Not so, and not in the same factory, not the same quality measures.
Check with a continuity tester. Did you check your Iphone before you plugged it in?
Made in the same place
Counterfeit Chinese Cables
I thought that I would write this for those who are curious about one of the many counterfeit Chinese interconnect cables that are available these days. I know that there have been threads about the subject before, and I was always curious because they seem to be such a bargain. I don't really recall much about what any members actually said about the performance of these counterfeit cables, and I didn't look back and do any research, but a couple of months ago there was a thread that came around to discussing the quality of Chinese made components, and oldhvymec said something that made sense to me.
He said that people that say that what they are making is junk should consider that much of what is in our gear, and a lot of our American brands are actually manufactured there. I decided shortly after that that I would take the chance on a set of interconnects, because I suspected that the interconnects going from my pre to my amp were the weak link and needed upgrading. The interconnects going from my DAC to my pre were Kimber Select which are very good, but the other set were LAT International (now defunct) which had cost $500.00 when new, but I had reason to believe they were lacking because I have one of their digital cables that turned out to be very poor sounding in comparison to others I own.
I decided on a one meter pair of counterfeit Nordost Odin interconnects for a total of $104.00 from Aliexpress. I received them a couple of weeks later. They appeared to be well made, and the locking fake WBT rca's were very impressive and are very tight.
First impressions after installing them were light, thin sound, lacking bass. Each couple of days brought improvements, but from the beginning I noticed that they were quieter. Now, weeks later, I can say that they are drastically better that the LAT's in every way. Detail and ambience are much better, but it's the focus and separation of instruments that is most noticeable.
I have no way of knowing if they are really a copy of the Nordost design, but I am impressed enough that I am going to try a counterfeit Nordost digital cable.
Obviously, this isn't a comparison that is useful to most, because there probably isn't anyone here using the LAT's, and everything is system dependent. I just wanted to relay my positive experience.
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Well on that note I just plugged in the Odin Gold 2 power cable and there is more air and mids are a little more detailed or pronounced. Bass is a little deeper. Backgrounds seems to be quite just like the stock power cable. Sound stage is taller and wider. I might have lost some depth. I don't know if I like the pronounced mids or am I getting more detail. Time will tell. Definitely worth the 67.00. The Gold 2 Interconnects have been in the system for about 2 weeks I think and that was a big hit. I'm using that between my DAC and amp. Listening to Patricia Barber Cafe Blue |
@juanmanuelfangioii Thanks for that tip. I just looked at their site. A similar product, being copper & silver plate, is $350 for a 1.5 meter length. I have sent them a message to see if they will build the 5 meter cables I require. This is the cable I am looking at from China. 5 meters pair for $168 https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004650557944.html?spm=a2g0o.cart.0.0.68e638da540cNB&mp=1
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@bigtwin You can support a company in Canada, Makes a fantastic product, ships free and cost less than a knockoff. |
@spenav I'm chuffed those cables are working nicely in your setup, I'm far from the authority on cables, but I think if you know your system decently well you can make some educated guesses and use cables to tune the sound and improve the synergy. Like I've noticed that if speakers are sounding a bit dull you can use cables with a bit of silver to add a little sparkle, likewise if things are a bit edgy copper can darken the sound and gold can smooth it out a little. I won't pretend to know the scientific reasons why. I've also seen people tune their amp by using different fuses, like silk or beeswax! I actually used a gold-plated fuse to power a previous amp and it did make a subtle difference to the sound, so my guess is that materials make the difference in the signal transmission, which could be beneficial or detrimental depending on the circumstances. That might be why I'm not in favor of counterfeit cables, I don't see a reason why a counterfeit cable should automatically sound 'bad', it's either of a constitution that works well with your system or it isn't, and when it's being sold as one thing when actually it's another, I think that must make it harder for the consumer to intelligently tune their system, especially if they don't know it's a counterfeit. |
@roxy54 That is why many use blind testing. Eliminates bias, but you are right I do not care. I refuse to support this business when there are companies like Blue Jeans, Zafino, Signal Cable, Raven Audio that make product in the US and Canada that have the quality, and performance to compete with the brands being counterfeited. |
@spenav I understand your comment and would agree if looking at $100 product. Would still like to hear from people having first hand experience with the "hign end" Chinese made cables. I assume most of the folks on this site are able to tell the difference between quality made and shoddy goods. Returning something to China would be a real pain? No sence in me making a bad choice if someone here can give some advice? |
On a slightly different note from copies of US made cables, what about the cables that are clearly marked as made in China. Many look to be very well made and a fraction of the cost of US product? And still others are almost as expensive. I purchased a 5 meter RCA cable from Morrow, on sale at 55% off and it still set me back $800 Canadian. I see a Chinese made cable at a slighly higher price, offering PURE silver wiring. Set aside the argument of silver vs copper as th better choice, has anyone had first hand experience with these higher priced, made in China cables?
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You are absolutely right. They are not replicas. I opened a Neardost gold power cable and confirmed that. On the other hand, these power cables have no right to sound the way they do. That part I cannot explain. I know it’s not confirmation or expectation bias, I am always honest with myself. Just cannot unhear what I am hearing. What’s the secret sauce? |
@thyname not real sure on AQ product. They do make a counterfeit statement on their website. I was referring to Nordost products and Kimber that claim US manufacturing. I am also not saying they are going offshore I truly believe these folks in China are making counterfeit product. Looking at the all of the manufactures websites they have a page on "counterfeits" so it is a real issue. That is why I buy from guys like Signal Cable and Zafino real quality at a real price. |
+1
I really don't care who makes them or where. If I can buy a cable cheaper that sounds as good as a multi thousand $ cable, that's all that matters to me.
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Does Audioquest say “made in USA”? It’s been a while I have owned any Audioquest cables, so I truly don’t know. I also know “made in USA” can mean a lot of things. Including final assembly in USA, but with parts (I.e wire, materials) made in China. And truth is lots of stuff is made in China nowadays, like it or not. I bet almost every single product has at least a few parts made in China.
Yup. Which is a bummer for everyone involved with trying various cables, buying, selling, etc.
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Well if you are marking your product as made in the USA and they are actually made in China you deserve a flood of counterfeit product in the market.
To your other point I will never buy a used cable here or on USAM after reading this.
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No, they did NOT ask for any proof of purchase. When I wrote to them, I mentioned that I bought from so and so dealer. That's it. They did not sent the fake ones back as they would destroy it (any company should do that). I have AQ cables as well and their is a lot of difference in customer service between PSA and AQ. PSA just goes above and beyond. Very few in this industry does that.
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You were lucky. Maybe because you could prove it you bought them from an authorized dealer. I know with Audioquest, if you send a cable over for authentication, and it’s found counterfeit, you will never get it back. Or any replacement. Audioquest will however provide a detailed technical report on that cable, but only if you were to dispute the purchase with the seller and trying to get the money back via legal manners (I.e PayPal dispute, or credit card). |
well, this is not about deliberately buying the fakes from Ali, but to the point where @thyname makes - sometime back I bought 3 PS Audio AC12 power cords from authorized PS Audio dealer when they sold through dealership (this dealer was also listed in their website). When I received the cables, they looked very "genuine" superficially but sounded so so after given a long time with breakin. At the same time, there was a fake power cord thread on the PS Audio forums and I wrote to PS Audio asking if they would do an inspection of their cables which they gladly accepted. I sent just one. Within a week, I get a message from PSA that its a fake cable and asked me to sent the other two and so I did. As in turns out, all 3 were fake cables. The dealer had no idea how it landed in his stockpile. I have also bought DS DACs, BHK Preamps and Power Plant P20 from this dealer as well, so there is absolutely no reason for me to suspect the dealer. Being PSA as they are with their customer service, they replaced all 3 with the genuine ones free of cost. The bottom line is you never know what’s happening in the background, especially in the cable business where there is a huge profit margin with a fraction of the production cost. |
Anyone bought the HiFi Dragons from Ali Express? They don’t say “Audioquest “ in their description, but the Audioquest name and logo is all over the place in the pictures. On another note, I wonder what the deal is with those counterfeit cables. Are they done from third party cable makers, copying the design, or are they “back door “ products from the same China factory/ workshops the real cables are made? That’s the real question is my guess. In any case, buying and selling used cables in Audiogon or USAM will for sure be much more difficult. Nobody will trust any individual seller on the authenticity of a cable with all these counterfeits around and readily available. And someone will surely find “innovative “ ways to make this a business, buying them cheap from Ali, and selling them here as “used” authentic cables. If not already happening that is, which I suspect it is |
I think that if you look closer at the description, you might see that it actually says copper. I don't know which ad you were looking at, but I've noticed this discrepancy with several of the ads, and then sometimes a photo of the product will actually say copper on the cable. I don't believe that any of the fake Nordost are silver. They might ne silver plated copper at best, and the use of the word "sterling" is in itself probably inaccurate. I believe that silver used in cables is always as pure as possible, or as pure as the customer can afford. |
Just looking on Ali Express at Nordost Odin 2 7N sterling silver flagship audio speaker cable HiFi main speaker amplifier cable gold-plated plug. The claim to be using pure Sterling Silver seems a bit rich (on un intended). At the cost of silver today, does anyone expect us to belive the claim, given an 8 foot pair is only +/- $75 U.S.? Ayone bought these and if so what's your experience with them? Thanks. |
You got it. I have worked in China for decades. If you are a naive American that contracts in China and gives your proprietary design to contract manufacturer… well you are stupid. Any world savvy business person understands proprietary info and knows they must protect it. Notice that Apple produces most of their stuff in China and they do not have “Apple” knock offs, well, anywhere. If you have proprietary stuff you need to protect it. I have worked all over the world in high tech manufacturing for over thirty five years. You quickly understand different cultures. Or you don’t. |
@evank do you have a pic/link of the speaker cables? |
tweak12,887 posts Came across this flipping threw Mono Stereo Alas, no copy. Tried the email link but not working. Maybe somebody can dig for it and report back https://www.monoandstereo.com/2022/09/nordost-odin-gold-vs-odin2.html#more
Odin Gold versus Odin 2 cables shoot out at 3mA Audio showroom, Houston, TX, United States
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Came across this flipping threw Mono Stereo Alas, no copy. Tried the email link but not working. Maybe somebody can dig for it and report back Odin Gold versus Odin 2 cables shoot out at 3mA Audio showroom, Houston, TX, United States.
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Valhalla speaker cables arrived today, and they are well built. I didn't realize they are so wide at least 4 inches. Bass is more defined, and vocals are more recessed in the sound stage. To me that is a good thing. I've been using Clearday shotgun speaker cables. Can't say better but a different presentation. Let's see how this turns out |
I had Cullen then 4 Wire World Electra 7 Power conditioning Cords @ $260 and now 2 of these * (one from wall to Core Power conditioner, the other to the Audio Alchemy PS 5 outboard PS for the DDP-1. dac/pre) + 2 Odin 2, one silver, one gold conditioning. And 2 (see link below) from Amazon. They are excellent are excellent
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An even better value in a power cable is a Chinese cable available from Amazon. It is the Viborg MBU1606 HiFi Power Cable 5N OFC 6mm² /Core, 16MM Copper Shielding + 2 Layers Foil US Hi-End Power Cord with Pure Copper US Power Plug + IEC C13 Connector (3.3FT/1M) at about $55 I bought one and then 2 more. They are great. For the amazing internal construction of this cable look here and scroll down. The only slight negatives are that it is plain looking and stiff. |
