@audioman58 Thanks for the update. I received my Level 2 a couple of weeks earlier than you. I appear to be on a similar audio journey -- just different stops. My MicroZOTL should go in for upgrade in the next two weeks.
Linear Tube Audio - Micro ZOTL - version -3 Update on upgrades
Having just received the Micro-Z OTL version 2 in Feb and seeing a much better upgrade was available . I had to do it to help complete my quest to get everything in my audio system as good as possible, and for 6 months the 30% off the upgrade stands . Where the older model had 4 circuit boards ,now just one very high quality Ceramic board ,with a small sister board , Gold over thick Copper traces. To start with an additional 80k uf in filter capacitance over 200k in total ,more then most amplifiers,pretty much Everything is name brand parts . I have the Top of the line Lundahl input transformers from Sweden .
having many years in Audio and having had many audio pieces modded , this preamp is Loaded with top of the line in parts quality using worlds best Belleson low noise regulators , Nichicon GOLD capacitors ,from Japan ,AMTRAN BEST - Golden SQ also Japan .EPCOS from Germany.Clarity-CMR -U.k all top notch capacitors
With balanced inputs , and the David Berning design Micro -Z-OTL output stage and Mark and engineering team . The interior is vastly upgraded, now a. Nice large toggle switch to choose between the 6 v - 6sn7 tubes and 12v. 12sn7 , the whole tube socket area is a nice thick platform no flexing and having just 1 Big main board not only more robust but much lower noise floor is Very apparent. Sonically the New version -3 is a major step up. To start I used just the stock tubes in the Version 3 to test vs an audio friends with the version 2 with much better Rays select 6sn7 tubes and same Telefunken 12au7 tubes that I bought . TheNew Version is better with ease ! Image depth is better and a deeper larger soundstage , Bass-MidBass has even better dynamics and slam, even quieter blacker back grounds, With excellent control ,and is just more tuneful, fast, and articulate. When I decided Now it’s time to. Put in my top Rays select 6sn7 tubes And 12AU7 Telefunken Red tip medical grade tubes . It was at minimum another 5 % Better still !! This was a substantial upgrade even with stock tubes .I go to several audio gatherings, the ones who have heard this all have $50k+ audio systems and stated you would have to spend well over $12k to just to come close to this preamplifier performance music just is seamless and coherent which I totally agree !! It has the best of what tubes do best in a Big open soundstage stage , with lots of Air and separation around the instruments ,with excellent Solid state like imaging Big dynamics and ultra fast Tight Bass, much more so now in the version 3 . Listening ,to classic Beatles to Pink Floyd interactions in the micro details that before we’re barely audible now come out of the shadows and are clear and defined , this alone to me is special .I have not found a preamp even close in the $10k+ range that can better this SS or vacuum Tubes, Great Job 👏 To all at LTA Audio 👍🎶👍.
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@audioman58, thanks for posting about your experience with the upgrade. My level 2 will be upgraded next week. I ordered the upgrade over a month ago and I’ve been waiting for them to let me know when they’re ready for it. Jacob asked me to send it in today. I’m also getting the Ray Reserve 6SN7. I’ve had my level 2 for about a year. It’s great that LTA is offering the upgrade to current customers. Does the upgrade sound good right out of the box or did it require some additional burn-in beyond what LTA does? |
@audioman58 - Thank you for the extensive write up! Out of curiosity, what do you think are the top 1-2 improvements with the level 3 upgrade in your system? Let’s say with the new Rays tubes and your Telefunken tube? Image depth? Sound stage? Base? Blacker background? Micro-details? I’m curious if you find yourself enjoying one or two of the above improvements the most? Based on your review, it sounds like I’ll want to get the upgrade myself. |
The rays tubes bring earth but nice depth ,Telefunken accuracy big soundstage but not brightt. The preamplifier on its own a bunch of things stick out the SE- Amtrans Blue capacitors are a special hand wound capacitor The Gold-SQ- special quality. now a array of Nichicon Gold Tune caps ,as well as German a premium Zgerman brand that is new , Worlds best Belleson Low noise regulators, the Bog Ceramic board only 1 main board vs 3 before And Zhuge upgrade in capacitance over 200,000 uf ,which is more then most amplifiers much more lock on precision and bigger deeper soundstage . This reminds me of the great Gryphon Diablo 300 integrated amp, which I am trying to buy from my brother , the LTA preamp is actually a bit better stillwhich is saying a lot. , but the synergy and Amplifier -integrated is great , on my budget trying to find a amplifier to complement the LTA-3 has been a losing battle for me vs the Gryphon and .on a limited budget .i just my buy it from my brother on a payment plan . |
@audioman58 I have not heard the Gryphon, but I am more than satisfied with the Pass Labs XA-25. I have difficult speakers to drive with a 0.5 Ohm draw in a few passages at volume. The XA-25 works great. I have powered subwoofers with an active SPL Crossover so the XA-25 does not have to do much work below 80 Hz. One of the LTA amplifiers might work as well. |
Sounds promising. I see the LTA site now has pictures of the new boards. Looks like they did away with the ceramic one. Overall, the parts look fairly similar to level 2, albeit now on 2 boards, so I am somewhat surprised the jump up in sonics is so substantial. Has anyone else received the upgrade that can comment on the sound? @audioman58 not sure if you had the Lundahl transformers before the upgrade. My Level 2 has them so I am wondering if I have to also purchase that option at $300 or can they reuse the older input board on the back that has the transformers? Do they replace that board as well for Level 3? |
@sfpeloton I will be sending my Level 2 back for an upgrade next week. Jacob said I already had the Lundahl transformers so that is not in my billing. It was an upgrade LTA did along the way. |
Perfect. Thanks for the information @thriftyaudio Please let us know your thoughts on the upgrade when it is done. |
Thank you @audioman58 for the write up. I’ve also been in queue to send my Level 2 in for a number of weeks and just sent it out yesterday. Really looking forward to hearing the improvements you talk about. |
Two days ago you gave a rave impression of the level 3 upgrade and now you want to sell it? Hmm …. that gives me the impression that you’re hyping it just sell it. Not a good look imo. I hope my impression of your post is wrong and that the upgrade is really all that you say it is. I ordered the upgrade well before you started this thread so your impressions didn’t factor into my decision to upgrade. I’ll find out in a few weeks how good the upgrade is for myself. |
@smatsui If Im not mistaken its already for sale on Audiomart. https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/650209683-linear-tube-audio-micro-z-otl-preamplifier-as-new/ |
My brother is keeping the Gryphon open I have 2+ audio systems. the LTA will be going with a Rebuilt older Goldman amplifier that is exceptional rebuilt 3 years ago ,got a sweet deal , I heard the amp already from our local audio club . I listened to it last night the $$ was the only sticking point ,paid under $10 k new $30k+ 2012, 220 v transformer replaced to 120v also. the LTA preamp sounds Great with it , maybe even better then the gryphon Diablo .the deal was not confirmed until this morning , for a change I get the bargain !! I have not compared then side by side . I still may buy the Gryphon this summer though from him . $$ is always the deciding factor never enough $$ |
Smatsui I never had anything even remotely negative regarding the LTA preamp. my goal was to match the Gryphon Diablo 300 synergy amp,preamp being That good beating most Any separates even low to mid $20k mark that was my only reservation. Having owned a Audio store for a decade and 40+ years in Audio I am Very Picky , there are no absolutes in Audio. a true Audiophile Never stops trying for perfection always a tweak here or there . grain of Salt or 🌶️ Pepper.I just tell it like it is and my goals ,most people don’t match for synergy from the router on down ,I do Everything ,and is being upgraded ,this year As we speak !! for my retirement Audioman58: tell you my age . |
I understand where AudioMan58 is coming from comparing these components. Why? Because I have the LTA preamp on one system and a Gryphon Diablo 120 paired with another speaker. They are both outstanding performers. Unfortunately, both of these systems are competing in my living room for final real estate. I’ll most likely upgrade my LTA preamp at some point in the future. I may also upgrade to the Gryphon 300 and simplify things. I just think this is a case of two outstanding components with owners who are questing for the optimal experience. Before anyone reminds me, I realize that’s a fool errands. But here we are on this forum obsessing about these things! |
To be honest this so called hobby cab be stressful at times. my brother being an attorney for a Big defense contractor is my little brother has audio systems in electrons just sitting on the shelf in his Audio closet to swap out gear , he never lends it out , and 2 $100-150 k systems he doesnot appreciate. When I had a Audio store it was nice to get at 50-60% off , now synergy for the best price I can afford . my speakers will be the most $$ expensive . Will see by fall Whst I come up with . p,.s getting older Sucks , the 100 lb amps I used to be able to lift ,no more or Hernia and slipped disc- LOL.
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Yes I left several entries , the level 3 with stock tubes is noticably better the version 2 using the best premium tubes in our audio club a guy has a version 2 a solid 10% better especially in depth of soundstage imaging and bass grip . it was like a new preamp the precision. Alone is worth it for me the new AMTRANS GOLD EDITION are hand wound AND SONICS BECOME THAT MUCH MORE 3D IN PERSPECTIVE. |
@audioman58 I did see your comments and thank you for taking the time to share your positive impressions of the Level 3 upgrade. I am just wondering if anyone else that was in the queue ( @smatsui @cbrez @thriftyaudio ) has heard the Level 3 yet? |
The upgraded level 3 preamp arrived yesterday just in time for my wife’s Mother’s Day present. |
I’ve had my level 3 upgrade for the past 9 days and I continue to be impressed with the sound quality improvement. The improvement in speed and detail while remaining musical isn’t subtle. Before the upgrade, I couldn’t use the LTA preamp with my First Watt F7 because the sound was slow and somewhat soft. By contrast, it seemed fine with my Pass Labs XA-25. After the level 3 upgrade, the speed and detail improvements with the F7 are startling. I’m also very much into headphones (see my headphone system in my profile). I think this preamp was very good with ZMF dynamic headphones (300 ohm impedance) before the upgrade. After the upgrade, driving the ZMF Verite Open headphones, it’s even better. I have a lot of high end headphones but the ZMF VO with the LTA level 3 preamp/headphone amp is about as good as it gets imo. The Verite Open can be had on the used market for $1500-1700 which is still expensive but a bargain in comparison to some $4K-8K headphones. This preamp is excellent with efficient headphones but don’t expect it to drive a power hungry Susvara or DCA Expanse well. |
Thanks for the feedback @smatsui . Seems like both you and audioman58 think it is a worthwhile upgrade. Just curious if you think it also sounded better with the XA25 or only the F7. Looking forward to any additional feedback from cbrez and thriftyaudio, Happy listening. |
Got my Level 3 upgrade back last week. It did need a bit of break in within my system. There is a bit greater extension or perhaps clarity that stands out on both the high and low end. Cymbals shimmer a bit more than ever and the notes of a standing bass are more taut. The midrange is still outstanding. The LTA is not an old school tube preamp,with the lush, dense midrange of old CJ sonics, but is also not like a lean SS preamp either. The Level 3 upgrade maintains for me the clean, present midrange quality that was there before. Perhaps a bit “cleaner” than before, which makes sense given the apparent attention to lowering the noise floor in this redesign. I am very pleased I had the upgrade done. LTA was very good at communicating status, not surprising given my past interactions with them. The Level 3 is still a great companion to my Pass XA25 and I am very happy overall with LTA and this upgrade. |
My Level 3 upgrade arrived Friday and I have spent a large part of the weekend listening to music. The total turn around time was eighteen days including shipping from the West Coast to Maryland and back again. Fortunately I was traveling during much of that time. I let the system play for twelve hours before I started any critical listening. It is very difficult to compare the Level 2 versus the Level 3 results without having them side by side. This is the same issue I have had comparing power amps, speakers, preamps, and DACs. I expect I will have the same difficulty as I upgrade my streamer. Fortunately, I anticipated the issue and had notes regarding particular songs and source material. Across the board I found the instrument and performer separation was improved. Frequently the singer, or featured instrument was brought forward slightly. Stage presence height improved with Level 3. Level 2, plus all my other preamps over the years had exaggerated placement relative to what they should be. Level 3 is the first preamp that I have owned to nail the height issue. Things that are suppose to be overhead (think Pink Floyd, soundtracks with singers on different floors, and helicopters) are where they should be. The soundstage placement is consistent a joy to listen to. Regarding background blackness: I am not certain I can tell if there is an improvement, or even a change. There might be, but I am unable to identify it. Some instruments seem to have a more natural extension. The Level 2 improved this area versus the Benchmark LA4. The Level 3 is better than the 2 with this as well. Bass is more accurate in the extreme (under 30 Hz). The extreme bass in Imagine Dragons' "Radioactive" is actually tamed a bit. I didn't have to rush to turn it down because the house was shaking. The house still shakes with the cannon from The 1812 Overture as it should. Bass placement is a bit more detailed and tight. I am very glad I decided to the get the Level 3 upgrade. It compares favorably to the Backert Labs Rhumba Extreme 1.4 (have not heard the Rhythm 1.4). Regarding tube rolling: I have the original NOS tubes shipped with the unit plus the Ray Reserve and Gold Lion tubes LTA offers. The upgraded tubes still sound much better than the standard tubes. I am not inclined to try many different tube pairings. I will leave that with the pros, in this case LTA. I did enquire regarding the Ray Select tubes LTA is now offering in place of the NOS Gold Lion. The replied that there would be a slight difference, but not much and that is could be perceived as an improvement or a downgrade depending on my perception. I may buy a pair down the road, but not the immediate future. There may be better tubes out there, but that is not path that I will be exploring for now. |
@sls883, same tubes in my level 3 that I had in my level 2. I have about 200 hours on my level 3 in addition to the 1 week of burn-in at LTA. I think it’s improved from the time I first received it. I have not tried it with my XA-25 yet. I’m using Sylvania 6SN7 from the late 50’s/early 60’s and Mullard 4024 (12AT7). I like those tubes better than the stock tubes. I also purchased the Ray Reserve 6SN7 but I haven’t tried them yet. |
@smatsui Thank you for the reply. I'm glad the upgrade worked out for you. I may do it someday, but I have purchased tubes and cables that work with my level 2 preamp. They might also be fine with the level 3 upgrade. I'm using Telefunken ECC801S input tubes. I think I'm using Sylvania 6SN7GT output tubes as well (I have a couple of types that I like). The only input tubes that I've tried that are close to the Telefunken (in my opinion) are Siemens ECC801S. Most of the others lacked the detail, etc of the Telefunken. |
@sls883 Tube rolling in the LTA definitely has a noticeable impact. I have had to change some tubes around, but am using medical grade Telefunkenkens for the inputs and currently Sylvania 6SN7s on the output. All from Brent Jesse. One other thing I have noticed with the Level 3 upgrade - massed strings, particularly violins in orchestral music sound more natural and less congested. I know the complexity of reproducing massed strings has been noted on this forum and others and certainly the recording comes significantly into play here, but Level 2 to Level 3 is really noticeable in this regard. I continue to be impressed the more time I listen after the upgrade. |
@cbrez Don't say that. You're making me want to upgrade. Lol. |
@thriftyaudio Would you care to elaborate on your comparison of the LTA to the Backert Labs Rhumba Extreme 1.4 . Thanks |
@dotto81 A friend has a Rhumba Extreme 1.4. He swears by it. The 1.4 might be the most affordable component in his system. He swung by Sunday after visiting a couple of wineries. He knew the Level 3 was installed and he wanted to give a listen. By the time he arrived I was very impressed with the results. While my system costs a fraction of his I believe it compares favorably. He has been encouraging me to step up to the Rhumba Extreme 1.4 saying that it would be the best investment in my system, even more than a streamer upgrade, which I am considering. He joined me for a game of pool while we listened. About halfway through he asked me to play A Vivaldi Four Seasons SACD. He sat there for around twenty minutes and said the preamp made all the difference. He felt is was the equivalent of his 1.4. While I thought it was also I know better than to suggest it to him. Now he says the next upgrade I should focus on is a streamer. We agree. He loved the detail, the instrument separation, the improved pacing, and the pleasure of listening to it. While he is not a fan of electrostatic speakers he does like my set up with the dual subwoofers. I doubt if he will switch over from the 1.4 to the Level 3. I actually think he will find a very expensive preamp to upgrade his system. That is the way he rolls. Otherwise, he is a decent guy. |
@thriftyaudio Thanks for that update. I auditioned the Backert Labs Rythm 1.4 a few weeks ago. The Rhumba Extreme was not on hand. Now I’m torn because I really liked the Rythm. It’s a big leap in price from them Rhumba Extreme. |
At @dotto81 Paul brought both in and for some reason preferred the Rhumba Extreme 1.4 versus the Rhythm. He is not shy about spending money. I do not remember the specifics. |
I have my ZOTL pre at LTA now, getting the upgrade. I'm just waiting for Jacob to call me so I can go pick it up. I also own the Backert Labs Rythm 1.4 and look forward to a comparison. I'm a huge LTA fan, but I don't expect the ZOTL to be on the same level as the Rythm 1.4. It will be fun finding out. |
Are there any compromises made when going from level 2 to level 3? It was mentioned that the sound was more forward? Does the added detail come with added sibilance? It sounds like there are improvements to be had, but I'm hesitant because I have my system the way I like it (tubes, cables, ddc, clock, etc). |
One thing that I forgot to mention that for me was a significant improvement over the level 2 was the change in the grounding scheme. I live in Michigan and I have forced air heating, and carpeted floors in my basement listening room and this results in a very dry environment that is very conducive to static. Yes, I have a humidifier on my less than one year old high efficiency furnace. Before the upgrade, I would get zapped whenever I initially touched the LTA preamp and other components connected to it. The static discharge was so bad that it fried the display control board twice resulting in me having to send it back to LTA each time for a control board replacement under warranty. In talking to Mark Schneider, he told me that the level 3 preamp outer chassis is entirely grounded. Since getting the upgrade, I’ve noticed that I no longer get zapped at all when touching the preamp or any components connected to the preamp. Maybe I’m the only user that experienced this problem but I know the folks at LTA have experienced this issue and perhaps that is why they changed the grounding scheme. I also think the grounding change not only eliminated the issue I was having but also contributes in a small way to the sound quality improvement. |
@smatsui I had that problem this winter. I had a couple of pretty good sparks on a couple of occasions. Fortunately, nothing got fried I've gotten into the habit of touching the metal posts of my audio cabinet before I touch my LTA preamp.. |
@sls883 I’m glad to know that I’m not the only one to have the issue. I actually did the same thing, touching the metal post of my rack before touching the preamp. I had the issue 100% of the time only when initially touching the preamp. If I touched the preamp a 2nd time, I would not get zapped after getting zapped the first time. The issue was so annoying that I put a ground strap at my rack with a pin to the ground pin of an outlet. I could feel a tingle whenever I initially touched the ground strap. This issue has been completely eliminated with the level 3 upgrade. |
@lancelock I am looking forward to your comparisons of the two preamps. The Rhumba Extreme 1.4 was my second choice, although I was never able to compare the LTA MicroZOTL Level 2 with it in my system. I went with the LTA ultimately based on price, then decided it met my needs, until the Level 3 upgrade became available. @sls883 @smatsui I have never had a grounding/shock issue with any of my equipment, but then again my rack is solid wood. |
This upgrade is a major improvement in 3 dimensionality, dynamics, bass and imaging. The upgrade is like getting a new preamp that is better in every aspect of sound quality. If you’re on the fence regarding this upgrade, I highly recommend just going ahead and doing it. I couldn’t be happier the improvement in sound quality.