One of the amps will need to have a gain adjustment. You'll need a sound level meter of some kind if you want an accurate adjustment. I tune my woofer towers by ear but YMMV.
Bi-Amping: How can I determine relative output?
Long Story Short: I have a 50w/channel pair of tube monos, and a 300w stereo solid state amp playing through a set of JBL 4367s. two way monitors.
The tubes are on the horn tweeter and the solid state is on the 15" woofer, crossover is apparently 700hz.
Doing absolutely nothing, some music sounds completely "normal" and some music sounds artificially bass heavy.
The solid state amp has gain adjustments for each channel.
I have a Fluke 115 multimeter, and access to plenty of test tones, but nothing to read SPL.
Is there a way to measure output at the speaker terminals such that I could dial the woofer amp down to "match" the tube amps?
If so, would this be more or less constant as the preamp driving the amps changes volume, or would it only "match" (to the extent that it actually matches at all) at one volume level?
Amplifiers are voltage amplifiers, and provide a fixed amount of gain (voltage out x voltage in). There is a convention of 23 or 26 dB, but best to measure it. You can use an average multi-meter if you can find a 60 Hz test done. At this frequency multimeters are spot-on. So, play a 60 Hz signal through both amps at the same time and set them so they output the same on the amps. You don't have to go very loud. A 5V signal is plenty to tell. |
I like what Erik described above but in the end, you'll have to go with your ears. My thought is that the songs that sound normal have room for more bass in them. They might even sound better with the more bass to many or most people. I would use a bass heavy song and turn it down until it sounds right. Done. |
SS Amp has a right and left gain controls. Using the Fluke, is it possible to measure at the speaker outputs (if so what would I be measuring) in order to get the right/left levels the same? A little background- the tube amps are plenty for normal use, and sound great. I’ve been having an itch to run the JBLs at ridiculous levels, so I bought a Parasound A21+ to play with. It sounds great and the combo allows for wall shaking sound, but isn’t as smooth as when using the tube monos. I noted the gain controls on the A21+, and set out to try a biamped setup. Given that the speaker is a two way with a pretty low crossover, I though that it may be possible to get decent sound. With zero adjustment, it sounds much better than I expected. Currently using the line level pass through on the Parasound, however I have a spare set of the IC I’m using and plan to try connecting to the 2nd output of my line stage. if there were some way to get both sides adjusted as to some actual metric, not by ear or according to SPL, I’d love to start from that point, and tweak if necessary. |
@erik_squires Voltage out does not equal SPL out. You may get the amps giving the same output but differences in driver efficiency will make the SPL different. |
@erik_squires Oh shoot I was thinking about the way I do it with an outboard crossover. You are right.
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The issue is that even if you can measure, WHAT are you measuring? Which frequency? The SS and tube amps will respond differently over the impedance curve of your speakers! The SS amp will dump more power into impedance dips and less into peaks. The tube amp will remain more consistent, but generally reduces its output on both peaks and dips. Therefore, the calls to just use your ears are not wrong. However, perhaps you can use your ears more effectively. Here's what I'd do, to "broadband" level-match the tube and A23+, easy peasy:
Note I haven't tried this; just kinda what I thought up now given your situation. I do have an A23 floating around here and the gain pots can be handy. |
OP: Not sure what you mean, it seems simple enough. First, find test tones from somewhere in the 50-60 Hz range. Attach a multimeter to one of the tube amp’s outputs. Set the multimeter to read volts AC. Adjust the preamp until the output reads 5V exactly. Switch to the SS amp and try to adjust the amp’s level settings there to the same. |
if the a21+ is new, it will sound extremely smooth at 450 hours or so like mine did, so that could be an option. you can set an amps gain with a test tone and measure the voltage at the terminals without speakers attached. the problem is that tube amps require the load of a speaker or you could damage the amp. just play pink noise bands above and below the crossover of the woofer and adjust gain so they sound close. use tracks 47 to 56 on this disk or download |
There are a variety of Audio Spectrum Analyzers available now on the Net and (looks like) as phone apps. Seems they (and whatever mic) should be accurate enough, at your crossover freq, to be of service. I've never used either, as I've always owned enough hardware, so: I can't swear to anything. Just pay close attention (set on Slow) to the band levels on either side of your crossover point. That's if you don't trust your ears. Female voices/vocals (with which you are intimately familiar) should sound way off, given just a slight disparity in levels.
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