Fidelity Research FR-64 vs. FR-54


In a prior discussion, I had asked about tonearm suggestions for a Luxman PD-441 table that currently has a Denon DA-307 tonearm and Grado The Reference high output cartridge.  Many suggestions were provided.  A Fidelity Research FR-64 was suggested as a simple replacement.  I'm wondering if the FR-54 would also be good, being that it is mentioned in the Luxman manual in the same category as the Denon arm on there now?
bdunne
Dear @dover : Only to put some ligth on you about my "  use them for boat anchors " / ML monobloks:

in those old times ML designed and manufactured the the pure class A ML 20 Reference monobloks and in those times the word Reference was a serious meaning ( not like today ) and the 20's was a true Reference amps that outperformed any other design in those times. ML was really serious about and the 20's were the first M items with the Reference ML status.

Years latter they designed a the class AB 23 stereo amp that in some areas performed better than the original 20's so ML decided that their References must lives as References and modified it and born the 20.5's. 
Even for the 20's owners they offered the ML factory up-grade.

Well, time pass on and the ML 23 was up-dated to 23.5 status ( I owned this one and was really good. ) that again performed better than the 20.5's and they redisigned it and born the 20.6's and again offered the up-grade to their customers.

The 20.6's that I own are not a 20.5 up-graded but ML factory 20.6's new units and are one of the latest 6 pairs where ML instead to use teflon in the circuit boards they made it something special and those cirduit boards came with Arlon and performs at a little higher quality level that the ones with teflon.

In the other side and due that you can't give me any advise about how to measure my " anchor "'s speed I did it my self and I found out that performs:

0 to 60mph in only 5 nano-seconds. I hope this figure can compete with your tubes unit.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.
This thread is about FR Arms and was usually hacked from our "beloved" Mexican member who lives in his own world (of distortions).
Let’s be honest, his part time knowledge is not enough for today, his inability to connect something to get a better result is well known. His USA tour was not really successful, some are too polite to name it, but a few told me, that Taco man is in reality even worse than at Audiogon.
High End Made in Mexico needs a bit more than distortion monologues which pop up like a broken record.
Enjoy the music and not distortions greetings is the pale result from someone who creates his own truth.
Dear @dover : At least tell us why those amps are slow ones.

It's pity that a gentleman like you with your knowledge level come and post " something " with no explanation, with no adcvise to, with no real audio target other that spread your bad attitude.

Try to solve it and give your advise here.

R.
Dear @dover : Btw, please tell me what to look to be aware/detect if my amps are slow or not and specific LP tracks ( 5-6 ) where I can detect it. The amps I can have easily to compare are: FM Acoustics and Gryphon.

In the other side why do you think my amps are slow and slow compared against which specific amps?

Thank's in advance, appreciated.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.
Hi: """  I object to his claim that he has superior listening capability "AHEE" to everyone else on this forum """

I never said or posted that anywhere in any forum.

Slow amps?, well could be but the mods I made it helps a lot because both the audio signal goes directly to the input circuit board ( by-passing some original stages. ) and the power electrical signal goes directly too.

In the other side I had several amplifiers in my system that my dealer's friends want it to check or that I ask for: Audio Note, VTL, Gryphon, Krell, modern MLs, Pass, FM Acoustics, Coda, Parasound, Classe, Boulder and other ones.

The dealers and audio friends never made a comment on that specific regards and I never detected that my monobloks are " slow ". Even the original specs, reviews and other owners never reported about.

R.
@thekong : Comes for more?

Hi Raul, coming back? No, I was always here waiting for your reply on how your room / turntable system could defy physic and be immune to the airborne feedback (also remarked by Mr J Carr)!

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/our-home-system-how-good-it-is/post?postid=351309#351309

This is really enlightening, you were praising the systems you had visited, and some of them even had TUBE equipment!!! WOW!

Yes, I know you can't live with those gentleman opinions. But you can't do nothing about because that's the quality levels of the Essential first version.

Which gentleman’s opinions are you referring to? Most of the thread was talking about other audio issues rather than your phonolinepreamp.

I can surely live with those gentlemen's opinions, but did any of them agree with you that tube must be inferior to SS?

I believe more in people’s action than their words! If you bother to check the systems of the participants in that thread (those that is listed in Virtual Systems), you will see it is around 50/50 for all SS system vs systems with tubes.

in a meeting there through a listening session with around 8 gentlemans ( one of them a Dagogo's reviewer. ) and making comparisons things were that no one but me took in count that the system owner all tube ( four chasis/boxes. ) phonoline item had a serious fault: its left channel was down around 2db-4db against the rigth channel.
This sole fact can tell you the level of those 8 pairs of golden ears touted by you.

Just to be clear, I never mentioned those gentlemen's names until you did!

This is very interesting, so now you are saying those gentlemen’s listening skill are questionable? If so, then why do you always quote members' praise to your phonolinepreamp, as if those are facts?

Oh, I get it, anyone who praises your phonolinepreamp must have good listening skill; all those who prefer something else just don’t. Is that it?

It's weird that all Essential owners I never meet them and never listened the Essential before bougth it.

Oh, do you really mean "all Essential owners"? If so, then are you saying that all those who you had met and had listened to the Essential didn't buy it? That is weird, or is it?!!!

@thekong : Comes for more?, no problem this is the rigth place to " enjoy " it:

first I name it both because ( I think ) were the only that heard the 3160 when I returned to their places but FC posted his opinion in the link I posted:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/experience-with-raul-s-essential-3150/post?postid=326188#3261... 

and this is one of his posts on my third USA trip ( second time with him. ) when the 3160 was there:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/our-home-system-how-good-it-is/post?postid=351309#351309

Yes, I know you can't live with that gentleman opinions. But you can't do nothing about because that's the quality levels of the Essential first version.

Now and first than all my apologies to the gentleman you are talking but I have to " enligth " you " life " and is you whom are mading a damage to him due to your ignorance:

in a meeting there through a listening session with around 8  gentlemans ( one of them a Dagogo's reviewer. ) and making comparisons things were that no one but me took in count that the system owner all tube ( four chasis/boxes. ) phonoline item had a serious fault: its left channel was down around 2db-4db against the rigth channel. 
This sole fact can tell you the level of those 8 pairs of golden ears touted by you.

Again sorry to post this again. There are many other issues that I can't disclose here or elsewhere, so please stop to damage other people because you don't know nothing about and I mean it.

Please do what you do the best: teach to other people as you did it with dover.


"""  shared you view of tubes being inferior to SS. Even an owner of your phonolinepreamp was (and still is, I believe) using tube amp. """

well, as you read it all those gentlemans including L.Walker were listening the Essential and you know what?:


"""  but the Walker table really can expose
any downstream troubles. The synergy between the Walker and the Essential
was overwhelming.
I must say that the sound in that system that day from the sweet spot is one
of the best sounding to my ears that I've heard in 25 years in this hobby.
Without a doubt, the most musical of about 5 times hearing various Kharmas.
Whether listening to classical, jazz or rock, everything sounded balanced
and natural. Dynamics, tonality, transparency, we heard it all. So many toes
were tapping, we looked like an audio-geek chorus line!
About 40-50 members of our audio club were at this demo, spread out over
about 6 hours, so perhaps some others who attended will chime in here with
their impressions. From the reactions I heard, I think many were
dumbfounded, as I was. """

yes, as a chorus line including me. Joe's owner was really enjoy it.  I will never forgot all those great people talking each to other on what each one of us like: MUSIC and enjoying it. Who can ask for more?   

Regards and enoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.

It's weird that all Essential owners I never meet them and never listened the Essential before bougth it.









Dear @lewm : Yes, that's what I mean. Was that University whom help us to achieve matched pairs because the ones we choosed was single bipolar devices. Before the matching task personally we choosed one single manufactured bipolar over several other different manufactured bipolars, as I said in my mposts not all bipolars sounds exactly the same even if measured the same.

"""  why should I think that this makes the 3150 unbeatable? """ I never mentioned that.

What I said is that even that the matced pairs in the MAT02 and MAT03 are good ones was not the MATs what I was looking for our Essential design. As I told you, ML choosed both MATs at the end of the 80s in my monoblocks. I knew it very well and I want it something better that fortunatelly we found out.

Btw, what sincerely makes the 3160 unbeatable is the whole design, the very fine details we care on it and of course its quality level performance.

Sorry that you thougth that I'm insulting on purpose your system, it's not that way. 

Look, why any one could wants to integrate in his audio system that kind of quality level performance only for the next system link " destroyed/massacred " that quality levels.?. Even that, any one with my unit in those tube systems heard it the differences for the better even that almost all were biased/equalized and accustomed for many years to the quality levels of tubes and a well designed SS item is way different and we have to try not only to understand it but assimilate it step by step: we have to re-set all what we are accustom to and start to understand the new medium. Just as when we start to enjoy digital sources.

There are many things that surrounded the SS great experiences but rigth now I have to give and answer to the audio dover's trainer.


Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not distortions,
R.


Dear @dover : I think you are a masochistic man and return for more, my pleasure.

I never did a 13D review. That aluminum way resonant dedicated headshell is a mess and never used because I had my tonearm prototype that comes with an outstanding one. The picture where is mounted was used too on the sale listing and that tonearm ( Sony. ) was the one on hand ( out of work. ) to made that.

Thank's for your invitation to move at " your level ". No way my friend I was there around 20 years ago but I learned. Go figure, after so many time you just are " touching " the SS alternative but with very low knowledge from your part and maybe through your future audio life never can  really grow up.

Your frustrations levels are extremely high and every time that you come back for " more " you only are going deeper and deeper in that very dark hole where you " enjoy " your audio life. There is no single " point " where you can see the ligth in that hole.
Fine that's your privilege.

Come on dover you can't hit me. Stop trying through your posts, it's useless.

regards and enjoy the MUSUIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.


Dear Raul, I read your post of 4:51 PM on March 19.  In that post, you merely quote your earlier post.  What am I supposed to take away from that?  Your post prior to mine seemed to say that you match discrete transistors in order to create the balanced circuit in your Phonolinepreamp.  I responded that it must be very tedious to match transistors for a balanced circuit, by hand. I now realize that maybe you were saying that you DO use bipolar transistors (which contain two very closely matched active devices in one case) but that the ones you use are specially selected for you by a lab at Mexico University.  Is that what you meant?  And why should I think that this makes the 3150 unbeatable?  Why must you then also throw in the insult that my system is not good enough for the 3150? You've evidently sold units to others with tube amplifiers, if that's the kernel of your disdain.

Btw, please read carefully this thread's information about the first Essential version:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/experience-with-raul-s-essential-3150?highlight=essential%2B3....

of those gentlemans only A.Porter and F.Crowder listened the 3160 ( third version. No one but me the fourth that only I owns. ). I was at their places twice.

Dear Raul, are you trying to pull out names of well-respected members of this forum to support your views? If so, it is such an irony that you picked these 2 gentlemen to mention. Just look at what equipment they are using right now!

It is especially interesting that you mentioned Mr Porter, to whom I must give thanks to for his invaluable advice on Aesthetix equipment. By looking at the date of the post (2006), he probably was using the Signature version of the Aesthetix at the time, as the updated version, which he got later, came out in around 2009.

So, after auditioning your phonolinepreamp, he stayed with the “tube 30's alternative” (your words, not mine). He changed to the IO and Callisto Eclipse later, and then changed to the Allnic. It is interesting that the Allnic is using tubes of even older designs (if I am not mistaken) than the Aesthetix!

Also, I have reread the whole thread above, and it seems to me that no one participated in that thread shared you view of tubes being inferior to SS. Even an owner of your phonolinepreamp was (and still is, I believe) using tube amp. Yes, some preferred your phonolinepreamp over some other models of tubed designs, but the opposite was also true.

>I reserve my opinion about the Essential 3150 quality sound reproduction against not only the Aesthethix one but about any other phonolinepreamp. This not belongs to my targets and I'm not the right person to do it because the Essential 3150 is an important part in the José and my life and we could have some bias in favor of the Essential 3150.<

I have also found your comment above in that thread. Looks like you have changed you mind regarding:
“I reserve my opinion about the Essential 3150 quality sound reproduction against not only the Aesthethix one but about any other phonolinepreamp. This not belongs to my targets and I'M NOT THE RIGHT PERSON TO DO IT .......and we could have SOME BIAS in favor of the Essential 3150.“ (my emphasis by capitalization), since then!

I explain ( trhough an Agon post. ) in precise way that that picture that shows the cartridge mounted in its dedicated headshell was only to use it in my ad for sale Agon listing.
Raul, why would you mount, advertise and sell a cartridge mounted incorrectly in its dedicated headshell upside down. Do you sell your Essential preamp with the channels reversed inside the preamp for fun too ?  
I never mounted the 13D in my system with that headshell: never.
Therefore you posted a review of this cartridge without having listened to it in the Dynavector recommended proprietary headshell, hardly an authoritative review. Furthermore check slide 3, it is mounted incorrectly in your tonearm. Tell me, how do you review cartridges - do you just look a them. And of course you pass a review on a cartridge you have never heard - your Dynavector 13D had a non standard cantilever bearing no resemblance whatsoever to the original.
Raul, if you read my posts more carefully you may find the path to exceed your AHEE status and move up to my level. I am well past the cognitive development stage and am now at the AHAA level.

Cheers   

Dear @dover :   """  you might want to look at eliminating the circuit boards...."""


it's obvious that you have no single idea of the very high level of our design where it's not posible to even think on that.

Did you know that almost any single electronic designs has high or/and low frequency oscilations? that the designers was not aware off. Did you took note of the Essential extremely wide frequency range?, I think only the Spéctral is down there. These and other critical design issues in our targets preclude simplistic kind of design with a few parts. Our design prevents almost everything a skilled designer can imagine, it's a bullet proof design. Not like your LOMC stage. Yes, even that our design is a non-State of the Art one it surpass yours by a wide margin, no doubt about. problem is that you can't understand this and that as always you are only trying to hit me but you know what: you just can't do it because my shield against it is your self ignorance levels that is different from my self ignorance one.

Btw, please read carefully this thread's information about the first Essential version:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/experience-with-raul-s-essential-3150?highlight=essential%2B3...

of those gentlemans only A.Porter and F.Crowder listened the 3160 ( third version. No one but me the fourth that only I owns. ). I was at their places twice.

This one is part of the gentlemans that heard the 2nd version:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/experience-with-raul-s-essential-3150/post?postid=326270#3262...

The best of all those was and is the whole experiences I had meeting extraordinary people/human beens, whom gave me their precious time and their family time too !!!  !!!!

Por that THANK YOU TO ALL OF YOU, again.


No one try to hit me as you.


Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.

Why know I that you once and again try to hit me with out success?, because you can't resist the temptation to post again  those you tube links that you made it expressely to do that years ago.

And you posted here in this thread even that many time ago, when you did it the first time, I explain ( trhough an Agon post. ) in precise way that that picture that shows the cartridge mounted in its dedicated headshell was only to use it in my ad for sale Agon listing. As a fact you took it from that ad.

I never mounted the 13D in my system with that headshell: never.  

You already knew this but your very high frustration levels with me provoque that non-mature attitude from your part. Pity.







Dear @lewm : You only see my posts but don't really " read " it:


"""  urious that you named the MAT02 and totally " weird " that you think I’m used in the Essential.

That matched bipolar pairs along the MAT03 were used in the late 80’s by ML and even that are good devices are not what we were looking in our near " perfect " Essential design and that’s why we took a very hard very hard task to choose individual discrete bipolars and not only that but we choosed/tested diferent manufacturers where even that almost all were made it the same did not sounds exactly the same. After the choice the hardest task was to have matched pairs that we can’t do it by our self, this task was responsability of a México University. No, not all similar bipolars sounds the same. Yes, it's more easy to handkle and to design a circuit with MAT kind of devices than single discrete bipolars, remember that single discrete bipolars has not the very high gain in the MATs and that was an additional issue to solve in the Essential design. """

"""  we don’t use it any single chips in the circuit not even the discrete ones but the B&B buffer """


R.



Nandric,
I'm not convinced "we all think in the same way". My professional life includes overhauling businesses and business processes. Believe me, one of the most powerful ways of removing "blockages" in businesses is by showing people how to think differently and empowering them.

Notwithstanding, I have no dispute with Raul other than I object to his claim that he has superior listening capability "AHEE" to everyone else on this forum. Raul cannot possibly know this for certain unless he has personally met everyone and experienced many listening sessions with every single person on this forum. Clearly that is not the case.

Similarly, Rauls claims that  his audio system has lower distortion than every other system on this forum cannot be proven. Now here I am able to critique this premise on the basis of shared experiences. I own or have listened to extensively many of the cartridges, arms and turntables that Raul has reviewed on this forum and from those reviews I have been able to discern quite clearly that his system is low resolution as far as analogue goes. Even if we assume he has the best phono stage in the world, there are failings to extract the best from his cartridges. In my view the issue probably lies in his choice of turntables and arms. In some instances it may be that his cartridges have been purchased second hand or are 30 years old and are not performing to the standard that they left the factory. Poor set up on his part is another possibility - I have already posted links to photos that show Raul set his Dynavector Nova 13 ( which by the way had been butchered with a replacement cantilever nothing like the original ) had been mounted with the headshell upside down. 
Link to Rauls butchered Dynavector Nova 13D compared to my own factory rebuilt specimen - look that the cantilevers in the photo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vveRGz-s4g
Link to Rauls Dyanvector Nova 13D mounted the wrong way up in its custom headhsell -  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4o-imxZHS8     
For someone who claims to be a more knowledgeable than everyone else on this forum this lack of understanding on how to set a cartridge up properly as evidenced in the photos above is enlightening.

Cheers. 
 

Raul, My source for the notion that you use the MAT02 in your preamplifier is.... you.  You told me this in a personal email a few years ago.  In the same email, you in effect congratulated me for choosing it. Or perhaps I misunderstood you; perhaps you just meant that you liked the MAT02 in general and did not mean to imply that you used it in the preamp. It doesn't really matter to me. I did not choose it at random; I chose it based on direct personal advice from Allen Wright, who told me he would use it in his RTP3C, if cost and availability were no problem.  (Read his book "The Preamplifier Cookbook"; the MAT02 is now out of production, so far as I know.) If I am wrong in my thinking that you use the MAT02, thanks for the correction.  It seems you are reluctant to divulge just what transistor you do use in your unit, but isn't the term "discrete bipolar" an oxymoron?  The MAT02 and 03 are "bipolar" in that each contains two matched devices in one shell.  If you use discretes, one for each phase, then you don't use a bipolar.  Since the matching of the two halves in the MAT02 and like bipolar devices is fantastically tight, far tighter than one can get with matching tubes, I don't know what you gain by using discretes, except aggravation trying to match them.  But that's your business and your preference.

In mentioning the CTC Blowtorch, Vendetta, and MFA Luminescence (which I think is over-rated by modern standards), I was only trying to side with you, by suggesting that your Phonolinepreamp may eventually assume similar long term "status", and therefore enhanced value, among audio aficionados, who are nothing if not snobbish when it comes to expensive yet unobtainable gear.  I was not at all implying that your preamp is worse, or better, than any of the above.

And finally, neither you nor I nor anyone else can prove by winning some sort of verbal debate that one piece of equipment is better or worse than another.  Words don't suffice.  And, whether you like it or not, emotion plays a huge role in how one chooses one's components.

Dear Dover, ''different opinions'' does not mean ''different thinking''

because we all think in the same way: from our premises to our

conclusions or deductions. The difference then means ''different

premises'' which are believed to be true . But ''believing '' has noting

to do with the truth. Something is true or false independent from our

psychology. .As is clear by your dispute with Raul you both have

different premises. BTW I also admire Reto Andreoli and own his

Magic Diamond and also Ikeda's 9 cantileverless cart.. Both are excellent

carts but Magic more easy to adjust. Reto learned the ''cart art'' at the

age of 15 by the famous Australian brothers. The other components

he learned himself while all his components are hand made by himself.

I got my Magic second hand his other components I, alas, can't afford.


Raul
My MC pre eschews the use of circuit boards, has no wiring, every component is soldered to the other components in free space ( in a 3 dimensional array to minimise component interaction as is done in the Mares Connoisseur ).
For your next build you might want to look at eliminating the circuit boards, and eliminate the resonant and hystereses inducing metal chassis, and all switches in the signal path. If your circuit is as good as you claim, then eliminating the circuit boards, resonant chassis and switches should be an audible improvement of a significant margin.

The answer to your question is yes, the same Reto Andreoli that builds cartridges selling up to $50k and for which he has an 18 month waiting list. Personally I don't use his cartridge but he has some interesting ideas on cartridge tracking/cantilever/stylus profile and the issues of how to minimise distortion on playback. He is a fan of the cantileverless Ikeda MC that I use which is very close to emulating the cutter head action in playback resulting in very low mechanical distortion and phase anomalies on playback.  

Dear @dover : Hysteresis distortion?, well that kind of distortion has different sources and of different kind ( existe magnetic hysteresis, example. ) and can detected as: spurious components/non-linearities in the signal frequency bands, especially on amplifiers. You don’t have to worried about in our design.

Well our four layer circuit boards could be not espcial if I don’t know what you mean for special. Our circuit boards were made it in Silicon Valley and choosed after we tested 4 different build materials in the circuit boards. This is an example only on how the Essential was builded and one of the many reasons the Essential performs with that so high excellence levels.

You name it the Vendetta and Blowtorch ( I don’t know why. ), well no one is a good reference for me. Our non-State of the ART Essential outperforms both easily. Btw, our design handle LOMC cartridges with an output level as low as 0.01mv. The Essential use only bipolars in gain stages and not FET/MOSFETS as the Blowtorch/Vendetta and uses no single internal wire but everithing input to output is hand soldered to the circuit boards.

Btw too, we don’t use it any single chips in the circuit not even the discrete ones but the B&B buffer. Btw, I was in one of the B&B facilities that’s nothing less than " impressive " and that was in Tucson, AZ.

As a comercial product the Essential is irrelevant to the forum but way releveant on what we can have and a target to fulfill.
I don’t know but thinking on people as M.Lavigne could made that I take again the flag of my latest Essential again and produce it. No, it’s not for you. You can stay with your engineering friends that are years a head the legitimate State of the Art: good for you.

Anyway, thak’s to your contribution.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not Distortions,
R.

Good to read that finally you are using SS technology with LOMC cartridges. A very good link to start and I hope that step by step and carefully you can follow doing in the time in the other system links.
Btw, that gentleman Andreoli is the same whom took the 103 inexpensive motor and created the Blue Magic cartridges in a price range from 3.5K to 7.5K dollars?





One full mistake from my part:

" poor design ", I'm not refereing to it self design on those tube electronics but to the poor technology.

R.
Raul -
2 further thoughts on your system. You will be pleased to know that like you I use outdated bipolar devices for optimum LOMC amplification, mine designed and hand built by Reto Andreoli. It is vastly more transparent and than anything else I have heard including my old Klyne 3.5 and some pretty exotic SUT's.
As far as the Levinson mono blocks, the mods you describe make good sense, but at the end of the day those amps are slow. I would only use them for boat anchors. You might want to look at replacing those in my view,

Cheers. 

Raul,
It is possible your preamp is quite good. ’State of the art’ unlikely from what I’ve seen. For a start the casework and circuit board physical attributes utilised in the Essential in of themselves induce significant hysteresis distortion. Your circuit boards are nothing special. What is "state of the art". "state of the art" implies state of the current art, but what you don’t understand is that there are many design engineers out there in non audio industries that are operating at design levels way ahead of current audio "state of the art".

I have access to 2 engineers who work outside the audio spectrum - one can reproduce any solid state phono stage currently in existence with improvements - you want a vendetta why ? I can build you a Blowtorch with enhancements. Halcro in this forum had a fault in his Halcro preamp, my tech can read the circuit and chips used from the topology even without removing the masking paint from the board and components. You want the noise floor of the latest Burmester preamp lowered - no problem. You want to improve Lewms tube preamp - no problem - we can go in there and do onboard regulation using new state of the art stacked op amps that no tube manufacturer would even be aware of unless they were designing in the digital domain as well. Why doesn’t he produce audio equipment - because commercial audio product cannot bear the cost of a design engineer who is operating at a level above current state of the art in our hobby.

You want a phono stage unlike any other produced - easy - the other engineer built his own phono stage designed specifically for MC’s with output down to 0.1mv and below including compensation for known cutterhead/amplifier deviations from RIAA using proprietary Burr brown chips. Can it be produced commercially - no because the chips are 1 off advanced research chips not even available to any current audio designer including the likes of Bob Stuart at Meridian - we are talking 3 generations ahead of current technology when it was produced.

So my friend take it from me - anything available commercially is out of date even before it is released to market, and significantly off true "state of the art" for which my definition is "in advance of what is currently commercially available by a significant margin".
Your Essential preamp is irrelevant to this forum - it is not available for audition anywhere commercially and if you think it is more advanced than anything else, then you are deluding yourself, there is always something out there better.

Cheers



@lewm : """  tell me about some of the revolutionary new transistors that are so radically different from what came before... """

whwn we started the Essential design we did it starting from below CERO. We had to learn every single subject from parts different sources to facilities to build boards and where machine the Essential boxes and everything. No one gave us any advises or any supoprt about and as a fact we did not ask for. Below CERO because we are not in USA, my country is way different.

So if you want to know more about bipolar transistors that's your personal job and if not for other thing but because you have to learn and that's the way to learn. In the other side if I tell you it will be useless for you because you can't handle/work with those kind of devices. Have to learn before you even think to buy it.

R.
Dear @lewm : Curious that you named the MAT02 and totally " weird " that you think I’m used in the Essential.

That matched bipolar pairs along the MAT03 were used in the late 80’s by ML and even that are good devices are not what we were looking in our near " perfect " Essential design and that’s why we took a very hard very hard task to choose individual discrete bipolars and not only that but we choosed/tested diferent manufacturers where even that almost all were made it the same did not sounds exactly the same. After the choice the hardest task was to have matched pairs that we can’t do it by our self, this task was responsability of a México University. No, not all similar bipolars sounds the same. Yes, it's more easy to handkle and to design a circuit with MAT kind of devices than single discrete bipolars, remember that single discrete bipolars has not the very high gain in the MATs and that was an additional issue to solve in the Essential design.

The ML circuit/stage where goes the MAT02 and 03 are a perfect circuit where those MATs are surrounded by a clever proved complementary devices.

Come back to the Essential I remember that in the external power supply we found out that simple circuit resistors ( not power resistors. ) changes makes that the Essential performs a little different. Extremely dificult to be aware about and we found out this by " accident " and after that we tested resistors everywhere in the power supply.

In those old times and before B&B was bougth by TI before any commercial source for naked resistors by Vishay we already were using it as many other today top parts.

No, my Essential can’t mate with the poor electronic designs you own. How can do it? is just impossible.

Even that’s out of production that design is years a head any other in today audio world. Maybe you don’t understand my past posts in this thread but our Essential was the very first Phonolinepreamp with the Neumann pole designed in the rigth way, the firstb one in the audio world: got this? understand this? and that is only one of " the first.. " and more important: performs just fantastic!

If I remember I offered to you and refuse to buy it. Big mistake.

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.
Dear @lewm : Do you know how after several years arrived where today I'm?:

some day ( and after that I continue with the same questions. ) I thougths:

what if all what the AHEE teached me and that I learned and living with is wrong?  where all those " wrong " audio subjects are? how to change and test these changes'?  and I took seriously all those and other questions and took ( I'm still doing. ) several actions. I'm not married in any way with audio but with MUSIC and nothing less.

Please do it a favor and ask your self something simple:

what if all those Raul's " craps "  are true?

I still make me questions as: what if I'm wrong in " this " or " that " ?

This is the attitude with we can really arrives " there ".

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.


@lewm :  """  people who read this crap and take it seriously, and I don't want anyone going off with a bad impression of tubes per se. """

crap?, only for those gentlemans that don't want to understand the tube " crap " subject in 2017.

Here in México people say: " that the worst deaf man is the one that does not wants to hear "  and " that the worst blind man is the one that does not wants to see "  . Whom are you?. I want to think neither because one thing is that you like ( you have no alternative because you don't want to change: yet. ) to defend what you have and the other is that you have high ignorance level that I know for sure you don't.


""  using the very same bipolar transistor that you use, or used to use, in your phonolinepreamp,  """

wrong, I never used the MAT02/03 in the Essential. These are very old Analog Devices items and very good ones. As a fact those devices comes in my ML monoblocks ( this amplifier design I think is unbeatble even today. It's a " electronic lesson for any one. ).

No, we use " discrete " single matched bipolars that we choosed in between more than 10 different bipolars in the market. 

""  if you want to lend me a phonolinepreamp "", 10 years ago maybe I accepted not today. 

Not today not just because I " don't want it " but because first you have to take actions to move on where you are. If your attitude to do nothing but only critics with out real foundations living sticky in that " crap " you never grow-up and certainly I can't borrow my unit.

Things are that I can see that almost none wants to do nothing to enjoy MUSIC and it does not matters what you think about.
Yes, I know that you think that you are improving your analog experience but in reality you are only walking with back-steps and side-steps but improving: NOTHING.

@lewm : wake-up. You are in the road of a Formula 1 race " improving " your cicle/Honda Civic to compete against the true real F1 cars ! ! ! 

Why is so dificult to you and other people to understand it. You are trying to compete in that F1 race with a car of the Fangio times against the today top car technology.

It's RIDICULOUS for say the least. The name of the game in audio is: MUSIC and that'0s why exist all those net forums: to learn about as we learn here in Agon.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.


Raul, Did you read my post from 3 PM today? In that post, I acknowledged that solid state devices can be put to good use in audio. Yes, the quote from the IEEE is an old one; I may even have posted it once before. When I come down adamantly on the other side, it is mainly because your attitudes are so infuriating, and I feel the need to be as dogmatic as you, only on the other side of the argument.  There may be people who read this crap and take it seriously, and I don't want anyone going off with a bad impression of tubes per se. Yes, for sure, I use a balanced differential hybrid cascode at the input to my phono stage, using the very same bipolar transistor that you use, or used to use, in your phonolinepreamp, as the bottom half of the cascode.  The MAT02.  It is very quiet indeed, but the main advantage is tremendous high gain. (The MAT02 has a transconductance of about 500 with only 10mA of current. No tube can do that.)  Because the gain is so high, I can anyway maximize signal to noise by keeping the volume control around 8 or 9 o'clock, where I even have enough gain for the Ortofon MC2000.  But keep in mind, the top half of the cascode, and every active device downstream, is tubes.

Like I also said above, if you want to lend me a phonolinepreamp, I would be pleased to audition it.  If you would just stop being a butthead about tubes, we could have other serious discussions.

By the way, please tell me about some of the revolutionary new transistors that are so radically different from what came before. FETs and MOSFETs are no longer brand new.
thekong insist in that airborne high distortions in my system/room because he can't not onloy understand it but even imagine any system reproduction with out that ! ! !. Is not his culprit, just can't understand it yet ? ? ? and if insist in that subject he will not ever.

Dear Raul, maybe I don't understand, but I am sure real expert like Mr J Carr must know. As I have quoted before, here is what he had to say on the subject (my emphasis by capitalization) :

BTW, I wouldn’t recommend combining the phono preamp together with the power amp. THE SOUND OF THE TURNTABLE IS TOO MUCH AFFECTED BY VIBRATIONS TRANSMITTED THROUGH THE AIR AND GROUND. FOR TOP PERFORMANCE THE TURNTABLE SHOULD BE IN A SEPARATE ROOM/CLOSET ISOLATED FROM THE VIBRATIONS AND AIR PRESSURE FROM THE LOUDSPEAKERS. If you were to go with a combination phono/preamp/power amp together with the turntable in an isolated room, the speaker cables would likely need to be v-e-r-y long.

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/best-phono-preamps

On reply, you said the following:

Dear @thekong : Look, I never said that air borne does not produce vibrations/distortions. In the other side, I already did it that test.<

So, apparently you are claiming that while airborne vibration do affect others systems, your system is somehow immune to it! Problem is you can’t even come up with a theory on why that is so, let alone proving it!

Maybe, your room / system is so out of this world that physic works differently over there!

No one deserves to stay sticky where he is " now ". We have to move to enrich our day by day audio life.

So very true! Look at where you are, drilling on the same old things all these years!

You probably should stop living in a delusion!



Dear @lewm :  """ his nearly crazy hatred of tubes. """

No, I don't loose my time on something like " hatred " that in any circumstances ( in any subject or scenarion. ) affect my health. Human been nervous's system equilibrum is the name of a healthy life.

In the other side I already experienced the tube " massacre " to the MUSIC.

@lewm I know that tubes can makes " sond " but a simple piece of paper can do either and either my target and what I'm talking for years is not about " sound " but the rare experience of LIVE MUSIC through a home audio system.

That's the difference on what you and me are talking about. Certainly you need ( is a must to do it for any one. ) to experience it.

To that can/could happens is not a process of " one week to the next ". No, it's a long process because you have to learn step by step what to do and how arrive " there ". This demanding and learning ( with a lot of fun and frustations in between. ) beautiful process took me years not months where step by step I started to discovery the real and true NEW MUSIC/AUDIO WORLD that only whom are " there " can really understand.

thekong insist in that airborne high distortions in my system/room because he can't not onloy understand it but even imagine any system reproduction with out that ! ! !.  Is not his culprit, just can't understand it yet ? ? ? and if insist in that subject he will not ever.

@lewm , some of my friends here " refuse " to come to my place to listen  MUSIC ( in reality they come. ) because they told me that after they finished their last up-grade ( any kind. ) in their system and when they thougth that are " there " come and listen and they gone from my place with additional frustations that are their new challenge for the near future and I'm not talking of gentlemans that are audio rookies, some have tubes and other SS based systems.

@lewm life and everything in universe is changin every " second " and I think we have to change just for " fun ". Rewards are unimaginable and with NO-RETURN.

No one deserves to stay sticky where he is " now ". We have to move to enrich our day by day audio life.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.
The majority of the people with high audio ignorance levels always try to hit me and that’s the only reason they post in threads where I’m. Problem with them is that in reality can’t hit me becfause they do not know audio arguments that could does it.
Typical example of that is @thekong , this gentleman post after post is trying that and he did not achieved and his frustation levels goes higher and higher then come back " for more ". Be that way if he is happy with.

Dear Raul, I think you have misunderstood, I never tried to “hit” you!

The way I see it is that, in your “nearly crazy hatred of tubes”, as Lewm has rightly puts it, you lose sight on the bigger picture, can’t see the forest for the trees, so to speak.

You have paid much attention to the electronics (maybe that is the subject you are good at), but fail to see the much bigger distortion generator of your system, your room and the airborne feedback (in the case of the turntable system).

You have always boasted about the distortion figures of your phonolinepreamp, but you have avoided questions regarding the distortion level at your listening seat (i.e., measuring of audio signal at your listening seat, as compared to output of the phono / CD). Distortion level at the LISTENING SEAT, isn't that the whole point about a low distortion SYSTEM?

I think you would be quite surprised, even horrified, if you actual see the result of such measurement.

Distortion of the electronic is only a very small part of the total distortion of the system. While, in the name of high fidelity, we certainly want to minimize the distortion of the electronics, we also can't neglect the bigger issues out there.

Your denial on the obvious shortcomings of your room / system, and your confident (maybe over confident) of your ears being better trained than most of others, just prevent you from making further improvements!

I want to make it very clear here, I don't claim to have a superior knowledge / system / ears than you (or anyone else for that matter), but I tried to keep an open mind and not limit myself to only one design type. Maybe it is a surprise to you, but I actually owned SS electronics (Pass Xono, Vendetta etc.) and they are part of my system. So, I am not anti-SS by any means.

BTW, I don't get frustrated on what you do with your system, it is your system after all, and you are the one listening to it day-in, day-out. As long as you are happy with it, everything is fine with me.


While I have enjoyed a couple of solid state phono stages and tube linestages since then, I am open to considering all designs and never nod my head in agreement when you mention me as someone who "saw the light" regarding solid state superiority. I just sold my hybrid monoblocks and am replacing with a solid state power amp, but that doesn't mean I don't still appreciate virtues of all design types. I am a believer that there is "more than one way to skin a cat". Please don't use me as an example of the opposite.

Hi Spencer, thank you for your post regarding what happened in your room!

I agreed with your above statement wholeheartedly. There is no perfect component, and we shouldn't limit ourselves to one (any) design type!

Like you, I also have both tubes and SS components, and they do have different advantages.

Dear @lewm : I re-read your post of advantages/disadvantages and that’s exactly what I learned and what learned all the biased tube lovers.

But that was information created in the middle of the past century and today we are in other century in 2017. Don’y you think that through 67+ years things improved for SS? even today exist bipolars designed specific for audio something that was not on those very old days. In the other side SS designers enhance their knowledge and skills levels.

Almost nothing of your post against SS is true today.

Btw, noise level in a unit is a kind of distortion and no one single tube design can approach the very low noise floor in SS today units.
@lewm why your unit is an hybrid one?, easy answer: to achieve clean high gain with low noise that tubes can’t even. Noise levels are part of the dynamic range as is the frequency response widder or not range

You are only one of the few gentlemans that even that sometimes are angry gainst me never try to hit me and that’s why we can have hot discussions learning inside it both of us.

The majority of the people with high audio ignorance levels always try to hit me and that’s the only reason they post in threads where I’m. Problem with them is that in reality can’t hit me becfause they do not know audio arguments that could does it.
Typical example of that is @thekong , this gentleman post after post is trying that and he did not achieved and his frustation levels goes higher and higher then come back " for more ". Be that way if he is happy with.

Now, your post there today are only myths in reference to SS electronics. Myths as are many of your touted tubes. Example: tubes development of second harmonics ia the name of the game against odd ones developed by SS.

But reality is way different regarding audiophiles top preferences and exist very well documented blind tests in listening sessions with two similar amps where one develop 2nd. harmonics and the other the odd third one and you know what: all golden ears prefered the sound of the amp developing third harmonics. But this is not the only example on harmonics there are many and the next is other very good example of those audio myths:

if any one of us ask to other audiophile which the best true analog source experience 100% will answer: Open Reel tape recorders.
Well, this analog best source develps only odd harmonics: 3nd and fifth, we can’t measure 2nd harmonic down there.

As I posted here and every where I owned several all tube audio system and heard top top systems handled by the best tube designs ( you can name it any and you can be sure I already experienced. ) and no single one can honor MUSIC. Yes, it can " sound " but I’m not looking for sound as @thekong or others: I’m looking for the " perfect " system that can be nearest to the live MUSIC as no other one in Earth. SS is today the only path to achieve it.

Again: now, I posted several times in this and other forums than in any audio system the owner of it can be sure that the system quality level performance is true " top notch " when the digital experience outperforms the analog experience in his sytem.
Always existed and exist the myth that CD were " irritant " especially in the high frequencies and a limited source on frequency range and many other " myths " but the culprit in reality is not of the CD by it self technology but from those old DACs and some bad recordings but several of those " bad " recordings " we thought were really bad and when your system is " there " then that bad CD will performs just amazing and surpassing its LP counterpart. There is no doubt about, you only have to to have that kind of quality system level with a today CD player ( no, you don’t need HR or other digital technology. ). Digital surpassed several years ago what LP can’t even and never will It does not matters what MF say about that btw when he still support the LP experiences are only saying that his audio system is not " there " yet.

Even in this forum today exist people that are digifhobic and are in this way because his very high ignorance levels.

Here is an interesting post, please read on what this very special gentleman posted about digital experience:

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/interesting-project-started-by-michael-fremer/post?postid=126...

and we are not talking of a more of the same: audio system:

https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/615


I will continue because there are to much to learn from every one here and ever where.

@lewm there are four versions of my Essential phonolinepreamp: the very first 3150, a revision/up date to the 3150, the third is a whole revision and is the 3160 and the fourth version is my unit where I made it additional modifications. Yes, always looking for " perfection " nothing less. Same with my tonearm design.


Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.







Dear @sbank : No, I'm not using you. Far away from that. As you I have very good memory ( is an atribute God gave me. ) and I remember those great days with you people.

Things were as this: "  poorly constructed Omega Mikro power cable was stepped on and damaged resulting in a DC surge ", yes I made it by accident when I was trying to connect my unit that at that moment was the only unit switch on in your system and things happen when I was swtching on my unit. No other system item was on. What happened is that all the external and internal fuses in my unit blow and we can't listen the system with my unit. After this you and me gone to Radio Shack and bougth new fuses ( the original ones were expensive hi-fi tune fuses. ). Comeback to your house and my unit works flawless on that " accident " and was precisely in this moment when the OTL were swtching on and we listening for a whle with out no problem. The problem was latter on ( the other gentlemans already gone after the listen session. As a fact you and me were in a hurry because your friends were invited to that listening session and my unit was down! ) and I remember that you and me were trying to identify which of the tubes in the amplifier connected at the left speaker was the problem and we did it smelling it.

In the other side,I remember at your place that when Joe ( whom knew very well your system quality performance levels. ) was there and we were listening your system and playing with my unit he approach me close to my left ear and told me: " Raul you are a magician ". Certainly I'm not other thing than a music lover.

Anyway, thank's for your contribution and again sorry to disturb you that was not my intentions. Never is with no one every where.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.






Just to be clear, by tweaking Raul for his nearly crazy hatred of tubes, I do not mean to imply a similar negative bias against transistors. Perhaps I went too far in that direction, in order to get Raul's goat. (Raul, there must be an equivalent phrase in Spanish.)  I am quite confident that wonderful sounding gear can be built with either or both types of active devices. I like to think that I have an open mind in this regard.  But it is simply not true that "tubes" are inherently higher in distortion than are solid state devices, which is Raul's mantra.  On that point, I do insist.  And anyway, this is a sidebar to the debate about the FR64S, which is also a sidebar to the OP's question about comparing the FR54 to the FR64S.  Love it or hate it, the FR64S is meant to be superior to the FR54 by its makers. At least we got that much across.

I would welcome the opportunity to audition Raul's phonolinepreamp in my system(s).  I was lately under the impression that it is out of production.  Someone would have to loan me one.  It is quite possible for a low production, high end product such as that one to become a "cult classic" with enduring value and even the potential for appreciation.  People pay way over original price for such pieces as the CTC Blowtorch, the MFA Luminescence, the Vendetta phono stage, etc. (I owned two tweaked samples of the MFA Luminescence, and I much prefer my Atma-sphere MP1.)

You all have wondered pretty far off topic, but since an event in my listening room with mentioned, I feel obligated to reply:
@rauliruegas My recollection is that while connecting your phonolinepreamp in my system a poorly constructed Omega Mikro power cable was stepped on and damaged resulting in a DC surge that reached the power amps and took out 2 tubes. When replaced all was fine. The fault lies in the Omega Mikro power cable (which the manufacturer wanted to charge near full price to repair -- leading me to trash it!), not in the OTL power amp. 
While I have enjoyed a couple of solid state phono stages and tube linestages since then, I am open to considering all designs and never nod my head in agreement when you mention me as someone who "saw the light" regarding solid state superiority. I just sold my hybrid monoblocks and am replacing with a solid state power amp, but that doesn't mean I don't still appreciate virtues of all design types. I am a believer that there is "more than one way to skin a cat". Please don't use me as an example of the opposite. 

Everyone, Raul is correct that many who heard his phonolinepreamp then and the following day in @slipknot1 's (aka JoeG) system were very impressed with the sound quality, especially since most were fans of tube gear. 
IMHO, the reason none of them bought one was the obvious, we all are quite hesitant to buy gear from any new manufacturer, especially since we often change gear and depreciation is a huge factor with unproven, unloved brands. For any new brand to make it, it takes a combination of superior sound, unique features, and a few risk takers who enjoy jumping in earlier even at financial risk. Cheers,
Spencer 
Dear @lewm : It's weird that you did not mention nothing about tube or SS handling of inherent design noise levels. I want to think that you forgot to mention it and if not then was on purpose.

Can you share your thougths about, it's important how you see that main audio subject. If tubes are better: good and if SS are the ones: good.

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.
Hi Raul, basically you are just blowing your own horn and boosting about your own design, as always! Do you even have an idea what IEEE, as mentioned by Lewm, stands for?

Btw, I made 3 USA trips showing my unit and learning on what other people listen to. In those times and maybe even today almost all the people that I meet there and that were my hostess ( great gentlemans for say the least. ) were not prepared for my SS Phonolinepreamp quality sound level performance. Almost all were using tube electronics but even this fact no one posted here or told me that my unit was or is a " trash " of design, including Lloyd Walker.<

Maybe, unlike you, your hosts were just being polite, and not wanting to criticize your product in front of you. You were promoting / marketing your product during those trips, and if the hosts were so impressed with it, how come not too many of them ordered your product? How many units have you sold? I think the result just speaks for itself!

I clearly remember at least one highly respected member on this forum openly stated he preferred another design (tube!!!) to your unit!

You can always say you are ahead of others and your way is the right / best way, but then the result speaks it all!

Dear @thekong : I can't detect it due to that glorious so low distortions in my today system/room.

That also doesn’t make any sense at all!

-The airborne audio feedback to your turntables is a fact (or are you denying physics?)

- The airborne feedback would cause higher distortion to the sound than distortion from the electronics.

- In your system, the room and the speakers would have higher distortion than the electronics. You don't know because you have never measured the signal at your listening position and compared it to the signal from the output of the phono / CD.

- If your system is that “glorious so low distortions”, the airborne feedback distortion should just stick out like a sore thumb. How could you not detecting it?

- You can’t detect the airborne feedback distortion because either i) your ears are not as sensitive as you think, or ii) your room / system has such a high intrinsic distortion that it masked the airborne feedback distortion!



Dear @lewm  : """ You are entitled to your listening preferences.... """

totally wrong, I'm not. I'm entitled to MUSIC, live MUSIC. My preferences has nothig to do on how live MUSIC sounds/flows. This is my main target.

""" but you are not entitled to create your own set of facts ... """

I don't have to do it but in reality I always did and do it. Problem for you and every one is that refuse to mimic in each one system my experiences.

You are a very good example of that: for years through the subwoofer thread I started and through emails to you I told you that your system needs ( this is a main necessity in evry audio system. Period. ) the integrattion of 2 self powered subs and you gave me several reasons why not. Your answers were very similar of the ones by my close friend Guillermo ( here in México. ) whom owns the big Soundlabs.  Today he is using a pair of subs in his systems and when he did it he told me: you had reason.

As you and many other audiophiles in this forum if the advise comes ( for first time. ) directly by Raul then refuse to do it and months or years latter many of them do it when that " advise " comes from other source but Raul.
Obviously that I don't care about. Losting the appreciated audio/music time is each one privilege.

With you happened the same with your second system when followed what Beveridge did or do on that subwoofer subject but they are not subs experts, are far away from there. So, what you did it about ( it does not matters what you can think. ) is just wrong. I already told you in the subs thread.

Now, on your audio/MUSIC " facts ":

Vacuum tubes – Advantages :

all those false/myth " facts " you learned through the real AHEE and I know that because I learned the same " facts " and that's why I used for some years an all tube audio system from Marantz through AR, CJ, AN ( Ongaku, between others. ) and many other items and I listened to almost all kind of tube designs including the ones you own. This is a real FACT.

Suddenly ( well not really suddenly. ) I started to learn and changed step by step to SS electronics till my system was all SS but something was not exactly as I wanted and that's why I started to think and take actions " out of the box " " out of what, as you, learned in that AHEE.

That's why I participated first hand in our Phonolinepreamp that I own and other lucky audiophiles.

This " unique " overall design experiences were and are my best audio/MUSIC lessons every where in the world and through those ( many years. ) true facts experiences I learned that all those advantages you name it are  in reality false and I give you some examples:

- negative feedback: this issue is not true in SS today good item designs. In ours exist no-negative feedback and works in pure class A, fully regulated input to output and fully diferential two. Our design in reality has 12 independent preamps channels.
Even today is absolutely unbeatable by any today units that are in the market.

I remember the first gentleman that ask me if we can manufacture for him our very first sample and we said yes, please gave us 6 months for you can have it in your system. History is that he had to waited 2 full years to receive it. Even he made the payment in advance through that time.
I think you already seen this chart that speaks by it self on what I posted here:


https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipPJLuDhIxhHGsjv2ZABr3TIpxMewVor1Pz33vhLoiISsURJmmnxUQB9cuwNnpog...


that is chart of my Phonolinepreamp I have. Till today unbeatable and this is a fact.

That unit has a very wide frequency range from 0.01hz to 1.5Mhz making easy not to use global negative feedback. Btw, negative feedback is not wrong or bad per se all it depends where and how use it and the knowledge and skill levels of the designers.


- clipping: again, all depend on the quality of design. Today normally decent SS designs has no problem about. Has high headroom and high overload margines.

- wider dynamic range: realloy? how is that? because your hybrid unit can't not only even but be near of my unit in that regards and in any other ! ! !  and this is a fact.

- circuit design tends to be simpler: agree and that's why any one can design a tube unit and that's why exist the famous DIYS that does not exist with top SS designs. Yes is a lot more complex especially when the design is using bipolars devices as my unit or my monoblocks. Not all designers like to work with and prefer the easiest Fet/MOsfets.

- operation in class A and AB: well almost all top today SS electronics ( bipolars or not. ) are in pure class A and non-feedback.


Transistor disadvantages:


  • Tendency toward higher distortion than equivalent tubes: Really?

Is useless to continue analizing each one advantages/disadvantages you posted because almost all are false on SS today designs and the tube advantages you name it just does not exist: maybe 40-50 years ago but not today and this is a fact.

I remember many reliability times with different tube electronics and I will name it 2-3:

in one of my USA trips I was hosted by my dear friend @sbanks ( Spencer. ) for 2-3 days whom in those times owned exactly the tube electronics you own and the very first day that we ( some other Spencer's friends and now mine as Joe. ) were listened his system his touted by you OTLs ( one of them. ) just " blow-out ". Well goes down because a failure in two tubes and in front of me he called the designer and well you know what happens when that happens.

in other of my USA trips and in a over 300K price audio system ( speakers alone are in the 160K price range. ) happens the same with a tube top very top unit that when I saw the shipping double box to make the shipping ( I helped my friend to do it that same day. ) I knew at ounce where the money was because tubes and tube dsign can't justify more than 5K and this is incredible price for a tube unit. No, I don't care what tube designers can think about or the reasons they charge so much for their designs.

here in México and hearing a pair of Wilson speakers a top C&J top unit blow-out as the ones in Spencer's place.


I never experienced that so dramatic events with well designed SS electronics and certainly never with my units. When I experienced a reliability event in reality was not but a mistake from my part doing changes in the unit.

Btw, I made 3 USA trips showing my unit and learning on what other people listen to. In those times and maybe even today almost all the people that I meet there and that were my hostess ( great gentlemans for say the least. ) were not prepared for my SS Phonolinepreamp quality sound level performance. Almost all were using tube electronics but even this fact no one posted here or told me that my unit was or is a " trash " of design, including Lloyd Walker.

and we have to consider this: all of them listen to my unit in their system almost every time my fligth arrived to their places with out time to anything but listen it. Even in Denver with the snowing day in that hard condition my unit performed really fine.

@lewm , I'm some years ahead of you and some other audiophiles ( inclusive professional reviewers or equipment designers. ) and not because I'm so smart/intelligent or something like that but only because I finished the audio kinder-garden before some of you and that is my advantage between other critical audio subjects.

That's why @thekong insist that I prove what he just can't understand or the why people like @syntax always is joking/laughin of me: this gentleman as many other of his type are still in first kinder-garden grade and seems to me that he will die that way as some of his friends.

Things are the same in school: not all human beens finish the school grades at the same time.

@lewm , you have to hurry about because you has the intelligence to do it before many of the ones that posted in this thread. Every one with the rigth attitude and taking actions can not only even where I'm but can surpass me easily if they know what to do and do it starting today instead to posting critics or why I'm wrong.

There are many other interesting things to say but that will be for some other day. 


Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.




Dear @lewm : """  not the "AHEE", your fictional bugaboo. . ................  I don't want to go back and forth with you any longer.  """

Your post confirm not only that the AHEE is not a " bugaboo " but that you are a clear and precise audiophile that today, and even that you are an intelligent/wise gentleman, still are stiky firm on what you learned through that corrupted AHEE.

I'm not, I'm out of that " box " from many years now and tha's why my posts ( for years . ) speaks " different " ( and provoke/cause hot discussions. ) on what you and several other audiophiles are accustom to and speaks different because more than the 70% that I learned through that real and corrupted AHEE was and is TOTALLY WRONG and it does not matters what you or any one else think about.

Audio is a business for every one but audiophiles and are we the ones that give our honest money to that corrupted AHEE. Period.

In the other side, I have not time at this moment to give you and answer to your post, I will do latter on and if you don't want to come back to me then why you posted: ? ? ? ? 

Anyway, I will answer, is interesting to do it.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.


Dear Lew, ''...you are not entitled to create your own set of

facts''. ''Facts'' is the other expression for true statements.

Our reasoning consist of some implicite or explicite assumptions

(aka ''premisses'') which are believed to be true and deduction from

the premisses. That is why self-deception is the most common kind

of deception.

Dear @thekong : I can't detect it due to that glorious so low distortions in my today system/room.

Dear Raul, only in your dreams I afraid :-)

Always just talks but no prove, right?

Dear Raul, The below summary comes from the IEEE, not the "AHEE", your fictional bugaboo.  Note the first bullet point under the heading "Transistors-Disadvantages".  I don't want to go back and forth with you any longer.  You are entitled to your listening preferences, whatever they may be, but you are not entitled to create your own set of facts.  

Vacuum tubes – Advantages

  • Highly linear without negative feedback, specially some small-signal types
  • Clipping is smooth, which is widely considered more musical than transistors
  • Tolerant of overloads and voltage spikes
  • Characteristics highly independent of temperature, greatly simplifies biasing
  • Wider dynamic range than typical transistor circuits, thanks to higher operating voltages
  • Device capacitances vary only slightly with signal voltages
  • Capacitive coupling can be done with low-value, high-quality film capacitors
  • Circuit designs tend to be simpler than semiconductor equivalents
  • Operation is usually in Class A or AB, which minimizes crossover distortion
  • Output transformer in power amp protects speaker from tube failure
  • Maintenance tends to be easier because user can replace tubes

Vacuum tubes – Disadvantages

  • Bulky, hence less suitable for portable products
  • High operating voltages required
  • High power consumption, needs heater supply
  • Generate lots of waste heat
  • Lower power efficiency than transistors in small-signal circuits
  • Low-cost glass tubes are physically fragile
  • More prone to microphonics than semiconductors, especially in low-level stages
  • Cathode electron-emitting materials are used up in operation, resulting in shorter lifetimes (typically 1-5 years for power tubes)
  • High-impedance devices that usually need a matching transformer for low impedance loads, like speakers
  • Usually higher cost than equivalent transistors

Transistors – Advantages

  • Usually lower cost than tubes, especially in small-signal circuits
  • Smaller than equivalent tubes
  • Can be combined in one die to make integrated circuit
  • Lower power consumption than equivalent tubes, especially in small-signal circuits
  • Less waste heat than equivalent tubes
  • Can operate on low-voltage supplies, greater safety, lower component costs, smaller clearances
  • Matching transformers not required for low-impedance loads
  • Usually more physical ruggedness than tubes (depends on chassis construction)

Transistors – Disadvantages

  • Tendency toward higher distortion than equivalent tubes
  • Complex circuits and considerable negative feedback required for low distortion
  • Sharp clipping, in a manner widely considered non-musical, due to considerable negative feedback commonly used
  • Device capacitances tend to vary with applied voltages
  • Large unit-to-unit variations in key parameters, such as gain and threshold voltage
  • Stored-charge effects add signal delay, which complicates high-frequency and feedback amplifier design
  • Device parameters vary considerably with temperature, complicating biasing and raising the possibility of thermal runaway
  • Cooling is less efficient than with tubes, because lower operating temperature is required for reliability
  • Power MOSFETs have high input capacitances that very with voltage
  • Class B totem-pole circuits are common, which can result in crossover distortion
  • Less tolerant of overloads and voltage spikes than tubes
  • Nearly all transistor power amplifiers have directly-coupled outputs and can damage speakers, even with active protection
  • Capacitive coupling usually requires high-value electrolytic capacitors, which give inferior performance at audio-frequency extremes
  • Greater tendency to pick up radio frequency interference, due to rectification by low-voltage diode junctions or slew-rate effects
  • Maintenance more difficult; devices are not easily replaced by user
  • Older transistors and ICs often unavailable after 20 years, making replacement difficult or impossible


Dear @thekong : I can't detect it due to that glorious so low distortions in my today system/room.

Yes, I know you can detect it in your system in the same way I detected it in the past, not today ( fortunatelly. ).

You need to learn several audio subjects and do several drastic changes in your system/room to approach or even or surpass what I'm living today that you can be sure will improve in the near future.

Talk to me when you be " there ". Futile that you continue doing through this thread. You have nothing to help enrich all other people knowledge levels. Stop all those boring posts.

Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.
In the other side, I never posted here or every where that my system has lower distortions than anyone else.
Dear Raul, good, then we have no disagreement.

What I can tell you is that my system/room has lot lot lower distortions than yours.
 I really have no problem with that, if it is true, as I have never posted that my system has low distortion.

The problem that I can see is you can't prove it! I don't think you have any idea on the distortion level of your complete system/room. Have you compared the sound signal at your listening seat, with the signal from the phono/cd output by testing equipment? I bet not!

Then you have to rely on your highly trained ears, but they couldn't even detect the distortion caused by the airborne feedback to your turntable system.

I did it using Telarc 1812, Dafos and Firebird tracks not at 83db normal SPL but at 97dbs ( at seat position. ) with 109db on peaks and you know something: I can’t detect any vibration/resonance because that air borne.


Dear @thekong : All human beens can hear and feel distortions. Distortions comes from everywhere in our day life ( not only audio. ). In audio music comes along distortions of every kind and as music the distortions comes along its harmonics/overtones.

Do you think that when we feel a low bass SPL what we feel is only " music "?, no my friend always comes with distortions generated in the system/room. Problem is that you are unaware of almost any kind of distortions at any frequency range and you can't detect it because the poor resolution of your system and because you don't know what to look for ! ! !

In the other side, I never posted here or every where that my system has lower distortions than anyone else. You did it.

What I can tell you is that my system/room has lot lot lower distortions than yours.

It's useless to continue talking when exist a to high differences on audio ignorance levels between two persons as you and me. It's useless that you try to find out real arguments to prove I'm wrong when you can't be sure: I'M NOT. Period.

Re-read carefully this that are not my words but other gentleman ones:

"""  """ This makes me think some people do like pleasant distortion  . Remember ignorance is bliss until you have heard the difference .  """

Btw, it's not your culprit that very low audio knowledge level you have because as all of us you learned and still do through that corrupted AHEE. You are a clear example of the damage AHEE did it and does.


Regards and enjoy the MUSIC not DISTORTIONS,
R.




Dear Rual, great, now you are saying you could feel it. I just don't know how you can feel lower distortion! I can understand if you say you can hear it, but feeling the distortion? How does it feel actually?

No matter, now that you can feel it, then it gets back to the original issue. If you can feel it, then the air-borne vibration will also be transmitted to your turntable system, as there is no barrier,  causing feedback and distortion. This is just physics!

So much for the claim that your system has lower distortion than anyone else!