I can attest to WC’s point re: Simaudio/incremental changes up the ladder. Going from Sim’s 870a amp in stereo mode to the 860a v2 in stereo mode to now two 860a v2s in monaural mode, the synergy remains with zero downside.
My Long List of Amplifiers and My Personal Review of Each!
So I have been in a long journey looking to find the best amplifiers for my martin logan montis. As you know, the match between an amplifier and speakers has to be a good "marriage" and needs to be blend exquisitely. Right now, I think I might have found the best sounding amplifier for martin logan. I have gone through approximately 34-36 amplifiers in the past 12 months. Some of these are:
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
Bryston ST, SST, SST2 series
NAD M25
PARASOUND HALO
PARASOUND CLASSIC
KRELL TAS
KRELL KAV 500
KRELL CHORUS
ROTEL RMB 1095
CLASSE CT 5300
CLASSE CA 2200
CLASSE CA 5200
MCINTOSH MC 205
CARY AUDIO CINEMA 7
OUTLAW AUDIO 755
LEXICON RX7
PASS LABS XA 30.8
BUTLER AUDIO 5150
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005
With all that said, the amplifiers I mentioned above are the ones that in my opinion are worth mentioning. To make a long story short, there is NO 5 CHANNEL POWER AMP that sounds as good as a 3ch and 2ch amplifier combination. i have done both experiments and the truth is that YOU DO lose details and more channel separation,etc when you select a 5 channel power amplifier of any manufacturer.
My recollection of what each amp sounded like is as follows:
ATI SIGNATURE SERIES 6005 (great power and amazing soundstage. Very low noise floor, BUT this amplifiers NEEDS TO BE cranked up in order to fully enjoy it. If you like listening at low volume levels or somewhat moderate, you are wasting your time here. This amp won’t sound any different than many other brands out there at this volume. The bass is great, good highs although they are a bit bright for my taste)
NAD M25 (very smooth, powerful, but somewhat thin sounding as far as bass goes)
Bryston sst2(detailed, good soundstage, good power, but can be a little forward with certain speakers which could make them ear fatiguing at loud volumes)
Krell (fast sounding, nice bass attack, nice highs, but some detail does get lost with certain speakers)
rotel (good amp for the money, but too bright in my opinion)
cary audio (good sound overall, very musical, but it didn’t have enough oomph)
parasound halo (good detail, great bass, but it still holds back some background detail that i can hear in others)
lexicon (very laid back and smooth. huge power, but if you like more detail or crisper highs, this amp will disappoint you)
McIntosh mc205 (probably the worst multichannel amp given its price point. it was too thin sounding, had detail but lacked bass.
butler audio (good amplifier. very warm and smooth sweet sounding. i think for the money, this is a better amp than the parasound a51)
pass labs (very VERY musical with excellent bass control. You can listen to this for hours and hours without getting ear fatigue. however, it DOES NOT do well in home theater applications if all you have is a 2 channel set up for movies. The midrange gets somewhat "muddy" or very weak sounding that you find yourself trying to turn it up.
classe audio (best amplifier for multi channel applications. i simply COULDNT FIND a better multi channel amplifier PERIOD. IT has amazing smoothness, amazing power and good bass control although i would say krell has much better bass control)
Update: The reviews above were done in January 2015. Below is my newest update as of October 2016:
PS AUDIO BHK 300 MONOBLOCKS: Amazing amps. Tons of detail and really amazing midrange. the bass is amazing too, but the one thing i will say is that those of you with speakers efficiency of 87db and below you will not have all the "loudness" that you may want from time to time. These amps go into protection mode when using a speaker such as the Salon, but only at very loud levels. Maybe 97db and above. If you don’t listen to extreme crazy levels, these amps will please you in every way.
Plinius Odeon 7 channel amp: This is THE BEST multichannel amp i have ever owned. Far , but FAR SUPERIOR to any other multichannel amp i have owned. In my opinion it destroyed all of the multichannel amps i mentioned above and below. The Odeon is an amp that is in a different tier group and it is in a league of its own. Amazing bass, treble and it made my center channel sound more articulate than ever before. The voices where never scrambled with the action scenes. It just separated everything very nicely.
Theta Dreadnaught D: Good detailed amp. Looks very elegant, has a pleasant sound, but i found it a tad too bright for my taste. I thought it was also somewhat "thin" sounding lacking body to the music. could be that it is because it is class d?
Krell Duo 300: Good amp. Nice and detailed with enough power to handle most speakers out there. I found that it does have a very nice "3d" sound through my electrostatics. Nothing to fault here on this amp.
Mark Levinson 532H: Great 2 channel amp. Lots of detail, amazing midrange which is what Mark Levinson is known for. It sounds very holographic and will please those of you looking for more detail and a better midrange. As far as bass, it is there, but it is not going to give you the slam of a pass labs 350.5 or JC1s for example. It is great for those that appreciate classical music, instrumental, etc, but not those of you who love tons of deep bass.
It is articulate sounding too
Krell 7200: Plenty of detail and enough power for most people. i found that my rear speakers contained more information after installed this amp. One thing that i hated is that you must use xlr cables with this amp or else you lose most of its sound performance when using RCA’s.
Krell 402e: Great amp. Very powerful and will handle any speaker you wish. Power is incredible and with great detail. That said, i didn’t get all the bass that most reviewers mentioned. I thought it was "ok" in regards to bass. It was there, but it didn’t slam me to my listening chair.
Bryston 4B3: Good amp with a complete sound. I think this amp is more laid back than the SST2 version. I think those of you who found the SST2 version of this amp a little too forward with your speakers will definitely benefit from this amp’s warmth. Bryston has gone towards the "warm" side in my opinion with their new SST3 series. As always, they are built like tanks. I wouldn’t call this amp tube-like, but rather closer to what the classe audio delta 2 series sound like which is on the warm side of things.
Parasound JC1s: Good powerful amps. Amazing low end punch (far superior bass than the 402e). This amp is the amp that i consider complete from top to bottom in regards to sound. Nothing is lacking other than perhaps a nicer chassis. Parasound needs to rework their external appearance when they introduce new amps. This amp would sell much more if it had a revised external appearance because the sound is a great bang for the money. It made my 800 Nautilus scream and slam. Again, amazing low end punch.
Simaudio W7: Good detailed amp. This amp reminds me a lot of the Mark Levinson 532h. Great detail and very articulate. I think this amp will go well with bookshelves that are ported in order to compensate for what it lacks when it comes to the bass. That doesn’t mean it has no bass, but when it is no Parasound JC1 either.
Pass labs 350.5: Wow, where do i begin? maybe my first time around with the xa30.8 wasn’t as special as it was with this monster 350.5. It is just SPECTACULAR sounding with my electrostatics. The bass was THE BEST BASS i have ever heard from ANY amp period. The only amp that comes close would be the jC1s. It made me check my settings to make sure the bass was not boosted and kept making my jaw drop each time i heard it. It totally destroyed the krell 402e in every regard. The krell sounded too "flat" when compared to this amp. This amp had amazing mirange with great detail up top. In my opinion, this amp is the best bang for the money. i loved this amp so much that i ended up buying the amp that follows below.
Pass labs 250.8: What can i say here. This is THE BEST STEREO AMP i have ever heard. This amp destroys all the amps i have listed above today to include the pass labs 350.5. It is a refined 350.5 amp. It has more 3d sound which is something the 350.5 lacked. It has a level of detail that i really have never experienced before and the bass was amazing as well. I really thought it was the most complete power amplifier i have ever heard HANDS DOWN. To me, this is a benchmark of an amplifier. This is the amp that others should be judged by. NOTHING is lacking and right now it is the #1 amplifier that i have ever owned.
My current amps are Mcintosh MC601s: i decided to give these 601s a try and they don’t disappoint. They have great detail, HUGE soundstage, MASSIVE power and great midrange/highs. The bass is great, but it is no pass labs 250.8 or 350.5. As far as looks, these are the best looking amps i have ever owned. No contest there. i gotta be honest with you all, i never bought mcintosh monos before because i wasn’t really "wowed" by the mc452, but it could have been also because at that time i was using a processor as a preamp which i no longer do. Today, i own the Mcintosh C1100 2 chassis tube preamp which sounds unbelievable. All the amps i just described above have been amps that i auditioned with the C1100 as a preamp. The MC601s sound great without a doubt, but i will say that if you are looking for THE BEST sound for the money, these would not be it. However, Mcintosh remains UNMATCHED when it comes to looks and also resale value. Every other amp above depreciates much faster than Mcintosh.
That said, my future purchase (when i can find a steal of a deal) will be the Pass labs 350.8. I am tempted to make a preliminary statement which is that i feel this amp could be THE BEST stereo amp under 30k dollars. Again, i will be able to say more and confirm once i own it. I hope this update can help you all in your buying decisions!
20,890 responses
I must agree with Viber on this one. It all comes to common sense and logic, the Mephisto is so so...the Merrill is king of the hill... Another fine example of new technologies beats old technologies. No need to throw a ton of money anymore on amplifiers. You know what they say. Put some lipstick on a pig all you want, it’s still a pig in the end... |
Awesome to hear this. Most manufacturers hand us diamonds in the rough and we either polish them or not. The Merrill is a perfect example of what can be done and how far you can push. Clarity in spades , smooth, clean sounding and awesome speed with bottom end control. I've had some people who listened to it in my room and some preferred it over the momentum set up I have here. The mephisto will also go through the motions and partnering and I have a feeling it will be spectacular when I do what I have planned for it. |
I agree as well WC about the new component experience. I also agree that the Merrill 118 + Ref6 + Alexia 2 is an example of great synergy and sounds really good. The Merrill 118 definitely sounds different than when you first fired it up - again, a testament to a new component experience and finding the right ancillary components. I wasn't as much of a fan originally, but now I do really like the sound of the 118 - thanks to your efforts for sure. Dave |
Wow it’s cool to know there is one more of me with the mephisto lol. I will get it right. I am glad you are the 100th person that has agreed with my statement on YouTube about not being done when you bring a new component. It just starts and those of you who don’t want to start again, especially when you are changing into a brand new line you have not owned then don’t change. If what you are you doing is moving up the ladder but you are staying within the same brand then you are most likely "ok" unless the next step up the line is leaps and bounds ahead of your current product. For example, let’s say you own a simaudio 860v1 amp and it sounds amazing as is and with maximum synergy right now, changing to the 860v2 will most likely be a pain free experience and very little will change on the rest of your front end. However, if you went to the simaudio 888 -$120k Monos and you are coming from the 860a, you will need to spend more money on the rest of your system. It’s s whole different league and level. Also, if you have brand "A" amp and want to go to brand "B" then prepare to have to spend more money on something else. Very few components work laterally with other brands, VERY FEW. |
@whitecamaross You are so right, when you talk about how getting a new component is just the beginning, not the end!!! My Daw was brought to me 3 months ago, and I already have new amp, trying a new dac, speaker cables, IC, preamps, power cords and new tubes for my dac and phono stage. I even had to check setup of my TT and change some settings, and I am still not happy with the way my vinyl rig sounds with the DAW and Mephisto:) This is a nightmare (financially) and fun at the same time. BTW, my amp has probably less than 20 hours, but I hear some improvement every single day. My preamp is definitely not up to the task now, so I’m going to audition Pandora and CH L1 next week. I also want to get MSB Reference at the same time and try it direct, the preamp section in MSB Reference and Select is very good. I salute your efforts to make the Mephisto sing. Please, keep trying and do not give up. Your experience is unique and is very valuable for many of us, who do not have access to this broad range of components. |
WC, Do your experiments, I'm all for that. However, it is unlikely that a flagship amp like the Mephisto would be designed to sound great only with particular cables, stands, etc. No doubt many happy Mephisto owners each have different setups. Every amp has its unique character, regardless of the supporting cast. Although the supporting cast makes a difference, it doesn't make or break the star of the show, the Mephisto. You found that the Merrill has its own readily identifiable character. We agreed on what that character is, even though I had the 114 and you have the 118, and I have different interconnect cables, zip cord, the Rane EQ, and no stand. You will find that the Mephisto has its own basic character, although of course the supporting cast will change it, but only somewhat. So please describe what you like and don't like about the Mephisto at present, so we can help diagnose the problem. |
All- Mephisto, Merrill or any big amp of mine will never see a power conditioner. I know my variables with both set ups and i think i have found the reason behind the outcome from both systems. As far as Mephisto vs Merrill: Why throw an amp under the fire without being properly set up? HOW MANY times have i done that in the past and i got flamed for it and now i am being asked to do it? REALLY? "oh Jay it is on the floor, it has factory fuses, it has factory powercords, it is not under stillpoints, it needs a lamp cord, it needs weights on top, it needs aluminum foil on the heatsinks, etc" There was one variable that was not kept the same with both set ups and i never thought that it would totally do what it did with the Merrill. I also did not expect for the Alexia 2 to be the microscope that they are. RIGHT NOW, and for AS LONG AS I OWN Alexia 2, I CAN NO LONGER get away with the sh1T i was getting away with before. Cables that were good before are now just "decent" with the Mephisto and Alexia 2. They take a MRI of your system and can find the weaknesses internally and totally piss you off. For example, a cable that you probably rated 8/10 before is now a 5 or 6. You can hear the muddiness, muffling effect, lack of bass, collapsed soundstage, etc the minute you select an inferior cable. It is LITERALLY that ruthless with you. I can now talk to you AT LENGTH and in detail the differences between Audioquest Dragon and Hurricane. Before, i only knew there was a slight change in tonality and overall improvement in the soundstage between both. I knew the Dragon was better than the Hurricane, but in this system? man, the change is like taking out a complete dac and replacing it with a new one (not kidding). What is the best part of this? It is that i will be able to tell you all MORE about what each new and future component will do. I will be able to tell you EXACTLY what a cable brand will do, add, deduct, enhance, decrease, etc. I will be far more articulate with each component’s strengths and weaknesses. Before, i was only able to call out things at a high level, but now i can reach new depths that will let me communicate the effects of everything. That is the most beautiful part out of all of this and it is what is exciting me deep down. I am "graduating" my hearing to new heights and putting them in front of a clear window without any obstacles. Did you all get to hear how AWESOME the Merrill Audio Element 118s sounded on my last video or am i the only who thought so? THAT IS EXACTLY what i am talking about; The transparency here let’s you hear so much more than before. When was the last time in any of my videos that you heard the Merrill Audio sound as good as they did on my last video? NEVER. I have received messages through here from people who gave me props for showing what i have accomplished with the class d amp that many doubted. The positive comments on my YOUTUBE channel also keep pouring in regards to the Merrill Audio/ARC REF6 of my last video. That must be telling you all that i am chasing something for the better here. I demonstrated it with Merrill Audio and i will do it with the Mephisto. Mark my words - It ain’t over. |
WC, What exactly don't you like about the Mephisto/ARC vs Merrill/ARC? Your voice on the video was soft, and maybe I missed it. Just be objective and describe the differences, before you go on a wild goose chase with preamps, cables, etc. I assume the Merrill and Mephisto had the same cables, so the intrinsic differences between the amps can be described. Don't retreat into your mixing and matching thing, because then you introduce too many variables. The Mephisto probably needs more break in time, or maybe the power line quality was so bad at the time you heard the Mephisto. I have had experiences with power line variations swamping differences between amps. However, I suspected something was up when you continued to evade our requests for comparative reviews of Mephisto and Merrill. |
I listened and saw. What I hear is someone talking about something (Mephisto) when they should be burning in and tweaking. You will never know how good it is unless you tweak. Why would you ever talk about something just sitting on the floor, using bad fuses and not burned in? Yes, you are getting in an amp stand. But you could be using some $100 footers and some great wood right now and already have better sound. You have never played with fuses. You will never never ever hear the Mephisto or any product do it’s ULTIMATE thing unless you replace the stock crap sounding fuses with serious audiophile fuses.....which cost nothing compared to trying to "fix" the Mephisto with multithousand $ Gryphon cables. Sure, the Gryphons could be better than the Nordost.....but then there are a ton of other cables out there that could also be better than the Nordost......and all of them cost way more than a $20-$225 fuse.....well, you need two for the Mephisto. And after all my prodding you still have your cables on the rug......yikes....you want to hear SOUNDSTAGE?????????????? Just take some cardboard right now and prop up all your cables.....will take 30 minutes.....it will blow your mind. Just cut carboard say 3 inches by 8 inches and fold in the middle and use it as a pyramid to hold up the cables.....you can cut a little groove at the top where the cable can lie, if you like....or you can do this kind of thing: http://tweakaudio.com/EVS-2/Recommended_Components_and_Twea.html Then you can try damping the heatsinks on the beasto. Might not make much difference as the heatsinks are mostly different vibrations....this tweak works wonders on something like the Parasound that has all its heatsinks the same length. If you run your fingernail across the heatsinks and you hear a Zinnnnnngggggg.....then that sound is being injected into the signal......Try the test on the Parasound and it will be like playing a tin harp......then damp the heatsinks with most anything.....the amp will sound noticeably better. I will check back in a month and if you have not improved.....I will write a note to your mother. Your report card will not look good. Do you want to get to audio graduate school? You better shape up! kiddo......he he.... I just cannot take any of this very seriously. But I try to help people get better sound. Some take my advise....most do not. That is the way it is. I love it.....I love the way it is....but your mother will not like the note....he he..... While I was typing you said you are getting cable lifters for your whole system......your report card is improving.....keep it up. |
i just ordered the voodoo adapters. The trials and games are about to begin.
I am now on a mission and pissed off. Very pissed off. I refuse to let my instinct beat me. |
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Another decent looking adaptor. https://voodoocable.net/product/premium-silver-20-amp-to-15-amp-iec-adapter/ |
folks take it easy, who are cheering down gryphon after WC’s observation. iam sure WC/jay with his extensive experience with amps is going to find the root cause, tame the gryphon and bring back the synergy soon and WC’s observation on Merrill is spot on.their Gallium Nitride based amps do not sound anything like class D and i know 3 folks who own this amp and everyone who uses it supremely satisfied.the designer has created a magical amp. @zprr the task of designing one great universal cable for different amps and speakers is a very difficult one and almost impossible. a cable has to match and optimize according to the load (speaker) and source (amp) impedances. in a way i like the strategy adopted by transparent cables ,where they build the reference and higher series cables.they ask you what specific components you are using and design for specific amp and speaker models. same like what MIT cable does for spectral amps.i think it is the best approach. at the higher end audio segment if we are paying big bucks for cables ,customizing the cables is something all manufacturers should follow |
WC Purist Audio sells that type of adapter: http://www.puristaudiodesign.com/Data/products/misc/adp.html# |
Well, some people just like to read, others like videos. Most of my free time I spend multitasking, watching tv with the family and reading on my ipad. To watch videos I would have to use EarPods or something similar which I’m not too fond of. This thread is just entertainment for me and I do watch an occasional video as I have several hobbies but only then as a last resort. You want people to watch your videos because it eventually could be a source of revenue (Advertisers) to help offset all your hard work. I don’t blame you, I would want that too and I fully understand. |
Frustrating indeed... That said, I think today I found the difference maker and why I’ve been struggling. On a side note: does anyone here know where I can get an adapter that makes a 20a powercord fit into a 15a power amp? Meaning the receptacle on the back of the amp is 15a and I need a 20a power cord to fit in there. I know Amazon has these but I am looking for something of decent quality. Thoughts ? |
I suppose it does seem like it's getting to you WC - e.g. one of your most recent posts, where you go off about folks not watching the video. Wonder how that impacts any newcomers to the thread? And for folks who prefer forums over videos - it's probably not great for them either. Anyway, I'm glad I read your thread AND watch your videos :-) I do understand, it's a lot of money for that Mephisto, so it's probably a bit frustrating at the moment. Dave |
It's the same cables you had. The vanta line isn't shipping yet. Mephisto Is a damn race car. I'm gonna put that son of a gun to fire at full class a bias for 3 days straight without shutting it off and see if it does the vodoo the pass labs xs300 did. I need to breathe, relax, not let it get to me and keep doing my thing with it. |
I have heard from my local dealer that Nordost and Gryphon do not play well together. So much so that they brought on another cabling manufacturer into their lineup that they previously didn’t carry before adding Gryphon. This was not your experience with the Colliseum... perhaps this is the case with the Mephisto as you may have alluded to in the video. Your point of needing to find the right cabling and components to a new amp obviously well taken. |
Wilson tends to do this with audio Research, Momentum, and focal does it with boulder amps. All manufacturers always work with another brand to fine tune things. WE THE END USERS are the guinea pigs that are left trying different combos and burning cash. That is part of the hobby though. Ain't a damn thing we can do about it. |
The more parts in it and complex an amplifier is , the more chances it will not give you the best sota resolving power and transparency of a well made more simple design (with a shorter signal path ). Add to that the fact that having lots of capacitors or resistors increases the chance one may get defective or out of balance with the other ones...We often see that with R2R ( ladder resistors) dacs these days... It could be the case here with the Mephisto. Sometimes, engineers just try to do too much and forget about the vertues of simplicity... |
@thieliste Thanks for posting the link to the Gryphon Mephisto paired with CH Precision linestage. Very precise and detailed presentation. What I found most interesting though was the 4 (2 stacked in each corner of the front wall) traps. What I believe those to be are AVAA C20 Active Bass Traps. https://www.psiaudio.swiss/avaa-c20-active-bass-trap/ Very interesting technology for controlling and absorbing room modes (excessive bass) between 15 and 150hz. I am currently researching these units for my listening room.....Anybody know anything about these units? |
People honestly either don’t listen or don’t watch the videos. I’m sick of repeating myself. I said it AND SHOWED IT ON THE DAMN VIDEO: DO YOU SEE A STAND UNDER THE MEPHISTO? did I not address that I ordered one already ? Did I say anywhere I swapped out fuses on anything ? I’ll say it differently and maybe with a simpler sentence: MEPHISTO IS NOT OKAY with something in my system and if you watched the video last night, you heard me say THIS. Yes it does sound good but MY INSTINCT tells me there is something NOT RIGHT or OFF. It feels as if it plays good and then it misses certain instruments or bells and whistles that the Merrill and ARC combo is hitting home runs on. It is as if you are driving a Porsche 911 at 150 mph and it does not ride better or more "composed" than a Camaro SS does at the same speed. No camaro Ss should ride better than a Porsche 911 at high speeds. Would you accept that fact if you had both cars in your garage ? No right ? You would be trying to figure out if you have low tire air pressure, the right fuel, are the motor mounts shot ? Is something loose ? Etc etc. That's where I am at. |
I really liked the Merrill, Wilson, ARC sound. Not so much the Gryphon and Fyne. I’m sorry to hear that the Mephisto is not living up to expectations to this point WC. You probably had built it up too much at the outset (“the end,” “probably will never be able to improve on this,” “maybe last amp I’ll ever buy”), none of those statements really fit your deal of churning thru gear (no negative connotation intended by that statement) so in some ways maybe you were bound to be underwhelmed. Anyway, this isn’t the first time that initially things are underwhelming and you will get it figured out. Keep it in perspective and take a longer term view and let the presentation come to you. Eventually you will hit on the right combination . what is refreshing is that you continue to tell it like it is. No sugar, no fluff. Right now the mephisto isn’t carrying its weight and you are telling us that. But it isn’t broken in and maybe you still need to find the complementary parts. Keep up the great work. What a ride this is to follow along on |
Horns, pure class A amplification, digital, on a old Rod Stewart limited recording. What do you think? https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fVR_CbvhOEw |
Here one other example of Gryphon Mephisto paired with CH Precision linestage : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7x39NjGVZk0&t=14s |
So, is the Mephisto fully burned in.....say 3-400 hours? Have you put audiophile fuses in it? Do you have it on its most sonically pure stand and feet? Have you found the perfect power cords for it? If you have not done this homework.....then you will not get a passing grade on your test....Young Man......he he. Why would you buy a thoroughbred amp and run it on a muddy track? Why do you have the AR sitting on its $4 feet. Those are some of the muddiest feet in existence. The amp I made last year had them as the basic footer.....I did not even screw them on....because I told everyone to get rid of them. For $4....they are nice. But they are not serious. And you really want a serious platform beneath your super feet on the AR.....not sitting on an amp.....that is not serious, at all. You can also try damped weight on top of the preamp as well. The AR needs an audiophile fuse too! Lot's for you to do if you really want to find out what how good your components REALLY ARE. But maybe you just want to play and not find out what is really possible with anything. None the less, the sound of your system tonight is very good.....however, not that other system.....yikes...terrible. You can take much cheaper gear and achieve the same basic quality of sound if you tweak the cheaper system like crazy. This I know. I have been doing this exact thing for over 40 years. But if you tweaked the "Super Gear" that you have......you would never leave the chair.....your hair would stand on end.....you would cry and laugh and giggle like a little girl. You would praise life for such an experience. Maybe you really do not want to feel that good. You deserve it.....we all do. |
don’t start the BS with conclusions about the Merrill besting mephisto etc. If you come with that, I’ll say it here: you’re full of S*t. You are talking out of your a$$. Isn’t that pretty much what you are implying with this statement ? Tonight I gotta be honest without bs:If not, then , Your statements are somewhat misleading. Or, are you saying that because the Mephisto cost So much more $$$, that, in your world, (the more it costs the better it sounds ),you just cannot let that happen ? |
Tonight I gotta be honest without bs: The REF6SE with 110hours now and the Merrill audio 118s and Wilson Alexia 2 are devastating me. They are completely making me want to go and sell every damn amp I own including mephisto. They are simply superb. Don't get me wrong, I know exactly what I am doing to help that combo out which I haven't shared just yet BUT i can't believe this. I'm really floored by it. Such a different presentation than the mephisto with arc6se. I have landed on FULL SYSTEM synergy with the Alexia 2. Now, the question will be IF the mephisto is still waiting on the Alexia 2 to fully open up so it can do its thing OR if it simply needs it'd sibling - Gryphon Pandora - in order to sing as it should or does it need a different linestage than the 3 I own here ? Again, system matching at this level is KEY. One can't jump to conclusions right away so don't start the BS with conclusions about the Merrill besting mephisto etc. If you come with that, I'll say it here: you're full of S*t. You are talking out of your a$$. |
I want to hopefully compare both and see which one I keep. Mephisto won't go on the artesania because I'm not about to take off the feet and embark on any sort of disassemble on an amp this expensive. I'll try the momentum s250 on both stands and see what happens. Video is getting uploaded (finally). You'll love Gryphon essence stereo and Fyne audio speakers. Those of you who are subscribed to the channel should get a a notification in about 45 minutes from now. |
trudat, You are correct that less bass gives a psychoacoustic impression of more detail. Zip cord does reveal less bass than thicker cables. But when I played music with no significant bass, the thicker cables were grossly murky compared to zip. Mapleshade makes thin speaker cables because they heard what I did with thick cables. Actually, I enjoy TIGHT bass, which is less full and sounds less brawny powerful than lower quality bass. carey1110, What were the characteristics of zip cord that you heard and didn't like? |
@goodsource. Alexia 2. Odin 1 won’t turn a Sasha Daw into an Alexia 2 and neither will mephisto. NOW is when I can say FACTUALLY, the Alexia 2 kills DAW. How many pairs of Alexia 2s have you seen listed online vs how many pairs of DAW ? and the Daw is much newer fyi...meaning it should be the one to be listed the least since it came out not long ago. The Alexia 2 came out like 18 months prior to the DAW. |
Ain't no deals on Gryphon. It's s small network of dealers that carry the line and they all inform the distributor when there is someone calling around looking for a deal. The distributor KNOWS and then tells dealers that there is someone looking to steal either an amp or preamp or whatever and then the moment a dealer calls to order the item from the distributor, what do you the distributor asks ? Is this for such and such guy who's been calling around all my dealers for a deal ? Who is this item for ? Etc etc. That's one way Gryphon remains tightly controlled. I said it before and I'll say it again, once that Colosseum sells, (the one listed) the market will dry and that will be it for quite sometime. |
@carey1110 thanks for responding. I understand why WC is doing it and iam not questioning that at all. @whitecamaross WC let me simplify this and ask you a simple question say you have X amount of dollars ,electronics that could drive both daw and alexia 2 and a room that could support both speakers. for x amount if you can buy either a (sasha daw and odin 1) OR ( alexia 2 and valhalla 2 or tyr 2). WC/jay which option would you choose? |