I'm not a fan of pure silver cables as they tend to sound bright, and less so of active cables which are a just a gimick imho. You sound like you are not familiar with Jorma cables Tbg and Jorma's sophisticated shielding. I'm not sure why you're making an uninformed statement like.. I doubt if you will have them more than two years. I have previously said what you have only to have myself proven wrong ? I actually know Vmhf and am familiar with his audio journey. Origo are the most organic, transparent and tonaly neutral of cables, yet have a musical soul as Vmhf said. At their price and performance level, imho you would have to spending silly money on your rig to justify higher end cables. Think Magico Q5, Marten Coltrane 2 etc. I recommend reading Robert Levi's PF review of Origo where he compared Origo to his reference KS Elation cables if you want to read up on them. |
Vmhf, forgive me, but I doubt if you will have them more than two years. I have previously said what you have only to have myself proven wrong. I must have heard the Jorma cables even at this years CES, but personally I doubt if I would be very impressed as they are not long crystal silver and have a charged shield to deal with rfi and emi, like my Exemplar Portal Silvers. I will never say they are the last cables I will have, however. |
For me it's jorma origo speaker cables. They are last cable for me. Gone through top end cables from jps labs, kimber cable but the jorma just captures the soul of the music the other cables cannot duplicate, excellent they are. Expensive but worth every cent for similarly high end systems. |
I have recently re-cabled my system w/ Tellurium Q Ultra Black speaker cables, and Black balanced interconnects. I upgraded from some XLO speaker cables, and BetterCables Silver Serpent balanced interconnects. No comparison, the Tellurium's were far superior. In fact, I've compared the Tellurium's vs Cardas Clear, and I liked the Tellurium Q's better, better bass, mids, and smoother (though still very detailed) highs. Well worth a listen. BTW, the rest of my system is Ayre DX-5, K-5xeMP, VX-5e and Wilson Sophia 3's.
Tom |
The only expensive i/c cable I've ever bought is Kimber KCAG 18 years ago (and compared with the prices of some these days, they're not wildly costly). Despite a few detours since, I've still not heard anything I prefer.
When I bought Bryston amp's, I had my Kimbers reterminated with Neutrik XLR's for balanced operation but, because I bought the base-level plugs with nickel-plated pins and the job was done by someone who used low-grade solder, it was a backward step that basically spoiled a hitherto excellent cable. So I had them re-done, again with Neutrik XLR's but this time the ones with silver-plated pins. The transformation was very worthwhile and, after a couple of weeks of burn-in (yes, plugs and solder need to burn in too), they sound better than ever, especially in the bass. In the mid and treble they're a bit on the lean side but, in the context of a very powerful system in a less than vast room, that's no bad thing. They aren't champions in the soundstaging/imaging department, but they largely make up for it with excellent transparency, detail, separation and resolution. As I write, I'm just burning in my second pair that I've had reterminated with Furutech XLR's (with gold-plated pins). Whether or not the higher cost of the Furutech's turns out to be worthwhile remains to be seen. What I can say is that Kimber KCAG is better than the vastly less expensive Van Damme Tour Grade Classic XKE Starquad microphone cable that PMC recommend for use between Bryston components, though not by a huge margin so, if you're on a budget and want an excellent inexpensive i/c cable, the Van Damme is as good a place as any to start. Being mainly a pro-audio cable (and used widely in many such applications), Van Damme doesn't get much, if any, coverage in the home audio press, probably because it rivals cables costing very much more, made by companies who contribute significantly the advertising revenues of most of the mag's, but it's certainly a very good benchmark against which to reference costlier alternatives.
Connect Audio in Slough do a very good (and quick) job making up whatever length you may want and terminated with whatever plugs you care to specify. A 1.2m pair only costs about £30, which in this game is peanuts. If, for some reason, I were to be denied my beloved Kimber KCAG's, I could (just about) live with a pair of Van Dammes instead. Connect Audio also have the equipment and skills needed to remove poor quality solder from i/c's that need reterminating using better stuff (they always use WBT silver solder). I recommend tham highly. |
BAHAHAHAHAHA! Cwlondon you need to get a life!! (oooh a double agenda) I haven't even read all my posts! (agenda) Look dude I recommend what I feel is appropriate to a thread!(agenda) It seems as though you are the Audiogon cop with the frequency of your "DEALER" allegations! (yet another agenda) Even in this thread you have accused some very enthusiastic, well meaning audiophiles as DEALERS! (yep another agenda) You gotta stop that dude or you will turn some very well intended and informative posters away from this forum. (hey a non agenda, go figure?)
As for your answer to my first post, you answered with all capital letters, screaming at me is not a good idea on your part! (serious agenda!)
Audiogon is a profit based enterprise. The forums serve as a conduit to help increase sales through the buzz and Q&A by Audiogon members. The more products are discussed in the forum the more advertising, commercial and non commercial sales will increase. (Duh!)
FWIW I'am in no way a dealer or schill for anything audio. If a product is good, I will say so! (agenda) I've built a very good business through word of mouth recommendations over the last 25 years, and have a stellar reputation for the product that I produce!( OK this one does have a slight agenda going for it)
The comment was meant to be "cheesy", and you bit on it.(DOH!)
This was too easy. You read all of my posts?...Unbelievable!
BAHAHAHAHAHA |
Rodge827,
I said "over 25".
In fact and on review, it looks like you posted thinly veiled advertising for Omega speakers 31 times, with a similar use of exclamation points suggesting an agenda.
You also posted a telephone number of the dealer or distributor, with a tell him I sent you kind of a tone.
As I have said in other threads from time to time, I am very devoted to this forum which began as place for enthusiasts to compare notes and share their experiences and enthusiasm for audio.
Many people here have been unselfishly helping others for years, and offering advice for beginners to get started by recommending bargains on the used market, which also serves the site.
In my view, the founders were wise in knowing that a gathering of passionate and unbiased experts would establish a foundation of credibility, after which they could accept ads, charge classifed fees etc.
In my opinion, the idea was not for people with commercial affiliations to lurk around the forums and try to steer people to products, while masquerading as helpful enthusiasts.
So I will continue to speak out when threads are hijacked by people where a quick review of their posting history suggests shameless self promotion or stuffing the ballot box in response to sincere questions.
In terms of what I described as a "fetish", the definition includes the worship of inanimate objects which are assumed to have special or magical powers - like oversized speaker wire.
I believe your attempt to insult me with a cheesey sex joke says more about you and your preferences than it does about me.
With that, I do hope we can get back to the enduring topic of biggest, baddest audio cables and wish you good luck.
cwlondon |
Cwlondon, Thank-you for for your infomative post....I had no idea that I posted 25 responses about Omega speakers...I thought it was only 24...My life is soo much better now!...I will leave you alone to your "fettish" for all cables long and fat...You were talking about cables, weren't you? |
I'm with Mapman
Rodge827, you sound like...... a DEALER!!!! I notice in the speaker forum you recommend OMEGA!!! OVER 25 times!! As an answer to EVERYTHING!!!!! WHILE OFF TOPIC!!!!! LIKE YOU ARE JUST NOW!!!! WOW!
Back to biggest and baddest, please. |
The only thing to keep in mind with DNM is that they are not shielded and I have found can pick up RF noise, for example if used with switching amps, in some cases more easily than typical shielded designs.
Other than that, they are golden. |
I went from some Biggest Baddest cables to the thinnest and best sounding that I have ever heard. For 10 years I was using Virtual Mode IC"s and loved them until I took a leap of faith and tried the DNM IC with the HFTN's installed. WOW! these cables are the closest thing to no cable at all. The music flows so naturaly with zero colorations and PRAT galore! DNM has been around a long time and are well worth looking into! |
I have to admint I bought the kimber select silver because of the sound but also the look and reputions. I won't get into detalils but was that a bad move really poor quality on the select stuff. the run of the mill stuff is great but avoid the select especally the speaker cables. |
First of all I'm going to assume that by size you mean girth, not length? Size does matter, but what matters more is how much you enjoy the overall performance....I'd be happy to make you a custom set of X-32s or X-16s (half copper) covered in 2 inch diameter conduit and black mesh. Let me know if you are interested.
Holly |
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Not big but bad ass-Basis Audio cables!!!
Not sure why anyone would focus on cable size vs. strictly on quality and performance for the price? The best cables I have ever heard by a long shot seem to be a well kept secret and are the interconnects, power cords, and speaker cables made by Basis Audio. Well known for fantastic turntables people have no idea how fantastic their systems would sound if they have not tried Basis interconnects and speaker cables. I am amazed at the huge leap I obtained when switching my system over to Basis cables and now I can no longer find any faults or weak links in the performance. For the first time I can sit back and simply enjoy the music without driving myself crazy trying to figure out what needs to be changed and what I should try next (you guys know what I mean). I HIGHLY RECOMMEND BASIS AUDIO CABLES! |
Homecinematronics, I not only had the Distech Platinum but also shotgunned it with multiple runs. I also made power cords out of it. I still have most of it somewhere. I don't think it is competitive anymore.
Audioman58, I also had the Cerious cabling. There were certainly others who disagreed with me, but I liked what I heard and at one time only used their cabling. Then Stealth Indra came along. |
Hello To all the I have had the Cerious cables better in some ways but still had a few short comings , the Teo cables are very good but a Ripoff $12k for a pr of speakers cables , give me a break. Audio Magic has spent 5 years and finally he has 4 lines of liquid cables ,Actually I bought the middle of the line Sorcerer
and Jerry at Audio magic says these beat his last years reference pure Silver Clairvoynt cables that is saying a lot at less than half the cost $1k for 1 1m pair of interconnects and $1500 for a 8ft pair of speaker cables is a bargain IMO none of the ringing as with metal cables and no EMI to pickup and very natural sounding, pretty new out there but their Illusions just got a excellent review check out Audio Magics home page for more info. |
Anyone remember the Distech Platinum (name only) speaker cable? It was composed of multiple runs of their silver plated, teflon coated cable. Terminated on beefy welding spade type lugs and covered in a nice black snake braid. the cable sounded great!! Nice smooth mids excellent bass a clean extended highs. Its only flaw was maybee a bit of tube like softness or slight midrange blur. At the time it was one of the best avaialble. I still have my 10' pair as do a number of friends. It retailed for $1100. at the time. Dealer was 50% of that. |
Ebm, I have had many of the Stealth cables and powercords. With the exception of the PGS ics, I loved them. I had silver connections on the power cords which sounded great but did not hold well.
These were all displaced when I got an all charged system using Synergistic Research cables. I found the SRs to be much quieter and more dynamic. I always keep an open ear for new cables, however. But I have compared several more expensive cables with my SRs and stayed with what I have. |
Not DNM Reson.
These may never come out of my system and are the exact opposite of what you seek. |
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what gauge is the monster cable Z1R speaker cable? Thank You |
SORRY ITS STEALTH WITH AN A STEALTH DREAM V10!!!!SORRY!! |
I have had Siltech and Kharma Grand Reference in my system this cable is amazing!! I tried Dream from my dealer High Water sound in NYC this DREAM V10 is even better than DREAM. |
Ebm
ARE YOU A DEALER!!!!!!!!!!!
AND/OR DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMERCIAL AFFILIATIONS WITH THAT CABLE?????
JUST WONDERED!!!!! |
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I got it the first time. No need to SHOUT!!!!!!!!!!
:-) |
STELTH DREAM V10 ON STELTH WEB SITE!! |
Thanks, a search on their site returned nothing. Where do you live? |
It is STELTH DREAM V10. It is under speaker cable DREAM Model V10!! on STELTH WEB SITE!!Thanks |
Thanks, a search on their site returned nothing. Where do you live? |
Hi again , Just go to Stelth web site go to speaker cable click DREAM the V10 will come up. |
HI, I own it i upgaded from the DREAM you may call Stelth at this time it is shipping but not the web yet. |
Ebm, contrary to your assertions it doesn't exist on the website. It must have been a bad Dream. |
STELTH V10 is now on STELTH web site it is a wonderful cable truly revolutionary. |
Silver ribbons, say no more.
Auditioning the Teo Audio Reference cables is known to cause severe disenchantment. |
STELTH V10 came out a few months ago i had STELTH DREAM on loan from my dealer and STELTH. After hearing the DREAM i was told this cable was faster better highs faster bass it is silver ribbon and has a carbon fiber core.I have over 100 hrs on cable and used a Darma cable cooker for a few days i still dont beleive how good this cable is i have had Kharma and Siltech . This cable is faster better staging(much deeper) it is not on the web site yet it is 30% more than the very good DREAM.Hope this clears things up. |
I Thought Ebm meant Stealth V10, but I see no such animal there.
Tell us about your experiences with the Teo References. |
Ebm: there is no such model. Maybe you're thinking of cars such as a Dodge Viper.
I just received Teo Audio's new Reference interconnects and speaker cables on loan. |
STELTH V10 Best cable i have ever heard in my system!! |
Norm (Tbg), I do not have resistance measurements, but we're talking about a liquid metal, not liquid ceramic (Cerious) or carbon (vdH), and I have not seen or heard anything to indicate the resistance is significantly different from, say, interconnects using solid-phase metal conductors, although the manufacturer may provide the information. What they have measured is capacitance, and on another discussion forum Ken Hotte (Kbk above), one of the principals of Teo Audio, posted the following: These cables are and or just were in, shall we say, a state of the art facility. Someone who definitely has the qualifications, just tested them and found that the the 'actual' capacitance of any of them, 1m length, 2m length, etc..any design (there are three extant IC models out of some 200 variations I tried), is a full magnitude lower than...6 inches of soldered in place, air dielectric, untreated, clean, 99.99999% 28g copper wire. Just using a LCR meter won't show this. I repeatedly stated that the cable will simply show you the reflection of the meter's design, nothing more. You have to know how to work at getting true dissipation information. This is part of why it is stated that the cable will simply 'become' the impedance that is necessary for matching or bridging the given presented load(s).
I knew that would be the case, and I didn't bother to measure it as the whole point was to make standard calculations and usage of complex LCR.....Irrelevant. I know the above may raise more questions than it answers, but there you have it, and it's as much information as they are willing to give out...I've asked, myself. As always, the proof is in the listening. Brian Walsh |
Essentialaudio, I have kind of dropped out of this thread. I meant no offense about the statement that I repeated from Cerious Technology.
Might I ask about the resistance of these cables. Years ago I had the carbon cables and found I had "ground loop" problems because of their resistance. I now have to lift all ac grounds except that to my H-Cat line stage to get the maximum benefit from it, so I should have no such problems with high resistance cabling. |
Thanks Klinerm, for your kindness and willingness to try something very new and different, and for your courage to speak out publicly about how wonderful Teo Audio Liquid Cables are! We appreciate it! Oh, yeah, I'm the worldwide point of contact for the product...I'm a bit partial :>)
Briankurtz (Answers) Brian, next time you travel this way please consider coming by for music. You can just listen or if you have XLR or RCA cables for demo, bring them along. If travel brings you on a Tuesday, the whole gang is here for you to meet. I miss the days when you lived here, it was good seeing you at the Canada show. |
Klinerm, thank you for the unsolicited kind words. I know you are careful about changes in your system, yet your leap of faith based on the shorter interconnects' performance has been rewarded, also confirmed by your friends. Many happy hours of listening. |
Yes, Brian, truthfully, the baseline physics are completely different. The issue is that signal itself is a fluid or plasma effect. running that signal through solidified and crystallized molecular structures like 'solids' is wholly contrary to how the signal itself wants to flow or express it's various and dynamic field conditions.
Running it through a fluid metal, a true fluid, which is free and separate at the molecular level and with high electron mobility at the same time it is charge neutral as relatively possible, means that the signal can express itself more correctly or naturally ...with less noise and less distortion.
More than one person has said that this particular cable added into audio systems makes the single biggest positive change in audio they have ever had or heard in their entire audio careers. This comment came from two different audio equipment distributors who have each been in the audio business for over 30 years.
So yes, there is considerable hype out there in the world of audio, but his is entirely differnent physics at play in this specific case.
One thing for an engineer to try to understand is that all of our basics in electrical measurements are based on the analysis of solids - via solids. Those rules only vaguely apply here and the analysis is so complex that physics cannot yet model what is going on. We (ie, science and maximum possible computer power) only recently managed to figure out how to successfully model a 'single hydrogen atom' structure. So, in essence, the physics of what is at play here cannot yet be modeled. However, we can use good strong intuition, prior experience, and a good mental model of what atomic structure actually is. And atomic structure is not what they taught you in high school.
It is a completely different and dynamic knarly beast, where Einstein, Heisenberg, and quantum function and effect meet in the street and duel it out.
This is all theory, speculation and this is the deep end of the pool in this particular case.
It isn't really an audio cable at all, it merely resembles one - and is a totally different beast.
This cable design presents a true 'before and after' moment in audio times.
For the first time ever, the transfer of the signal between gear is being handled in the exact way that the actual physics of actual signal demands it be handled.
We have a fluid plasma transfer system handling a fluid plasma signal. |
Klinerm, I'm not much of a forum/chat room guy (I'm too wordy!), but your dealer contacted me and let me know about your post. Let's just say that we're thrilled that you're thrilled! Teo Audio's patent attorney says we have in Teo Audio Liquid Cable the first truly new thing to happen in conductor technology in 150 years. These things are very different than conventional solid metal cables. They seem to break all known laws of physics, but in fact only use ones never applied to audio -- liquid metal doesn't follow the same rules as solid metal. It's quite complex, yet just that simple. I'm just glad we have the patents on it! Thanks Klinerm, for your kindness and willingness to try something very new and different, and for your courage to speak out publicly about how wonderful Teo Audio Liquid Cables are! We appreciate it! Oh, yeah, I'm the worldwide point of contact for the product...I'm a bit partial :>) |
After listening to some smaller lengths between my source components and preamp, I just persuaded my dealer to persuade TEO liquid cable to make a special 6.5 meter run of RCA interconnects. They weren't sure they could do it initially, but after a few weeks and some listening tests they produced them. I put them between an ARC Ref 5 and a pair of CAT JL-3 monoblocks, and the openess of the sound is just incredible.
I can't of course predict how these would sound in any other system, but if you ever get a chance to demo a pair in your system, I highly recommend you try them out. |
James Brown cables are man's,man's,man's,man's cable!! |
James Brown cables there SUPER BAD!! |
KHARMA i use KHARMA REF on my MAGICO MINI 2 SOUND GREAT!!!Body weight great sounstage!! |
