The very low input impedance of the 14B3 (7.5K unbalanced, 5K balanced) makes it unsuitable for use with the majority of tube preamps, as well as with passive preamps such as the Lightspeed. A tube preamp that comes to mind that would have no problem driving those impedances is the Atma-Sphere MP3. A dealer presently has a new MP3 listed for sale here for $5K, without the optional built-in phono stage.
Good luck. Regards,
-- Al
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The primary question would be, what are you trying to improve upon in your system? If you can elaborate on that along with the rest of your system I think you'll get much better and more helpful recommendations.
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Im actually using a 14bsst now and going to the cubed version. There is some glare in the 7k region. That according to a free spectrum analyzer app. Maybe I should wait and see if the cubed Bryston tames it. I have acoustically treated my room with curtains , panels and tube traps.. Vinyl does not have as much harshness but I am upgrading to a Marantz as-10 |
So, what are your source components, speakers, and cables, and are you using any power conditioning?
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Marantz 8005 sacd player. PS audio P1000 power regenerator powering everything but the amp. OHM 5000 speakers with Canare 4s11 speaker wire. Pangaea and PS audio power cords and Pangea SE interconnects. Analog set up is a fully upgraded AS final tool TT with Graham 2.2 forearm and an Ortofon 2m Black cartridge and an Acoustech ph1 p phone preamp. I have the speaker cables 2 feet off the floor. All components isolated with cones or damping material. Dedicated AC line |
Wow. Frankly, you've now got $11,000 amps powering $7000 (or less) speakers. It's absolutely worth seeing how your system sounds with the new amps after they've had 100+ hours to break in, but at the very least at this point you've got to explore the possibility of upgrading your speakers. My extensive experience with a Bryston BP6 in my system is that it will neither create, nor mask, a glare in any area. It's a virtual straight wire with gain, and since the BP6 shares very similar topology with the BP26 (as per James Tanner) I'd have to surmise going that direction will not bandaid your situation in any way. Once you have your new amps broken in I'd suggest following up here. I know there was a big change from a 2BSST to a 3BSST2 I had in my system in terms of refinement and more natural sounding treble, so you may well be on the right path. But still, I can't help thinking those amps could deserve and reward you with better speakers down the road. Anyway, keep us posted. |
blueranger
very sweet system that you are putting together.I am in a similar situation w/ the Bryston cubed series (power amp and matching pre-amp). Hopefully I will get my audition in August.Also, the Marantz SA-10 catches my eyes as well. Keep me posted on the delivery and break-in on the SA-10.
As soon as I demo the 4B3, I will update here for you.
Happy Listening!
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Thanks all. Yes I might be a little anxious and not estimating the impact the 14b3 will have
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I haven't heard neither the 14BSST nor the 14B3 but my brother's 7BSST monos were simply transformed when he switched from the BP25 to an ARC REF5SE. His Magnepan 3.7i speakers never sounded so good. Just one (more) data point for whatever its worth. |
Hey soix. Those OHM speakers are actually closer to $20k speakers in real value.
1. You buy direct from the manufacturer bypassing the dealers.
2.The soeakers do not have to be very robust and reinforced since the sound waves travel off the cones differently.
3. There is only one driver and tweeter. They are quality ones unlike mid price speakers with multiple drivers where cheaper ones would have to be used to compete costwise.
4.Down side is the bigger ones are power hungry and they might not be the most dynamic. They do take a while to break in.
For me they do convey the music.
Now I just cant wait for the 14b3. |
Don't sell the Ohms! Truly excellent for their cost and competitive with far more expensive speakers. I have an older pair of Ohms and won't part with mine! |
About that "glare in the 7k region" - remember that recording quality (both analog and digital) can vary widely! A "perfect" recording is a rare creature indeed! And one of the best audio equipment designers, James Bongiorno, found recordings so problematic that he stated that he would never design or use a preamp without tone controls! |
I too own and use a Bryston preamp (among many in my collection). It is the .5 from '88 (go ahead and laugh!). Still working and sounding fine indeed! I also own several tube preamps. But feel no compelling urge to switch from the Bryston .5! |
Stick with Bryston for choices in preamps. They are indeed fine sounding units! Stop being so neurotic! Enjoy what you have! Search for better recordings! |
By the way, in one of my current systems I use the .5 with the Bryston 3B amp (1988). Go ahead and laugh! Still working and sounding fine! No compelling urge to change to another amp (in that particular system)! |
Big difference going to new cubed series. Also new preamp i.e. an improvement. Had great luck mating 14b Sat with tubes audio note pre. |
@blueranger -- my apologies. I've never heard a bad word about Ohm speakers and unfortunately haven't heard them myself. I'm sure they punch way above their price from everything I've read. Shame on me. No way to move up in the Ohm line?
Having owned and greatly admired my Bryston BP6 and had it hooked up to a couple different Bryston amps and others, once you get your new amp burned in I'd still try to audition a good tubed pre just to see what it does. Definitely keep in mind Al's warning about the 14B3 low input impedance though, and I think the Atmasphere pre would be an awesome pre to audition if you can. I think a Bryston amp properly mated with a tubed pre could be a sublime combo. Anyway, I'd be very interested to hear your impressions of the new versus older Bryston amp.
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Oh I will give the new equipment a very good listen and see how they perform. |
Help!!
i have a 4B cubed amp with the Bp17 pre.
Looking to upgrade phono stage to tube for a little warmth and was considering the Herron. Actually talked to a Keith and he said because of the low input impedance of the bp17 a tube front end wouldn’t be a great fit.
I love the amp but do I change out the 17 to tube pre or do a bryston ss phono stage.
Rega RP10 and Harbeth 40.
Advise |
bermart,
I have a 4Bsst2 and am still using a BP6. I agree with soix - -effectively, it's a straight wire with gain. Remember, as soix pointed out, the BP6 shares very similar topology with the BP26 (as per James Tanner) For a CD spinner, I recently added a Bryston BCD-3 for an extensive collection of RedBook CDs. Driving a pair of Thiel 2.7s and a Thiel SS2.2 sub, I couldn't be happier with the BP6 and 4B amp.
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I run a BP17 in my 2nd system and I do it with a tube phono stage (CJ Premier 15) and have no issues ( I use a step up transformer for gain).
The BP17 is dead quiet at all gain settings and is a good sounding preamp |
Thanks wspohn,
what kind of step up do you use? |
Anyone compared the BP-17 Cubed to the Parasound JC2? |
Now that would be interesting! |
I have heard a bp17 cube with a cube amp. The 17 cube is thin sounding, makes my CD player for the most part sound small and thin. There is also quite a bit of noise, hiss coming from speakers. |
When I went from the BP 25 to the BP 17 I had more bass and the background wasn't noisey. |
Is anyone having issues with the BP 17_3 with hiss ? I went to audition one and heard a louder then normal hiss from the left speaker. I might go for the BP 26 instead.
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I have a Luxman CL38U-SE tube preamp hooked up to a Bryston 2.5 SST2 amp and a pair of Aerial 5T's. Excellent combination.
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I own a lot of old Bryston gear purchased around 2010. Just ordered a new BP-26 and new MPS-2 for a second system. The BP casing was warped and rocked when set on a table, and the MPS-2 had parts rattling around inside, plus a visible scratch. I’ve noticed quality slipping in a few brands and never thought Bryston would follow suite but it’s hard to look past such obvious oversights. Be careful. They may be so focused on cost cutting that quality is just a fancy word now. |
The Bryston preamps are ok, but if you want to improve the overall sound you should consider an Audible Illusions tube preamp, like the L1. An excellent preamp and known to be a very good preamp to use with solid state amps without too many connectivity issues!
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I demoed both the Bryston 26 and 17. I have Class' CA M600 amps with Joseph Audio pearl 20/20s. At the time I had a PS Audio Directstream Dac. Bad gain mismatch with my amps and dac. Very little volume control, had to turn the volume down on the DSD to have a little more control. Also lots of noise. I have since gone to the EMM Labs DV2 and PRE. Dead quiet lots of volume control. Bryston amps have a gain of 24 and so does the preamps. My Classe' have a gain of 29. I would pair Bryston amps with Bryston preamps as to not run into a gain mismatch. Bryston will adjust the gain to match certain amps however they don't put that info out. |
Tubes are a whole other thing. But as far as a good quality solid state preamp, Bryston is'nt a bad choice. Particularly if you get a used one.
I went looking for a relatively affordable self contained solid state (no outboard supply), single ended only preamp with tape monitor. A tougher call then you might think, especially if you are talking currently available new gear. Anyway a used Bryston fit the bill.
It does'nt add any sweetness the way tubes might, but neither is it harsh. Maybe a bit forward and plenty of gain. Neutral yet still musical. It makes a good match for power amps whose gain is on the lower side, I could see it being a mismatch for higher gain power amps. There are definitely better preamps. But the BP6 does the job fairly well.
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