avoidance of verse>chorus>bridge song structure, no need for simple hooks.
Are you saying that the Great American Songbook is crap?
Is Rap a valid musical form?
This has been way more than the progression away from tubes to SS!
Believe the world of Hip Hop has been around and evolving for around 5 decades.
And for most of that time I have dismissed and avoided that world and its “music”.
So angry, offensive and abrasive. Just a bunch of rhythmic yelling.
I believe my former thread was titled “Why Rap?”. Through that discussion and somewhat of an understanding that this must be a new art form that engages and entertains millions if not billions. That and a long standing belief that if a type of music or a particular artist attracts many, many fans there must be substance and quality there. Even if I personally don’t particularly like it there must be something there.
Rap and the Hip Hop world was always so foreign and culturally untouchable.
Then my Rap thread and several others at that time got me rethinking my perspective and I watched a video of a group of student performance musicians at Juilliard all exclaiming their fascination with a Rap artist named Kendrick Lemar and his “masterpiece” “To Pimp a Butterfly”. I bought the double LP. Trying to listen to it turned out to be difficult because of my old view of Rap and that of the world of Hip Hop. But it was also becoming clear that this was truly something of significant interest. However, I just listened to the two discs only once-with some difficulty.
Today, after several weeks, I hesitatingly pulled the album out again. And to my surprise and actually delight hearing it with fresh ears it grabbed me and would not let go. I immediately heard the brilliance of a multi faceted, and to me, all new experience in sound. Not unlike great 20th century or progressive Jazz it evolved from section to section with a plethora of fascinating, yes musical, experiences. Tonal, atonal, percussive, rhythmic, breathing combined with incredible, energetic tongue twisting strings of mostly unintelligible words. And not merely angry yelling.
Sure, a ton of F bombs but words that don’t flow over you like lovely other genres but invade the psyche and don’t let go. Not particularly pleasant but gripping and interesting in its complexity. Words delivered with such power and drive which acted as a rhythmic counterpoint. It was impossible to turn away or turn off.
And speaking of turned off, the experience was the opposite of that. Stories of life undeniable human. Yes, driven by bitterness, anger and raw emotion. Impossible to dismiss it as not deeply felt.
I do think “To Pimp a Butterfly” is unique. But I also believe that there must be much more in this Hip Hop world that has deep musical interest. Some time ago I heard Drake on SNL perform a song that was amazing though not really Rap. Rather an advanced and unconventional musical form. I hear similar musical threads throughout “Pimp”. I did get a CD of Drake. “Scorpion”. I also could not absorb it in my first listen. I look forward to the next, fresh listen. I did try to hear several YouTubes of some very successful Rap artists. They mostly lacked the interesting musical themes threaded through. “Pure Rap” with just the rhythmic words-not my cup of tea. But a musically valid form none the less.
@charcoalchuck + 1 |
FFS people. Hip hop is an amazing form of music. The fact that it exists shows this. Anyone who thinks different is likely being closed minded or worse. Is punk and good form of music? Hell and yes. Some of you just need to sit this one out. To the detractors, be honest with yourselves. How good of try have you given this art form. I don’t mean hearing it on a commercial or in a store. But really given it a go. I am not a classical fan but decided over the pandemic to give it a proper go. To me, that meant researching where to start and what to listen to. I also tried to read real criticism from real critics and not just "reviews." I am not a superfan now, but hqve found my classical niche. I am hoping with more listening and experience my classical pallet grows. If you won’t or can’t do the same for "rap" or hip hop...just sit this one out.
Night. |
Sure it’s a valid musical form. Not a very good one, but still valid. It’s just one I happen to dislike immensely. While I can appreciate the political messages, especially in the earlier days of rap, the simplistic musical delivery system for those messages, is boring, cliché, repetitive, poorly played, to me. My criteria for what I consider good musical forms are: very high level of musicianship, musical complexity, deep and broad emotional and intellectual content, avoidance of verse>chorus>bridge song structure, no need for simple hooks. In other words, almost the complete opposite of rap. And yes, I have listened to rap many times, in all eras. Every time I mention on music forums why I don’t like it, someone will invariably mention rap that they believe fits some of my criteria. Having an open mind, I will listen to it, and always come away disappointed. It is always simple, repetitive, lacks any real musicianship, etc. Just to sum up, my dislike for rap is purely based on musical content. No other criteria at all enters my judgement. I also put pop, mainstream rock, country at just a slightly higher level than rap, again due to those criteria I mentioned above. |
@jasonbourne52 Fight the Power |