
@gte357s
My NAS is a Western Digital PR 2100.
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@gte357s
My set-up issues were directly related to me. I decided to switch from wifi to ethernet to make it easier for remote 'trouble shooting'.
And now that my system is set-up correctly I wouldn't change a thing. Also airplay is useful when entertaining....others can share music.
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@gte357s
I second the Bluesound Node and Vault recommendations as they sound pretty decent. There are occasional software glitches. A Mac Mini with Audirvana in my setup sounded better than Bluesound, but not a huge difference. The Bluesound software works better than Audirvana Plus, but I haven’t used the most recent updates on the latter so I may be out of touch there. The Bluesound software tends to crash as well, usually with failed updates
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Oh... and get Roon. Best purchase I have ever made in this hobby, by far. I bought Lifetime about three years ago. Until recently, the Roon Lifetime used to be $499 |
NAS is not a server. Total different things. Unless is a really powerful, with a strong processor and enough RAM.
I would second Innuos here. ZEN and higher if you can afford them. Innuos is a one-box solution: server, streamer, CD ripper, storage
As for streamer, take a look at these two brands: (1) Sonore, and (2) SOtM. They have solutions for all kind of budgets. Sonore microRendu (now discontented) can be found for less than $300 (you need a DC power supply), and SOtM sMS-300 in around that price range. They of course have higher priced / higher performance models, like opticalRendu or SOtM sMS Ultra Neo
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Actually, on a second thought, it doesn’t make a lot of sense to have a music server since I already have a NAS. If I opt for a streamer, it seems I can save $500-$600. And I am thinking, if I use a Ethernet cable, will it be ok streaming off the NAS?
@mrklas, when you have those trouble in the setup, are you connecting using Ethernet cable or wi-fi? |
Agee with others who said wireless connection is not the best. I hardwire everything with ethernet cables. Wireless is prone to dropouts, as the OP described. Also a "computer" source is inherently noisy and recommend a dedicated server or purpose built device. |
So, for sound quality, is there a significant advantage using a dedicated music server over a computer? I think in theory, the main difference is the hardware, where a dedicated music server remove all unnecessary stuff that may degrade the sound quality. The player also make a difference. When I compare Foobar vs Groove, at the beginning, I like Groove more thinking it gives a warmer sound. After more listening, I realize it also not as detailed and switch back to Foobar. Given a computer, I can try different player. But for a music streamer, I am stuck with what comes with it, and it is hard to compare which one is better. These are the trade offs, I feel. |
@knownothing Roon seems need a monthly subscriber fee, or $700 for a life time license. Since I don’t need multi room control, it seems it is more than what I need. Do they have a simple player?
i will look into JRiver. As well as the Audirvana suggested earlier. Thanks.
for now, I think I will avoid the streamer route except using a computer. I am worried about technical challenges on playing music from the NAS.
i think my two preferred options are:
1) computer + app other than Foobar
2) music server
i just found out a Mac mini is as expensive. |
1. “Buying a streamer is definitely harder than it looks. There are multiple technical issues. It makes me appreciate popping in a CD and hitting play.” +1
2. Break your relationship with foobar when you repurpose your computer. Pick up Roon as your operating system.
3. Have you considered these?
- Pro-Ject Stream Box S2 Ultra
- Cambridge Audio CXN (V2) Network Streamer (a bit over $1k)
4. Or, Keep your computer and ditch foobar for JRiver Music Center. I did this a few years ago and am enjoying excellent sound and user interface. JRiver software is much, much cheaper than a decent sounding streamer. YMMV
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BTW, on that route, how about Apple TV or something similar? Can I install apps like Audirvana on Apple TV?
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@mahler123 it seems a third option is to buy something like a Mac mini + Audirvana. It is cheaper. The Mac mini provides more function. But theoretically doesn’t sound as good. |
@lalitk i read good reviews on the Zen mini III. And I think it supports CUE. It is a server which avoids the possible glitches connecting to a NAS. The only shortcoming is no wireless. Actually, I have an Ethernet cable but it is used by my TV box. Maybe a simple solution is to buy a Ethernet hub. How come I haven’t thought about this before!
The Bluesound Vault in the other hand has wireless but doesn’t support CUE.
From reviews, it seems the Zen has a better sound? Is the interface to organize the songs easy to use? I would like to have a smart playlist based on ratings. And as a nice to have, it can gather data and auto adjust volume of each song. Foobar has this, but it seems this is the reason causing the intermittent drop out while updating the database so I remove it. |
@mrklas thanks for sharing, this is exactly what I worry about. I don’t want to go through this hassle. It seems a big part is looking up and connecting to NAS. Having a server will avoid this problem. If all the music is in the same box, then the remaining possible glitch is the player which is another software. |
I have set up a Bluesound Node 2i as my streamer and to connect to my NAS. I am not the most technical person and was close to returning it because it didn't do 'as promised' from my perspective.
However, my dealer recommended contacting the support group for Bluesound and they have been awesome and provided feedback live responses as well as via email and they have sent follow-up emails on both my issues. Dropping off the network and connecting to my NAS.
Network drops. recommended setting up
a DHCP reservation this worked for me. I did it for a few weeks then set up an ethernet connection because I could.
NAS integration. Functionality is provided by directing the Node 2i to a shared folder and then it indexes the media. After struggling with using the computer name I used the IP address based on guidance from Bluesound and this worked like a charm.
On connections I have used both toslink and digital coaxial and I couldn't hear a difference so I went with the short cable - my toslink that I bought from Blue Jean Cable. |
If you step outside the box (cue sheets), wireless connectivity (not recommended) cause wireless does not offer best SQ, you can be well on your way to enjoy digital streaming. IMO, you do not need to be a computer geek to stream audio files (no pun intended).
You want to simply your setup, look into Bluesound Vault 2i or ZENmini Mk3. They both comes with
- Onboard storage so you can store and play your music. - Vault offers WiFi connectivity (again not recommended)
- Zen Mini requires Ethernet (You can install google mesh for Zen)
- Onboard DAC...albeit not great but good enough sound quality
- Pretty good and stable app interface that is operated wirelessly via phone or tablet ( this is a very important consideration most folks overlook when they go for cheap alternatives)
- Create playlist
Both of these players will eliminate the need for laptop and the clutter. There are other more expensive alternatives that are step in SQ but the above two players offers lot of bang for the money and stress free musical experience. |
Buying a streamer is definitely harder than it looks. There are multiple technical issues. It makes me appreciate popping in a CD and hitting play. Have you tried running something besides Foobar? Are you interested in Roon? I would suggest Audirvana Plus, if it can be run with Windows
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