Borresen X3 vs Harbeth 40.2 -- my impressions


After reading so many glowing reviews of the Borresen X3 speaker, I decided to go and audition them at a local dealer who was gracious enough to let me stay there for over 4 hours. I went there with the intention of buying the X3 if they appealed to me. I thought I’d share my impressions here for those who are interested, especially in comparison to my Harbeth 40.2 speakers that I adore.

 

The dealer at first hooked them up to the Axxess Forte 1 integrated amp. To be brutally honest, I was about ready to bolt in the first 10 minutes. I just don’t understand why Axxess is getting so much praise. It was the most flat, dry, and boring sound I’ve heard. Luckily, the dealer had some very high end Burmester amp, preamp, and music server (close to $100K retail for the three pieces), which he agreed to use instead. Huuuuuge difference! The Burmester really made those Borresens come alive and sing. IMO, AGD is really doing a disservice to the X line by pairing them with the Axxess in audio shows. They are capable of scaling with much better gear. Shame!

 

If a massive, immersive, and holographic soundstage is your primary criteria and your budget is $11k max, you should stop reading at this point. Run and get these speakers before AGD decides to raise the price. I have yet to hear a speaker in this price range with this kind of soundstage. But if you value other aspects of music reproduction, keep on reading ...

 

Soundstage Width, Depth, and Height:

No contest. Borresen is noticeably better. The soundstage is as tall as it is deep. I heard sounds coming from besides me and behind me. Depth, while not outstanding, is there for sure. Just not as impressive as the height and width relatively speaking. I still can’t get that immersive feeling out of my head.

 

Ability to disappear:

This is one area where Harbeth always struggles. Owing to the thin walls of its cabinets, one is always aware of the big box the sound emanates from. The X3s totally disappeared. Again, very impressive for a speaker in this price range.

 

Vocals:

Sorry, but the X3 is simply not in the same league as the 40.2 when it comes to vocals. There’s this little extra, lifelike quality to vocals in most Harbeth speakers that is hard to beat. I listened to some very familiar songs on the X3, and it became clear why I fell in love with the Harbeth sound many years ago. Female voices are more ethereal and nuanced, male voices have more chestiness. You hear the emotions and every little inflection in the singers’ voice. It simply gives more of the ‘singer in the room’ feeling.

 

Instrument Separation:

This is a tough one. Both are excellent in this regard. But I will give a very slight edge to 40.2s here. Or maybe not. I don’t know. Let’s call it evens.

 

Transparency and Realism:

This is where Harbeth pulled ahead of the X3s in a major way. I’m not saying that the X3s are deficient by any means, but the 40.2s just give you a lot more of it. You really have to live with them for a while to truly understand and appreciate what this speaker brings to the table. It’s truly addictive. The only other speakers I’ve heard that are better in this regard are the Quads or other electrostatics.

 

Midrange and Lushness:

My impression of Borresen speakers prior to this was that they were very fast, neutral, and quiet. But, much to my surprise, the X3s (or perhaps the X line itself) has been voiced to be more on the warm side of things. Sound was warm and had body. Unfortunately, this is being achieved by adding a bit of a mid bass bump. While it gives the speaker an overall warm predisposition, I felt it came at the expense of hiding details in the mid bass region. Harbeth is also known for a lush midrange but it doesn’t get here by sacrificing detail or exaggerating the sound. Another side effect of this characteristic was that acoustic instruments felt bigger than life. Guitars felt like they were 10 foot long. Piano strokes lacked the bite and immediacy that I get with 40.2s – and by the way this is not a particularly strong point of Harbeth either.

 

Tone and Timbre:

Harbeth to the front of the line, please. The timbre and tonal accuracy of the 40.2s is on another level. X3s are also very good in this regard but are somewhat outclassed by Harbeth.

 

Overall Refinement:

I apologize in advance if this is going ruffle some feathers, but the 40.2s are overall much more refined sounding than the Borresen X series. Again, this is only in comparison. On its own, I would never label the X3s as unrefined. The Harbeth just has this extra layer of refinement that you come to appreciate the more time you spend with it.

 

Bass:

As they say, there’s no replacement for displacement. The 4.5” drivers on X3 produce a prodigious amount of bass which is hard to believe considering the size of the drivers. Yet, the 12” woofer on 40.2s gives you more of that deep and tuneful bass. It just sounds more satisfying and fuller.

 

Look and Feel:

This is very subjective, of course, so please feel free to take it with a grain of salt. But I was not impressed by how the X3s looked in person, they lacked elegance. It kind of reminded me of Tekton – okay, maybe that’s too harsh, I take it back. But I was a little disappointed as they looked really nice in pictures. Wish they would lose the carbon fiber touch and the checkered driver patterns. The Harbeths, on the other hand, don’t look as impressive and nice in pictures. I mean what do you expect from an oversized shoebox on stands. But, the quality and craftsmanship of hand-built cabinets has a more timeless and elegant feel to it that has to be seen and felt to be appreciated. I just feel this style, boring as it is, just ages more gracefully.

 

Long story short, I have decided to stay with my 40.2s. They have many quirks, as pointed out by several members on this forum. But what they do, they do it exceedingly well. I found the Harbeth 40.x to be overall more transparent, lifelike, refined, and balanced. They don’t do dynamics as good as other speakers or disappear as much as other speakers in this price range, but they more than make up for it in other ways. I’ve heard people claim that the X3 are twice (or even thrice!) as good as their asking price. If soundstage is your primary criteria for judging speakers, then I wholeheartedly agree. But if you value transparency, vocals, timbre, tonal accuracy, and overall refinement ... the Harbeth 40.x series justifies its higher price, despite the shortcomings.

 

Having said that, I was still very impressed by Borresen X3 and won’t mind having it as a second pair once they hit the used market. But I feel the hype doesn’t quite align with what I actually heard during the audition. In this price range, I find Audio Vector to be a better value.

 

Please note that these are my opinions based on a ‘mere’ 4-hour demo, and only in comparison to my favorite speakers. It’s totally fine if someone draws a completely opposite conclusion, or tells me that I’m biased. My taste, my preferences, IMO, IHMO, etc. etc. etc.

 

 

128x128arafiq

@prof  I wanted to collect my thoughts before responding to your question :)

if I have to rank the three speakers, it would be like this:

Harbeth 40.x > JA Perspective2 > Harbeth SHL5+

When I replaced the SHL5+ with JA Perspective2's it was definitely a jump in sound quality in most areas, especially bass and treble. JA has a very modern, crisp sound that I enjoyed. However, I still missed that little bit of midrange magic that Harbeth had. But in almost all other areas, JA was superior.

Now, on to Harbeth 40.2 ...

First of all, it is a completely different beast than the rest of the Harbeth lineup. You would be mistaken to assume that just because you are familiar with other models in the lineup you can extrapolate it to the 40.x. Yes it retains most of the midrange characteristics, but it adds tremendous scale to everything. Everything sounds much more palpable, more real, more organic, more transparent, and at a much bigger scale. It added a fullness to the sound that was missing from SHL5+ and Perspectives. Here's an analogy I would use to describe the difference between JA Perspective2 and 40.2: The Perspectives are like drinking an ice cold coca cola on a hot day. It gives you that refreshing kick while tickling all your senses.

The 40.2, on the other hand, is more like drinking a warm glass of thick, rich hot chocolate milk on a snowy day. You just feel the warmth going down your throat and engulfing your entire body. There's no wrong or right here. Just depends on what your preference is. For me, I love what the Harbeth 40.2 brings to the table. That does not make Perspective2, or Borresen X3 for that matter, a lesser speaker.

However, the 40.2 do require a beefy amp to really wake them up. More so than the Perspective2s.

 

Post removed 

Thanks!  That’s what I figured.

As I mentioned, I’ve heard the Harbeth 40s And my descriptions would be similar.

Unfortunately, my room situation is complicated and wide speakers

Won’t work well in the room.   However, I’ve got my Joseph perspectives sounding remarkably lush.  My Thiel 2.7s Sound even fatter and lusher.

So I’m doing pretty well in that regard.  
 

 

Good tread despite the negativity. I have not seen a lot of A/B comparisons (not that this really is one). I personally am waiting for detailed measurements or a demo. I have only seen the M1’s measurements and they a comically bad at any price with a 7db peak at 80hz followed by a 5db dip at 300hz. You have to use a translator (built into web browser) to read it but the link is below.

I have seen a few comments now about the X3 having a bass peak. I wonder if they are all tuned like this.

https://audio.com.pl/testy/stereo/kolumny-glosnikowe/3781-borresen-m1/s/3#laboratory


I have seen a few comments now about the X3 having a bass peak. I wonder if they are all tuned like this.

The X3s do have an inherent bass peak, but it certainly doesn’t sound anything like 7dB. My estimate is it might be as high as 2dB. This actually helps them to sound more linear and dynamic when playing at normal levels. My previous floorstanders (BMR Towers) are some of the most linear-measuring speakers on the market at any price, however, in practice, the X3s actually sound more linear and balanced in my room. My suspicion is the X3s are voiced to compensate for the natural dips/peaks of our ears (aka Equal Loudness Contour). This isn’t to say they do that in the same way some other brands do. They sound more balanced than the newer B&W lines for example. 

In terms of on-axis linearity, I doubt the X3s are close to as flat as the BMRs, but it’s quite apparent to my ears that the X3s are considerably lower in distortion. The X3s are over twice the price of the BMR Towers though (and I still prefer the BMRs to all Harbeths I’ve heard), so in terms of absolute value, the BMRs are still incredible. 

I was increasingly gravitating toward great measuring speakers prior to acquiring the Borresens, but the X3s have upended that whole paradigm for me. As I stated earlier, I visited the dealer expecting that I would probably leave with a pair of Perlisten towers, or at minimum, realize the Perlistens weren’t any better than my BMR Towers. Instead, I ended up buying the X3s, which was an easy decision after hearing the Perlisten R towers. That said, I was also able to conclude that the BMR Towers perform better than the Perlistens. In recent weeks I have begun to suspect that driver distortion levels matter far more than on-axis linearity when it comes to subjective sound quality. 

 

Helomech,

 

good feed back. I am not a die hard measurements guy either but most of the speakers I really like also measure pretty well. I think it is an important starting point and then quality of the drivers/build matters too. I will be interested to see measurements of the X line and see if insight can be gained with subjective reviews. I have seen the BMR measurements but never heard them. Also having owned Revel speakers I know “perfect” measurements are not the be all end all as everything important is not measured.  
 

I hope to hear the Borresens sooner than later but in the meantime I would love to see full measurements of the X line, whether it is gated, Kipple, or anechoic. 

Arafiq again thank you for spending time writing this thread.I just realized you spend four hours on the dealership that’s a long hours just to demo speakers. This tells me you enjoyed listening to them. Because initially you almost bolted out when the x3 when connected to axxis integrated amp.When I listened to to audition 30 minute is needed to settle my ears .I also believe your Harbeth are tune for your listening preference.your room is very familiar to you.The dealer room is very unfamiliar to you , you are not familiar how the x3 react to the room.I believe your system is also perfectly match to your Harbeth. So I agree with your comparison.I wish you can listen to x3 with perfectly match system and the right room for them.

Arafiq - nice review, thank you for taking the time to write it.  I listened to the X3's at a local dealer (who also used Forte integrated amps).  In their room I did notice the clarity, transparency and high frequency extension that you mention.  I also noticed a disturbing bass bump.  In this dealer's room the speakers were place well away from the rear walls behind the speakers.  I don't know why the X3 and other AGD models haven't been measured in labs yet (like Sterephile) as that would help us to better understand the sources of what we hear, the design aspects (and tradeoffs) and give me, at least, greater confidence in making a purchase decision.

@jayctoy I understand your point about listening to the X3s in an unfamiliar room. But that is still significantly more valuable than just reading about it or listening at audio shows -- which I suspect a vast majority of buyers do. Whether we like it or not, unless the dealer is willing to let you try the speakers in your own room, the best we can do is to listen at a dealer. Perfect? Of course not. But that is the only data point I had available to make a decision. Could the outcome have been any different in my room? Possibly. But I wasn't going to roll the dice based on my initial impressions.

I ended up buying the Magnepan 1.7i's. TBH, they are a phenomenal speaker given the price. Like any speaker, they have strengths and weaknesses. But you would be hard pressed to find another speaker at $3k retail that can compete with Maggies when it comes to soundstage, acoustic instruments, and vocals. I'm thinking of upgrading to 3.7i/s ... that should tell you how much I liked the 1.7s :)

 

@newton Good to know I was not the only one who was perturbed by the mid bass bump. I suspect the issues I heard with X3 has more to do with how they've been voiced as opposed to an inherent weakness in the overall design. Nonetheless, it still provides SQ that punches above the asking price. I hope Michael Borressen will tweak the design in v2 of this model to get rid of the midbass bump.

Arafiq ribbon speakers are so unique. You get different taste of sound.Why I bought the model 9 KLH panel, Resd rose, and now x1.Magnepan are good speakers if you can match them. Thank you for the update.

Good to know I was not the only one who was perturbed by the mid bass bump. I suspect the issues I heard with X3 has more to do with how they've been voiced as opposed to an inherent weakness in the overall design. Nonetheless, it still provides SQ that punches above the asking price. I hope Michael Borressen will tweak the design in v2 of this model to get rid of the midbass bump.

My hypothesis is that the midbass bump is what allows the X3s to sound so dynamic and linear at conversational levels, it compensates for the Munson loudness curve. The bump does necessitate giving them plenty of space—about 3’ minimum from the front baffles to the wall behind them. When I first setup the X3s there was a considerable mode being excited when the aforementioned spacing was closer to 2.5 feet. An additional 6” was all it took to tame the mode completely from a subjective standpoint. Despite having zero doubt the X3s would produce a hump in anechoic measurements, they still manage to produce the most subjectively balanced bass I’ve ever achieved in a system, regardless of playback level. In fact, when I had the WiiM Ultra streamer here to test, I ran its room correction DSP and was surprised that it suggested considerable levels of bass boost between 40 and 120Hz, no reductions at any frequency. The system sounded much better without the DSP, no matter how many times I allowed the WiiM to attempt correction. 

I was a stalwart believer that all good speakers should produce a mostly linear output, but my experience with the X3s has completely upended that concept for me. My hunch is the X3s would produce rather mediocre measurements by the Floyd Toole metrics, which is why I am beginning to doubt whether said metrics really do indicate much of what we can expect subjectively. My departed Revels measured better, no doubt, but the X3s absolutely wipe the floor with them subjectively.  

 

follow up --- during the summer I had a pair of the X1s (bookshelf) with their stands to compare to the Harbeth 30.2 XD.  At different points over the frequency curve I was able to hear some details previously unheard on the 30.2.  Bass was not bloated, but appeared to be punchy.  The overall X1 sound is 'fast' and neutral.  But the overall tonal balance of the X1s is thinner/leaner, which in a bass-limited small bookshelf speaker is a negative, to me.  The answer as to which one I kept:  the 30.2s.   In general, I'm curious as to how no reviewer who does lab/spec analysis has reviewed any of the Borresen speakers (to my knowledge) yet.   I hope to see some, which will illuminate why they sound the way they do and may put aside any reservations prospective buyers may have about acquiring a pair.

Did ANYONE hear any imaging issues with the Borresens?  Anything strange?  I heard something quite definitive during every audition (3X).  


Did ANYONE hear any imaging issues with the Borresens?  Anything strange?  I heard something quite definitive during every audition (3X).  

No imaging issues in my room with my system. They are arguably the best imaging speakers I’ve owned, perhaps only slightly bested by coaxials in terms of center image outline and depth. They are definitely the best with regard to instrument outlines at the left/right of the soundstage. Though I must note that the same pair produced a more “wall of sound” presentation (relative to my setup) at the dealer where they were spaced further apart by a couple feet. In that setup they made vocals sound larger than life. I didn’t let that deter me, however, because I’ve experienced similar presentations with many speakers at other dealers. I figured it was only a matter of the dealer failing to dial in the best toe angle or the room’s treatment scheme.

I can’t speak for the X2 towers. The dealer had them on display but I didn’t audition them. My guess is they image somewhat differently since their tweeters are above their midwoofers rather than below as in the X3s. 

 

Did ANYONE hear any imaging issues with the Borresens?  Anything strange?  I heard something quite definitive during every audition (3X). 
 

I have been breaking in a pair of X3 for about 30 days. Little frustrating at first as the center image had an off center,left channel tilt. After breaking in a bit and careful remeasuring, everything is rock solid. They sit on Townshend Seismic Podiums which bumps them up to another level. 
 

They replaced a pair of Persona 5 f’s ( which replaced Magico S3) I lose a tad transparency from the Personas but gain a huge soundstage with much fuller bass. 
They are sounding better every week and have around 150 hrs of the 500 that Borresen claims to get them peak performance. 
 

I am running a Coda CSiB integrated which runs class A for the first 18 watts per Coda. Borresen dealers usually will show the X model with the Axxess Forte electronics. Could be why I have heard comments on them being non musical. I have run them on all genre’s and they are definitely musical ,  I suspect amplifier matching could be the reasoning 

Regarding a mid bass hump that I have seen mentioned. I have a purpose built, golden ration room and there is no mid bass hump. The bass is tuneful, deep and tight( took a few weeks of break in)  I have put my custom swarm system up for sale as the bass is so good. 
 

Really liking what I am hearing with this speaker for under an under 10k street price.   Looks awesome in the room. The finish is beautiful. Perfect size speaker. 

Not exactly on point as I have no experience with the X3, but someone might find this useful. I’ve had an AGD ecosystem since shortly after the intro of the 2nd gen cabling.  From Aavik U300 through U-280 amps up to the D2 cables, eventually settling on the C2 as best bang. Only I was using the Raidho TD series for speakers. It was otherworldly. However, being fully invested in AGD I figured it could only get better adding the cherry on the top with a Borresen speaker. I was wrong. I sold my beloved TD for the B02 and absolutely hated it from day one. Thought I would get used to it and really tried for 6 months, nadda. Ended up going back to Raidho and the TD’s, sorry I ever left.

Just my experience but I’ve been at this for more decades than I care to admit and feel people should consider the Raidho TD series if Borresen is on their radar.

@benzman 

 

thanks, that is exactly what I heard. 

sounds like it can be fixed with precise positioning and aiming which I am prepared to do.  

ready for another audition ! 

Did anyone see the new review posted by Erin on youtube. As I mentioned earlier, while there was a lot to love about the X3's, there was something about the midrange that I didn't quite like. I still preferred the Harbeth 40.2's over the X3, especially when it pertained to midrange. I didn't evaluate the differences technically, but I think Erin's findings shed some light on my impressions. There's definitely something about it that didn't appeal to me.