A brief blurb in Stereophile online (by Herb Reichert reporting from AXPONA 2019) gave accolades to Magnepan's new LRS. The local authorized dealer is not carrying it for unclear reasons (at least, the decision to not offer that model wasn't explained to me when I asked directly about it). Have any Forum readers had an opportunity to audition these and, if so, what's your opinion? Thanks,Keith
jjss49: No, the review in ASR didn't alter my opinion. As I wrote, the technical analysis was beyond comprehension so I read the OP's conclusion and scanned the remaining 28 pages of posts for enlightenment...that insight never arrived. The purpose of my post here was to get Audiogon readers' perspectives on the ASR dissenting review. The one point I did take away from the entire thread was that putting the LRS back on the floor might help improve bass.
Eric: I've been moving them around a bit every week. I'm pretty satisfied with the imaging, but the bass is anemic (at best). Fortunately for me, I mostly listen to music that doesn't feature a prominent bass line but I've been routinely reading the Audiogon classified ads for used sub-woofers for sale locally. snapsc: Until someone posted here, I'd not heard of ASR but that forum does seem to rely very heavily on measurements vs. listening. thanks for the replies!Keith
I’d have to say that having spent a few hours with the 1.7is at a dealer’s store... and 20 minutes with the .7s at the Florida Audio Show... there are some things they do that are really really good. In both cases, the bass down to maybe 50/60 hz was good... mid bass and midrange almost a hologram.
I didn’t particularly care for the very small listening window... but that is just my preference.
It is unfortunate that ASR doesn’t take the approach of concluding with something like...”our measurements don’t correspond with what people are hearing so as a next step we will try to figure out what we are missing... what measurements we might be missing”.
Keith, planars are notorious for being difficult to measure (that's why Magnepan doesn't send Stereophile products to review). Those who measure them the same way they do drivers-in-a-box loudspeakers, and then listen to confirm their measurements, are bound to find fault.
The best things an LRS owner can do to maximize their sound is: 1- get them 5' in front of the wall behind them if possible, 3' minimum. 2- feed them as much power as is reasonably possible (200w/ch is good). 3- augment them with a sub or four. The Rythmik and GR Research subs are finding favour with Maggie owners: the OB/Dipole if you're a fanatic, the F12, F12G, or F15 if you're not.
I tried to read and understand the Audio Science Review analysis and the technical details of the original posting and most of the subsequent 28 pages were entirely opaque to me, but I've no background in engineering or acoustics. Allowing for that, the consensus there was that the LRS is seriously flawed. That conclusion (based apparently on the measurements) contradicts all other reviews I've read. Anyway, I do agree that the LRS are seriously bass deficient, at least as far as I've been able to determine in my listening room. I think this problem has been aggravated by placing them on off-the-floor stands (as some of the comments on that forum suggest will be the case) and maybe tomorrow I'll remove the stands and re-install the manufacturer supplied ones and re-assess.
As for "virtually unlistenable", I don't agree with that conclusion. Allowing for the bass issue (without sub-woofers), I'm generally content with the LRS. I'm interested in reading Audiogon comments from technically sophisticated reviewers on that Audio Science thread.
I've had the LRS for a few months now. As is well known, these speakers require very careful positioning and so obtaining the best possible sound they can provide may prove to be impossible in some rooms (regardless of "treatments"). That statement of the obvious aside, my extended listening impressions are: 1) Stereo imaging is exceptionally good, 2) Midrange and treble reproduction are first rate (based on hearing recordings I'm quite familiar with on other equipment in other settings and in "real life", too), 3) Bass response (in my room, sans any sort of "treatments") is limited. I'm sure that without the constraints imposed by the dimensions of my own space, bass would be better...because other listeners say so, 4) Addition of dedicated stands will likely be a big help and they most certainly will be more stable/secure than those the factory provided. Magnepan's stand for the LRS leave the speakers very precariously balanced, at least on an industrial carpeted floor. I've ordered Magna Risers (for several reasons not germane to this topic) and I'm awaiting delivery. 5) With my system in my room, I'm very pleased with the LRS though sub-woofers would present a better musical picture. However, a reasonable pair would more than double the price of the original speaker. Still, the combination is economically competitive with other contenders.
I made a decision to suspend any spending this year in lieu of my daughter graduating from a few of her therapies to save and buy a place when housing prices correct. I keep eyeballing those Cantons for $1200 but now I think I may get a set of LRS.
In my mind I have a sound I’m trying to hit and it occurred to me that this might be that sound. In the 80’s we used to frequent Circuit City and in one of their speaker rooms they had, I think ML’s playing Billy Idol’s Sweet Sixteen. The vividness and immediacy and clarity as well as the BASS. I think they were ML’s as I seem to recall them having a boxed woofer at their base. They used to put them behind plastic plants and put big floor standers in your line of sight to fool you.
At $650 I may splurge. I have a generic sub and may then spring for 1 or 2 more later in the year (looking at Rythmik F12, SVS SB1000 or maybe REL in the $500-600 range).
Here is an update for those of you who have placed LRS orders and are awaiting delivery. Eric of Magnepan told me today, the company has (unsurprisingly) been inundated with orders. Mine - placed on April 18 - will probably ship in a couple of weeks.
In short, it seems that there's about 6-8 weeks from mid-April orders to shipping. I suppose that's likely to decrease, now that the company has an insight into demand and can manufacture accordingly. Keith
I ordered a pair on a whim. I like the sound of Maggies when I've heard them. I am looking forward to hearing them in my space. McIntosh MC452 driving them.
marcs: I can't answer the amplifier question but I'm wondering if you were given an estimated delivery date (range) by Magnepan when you placed the order?
Waiting on my LRS's to arrive. I have 2 amps available, A Sunfire Cinema Grand and an Adcom gfa 555ms. I guess I'll try both but any opinions on which will be better for moderate volumes in a medium size room?
I think folks getting the LRS should consider Sound Anchor stands to lift them off the ground a few inches. I had them with my MMGi model and they made a positive difference by adding some rigidity to the frame as well as reducing floor reflections. I thought the OEM stands were fairly flimsy. The same stands might fit the LRS if they maintained the same dimensions as MMGi. I personally could not warm up to the MMGi sound and sold them after only two months. The LRS seems more promising.
I find Magnepan's very attractive, especially with black grill cloth and cherry end caps. I consider my Tympani T-IVa's beautiful. As for WAF, who cares? Many are themselves loud speakers, and not so good looking either.
Never experienced any Magnepan speakers in my time. For the price of the LRS I think I may try them. My integrated amp is a Primare i30 which is 100w in to 8 ohm and 180w into 4 ohm with a peak current of 40A. Would the Primare i30 do justice to the LRS?
I placed my order directly with Eric at Magnepan after getting the "brush off" and an attempted "up sell" from the nearby authorized dealer.
While I feel a general obligation to patronize locally owned businesses, I'll only do so if they offer better-than-good service, considerate and informed sales staff and somewhat reasonable pricing (acknowledging that they have lease fees, employee obligations and so on to account for). Failing those standards, and as gammonit_2000 wrote, "Why bother?"
I believe Magnepan has a "trade-up" policy on the MMG/LRS. You can trade-in either within a year of purchase towards a higher-priced model, receiving full credit. As you presumably would purchase the up-market model from a Magnepan dealer, I don't know how that is arranged.
So, I should waste my time driving to their store then if I can't hear the gear there? To talk to somebody who hasn't a clue and doesn't want to? Their marketing by selling direct is a strange one but that's OK with me I will pay 1/2 price and avoid traffic and stuffy stores with snobby ignoramuses. Meanwhile Eric at Magnepan is super nice, super knowledgeable, and super helpful. No brainer.
pryso I understand and I agree with you. I was in sales for many years. This and other reasons as mentioned is probably why brick and mortar is in trouble. Having said that, try harder! The LRS situation is a bit odd and I really don't know how the MMG was sold but with this as a replacement it seems some dealers won't carry it and others will?
I have some older Rotel separates (RB 1080 Amp @ 200watts/ch and RC 1082 pre) in a second system. Would this drive the LRS speakers adequately? Thinking about getting new speakers for this system.
gammonit, it was not my intent to pick on any dealer. Merely to point out there could be opportunities for selling other components as Richard suggested.
pryso and Richard, not to try to pick on Pearl Audio who seem like nice enough folks and who have been very good with me on the phone, I think these are two different marketing strategies with sell direct vs. the dealers. I literally offered to bring in my new LRS to Pearl and let them listen to them vs. the .7 and maybe 1.7i and they turned me down. That's OK, I didn't want to waste 4 hours if that's their attitude on that one. Personally I think Magnepan should be selling systems directly to people and cut out the middle man completely on these LRS. Give Bryston and REL a call and hook it up. DH Labs call Greg for cables and wires. Too much fluff with these dealers already whining they can't make any money but are basically lazy. OK I guess I did pick on them so be it.
I think I will dive in the water and order a pair of the LRS.
I have never heard a speaker other than conventional box speakers with piston drivers.
Would it be a fair comparison to say the LRS is to one of the larger Magnepan speakers what a given brand's conventional driver bookshelf speaker is to their larger floor standing models?
Richard, there are posts by some close to Magnepan saying the new LRS was designed to work with higher grade electronics, unlike the MMG which apparently could reach its potential with most off-the-shelf receivers. So there should be opportunities for dealers to do just as you suggest.
In fact it might be appropriate for Magnepan to notify local dealers whenever a pair of LRS are sold directly just for that reason. But that might suggest too much of "big brother", even if similar things happen more often than we know about these days.
I wouldn't be too hard on your dealers. They have a tough life these days. First, NO ONE is buying huge high-end systems like they used to and you all know that. SO, the dealer is stuck with the same monthly expenses, and if they do not own the building, rents are sky high even though brick and mortar stores are on the decline. Not sure why, but it is true. Next, manufacturers have had to cut back as well. People today listen to music on their PHONE or in their car using their PHONE.
High-end was ALWAYS 10%-15% of the marketplace. That marketplace has shrunk in real numbers even as the population increases.
I applaud Magnepan and others plowing new territory--Tesla(?)--by avoiding expensive selling options and giving people a chance to enter the world of high-end speakers, Magnepan is incenting them to upgrade and visit their dealers. Now, not being in the company, I have no idea if their marketing area is doing a good job working with dealers on this strategy. If I were still in business, I would visit the owner of the new speakers and set them up for the customer even though I did not sell them directly. This person is a potential customer for everything else I sell.
Maggies are so much more accurate than any box speaker that the owner will probably need better hardware or cables or something as he or she starts to appreciate what the speakers reveal. Dealers who are not into this strategy are, in my opinion, not thinking very well, but then again, that is their choice. Personally, I would pursue EVERY Maggie sale in my selling area with a note, call, etc., but that's just me!
bdp24: That's who I contacted and I got the same report. I was offered the "upgrade" to the 0.7 as an alternative. So, I ordered them directly from Magnepan. I hope they will arrive within the next 3 weeks.
Today I called the Magnepan dealer nearest to me (Pearl Audio Video in Portland Oregon) to ask if they are stocking, demoing, and selling the LRS. Nope! Heck, they sell interconnects that cost more than the LRS.
While I haven't heard the .7, at 2x the price and the 1.7i at 3x the price of the LRS is a big difference. I did try to get the local Magnepan dealer to get the LRS but they weren't even interested in listening to my pair vs. their 1.7i. Probably afraid to lol. In fact they didn't even have a clue Magnepan had come out with the LRS. Not exactly a vote of confidence.
Frankly I don't see myself spending 6k to upgrade to the 3.7i but you never know. How much better is the "true ribbon"?
There are a lot of useless dealers who carry usually their lower line speakers thinking no one will spring for more money and buy better one. This is why manufactures need to work out a consignment program. Perhaps delay bill them for 6 months. If the dealer hasn't sold them in 6 months then invoice the dealer. The reason why most dealers are struggling is they do not spend a dime to market themselves. Since when does sitting around and waiting for the phone to work make sense. What about asking the manufacturers to share the cost of direct mail, radio and TV advertisements. Better than a stake in their eye.
I've had a pair for a few days now. I did a review on Steve's channel and also OCD guy. Tube preamp CJPV10B Mullard NOS, Muse 150 monoblocks, Rega P3/bias 2, HK CDR20, DH Labs air matrix, DH Labs Q10, two (2) REL T5i subs set at 60 hz.
I'd recommend you buy before delivery is 8-10 weeks.
"Can I save money or time buying direct from Magnepan?"No, we are not in competition with our dealers. The terms and price, including tax, are the same whether you buy direct from Magnepan or from your nearest dealer. It is a matter of which is the most convenient for you? There is a potential advantage to you, the customer, if you are able to audition the LRS at your nearest dealer. In the event that the LRS is not the right speaker for you, you would have no further obligation.
The 60-day, home-trial program is only available in the USA. The LRS is only sold direct from Magnepan to USA and Canadian customers.”
As I understand it, some dealers are selling the LRS. But not all -- they don't make much money off them, and neither does Magnepan. As kingbarbuda said, they're intended as an "appetizer" -- Magnepan sells them near cost, knowing that some of the people who buy them will move up to bigger Maggies.
Glad that the best speaker maker ever now has a more affordable item. Possibly music lovers everywhere will finally realize what I found out that day in 1974 when I turned on the Tympani I-A set that just arrived at my shop and it blew all of us out of the room; truly a revelation, and those were not anywhere near as good as today's Magnepan items.
Jim was a very smart guy; his son is continuing the tradition of making the best possible speakers right here in Minnesota. By the way, if you hook them up to Audio Research gear, you will hear what you have been missing all these years.
Just remember, LOCATION, LOCATION, LOCATION. They take time to set up properly, but once you get it right, you will know immediately--it is that amazing.
Cheers,
Richard
PS Funny how so many high-end manufacturers are now making TALL speakers. Wonder where they got THAT idea???
Do y'all think the Prima Luna Prologue integrated will drive these well?
If it's the 35 watt per channel model, probably not. Well, it wouldn't be my first choice. The 70 watt model, however, might be an interesting match...
Does Timbre carry them in Houston?
Factory direct only. From the page linked to above:
"The 60-day, home-trial program is only available in the USA. The LRS is only sold direct from Magnepan to USA and Canadian customers".
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