I can't help you with your question but I can suggest you wait to hear the Delos on the Aries. I have an Aries 1 with a Lyra Kleos and it sounds amazing.
You may decide the extra real estate is worth it, especially if you ditch the flywheel and just use the motor. The motor nearly fits inside the profile of the Aries.
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There are lots of great TTs out there but the VPI Aires 1 is very special. IMO it has the best platter/spindle system ever devised. My problem was always with the JMW tonearm and I wish that I had tried a different arm before I sold my Aires. If I were doing it today I would go either the TriPlanar path or maybe the Pete Riggle Woody - the SPU version.
Just my 2 cents worth...
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Not a VPI fan here but the Aries 1 is simply beautiful. And these days 4K doesn't get you very far :( |
I have an Aries 1 (Extended). You will probably be disappointed with anything new in the $4K price range. You might want to keep the Aries. It could be better to spend some small coin on a VPI "Dual Pivot" arm upgrade. IMO, will improve the performance of the arm and help the Delos sing. |
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Thank for this. Indeed I have told on several accasions that the Aries is going to very hard to beat without spending a lot more money. I have wanted to call VPI to ask them about upgrading the tonearm- i wasn't sure it is possible but then again I have no real reason to think that. On top of that I could have tonearm rewired with better quality wire (nordost etc)
If I were to actually change anayway Ithink a Sota would have to be on the list. Yje 2 above I was asking about were new offerings I am less familiar with I was curious about. In other words, my search not be restricted to those.
Another friend of mine suggested that if a really wanted to make a change and improve the sould too he would think that nothing lessthan a Bardo would do....and that one is a fantabulous amount of cash- even used. |
I would say ditch the flywheel which is the major space-eater and add a motor controller specifically the SOTA Eclipse if the vpi motor is ac synchronous. You’ll experience a major upgrade AND a reduction in size in one fell swoop. If the vpi motor is not ac synchronized then replace it with one that is.
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I would say ditch the flywheel which is the major space-eater and add a motor controller specifically the SOTA Eclipse if the vpi motor is ac synchronous. You’ll experience a major upgrade AND a reduction in size in one fell swoop. If the vpi motor is not ac synchronized then replace it with one that is.
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Tone arms can always be upgraded, and to just about any arm, only depending on how willing you are to do (or pay for) the work, and modify the existing table. Which depending on the arm in question might be surprisingly easy or near impossibly hard. So that's the real question: which arm? Origin Live are highly recommended and greatly simplify things as they all use the standard Rega cutouts.
That being said you're messing with the source, arguably the most important component and one you sure seem to like and one you and it seems everyone else thinks will be hard to equal or better, so I would counsel extreme caution.
If space really is tight I think your integrated amp idea makes a lot more sense. Only drop the inboard phono stage idea, there's just no way you're gonna get good sound and why when something like the Herron is so reasonably priced?
You already have experience with Prima Luna. Seems to me you could sell that, and the Pass amps, buy a Prima Luna integrated and Herron phono stage, get a nice bump in sound quality and maybe even have money left over to put towards a nice Origin Live arm for the VPI. |
Thanks for all this- very interesting. I should have added to all of this that . I also the VPI SDS- so unless the Sota controller is so much better I'd probably stick with the SDS, no?
@ millercarbon
You raise an interesting point re the phono. I assumed that I phono board addition to an integrated might be more cost effective that a whole new separate box and that that would imply that for the same price it might be a little better. Sounds like I have it backwards. That said I have afriend who owns an Aesthetix Janus preamp and he suggests it is in most cases superior external phono's within the same general price range. I have much less experience with phono's than with other equipment but I will say his vinyl system sounds amazing. Anyway, thank for raising the point- maybe Aesthetix is an exception considering who Jim White is and should porbably rethink some of my assumptions.
Also, I think that if I am going to go integrated I am going to look for something that has a higher quality volume control than the Blue Velvet- as good as this potentiometer is I have heard in a head to head comparison what a better volume control can do.
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You can use a variac instead of an SDS or other controller. Start the platter with full voltage, then dial back to 65% of "wall voltage" after the platter gets up to speed. Does the same thing as an SDS at less than $100.
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@bpoletti , a variac only does 50% of the job of a VPI SDS. A SDS drops the motor voltage after start up plus you can adjust the line frequency which alters the rotational speed of an AC synchronous motor thus allowing the end user to dial-in platter speed.
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The variac adjusts the voltage. There is no need to adjust the frequency.unless there is a problem with the pulley size. A VPI pulley is stepped to adjust between 33 /13 and 45 RPM. The 60hz line frequency does not vary. That's a myth. |
By now, I thought you guys would know that the SOTA eclipse motor controller system is a highly sophisticated device based on the now discontinued phoenix engineering products. As such it is miles ahead of a VPI SDS and light years ahead of using a variac. But I know this won’t dissuade you. Anyone who is interested ought to do some reading on the subject. My point was that the outboard fly wheel is of some value, however minimal, to regulate speed, and the SOTA eclipse system is at the other end of the spectrum, the best you can get right now in an aftermarket product. I say this as the owner of the original Phoenix engineering system, which has transformed every turntable I have applied it to. I would not dream of having a belt drive turntable without a device of this type, and right now this is the only device of it’s type.
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I'm very happy with my SOTA Nova V, but the new advancements in the VI series look pretty amazing, as mentioned, especially the Eclipse / RR package. I'm also a big fan of their vacuum hold-down platters (unfortunately the entry price for a new vacuum table is above your stated budget). If you do move on from your Aries, SOTA would be one to look hard at. Or, incorporate the Eclipse upgrade into your Aries. |
In my opinion....
"Speed regulation" is an insignificant factor. Look up the actual the variation in 60hz grid frequency and what happens if a power generation device is out of synch at all with that 60hz signal. The 60hz signal is stable regardless of all the misinformation and power mythology floating around. And there is certainly no audible variation. By far the biggest pitch variation is by off-center holes in the middle of a spinning vinyl record. That "wow" is quite audible.
It's ALL about voltage. Getting rid of the ac synch pulses that travel through the belt and onto the platter that is critical. The ONLY possible improvement is an automated means of measuring the absolute minimum voltage that will stabilize a spinning platter RPM. But in the meantime, if variac trial and error indicate that (for example) 65 volts provides that stability, using an automated voltage regulation that reduces the voltage to 63 volts won''t matter.
The ONLY advantage to an automated system is that it's automated. Hit one switch and it's done. With a variac, the voltage must be quickly manually increased to the starting voltage and then manually reduced to the stable operating voltage when the platter is spinning at full RPM. Then at the end of play, voltage quickly manually decreased to zero.
In my opinion, any other argument is snake oil. |
Thanks everyone for the very interesting posts. My impression that unless I plan to make a major investment (as suggested mulveling) I should stock to the Aires.
As for the speed control I'll stick with the SDS and maybe focus on an arm upgrade- and/or a phono upgrade.
So in terms of the latter, the Herron does seem to be a very piece of equipment. Assuming I were to think about something in $1k range (which would leave me $$$ leftover for the arm) what to you reckon is good and would match well with the Lyra Delos. My currrent phono is a Trigon Vanguard II which at the team was better most other phono stages up to around $600-$700 with Trigon beinng nonetheless being about $500. I did a round of comparisons at sound by Singer in Ny wau back when.
I think I should be able to achieve a significant step -up with something around $1k used, no? |
