I would like to start a thread, similar to Orpheus’ jazz site, for lovers of classical music. I will list some of my favorite recordings, CDs as well as LP’s. While good sound is not a prime requisite, it will be a consideration. Classical music lovers please feel free to add to my lists. Discussion of musical and recording issues will be welcome.
I’ll start with a list of CDs. Records to follow in a later post.
Berlioz: Symphonie Fantastique. Chesky — Royal Phil. Orch. Freccia, conductor. Mahler: Des Knaben Wunderhorn. Vanguard Classics — Vienna Festival Orch. Prohaska, conductor. Prokofiev: Scythian Suite et. al. DG — Chicago Symphony Abbado, conductor. Brahms: Symphony #1. Chesky — London Symph. Orch. Horenstein, conductor. Stravinsky: L’Histoire du Soldat. HDTT — Ars Nova. Mandell, conductor. Rachmaninoff: Symphonic Dances. Analogue Productions. — Dallas Symph Orch. Johanos, cond. Respighi: Roman Festivals et. al. Chesky — Royal Phil. Orch. Freccia, conductor.
All of the above happen to be great sounding recordings, but, as I said, sonics is not a prerequisite.
What EVERY Classical lover should have is IMO the greatest recording ever made . Puccini’s" La Boheme " with the greatest singer of the last century,Jussi Bjoerling, with his two favorite partners, also greats, Victoria De Los Angeles and Robert Merrill . Sir Thomas Beecham never made a bad recording and this is his very best , a true masterpiece . Every one involved was at the acme of their art .
As Robert Greenfield ,the great Gramophone critic said "rarely if ever directed a more glowing opera performance on record .......the norm against which all other performances have to be judged ."
The sound was remastered from mono from the 1956 recording from the original two track tape and is very natural and spacious . My two copies are Seraphim SIB-6099 which means it was an EMI recording , a good thing . I know it is on CD and also know I would pay a lot more for vinyl .
Even if you hate opera perfection has a beauty all its own .
P.S . There are CD recordings both on Naxos and Great Performances of the Century on Amazon . I'd buy Naxos , same thing , less money . Read the reviews folks !
As with others here, Mahler 1 was my introduction to Mahler. (Solti and the CSO). Next was the 7th with Levine and the CSO (still my favorite version, and I think this may be due to Levine’s association with the opera, he brings an aspect of more ’theater’ to it.
Then came the 2nd. I still have problems getting really interested the the first couple of movements except as a road to take getting to the last movement which is my all time favorite climax (of anybody). It really is emotionally moving. It just wrings me out!!!!
Then came the 6th (Sanderling and the St Petersberg PO). At last, for me, a complete, coherent, symphony full of moments great beauty alternating with moments of great angst right thru the final movement. This has always been, for me anyway, Mahler’s best.
The 4th is excellent especially if you want to just relax. It is almost too accessible. :-)
The 3d is just too long for me. But as with all of Mahler the use of chorus or solo vocals, makes it worth while.
The 8th is two different symphonies, in style at least. I like the first, the second not so much. But I do prefer Solti’s and the CSO when I do get it out.
Then comes the 9th. Much as I like it I’ve never put is all together. Bernstein’s 1979 live performance with the Berliner PO brings me as close as I’ve ever come. The 9th fascinates me none the less.
Needless to say Mahler competes only with Sibelius and Beethoven in my pantheon of the greatest composers of symphonies.
The Ninth Mahler Symphony is not only my favorite of his, but maybe my favorite of any composer. The first movement, especially, is heartbreaking. I just listened to the 3rd Symphony with Bernstein on DG with the NY Phil. Magnificent interpretation and state of the art sound on my system. Having multiple versions of all Mahler’s symphonies, this interpretation is one of the best.
We apparently live in different time zones. While I occasionally listen to Bruckners 7th, 8th, or 9th, time is becoming too precious for me to do it often. I'll also listen to Schubert's 8th & 9th performed by the OAE conducted by Mackerras. Great symphonies sans over orchestration. If one must have some of that then Mackerras provides it with the Scottish SO on Telarc. I grew up with Solti's Weiner Phil performance but lost interest in it after I heard Mackerra/OAE version. I'll pass on Haydn entirely, and for that matter most all symphonies pre-existing Beethoven.
The horse that thinks Beethoven is better than Mozart and that Schuberts Great 9th a "if you must have" and Haydn out of hand , must prefer mud over oats and 400 lb jockeys . And likely has heard little live music in his stall.
And my horse likes a muddy course. More fun getting all fouled up in the process than having to cross the finish line all prim, prissy, and politically correct.
FWIW, I reflect a bit on my early experiences with Beethoven (and Schubert) symphonies. At that time I found the most venerated performances were over orchestrated, dense, slow, forced grandiose, etc, and IMHO, ultimately boring (or, alternatively, perhaps I was too just too dull to absorb them). I tried various HIP recordings, often using original instruments. No answer for me there.
Then I heard; 1) Kleibers 5th - It blew me away, still does, that man really got the beat down! Exciting as all hell; then, 2) Harnoncourt's performances of the symphonies which were just influenced by original performances/instruments, not just replications. Now I began to hear something that made sense to me and really opened up my mind for subsequent performances without historical restraints.
To paraphrase a famous line, I just find it more fun to follow the road less traveled. :-)
CARLOS Kleiber’s 5th (I haven’t heard his father Erich’s 5th lately) is indeed a very exciting performance. I concur that the Schubert Symphonies sound more alive with a lighter touch.
RVpiano, I'll have you know I happen to have a very smart horse! It is a real challenge to compete with him when he's having a good day. But I digress (or is it regress? I'll have to ask my horse.) :-)
It's common for those who grew up in a rock culture to like music that does something for them and not for the music itself .A German principal in a great German orchestra said to me , " their hearts are blind to beauty " .
Which happens to be true . And happens to not meet any known definition of xenophobia .My friend was speaking of the entire World . What do you have against Germans ?
If you can’t see how your comments are prejudicial and offensive to an American (“rock culture”) music lover or musician, there’s nothing more I can say.
An under appreciated genre of Beethoven’s output are his magnificent piano trios, crowned by the renowned “Archduke” trio. The sparkling genius one finds in the string quartets can be found in the trios as well. I’m now listening to the complete set recorded by the Beaux Arts Trio on Philips. Highly recommended.
I'm not unappreciative! Some of favorite Beethoven is his chamber music. My introduction to his chamber music was the Archduke, as well as his Kreutzer and Spring sonatas for piano and violin. I'm currently listening to the Florestan Trio on Hyperion. A complete set on 4 CD's. This is excellent stuff.
I don't have a copy of your Beaux Arts disc - I thought I did. If It is an LP I probably gave it away with all my vinyl some years ago. :-(
But, not to be overlooked, are his sonatas for piano and violin. A current set of the complete sonatas by Faust and Melnikov are available on the Harmonia Mundi label. An excellent place to start, I think.
Schubert, FWIW, I can’t imagine a context which makes your comments about someone growing up in the age of ’rock’ relevant to the music they might like, or appreciate, nor, for that matter, detract from the obverse. Sophomoric drivel, I think, even if it came from, or affirmed by, some mystical musician playing for a great orchestra in Germany. But pontificate if you will. That seems to be what you do best.
Best I check with my horse, but he is momentarily detracted by a sudden gas attack.
I like the cello sonatas even more that the violin sonatas. The second one in g minor, to me, is one of the glories of the classical age. And the third, the most popular, is glorious as well. The fourth, is more abstruse, more forward looking and wonderful.
Yes , I’ve noticed general knowledge is not your strong point , newbee. What I do/ did best is teach History at a German University . I gave my 12 year old daughter a complete set of the Beethoven String Qts. I did so because she heard me play them so much she wanted her own set .
Seriously , you two would do well to at least audit Logic 101 at a college near you .
Unless you are just using Classical as a time period about 90% of all those enamored of this would give this title to Bach .If you are Mozart gets more votes . Not to say a good case can’t be made and is for Beethoven . IMO Brahms tops LvB in most things other than his String Quartets . More refined and elegant , listen to both violin concertos back to back.Listen to Clarinet Quintet Op 115 etc . Of course at the end of the day, you like what you like .
No problem at all rvpiano !The only reason I went on and on was I respect you as a musician . At one time I was part of the " family " of the second best band in Berlin and knew well most of them . As a History Prof . I saw that their total immersion in their craft left them with little knowledge of the society around them . Some were aware of that as Germany makes a BIG effort to tell history like it is in a much more truthful way than we do .I talked to a lot of them about the world around as it related to them . Some thanked me .
As I saw it musicians are like the best doctors and others in the most demanding professions . They live in a bubble, which is great for the music, but not always for them .
P.S . My buy of the Beaux Arts box was one of my better buys .That Pressler is a one-off .
elizabeth, I’ve been sitting here trying to think of the basic difference between elegant Mozart and pedal to the metal LvB , which is hard at my age . .When Beethoven hits his last note one thinks " that’s how its done !!!" . When Mozart is done one can only think "it could be done no other way ."
I ran across Weinberg a couple years ago and I wondered if he is enjoyed now. Apparently lost to Soviet history for a long time and friend but not student of Shostakovich (liner notes.) I found the ECM disc with Kremerata Baltica/Gidon Kremer to be enjoyable. This has Sonatas and Symphony #10 which I have to listen to again. Meanwhile I did discover I have Mahler's First (Bernstein) so I will definitely listen this week. I enjoyed the 6th as mentioned. I thought I had the 9th but don't seem to find it.
I felt that way too, years ago when I first heard it. But, I’m so tired of hearing #1, it sounds fresher to my ears. It’s not a bad piece at all. It takes some getting used to. Very different from #1. #2 is especially good.
The first piano concerto is truly a classic and allows the soloist to show his/her stuff. The second and third never seem to capture that. Both have slow movements that border on maudlin. The second has a nice final movement, technically super difficult, but doesn't allow the soloist to make it his/her own, like the first. My 2 cents... -Listening to DeBeriot Violin concertos as I write. B
Liking #2 as I write, still on first movement. Listening to the Donohoe/Barshai EMI recording, which seems very good. An excellent breadth and depth of soundstage, and seems to get the balance between piano and orchestra just right, which many piano concerto recordings don't (generally spotlighting the soloist).
Wow- I have been away from this board for a few weeks and there have been some interesting discussions here!
I don't think anyone responded to Pete, who asked about programs for cataloging a collection. I found the ones I looked at wanting for classical, so I just use an Excel file with columns for everything I want to list.
Mahler's symphonies are amazing - I would urge anyone who hasn't to try the performances of Claudio Abbado, both older and newer. For instance, many prefer Abbado's 5th with Chicago to Solti's from the same era, including myself. His more recent work with the Lucerne Festival Orchestra was amazing as well. The best Mahler conductor of our time, IMO.
Speaking of showing off audio systems with Mahler, my choice is always the first 20 minutes or so of the second movement of the Mahler 8th, with Solti and Vienna, recorded by London. This is an excellent test/show off vehicle for your system, for a lot of different things, from one extreme dynamic to another, and one register extreme to the other as well, along with a huge variety of timbres.
Very interesting discussions about different composers, too. There are a few I personally would put above Beethoven for sheer compositional craft - Mozart and Bach from earlier in his era, and from nearer our own era, Bartok and Stravinsky. Of the later romantics, Wagner and R. Strauss are his equal for sheer craft as well. Wagner of course much more limited as far as variety in genres, lol! But Mozart and R. Strauss are the two who wrote a truly great work in pretty much every genre of the art (if we stretch to include tone poems in the case of Strauss).
As far as great symphonists go, obviously most of those don't apply. I agree with the Sibelius choice, Mozart and Haydn must also be mentioned, Brahms, Dvorak, and it must also be said, and I'm surprised Schubert didn't mention this having lived there, but in Europe Bruckner is often considered second only to Beethoven as a symphonist. He is still under-appreciated here in the US. Try the Giulini Bruckner 7th with Vienna if you have never heard that recording. The writing in the coda of the slow movement for the horns and Wagner tubas was in tribute to Wagner, who died while Bruckner was composing that movement. One of the most beautiful and moving moments in the entire symphonic repertoire.
learsfool. Perhaps it was on another post, but I did recommend Bruckner , and would have R. Strauss if I had not been schooled by Herr newbee for putting Mozart and Brahms above LvB and Mahler .I learned that Bruckner was too "precious " , Schubert’s 9th was over done and Haydn is to be dismissed out of hand . In fact all symphonies before LvB are to be . I do appreciated being corrected .
In Europe Claudio is the man for Mahler beyond doubt . Rightly so . Few of my favorite moderns , fool that I am, in no order are,Bartok, R.Strauss, Vaughan Williams, Hindemith , Janacek and Bruckner . FWIW , I have a Bruckner set "Skrowaczewski / Rundfunk -Saarbrucken" that I dearly love . Those smaller German radio banks played together forever and often , this great conductor had them at their peak and sometimes lesser is more .
St. Paul is a hot spot for Early Music , I’d as soon listen to Henry Purcell as anybody .
Herr Professor, since you are a self proclaimed history professor perhaps you would like to revisit the basis for your statement that I 'schooled you' for putting Mozart and Brahms above LvB and Mahler.
At 10:03 AM on 2/18/2019, I posted my personal views about Mahler's symphonies and said that " Mahler only competes with Sibelius and Beethoven in my pantheon of the greatest composers of symphonies".
At 12:28 PM on 2/18/19, you posted in response (?) "Really? Mozart and Brahms are better. And at their best, cases can be made for Haydn, Schubert and Bruckner.
Clearly you were trying to 'school me'. For stating, what was obviously, my opinion.
Since you are admittedly not a musicologist one must assume that you were just voicing your opinion. However, as you are aware, most folks reading your posts may not be aware of your background and believe that your pronouncement(s) was a statement of fact.
Perhaps you would like, for the sake of historical accuracy, in the future to append to your posts of such things something like 'in my humble opinion', or if that is not achievable something as simple as 'I believe' or 'I think', if your do.
Richter--Dvorak. Wow!! These older recordings can sound truly excellent. Not only great piano playing, but I'm focusing even more on the fabulous wide, deep, full measure sound stage. Not only a great performance but a great recording.
Point taken .It was not obvious to me . I thought you were just some self appointed expert out of their mind dismissing the Mozart and later Haydn symphonies as well .
I found Mahler's 8th on a cassette earlier today, recorded from a CSO broadcast from sometime in the '90's. Levine is conducting. Not going to be a reference (tape is a bit off) but giving it a listen now anyway. First movement finished and... it's a bit nuts isn't it? Now an interview with Levine, how nice. I found a few other broadcasts I recorded so it should be fun going through them.
I've added Bruckner 7th to my exploration list, as well as
Puccini’s" La Boheme" (I'm sure I've heard it before). I'll check to see if I have any of Beethoven's trios. Also, someone mentioned Leo Janacek so I'll add him too.
I didn't appreciate Mahler until listening to stereo LPs.
I'm new to this group, and probably will make a fool of myself. And, horror upon horrors, I have no particular preference for composers. I was taught music should be judged on its own, and not by who wrote it. Performance of a piece is another matter. I'm an Old Fud, whose introduction to classical music was listening to Enrico Caruso on 78 rpm Victor Red Seals, played on a wind-up Victrola using cactus needles - - and whose first opera was Carmen, in the Met, with Risa Stevens.
hi guys I don't know if any of you know of this program but I have found it and it is free. I have been using O and O software for a few years and have just found a really good piece of software they have with the catchy title Windows 10 shut up. What it does is it switches off things that run in the background of Windows 10 and makes a big contribution to cleaning up your apps that play your music. You can use it in a couple of ways you either use it with all options ticked to get full benefit or in stages to see which one works for you and the good thing is it is completely reversible at the click of a mouse. Do try it as I said before you have nothing to lose as it is completely free.
I use a program called Fidelizer. It doesn't cost much, but I have to say it does improve sound quality on my PC streamed music.-And, the designer offers frequent upgrades at no charge. It does something much like the O and O software Jim204 just pointed out-getting Windows to run the audio at higher importance. Bob
Guess I'm ready to make a fool of myself. Trying to cull my classical CD collection has been a chore. Over the past several decades, my wife and I managed to acquire multiple performances of things we liked - - symphonies, operas, concertos, chorales, etc.
Just now, I've been selecting what to keep of the various Verdi Requiem recordings, and what to pass on to our community library.
We had managed to collect performances by Karajan, Solti, Toscanini, Reiner, Shaw, Giulini and Barenboim. Of these, I narrowed it down to the Shaw (Atlanta), Reiner, Giulini (Berlin) and Barenboim (La Scala), each for a different reason as clearly, each had a different approach to the Requiem.
Shaw's is an "In Your Face!" rendition, with both the chorus and soloists clearly recorded above the orchestra. Reiner's opening is inordinately slow, with the chorus barely discernible above the orchestra. Giulini's latest, a 1989 recording in Berlin, shows how his interpretation has changed over almost 60 years since his first in 1960. Finally, Barenboim's current 2012 recording is the only one made with a live audience.
Both Karajan and Barenboim recorded in La Scala, with the La Scala Orchestra and Chorus; however, Karajan's was all about Karajan, and the absence of a live audience permitted pauses in recording and patching recorded segments into the final product. To satisfy my curiosity, I purchased the DVDs for both the Karajan and Barenboim performances. IMO, no contest. For me, Barenboim.s was the better meld of Soloists, Orchestra, Chorus, Conductor and Venue.
Next CD-winnowing project: Go through the Puccini and Verdi operas. My mother used to tell me: "Verdi wrote for the mind, while Puccini wrote from the heart." I'm going to assess those operas with that as a judgement criterion.
Finally getting into Schubert. Stumbled on Krystian Zimerman CD on Tidal, Piano Sonatas 959 and 960. I can't get enough. Does anyone know any other pianist who is known for Schubert? Preferably high quality recording.
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