If I wanted to make my own speaker cables, is this a good choice for wire?

Nice to hear your component choices...speakers?

@digsmithd 
Well the speakers I have currently hooked up are Omega Super 3 High Output XRS.  They're a high sensitivity speaker and around 6 ohms.  Amp is a Rogue Cronus Magnum 3.

Sounds like the choice of the 16 is perfect...alot of guys here with experience with duelund.Should have lots to read about this weekend.

Cool, I'm trying to find some examples where others built cables out of this wire... for some ideas.

@tubeguy76 

Why did you choose this wire?

@tubeguy76 - 2 x 16 gauge would make a good signal conductor for a speaker cable. But for the neutral I would recommend a 12 gauge wire.

Take a look at this thread - it’s very educational with lots of great DIY ideas for cables/conncetors that outperofrm most of the top brands available today

DIY Helix Cables

I use these cables at present and I am extremely happy with them

• superb clarity and details
• very fast dynamics
• excellent imaging

If you are going to the trouble of building your own cables then go for the Helix - the extra effort is well worth it.

BTW duelund it very good, but there is better wire available - just depends on your listening preferences

• Duelund is mellow wire
• UP-OCC wire is more dynamic and more detailed
• UP-OCC Silver is extremely detailed and provides superb clarity and imaging

It really depends on your listening preferences

Regards - Steve

@tubeguy76  Another excellent option might be:

https://www.vhaudio.com/speakercables.html

This was a fun project.  Message me if you would like any info on other parts/suppliers use.  

Nice job on that...nice and tidy.Furez spades too🎵I really wish i could get there banana's.

@digsmithd  Thanks.  I'm about to make another paid with Bananas.  I like the crimp style connectors and have settled on:

https://www.pangeaaudio.com/Gold-Banana-Gold-Plated-BFA-Banana-Plug

Took me awhile to find these.  Might try a drop of solder after the crimp. 

Yeah i have set 8/not in use? ...too tough to crimp for me...solder good idea.

Interesting that you went from discussing speaker cables to interconnects, with no mention of what you are planning to connect with these cables.

If you are interested in tinned copper wire, you might also take a look at this wire from a well-regarded company.   OTOH, there are many other bulk cables for consideration, depending on your goals.  Tinned copper has its attractions and its uses, which IMO are generally a nice full midrange with a colorful, warmish tone, and full-sounding bass, and that it is best suited in power cords, speaker wire, and interconnects, in that order.  It is just ok in the high frequencies and in resolution.  It does seem however to be one of the few bulk cable choices that can be used, as-is, for PCs, SCs, or ICs.  I have made multiple cables with the Duelund wire, Jupiter  Condenser wire, and old stock Western Electric wire and they all have their own characteristics and strengths, IMO/IME.

if you shared your specific equipment and specific sonic goals, plus your general budget range, you might get more meaningful answers instead of everyone’s generic go-to cables.

@vonhelmholtz 

I found some conservations about it and was wondering if it was still viable.

@mitch2

Sure, my setup is a Rogue Cronus Magnum 3, Chord Qutest, iFi Zen Stream and the Omega Super 3 High Output XRS speakers mentioned earlier.

I don't have any specific goals in mind, I'm just looking to build some cables for something to do.

I would think a thicker gauge

speaker wire, 12 gauge, wouldn’t

hurt you.  Good luck.

@tubeguy76 

Louis loaned me a pair of 3HO XRS’s so I know exactly how these speakers sound. Those Omega’s are electrostatic fast, hyper detailed and downright spooky how great they sound with good recordings. But they’re unforgiving on lesser sources.

Acoustic Zen Hologram II speaker cables tamed that to a degree. Other Omega owners I’ve chatted with seem to agree that a thick high quality copper cables work best.

I opted for his Modern CAMs with alnico drivers. A much smoother ride for me overall but still darn spooky good. My Sboosted Qutest is always set to warm/non-cutoff filter.

Perfect as is.

I ran this cable against the Silversmith Fidelium and not much in it at all sound wise. Silversmiths had slight edge. Factor in the cost though and Duelund is the hands down winner.

12 guage makes the sound bassier/heavier, and is not as well suited IMHO

Ok then, nice set-up. I did ICs with the previously linked 16awg Jupiter wire, and with Duelund 20awg, both have nice tone and are pretty good overall but are  bettered IMO by my Furutech u-p2.1 ICs.

For SCs, with 100wpc, and depending on the length of your run, you might like the larger 12awg wire mentioned by @needfreestuff .  Duelund makes a twisted pair 12awg in a single cotton casing, just like the 16awg you were looking at.  However if you are trying to buy just one wire to make both SCs and ICs then either the 16awg Duelund or Jupiter would probably be best.

Use connectors from pure copper or silver when possible - plating over the copper/silver is ok. For bananas, the KLE plugs that @williewonka likes should sound nice.  Good luck

I used these BFA connectors in my last build. Crimp and solder.

https://nerveaudio.com/product/silver-z-plug/

Nice work, diy can be an excellent option and parts connexion has some great materials. 

As interconnects, why would you opt for side-by-side 16 ga. wire?  Are you unaware that opens up a world of RFI/EMI pickup?  The Jupiter wire is twisted…a better choice for unbalanced ICs.  For speaker wire, the Dueland might be fine at lengths up to 4M.  Beyond that, maybe go heavier.  For shorter, no need.

The problem with bananas, RCAs, and AC outlets has always been the need for a spring type elastic resistance, which copper is not very good at because it is a softer metal that deforms upon repeated loadings (i.e., plugging in and unplugging).   This is why most bananas, RCAs, and AC outlets are commonly made from an alloy of copper, which of course will be less conductive than copper.  Tellurium copper seems to be the best at about 93% of IACS (Copper is 100-101% IACS), while other alloys sometimes have much lower conductivity like Phosphor Bronze at 19% IACS.  Spades are different since they are actually connected by mechanical compression from the binding posts and have no need for elasticity, which is why it is not uncommon to see pure copper spades.

Interestingly, I thought the KLE bananas used to advertise being silver plated pure copper but after reading the technical write-up in their brochure, it was not so clear to me.  There is a lot of dancing around and referencing IACS but I did not see anywhere that they came right out and said exactly what the pin material is made from, except that it has silver plating and is apparently above 100% IACS in conductivity.  I am sure they are very good, but I get skeptical when I read a technical description that appears to dance around the subject.

IT DEPENDS!
Roughly 10 years ago Belden CLAIMED that a 'single strand pair' of their CAT5e Ethernet cable was capable of Audiophile grade transmission up to 10 feet.
That aside, we now have OFC, Long grain copper, Silver plated copper, Litz braided copper, and we haven't even started to discuss shielding or abrasion resistance. I cannot imagine using Cotton on anything.
I didn't see anything in your list that impressed me. What you discussed, I believe can be easily matched or exceeded by something simple like 'Cards 101' cable which is not too expensive and has great statistics. Now I am a huge fan of DIY but now in my senior years I have also given way to more abundant brands that can provide what I want at budget prices. The afore mentioned 1'01' cable can be purchased in any length up to 100ft and even at that there are options of running multiple lengths of that if you feel you need more size and 3 lengths could be braided. Options abound.

It appears the marketing department has hacked into the engineering department’s technical text once again! That Cardas 101 discussed by @esarhaddon does indeed look pretty good but I do find the write-up interesting in that they call the cotton filler material the dielectric and the actual wire insulation a “poly jacket.” Mind games.

Mitch2
What I think you may have missed is that I was jsut giving examples and possibilities. AS far as the cotton fiber goes , you might as well go demolish some 120 year old house and rip out the electrical wiring and use that for you speaker cable. Who knows you might get some good copper that way too along with the cockroaches and other creatures that love eating cotton sheathing.

RAMM audio OCC cable. Amazing. 

@esarhaddon 

I get it, and no slight was intended, at all.  Cardas makes good wire. I was just pointing out the promotional rhetoric in their document that ignored the “poly” dielectric yet referred to the cotton filler as the dielectric, since most DIY’ers prefer cotton.  Marketing slight-of-hand.

Mitch2

I guess next time you will have to use a bullhorn to get me to listen! hehehehe

Using inexpensive CAT6 plenum cable - solid copper, not aluminum, you can make an exceptionally good speaker cable:
(from the silversolids.com Blog)

Jung and Marsh stated that their tests showed that the use of multiple thin gauge solid core wires in parallel was the best way to go. This gives you low capacitance with no phase or skin effect problems in or directly above the audible range.
When asked, "What is the real thing about using silver in audio chain?" Mark Levinson replied: "Silver is the best conductor of electricity. Laws of physics. But copper is more practical for speaker cables.".
For a speaker cable, using just one pair of 23 ga. conductors results in a noticeably lean tonal balance but grouping multiple light-gauge wire gives you an even tonal balance without diminishing the desirable high-frequency performance advantages of thin gauge wires. The most cost effective way of achieving this is using plenum type CAT6 Ethernet cable with eight pure copper 23 gauge solid wires and Teflon dielectric in multiple pairs. Uncompromising high-end caliber performance at a bargain price.
The illustration below shows one side:                                                        

@esarhaddon -all good

@tubeguy76 - the post by @stager2  is true, CAT cable can be used to make really good sounding speaker cables.  Here is an older articles explaining one alternative but there are easier methods, I have no idea which would sound best.

Thanks for the suggestions and tips everybody.  I read every post.  :)

For single driver speakers I suggest using solid core copper (one run for +/one run for -).

With cables 12' or less stay in the 22-26 gauge range unless if you want a "less full" (thinner) sound then go 16-20 gauge.

I use 47 Labs OTA (26 gauge solid core copper in a VERY thick polyvinyl insulation) and recently tried Neotech 24 gauge/Teflon.

The Neotech is readily available (by the foot) and inexpensive.

https://www.soniccraft.com/index.php/neotech-wire-teflon-solid-cu-c-296_175_183_221

I've used (mainly) vintage Elac S517 and Stephens Trusonic 80FR single drivers for the past 20 years and realize that saying that heavier gauge wire reduces bass/fullness seems to go against the grain, but this has been my experience with all of the single driver speakers I've used over the years.

DeKay

Mitch2

Yes You are correct about CAT cable. The reason I mentioned it was that My first pair of good sounding cables were DIY from CAT5e cable, 27 pairs braided into one homogenous cable. There wasn't ANY measurable Inductance and the Capacitance only slightly high. Resistance was VERY low. Seldom would you find an AMP that responded negatively to high capacitance. When I first connected then My Volume rose roughly 3db which is huge if you think about it. Covered them with nylon woven covering and gold plated Bananas. I must say, when braiding these you can expect to have a lot of arthritic pain in your hands for a long time afterword. I ran these for roughly 15 years up until I got my first NAD amp and then graduated up to commercial cables.

I will recommend Inakustik wires.

Julian

Yes I made speaker wire using Dueland tin copper for my home office system consisting of TeKton Lore speakers a refurbished vintage Pioneer 5590 receiver inexpensive dac and server . I also use Dueland tin copper for my headphone cable fabulous bang for buck wire ,,..

Duelund DCA12GA bare between Luxman 509X and ATC SCM 20 monitors set on Sound Anchor stands and they are superb.  Solid bass, sweet midrange and very open on the top end.  This is a perfect speaker wire for the money.  Perhaps my Decware Silver Stix are a bit better, but for the money Duelund is tough to beat.  Have fun with your choice.

Anyone have any thoughts on Belden 9497 vs Dueland? Oil soaked cotton seems like a perfect fire hazard, lol, also might attract insects. 

Marty I have my office fumigated monthly to keep the infestation of insects at bay and so far only two fires this year so far ,,,,

😆 seriously though i dont understand the benefit of cotton over pvc like in belden 9497, though it is prettier in a retro WE kind of way. 

I have two pairs of DIY speaker cables.

One is Belden Studio 814 and another is Nanotec Golden Strada #79 MKII.

Both are models unique to Japanese domestic market, but my local Belden dealer does carry it, so you might want to check with your local dealer first.

Studio 814 and 717EX are extremely popular with DIYers in Japan and I could see why. 814 is a romantic sounding cable, adds a lot of weight and dynamics, and just the right amount of warmth. Very effective especially with smaller bookshelves. I am currently using #79 MKII in tandem with Soundstring Gen1 Tricormaxial cables in my main system (I am running a high input/output setup with a sub). The Nanotec is probably as good as it gets for its price. Very spacious, musical, and neutral sounding. But it seems like you could only purchase this in Japan, though you might try your luck with their Taiwan dealer on Facebook.

@auroravengeance 

Thanks for the suggestions, the Nanotec Golden Strada looks interesting.  I did a quick search and yeah, they appear to be hard to get.

@tubeguy76 

This store in Australia seems to carry a selection of Nanotec bulk cables. 

They sell the updated version of MKII. 

http://www.waraudio.com.au/p/9218046/nanotec-sp-79-mk-2-hv.html

Canare Star-Quad Speaker Cable.

https://www.markertek.com/product/4s11ft-bk/canare-4s11-star-quad-14awg-4-conductor-speaker-cable-black-per-foot

terminate with some good quality ends as needed

spending any more on cables is a waste of money. The high end cable companies have duped most audiophiles into believing they need to spend big $$ to get good cables. One of the biggest scams ever perpetrated on the ignorant consumer. Use what you save to buy some records, you are welcome

likewise these are excellent line level cables, all you need. Or make your own. You can get the raw cable these are made of from the source above

https://benchmarkmedia.com/collections/all-products/products/benchmark-starquad-analog-xlr-cable

@dekay, I've used the Neotech OCC, for my IC and speakers cables per the Helix DIY noted in a prior posting.  For all of them I used 3 solid strands. Effectively 18 awg for the OCs and 14 awg for my speakers (Wirebarn calculator).  I'm intrigued by your comment concerning gauge and the quality of sound you hear.  Have you made or compared awg gauges to make that determination?  Not questioning, seriously interested.  To be complete, I stripped the insulation and ran thru 3 Teflon tubes of wire+1 awg for approx "air" as dielectric.   Return or neg leads are twisted Neotech OCC in Teflon at +1 gauge to positive side.  Helix configuration. 

akgwhiz:

I've compared single runs of various solid core copper (speaker wire) in gauges ranging from 18 to 26.

Also tried doubling up on some of them.

Early on I had more traditional speakers (Reynaud) and later various vintage wide band drivers ranging from 3" to 12".

My favorite spot is single runs of solid core copper in the 22-26 gauge range with the runs not exceeding 12' (or so) in length.

Interconnect wise I use the 47 Labs wire/connectors though I have experimented with "nude" solid core silver and "lab tube" IC's as you described (single runs for +/).

Nude silver was the best (30 gauge), but using it was too nerve racking.

Lab tube silver was not as good as the 47 Labs stuff.

I prefer the 47 and DIY to all the other commercial cables I've tried.

DeKay

If the Helix Configuration Thread is looked into, there is in the latest posts a reference to a PC Triple C wire.

This is the wire that has superseded in its supplied form, the use of Mapleshade Clearview Double Helix in my own system.

I have also bought into this as a second purchase as a Bulk Length, to be used as a Helix configuration. 

I use 47 Labs OTA (26 gauge solid core copper in a VERY thick polyvinyl insulation) and recently tried Neotech 24 gauge/Teflon.

Those tiny 47Labs cables can not work proberly, considering the science and according  to the experience of most pundits.

I just can't seem to find a better cable for all the systems I had over the years ...

I have tried so many wires over the years and currently own PCOCC stranded (Furutech), PCOCC solid core (Harmonic Technology), solid core braided silver (HGA), and others here that I occasionally swap out just for fun.

I can honestly say, that I doubt there are audibly meaningful differences between cables made with ETP copper (100% IACS), OFC copper (101% IACS) and PCOCC copper (102%? IACS).  As an example, even the highly rated Iconoclast speaker cables do not use any type of "perfect surface", "continuous cast", or other fancy processed copper.  The best you can get with their cable line is either OFE (Oxygen-Free Electrolytic Copper - 99.99% pure) or SPTPC (Silver-Plated Electrolytic Tough Pitch Copper), which reminds me of my former DH Labs cables (I remember liking the T-14).  

However, I do seem to perceive differences between solid core and stranded cables and also between dielectrics, with cotton or foamed PE being my favorites.  It is hard to argue with the HT speaker cables that are multiple, small gauge, solid core, strands of individually insulated (with foamed PE), PCOCC copper, resulting in a fairly heavy aggregate gauge of 9 awg or 11 awg, depending on the cable. 

The only thing I have here that I like as well as the HT cables are DIY, multi-strand, solid core copper in cotton cables that are configured in a star-quad geometry with two separate runs for bi-wiring.  The HF run is made from 20 awg wires (four per side) for a 14 awg aggregate per pole, and the LF runs are made from 16 awg wires (also four per side) for a 10 awg aggregate per pole.  For whatever reason, those cables simply sound natural to me and are currently connected to my system.

Not sure why the 47Labs cables are favorites of many but I do understand the preference for solid core copper wire.

, 

Not sure why the 47Labs cables are favorites of many but I do understand the preference for solid core copper wire.

I wasn't aware that the 47Labs wire were any popular, or even known of by most audiophiles.😉

Thanks a bunch for sharing your experiences and observations; I've tried many cable recipes over the years, diy or manufactured, including some of the designs you mentioned.

I just can't get away from small gauge solid core, single run, no twist... even though I know there must be something better.