Anyone heard new Zu Union 6?

Thought I’d have to try out for myself 

So……. How are they?

Just got them so will be a while before I can review them as they are notorious for break in. Trying to let them play in 24/7 with some burn in tracks. I prefer high sensitivity speakers since I love my low watt tube amps, 45, 421a, etc. but currently also have an Ayre EX-8 2.0.
 

 my favorite pair so far is a custom built Omega called Vintage 8 High Output. two 8” custom built ferrite based drivers called RS8

How do they sound right out of the box with no break in?

@snapsc  they were a little strident in the mids, and didn't seem as 'dynamic' is my main speakers... I've been trying to torture them 24/7, turn it up louder when I leave, etc. 

But they are very punchy and reach lower than I expected. I think they prefer more dynamic/exciting amps as opposed to warmer right now, just a general observation. The Ayre tends to tilt slightly warm for me, so they don't sound as open yet on the Ayre. I switched over to my 421a based tube amp, which has glorious top end extension and air, and the Zu's did much better there. 

But it's still too early to pay close attention. I'm heading out of town next weekend so will get them 24/7 for 3 straight days. ( I can control everything remotely )

Kray… so the Supreme is the top end model as I read it. Now that you have more burn in… what do you think… how is the low end… the stridency… the sound stage?

Hi @snapsc well they aren't technically full burned it yet. this is the craziest speaker so far... they keep changing, thankfully for the better. Made the mistake of changing several things in my system at same time as well, so I'm trying to let everything play in together for a good 100-200 hours before I make a final judgement. 

Zu states the U6S reacts to all component changes, more so than the lower line. so pairing up with what the Zu wants seems to be key. I've noticed this first hand. I've never had a speaker that sounds so different with different amps, etc. 

Compared to the Zu’s right now my omegas flow better and are smooth while Zu has a little more bite in the details (I still need to put 100+more hours on them to be fair). This might be explained as stridency... 
But at the same time I feel the Omegas have plenty of details and aren’t hiding lots of stuff. So it’s kinda perplexing. Being sensitive to equipment changes, any change shows thru. Which can be good or bad. While Omega seems to be good with almost whatever I connect to it. I guess you could say they are more forgiving which could be “bad”, compared to the Zu's really staying true to what's behind them. 

The sound stage is huge though. Very nice and big. Low end is there with the right amp. my 421a tube amp is great but I feel I need to connect my sub to get some of the lower end grunt. But with my solid state stuff, a Naim Atom, Valvet E2, I feel the low end is satisfying and don't feel I have to add a sub. But from my experience once you have a sub in your system, it's hard to unheard 

I think part of my issue too is I made so many changes. I was trying to simplify down to an all in one integrated from all separate devices. but I'm finding the DAC's in these all in ones very lacking. I much prefer NOS R2R/Multibit dac sound... so I will also be reverting back to a NOS/R2R dac soon. 

with that said once I get the new DAC I will give everything 2 weeks to play in fully, then do my final love it or leave test, take advantage of my 60-day return window. 

I'm very interested in what you'll have to say. I'm looking for new speakers in the high-efficiency range, and both Zu and Omega seem to be top notch. It seems Zu may do bass and the "party" side a bit better than Omega (in general), tho I could be misinterpreting.

Sounds like Zu is all about dynamics and tone, which are my priorities as well I'd say (not as picky about staging/imaging, detail retrieval, etc).

Looking forward to your thoughts.

I am also interested in your thoughts on these speakers. I tried Spatial Audio speakers and they were OK, but I did not like them as much as my EgglestonWorks Fontaines, so I sold them. The Spatials were the only high-eficiency speakers I have ever tried. Thank you for your time!

sorry it’s taking so long. I made the mistake of changing out too many components at once. New DAC, new streamer, new DDC, new power cords (Audio Art Statement with rhodium plugs). So even though I’ve got over 200 hours on the Zu’s now the other components have less than 40 hrs on them. 

at first I thought something didn’t sound right with the Zu’s so I swapped the omegas back in which I know intimately, but they sounded off too, so I know it wasn’t the Zu’s. 

@sp33ls so far just a quick generalization the Zu’s are definitely dynamic, toneful, and great detail retrieval. The omegas can seem softer or more forgiving, but just a beautiful sound. I wouldn’t party or rock out with the Omegas, but you probably could with the Zu’s since they are a bit more punchy. 
 

@moofoo I've never heard a pair of Spatials, but have wanted to. But I’d say the Zu and Omega are prob more efficient especially with flea watt tubes. 
 

give me another week or so to get everything gelled together. No more changes coming anytime soon. But I’ll follow up

Hey Kray, I am also giving Union 6 a try right now to see if I want to trade up from my Dirty Weekends.  They just arrived yesterday.

Have you tried corner loading these?  Because right now that seems to be where they are performing best in my room, corner loaded, Audio Note-style with extreme toe in so they cross over about 2 feet in front of me.

First impression is these are loud and not very forgiving.  They play noticeably louder than Dirty Weekends. Definitely more detailed than DW2, but like you mentioned there is some bite to certain instruments. That said, the sound can be very exciting and piano sounds are much more resolved on Union 6 than DW2.  

Hey @whoopycat good to hear from you. Did you do the base model or a superfly/supreme upgrade? haven’t tried corner loading yet but may give it a go soon. But I do have them toed in pointing directly at me. 
 

how far from the walls do you have them? Loud and unforgiving was my first impression but they have broken in a lot and sound better. First couple days I was perturbed, but remembering how other Zu’s needed MAJOR break in I’m letting them play as much as possible. I also think they are VERY susceptible to your gear/chain. You hear exactly what your DAC, amp, etc can do. I had a ESS9038 DAC that I didn’t like at all with them. Switched back to my favorite type of dacs, R2R, and they’ve been much better. Also my Valvet E2 amp sounded almost too warm on my omegas but on the Zu it’s a much better fit. 

Mine are the standard version with Mission wire and ClarityCaps.  I have them tight in the corners, maybe about 4 inches off the wall.  Your walnut Unions look great, I wish I had gone that route.

yeah I decided to go full upgrade instead of wishing I would have later. 

So after a full 5 weeks of constant usage, I can say the Zu Union 6 Supreme is happily staying put in my house. They've broken in very nicely, and from what I read, they will settle in even more over next month or so. The strident is gone, the top end is open and airy, the low end is satisfying enough (although since I already have dual REL T5i's in stereo I leave them hooked up with just slightly adding to the very bottom.

As mentioned before, I had a lot of changes going on during the process, which made it hard to dial it in from a constant setup perspective. I think the best change was adding a Sonnet Morpheus DAC and Denafrips Hermes DDC. My chain looks like this:

Innuos Zen MK3 -> Denafrips Hermes (USB) -> i2S to Morpheus -> RCA out to amp(s) (Valvet E3, and Oliver Sayes 421a tube amp)

I added two new PC's from Audio Art during the process.

My biggest insight is the Zu's are the most revealing speaker I've owned. Every change I made you could hear it, whether a cable, the DDC, etc.. good or bad, the Zu's let you know... So dialing in has been the key as well. 

Compared to my previous statements, I no longer feel the Zu's are strident or closed in. They throw a huge soundstage, and this is the first time I've experienced front to back placement more extremely. Ex on Eagles live Hotel California track, you can easily tell when the drummer kicks in he's behind the other performers. so you get a 3D soundstage on top of the left to right. 

When compared to my Omegas. The Omegas still have a super sweet midrange, at the expense of being more forgiving. To me that means losing a little size of the music, and a little detail. They are actually more similar than different, but with the right gear the Zu's are on top. I'm actually thinking I'll sell my Omega's (Vintage 8 Dual High Output) and buy a used pair of CAMs (Compact Alnico Monitors) to have as a secondary pair. 

@whoopycat put some major hours on yours, and the roughness is all but gone on mine now.

I’ve been following this insightful thread. Currently taking a strong look at these speakers.

@whoopycat did you end up keeping these? Any thoughts after break-in?

@kray feel free to add any more observations. I’m sure I’m not the only following this informative thread. I’m prefer a huge soundstage that you mentioned, but wary that I may encounter listener fatigue after an extended listening session.

@toro3 I'm using a R2R NOS DAC, the sonnet morpheus, so I rarely if ever get listener fatigue. 

These Zu's are great at exposing your equipment. Change something and you can hear it pretty easy. And like most of this hobby, synergy is a major key. My amps are 12wpc Class A Valvet E3 (I upgraded from the E2) and two single ended flea watt tube amps. beautiful combos with the Zu's. Along the lines of exposing... you aren't going to get a bad recording to sound great, but great recordings are what makes me love this hobby. beautiful immersion into the music, very lifelike. 

@kray that was an incredibly helpful post. I owe you either a beer or cup of coffee. Much appreciated!

no problem @toro3  😄

If you're ever in Sarasota I'll take you up on that

Listening to Muddy Waters - Folk Singer now... eerily/spooky good recording

Thanks for the feedback on this thread. I have started looking at high efficiency speakers to go with tube amps. I have narrowed my search down to Tekton Perfect Set, Zu Union 6 and Omega XR8. Also, giving consideration to Heresy IV, but am interested in the full range driver options. I have a Decware UFO2 on order, but it could be a year before I see that. In the meantime I’m debating between some other tube amps like the Willsenton R8 or R300B, Black Ice Audio F11, or Cayin CS-55a. 
 

I’m probably overthinking this entire scenario and will likely be happy with whatever I choose. My lack of experience with these brands and the limited feedback available in the wild on them  is probably what’s causing my hesitation. But thanks again for sharing your experience with speakers.

@mindhead1 owning both the Zu and Onegas, you can’t go wrong either way. Vs the zu union, the omegas will be a little more forgiving at the expense of a bigger more immersive sound. 

the best part of the zu for you is they have several pairs discounted in their “ready to ship” section. You get a 60 day return period on them. Get them. Break them in for a month, then spend a couple weeks decided if the zu is for you. 

louis omegas are usually around 3 months out, since he’s a one man shop, but you get a beautiful speaker at a very good price. Unless you can find what you want used, which can be difficult. I’ll be putting mine up soon. 

How would you say the midrange is on the Zu's?  Is it more neutral or does it have a nice lush textured sound?  How to strings sound with them?

Hi @jwglista It's always hard to explain, but I'd put it between neutral and lush. in my system I feel the midrange is the most natural/live of any of my recent speakers. Female vocals are eery and can hear breathing, raspiness (if it exist in the voice). 

I'll have to do some testing with strings, and I don't listen to classical and haven't paid much attention specifically to strings.

Reading through kray's Union6  experience with interest. I have the Omen Defs and have similar experiences regarding how sensitive they are to equipment and wire changes. To me it has been well worth the experimentation to find the perfect symmetry.I went from Harbeths to ZUs and now am seriously addicted to the big live sound.Don't want to hijack the thread, but one thing to think about is that it took forever to to find the exact positioning,which ended up being totally different than any other speakers ever.One of them is actually toed out slightly. Bizarre.I'll continue to read y'alls experiences and be quiet now :-)

@jtcf i had Harbeth C7ES a while back and totally agree. The big live sound is great. 
 

Great looking setup and I am sure it sounds great. I like clean and simple, in setup and components. Thank you again for your time and input on these speakers! Have fun!

Reporting back to say I returned the Unions to Zu.  They do improve with break in and did a lot of good things, but they were for a third system (I know).  For the record I have Zu Defheads in my bedroom that I've listened to daily for the last 7 years.

I've had about 5 Zu models in my home and the funny thing is they all sound different.  The Unions had crazy transient repsonse and were easily the most sensitive Zu speaker I've heard, I'd be surprised if they did not measure close to spec. The new internal Griewe scheme works well.  However they are also the most unforgiving of recordings of any Zu model I've had, and I like to listen fairly loud.  It's easy to hear the performance gains played side by side with Dirty Weekends, but I don't listen to much female vocals, and there's no question the DW's are easier to live with.

I did have a buddy come over and listen who has heard all of my Zus, and he said he liked the Union 6 better than all of them save for my Defheads.  Better than DW, even better than Druid V.  I don't share that opinion, I liked Druid V more, but I mention it to point out as always YMMV.  Also I was playing some Brazilian music while he was here which was right in the Union 6's wheelhouse.

Anyway, definitely worth an audition and that's why Zu offers their generous trial period.

@kray  beautiful setup! I probably wouldn't have struggled so much if I'd gone for the dirty weekends, but it's been so worth it.@whoopycat that's the way it goes sometimes.Your comparisons are very informative.

I am right now in a free trial of the dirty weekend 6s. I have mixed feelings. Nice deep bass response. I like the mid-range performance considering it somewhat lush. But the treble clarity and presence is not quite there for me. Resolution, too. I am considering an exchange for the union 6s. For example, I am missing the sense of spaciousness listening to wish you were here on vinyl that I got with my old ADS 1230s.  The higher notes seem suppressed in the mix. I can see the most people here with experience with the dirty weekends have had the older models but any thoughts would be appreciated.

I listen to a variety of music but most often listen to indie rock and pop with a good deal of classical music mixed in. Particularly, violin. Some straight ahead rock and roll and the tinge of classic rock like Pink Floyd and the Eagles. Some electronic. I listen most often from mid 60 DB's to 70s with 80ish DB peaks. 

I have to say that I was both surprised and disappointed.  I heard them at the Florida Audio Expo last weekend in the Black Ice room.  It may be that they were being played too loud for the room but what I heard had a lot of muddy bass and was quite harsh.

@snapsc i was there too. It’s so hard to judge speakers at those shows. But I would say that’s isn’t a good representation of them.

also they are extremely transparent to your gear. I’ve never heard a speaker so revealing of that you put in front of it. Change anything and you can hear it. And they pair better with certain gear over others as well.

what was your favorite room? Mine was the simple Orchard GaN amp with Soundfield standmount speakers.

My favorites… not counting the megabuck rooms… in alphabetical order…

a.  Hifi Rose Andrew Jones Source Point 10

b. Orchard Audio Soundfield Audio 

c.  Volti Triode Border Patrol

d.  Joseph Audio

@snapsc I unfortunately didn't get to hear a. or d. but we agree on b. and c. 

So would you say that the Unions lean bright or do they have a balanced sound--if the rest of the system allows it?  I am thinking to add a class D amp to the DWs to boost the treble and clarity or go with the Unions.  I can buy a pair of Unions to test alongside the DWs while extending my DW trial period then return one or the other--according to Zu.  This seems to be a pretty exorbitant step to take.  Right now, I am leaning to getting a Peachtree Nova 150 for $999 with a 30 day trial period. Test out my class D theory.  Zu suggests tubes but that would seem to compound the DW's warmth.