Kinki Studio EX-M1 200wpc Integrated Amplifier

I have used Rythmik F-12's with M3 Turbo S then M3 TM's for the past two years.  More bang for the buck and great match.

Thanks for the replies, thinking of a rel t7i to go with my spatial m4 turbos.  Would be happy to hear better alternatives.  Cheers

Can REL subs be connected to this amp using the speaker terminals? Cheers for the help

Technically, yes, you can connect the EX-M1 speaker terminals output to REL subs' high level input.

Hope this helps!
Rgds,Alvin
Vinshine Audio

Do your subs have Class AB or D amps as REL makes both?

@spoutmouzert  There are a few active members / owners of this amp, who can help.

You can also post on the Kinki Studio Facebook page, where Alvin / Vinshine Audio is active with support, etc.

Can REL subs be connected to this amp using the speaker terminals?  Cheers for the help

wonder if the gain on the kinki was set to low...
I agree vol @255 seems like the db level would be louder
I dont get above vol 100  & the db app loudness says I'm up in the 90's
that said I notice some streaming sources seem low & I  have to pump it up a bit but never all the way

Report back if you, do speak with him. Even if you don't get all of your questions / issues answered/resolved I'm sure you will have an engaging and productive conversation. He's great over the phone.

Hello David,

Thank you Sr

Best regards!

Mki

@mikicasellas   Reach out to Mike Powell directly. He'll be able to address your questions. I've found him to be very helpful over the phone.

Hello Guys,

Greetings everyone!!

I just saw the Mike Powell video where the Kinki was paired with the Magnepans, i just want to ask if the Kinki's 215 watts are real, i have a Hegel H20 amplifier (200 watts per channel) with P20 preamp and a pair of PMC Twenty5 26s and they are rated 86db, i am a bit confused here the Magnepans are 86db too and Mike could pump up the volume to its max, with my 200 watts Hegel amp i can't hardly do half the volume and it gets really really loud to the point where i can hurt the speakers and be deaf.

I am interested on the Kinki but Im afraid that it might not be that powerful to control my PMCs like the Hegel does.

Has anyone listened to Hegel amps and comment how do they stack vs the Kinki?

Regards

Miki

Another great product from a maker of great product that gets no where near the exposure that the majors do. Unless you read the reviews at 6moons, or here, and there, one has no idea of the level of performance you can get for much less coin than what the competition offers.

All the best,
Nonoise

6Moons Award Sighting!!! Kinki EX-P7 Preamplifier

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews2/kinki5/1.html

@wig 

Do you still have your Don Sachs amp or did you move on to Kinki?

Kinki EX-B7 mono amplifier review now posted in full at 6Moons:

http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews2/kinki4/1.html

If you are using L12's you are correct that RCA input is your only option.  I am using F12's in both of my systems so I have the option to go either way. 

Thanks for the tip, Al.

jackd:
My Rythmik L12 subs have their own internal power amp, and only accept RCA inputs. Unless I'm missing something obvious, they always have to be run directly from a preamp.

If your subs have speaker level inputs that would seem to be a better option than "modifying" a working design.  

Pts, the line-level inputs of powered subs generally have low impedances, typically in the area of 5K to 20K.  Before proceeding down this course, it would be prudent to inquire as to what the output impedance of these pre-outs would be, and if Alvin would recommend them as being suitable for driving such low impedances.

Good luck.  Regards,
-- Al 

I don’t want to run only main speakers, but also some active subwoofers. So I need RCA pre-outputs.

mboldda1:
Inputs bypassing the preamp (effectively turning the EX-M1 into a power amp) aren’t a bad idea; I’m sure Alvin could do. It defeats the point of buying an integrated though. Do you not think the pre section of the EX-M1 to be high-end? The reviews so far suggest that every component used is top quality.

it might would make more sense to have a preamp input as my mastersound has so you can upgrade the pre section.

I dropped Alvin a line; he said for an extra $150 they can change a pair of stereo inputs to pre-outs. That’s great news!

@pts  Let Alvin know via a detailed email...can't hurt? : )  

They have the EX-P7...so what you are asking for is a logical extension of their product lineup.

It’s a shame the EX-M1 doesn’t have a preamp outputs. I’m all for simplicity, but it seems they’re excluding a sizable portion of potential integrated customers by not doing so. I wonder if it could be modified by a tech to install preamp outs?

I can see both sides, he says so to keep your cost down. he could have a return policy then you would have to pay shipping both ways and I am sure the price would go up as they cannot sell the return as new so guess who pays for the loss when they have to sell the unit as a open box.
see what I mean.
 
I was looking at one of the magico dealers and you pay for shipping plus a 25% restock fee!

As always, the devil is in the details. When I read that they have no return policy, that's it for me. No return on something you have to buy without audition? No thanks.

@mboldda1 , I feel your pain. I went through the same thing as I watched the status of it get closer, and closer, and closer....

Just remember, it is heavy. 

Man, this is exciting. I've been going back and forth between replacing my Anthem 225 with a tube or hybrid integrated, or going separates....maybe Class D ...maybe from PS Audio with a tube pre. Lately I've been thinking that the real difference between separates and a good integrated just isn't all that much. This guy just might do the trick!

@mboldda1  Nice hearing the excitement in your posts! Looking forward to hearing how it works and sounds within your system.

mine cleared customs in ohio today and is scheduled to deliver Thursday.
can't wait.

I am curious to read that review as well as knowing what amps current owners of the Kinki have compared it to.

@teajay, when does the review come out ?

It states over at vinshineaudio.com that Mike now handles No. American sales and servicing of equipment and to please buy from him as of 8/29/2018.  It's about $89 more than if you bought it from Alex but you're getting the service from someone close by. That, and he has to stock the units as well so it's worth it, if that was part of your question. Sorry if it wasn't.

All the best,
Nonoise

I believe @teajay compared the EX-M1 to a $30K T+A and found the 
T+A to better it in air, separation and imaging but found it to be it's equal in the base. Not bad company to be in. He should have a review coming soon. 

All the best,
Nonoise

I wonder how does this amp competes against the Hegel Separates (P20 & H20), i have been considering reducing items and go for a super Integrated instead

Has anyone made any more comparos with other brands like Hegel, Devialet, Bryston, Pass, T+A (the ones around $10,000)

Best regards

I was under the impression that some watts were wasted if one had to crank up the volume before hearing something.

That would be true if the combination of amp gain, preamp gain (if there is a separate preamp, although of course there wouldn’t usually be one in the case of an integrated amp such as this one), and source output voltage is insufficient to drive the amp to its maximum power capability even with the volume control at max.

That can happen in some situations, and in fact I’ve been discussing just such a situation in a recent thread which involved the possibility of using a Herron phono stage to drive a certain power amp via a passive preamp which provides no gain.  But that would be a fairly unusual set of circumstances.

Best regards,
-- Al

Thanks for the clarification, Al. I was under the impression that some watts were wasted if one had to crank up the volume before hearing something. 

And, mrdecibel, the designer of my now, sadly gone, Tonian Labs TL-D1 speaker was of the same mind as you. He felt that the best amps had just one pair of output transistors (one per channel) as they had the speed necessary for sounding real. As one doubled up or went further, it slowed and muddled things too much for his tastes.

All the best,
Nonoise

I contacted the designer, via email, about using his amp with my modified Klipsch Lascalas, ( 104 db ) and he indicated the gain switch was for situations such as this. I obviously do not need this much power, although I have had monster sized amps driving them in the past. I always prefer smaller amps ( with less signal path / less output transisters ), but the circuitry with the EX-M1 is quite minimal, considering the output of this thing. Enjoy ! MrD.

Nonoise, to clarify a minor point, the gain of the amp affects the position of the volume control at which the first watt occurs. But the first watt is the first watt, and will produce the same volume with a given pair of speakers whether it occurs at a 9 o’clock setting of the volume control with a high gain amp, or at a 3 o’clock setting with a low gain amp.

On the other hand, of course, the first watt of two different amps can sound considerably different.

Best regards,
-- Al

No, mine doesn't have the high/low gain switch as it was the first version. After living with my Marantz, which I had to turn up at least a quarter of the way before I could hear it, it's nice to have it come on with great resolution at around that first watt. 

Wasn't it some tube amp designer (Decware?) who said something like, if you can't hear/use the first watt, what good are the remaining ones? Or something like that? With a proper set up, you can get most of what you need with that first watt, and this amp does that, so why curtail it?

I can see if one has a super efficient speakers (98db or higher) since you don't want to blow something out, but I like having it come on early. I find it very refreshing. 👍

All the best,
Nonoise

Reading the ad makes me want to buy another one. 😄

if you are in north America you have to order thru mike powell, the north american distributor. the price is now $2499 usd.
https://www.mikepowellaudio.com/shop/

here's one listed from mike on audiogon, you might want to ask if this the newer ones with a high/low gain switch on the rear.
https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lis93380-kinki-studio-ex-m1-integrated-dream-amp-of-the-decade-sol...

No duties here either.

I didn't have to pay any duties. The EX-M1 doesn't appear to be on the tariff radar as of yet. 👍