Affordable alternativ to the PS Audio DirectStream DAC

"I have reported @audiotroy for trying to stuff a T2 down my throat .."

Seriously? Are you a 2 year old? You should read some of the aftermarket fuse and power cord threads to build some character...

I have yet no experience with really high priced dac/streamers (above USD 2,000). In my opinion the musical experience is to 95% in the recording, the speakers and the room. But I understand the Moon 380 D with the MiND streamer is a nice piece of kit for about USD 2,500. Beware though that bad apps often destroys good streamers. 

If you are patient quite a few DS Juniors and Seniors come up on eBay, also try your PSAudio distributor they can often get hold of ex dem models

I have the Bell canto 2.7 dac and it is very musical and natural sound8ng , upgrade the fuse and put in a quality power cord 
better still. The Schitt Yaggs is very good also , it excels in detail 
but in my system the Bel canto sounded more Natural,
not quite the absolute resolution in low level detail  but overall 
balance was most important to me and has a excellent digital preamp if you wanted to run direct into a amplifier 
from my Blu-ray I play concerts through it ,and has a Very very low noise floor,excellent dynamic range and Dual low noise Femto clocks Trillions of a second . Dedicated Audio give great deals,
and FYI they are coming out with a player Exact same setup
you can probable get for under $3k in the fall , thedac retail $2500
can be bought for under$2k, all great reviews they only did3-4 
Schiit saturates the market with reviews, 

First dont turne this into a cat fight over a LUMIN product. I was looking for advices from people that has experiences with the PS DirectStream and has compared it to other dac's at a lower prices.

I am looking for used junior but I live in Denmark and there are sold very few PS Audio products.

I know I maybe asking to much but I was blown away by the PS. Had a Chord Qutest for a week, but the PS sounds so much better in my ears.
 
I have reported @audiotroy for trying to stuff a T2 down my throat  

OP, I know a dealer Chris in Ontario who has some Directstream Juniors on sale in both colors, you can email him at cjohnson@partsconnexion.com

I bought one a month ago, updated it to the newest "Snowmass" upgrade patch, and the sound is even more "analog" that advertised, which for me is a good thing.

Let us know how it goes, if you decide to buy one!

Street price on a Directstream w/ bridge is closer to 4500 so compare that to a 4500 Lumin T2 which is not discounted as heavily and the PS Audio is a no brainer I sold my T2 as the sound gets fatiguing after a bit. Aurender A10 is very listenable but not quite as detailed as the T2. 
A few ladder DACs available in the 1,000-1,500 range if you can live without DSD. MHDT Orchid getting a lot of hype. 

I used to own the Auralic Aries streamer which I thought was much better than the LUMIN and Aurender. I got rid of that and my external dac and the expensive usb cable ($750) and went with the ps audio DS dac with bridge board. Much much better. Use Roon on my Mac and use Ethernet to connect to the dac. The DS jr is almost as good as the sr version, gets the same updates. Fpga based dacs are the way to go. Every 6 months or so you get a free update that makes the dac better sounding or adding in additional features like MQA at no charge. People and reviewers like this dac years ago using the then current firmware, and now the latest snowmass firmware is much much better

Jacked

From the OP

I will try to see if I can audit the T2

Considering the T2 is only  a dac/streamer it certainly looks like the OP wants a unit with a built in streamer or it would be doubtful he would have said he would like to take the next step to audition one.

Audio Doctor

The point here is we don't really know what he is looking for.  He only mentioned the DS Sr. in  the context of it being a DAC and at no time mentioned the Bridge II.  So until he clears up what he wants then we are all just guessing.  As he said he was looking for a lesser priced and similar sounding DAC to the  DS Sr. then the S2 fits the bill and as I said I own both.  Whether that is true of the S3 I won't know until Mark sends it back and it is broken in.  If he wants a streamer/DAC combo then one of the Lumin's with the Wolfson chip fits the bill and yes I have owned one of those too. Whether or not the newer Sabre based units fit the bill I won't guess as I have never heard one and am not selling them.  I would guess on based on hearing them that the AKM based Teac Reference/Esoteric units would come closer.

Initm, the Benchmark does not sound like any of these dacs.

Benchmark sound is much crisper and hyper detailed, the PS, the Lumin especially running DSD mode, and the Aqua are all in the liquid more musical camp.

If you want a cheap dac that sounds great and is very liquid but not as good as the above the Ifi DSD pro is really amazing for its price point of $2,500.00

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ

Martin-anderson ,   Buy a Bluesound Node2 and a great dac like Benchmark 3 DAC for about $2,000.00 which is a Stereophile Class A/ A+ recommended product and as good a DAC as the PS Audio. There are other good standalone streamers, the software and app on the Bluesound is great and never gives you any squabbles. 

Jburidan, we also sell the Aqua, we have a Formula and a Lascala Mk II on display and we are not going to say they don't sound good.

We would also ask you have you heard a Lumin T2 or an X1.

The X1 is an extraordinary digital product one of the best sounding front ends we have ever heard, it is magical and it also uses a Sabre dac. 

Their are many great dac chips from AKM, Sabre and Burr Brown including the 1796 and the 1792 chips what really matters is not the chip but how you impliment your design. R2R dac chips and the best multi bit chips are sounding more and more alike these days.

However, again, you are basing your love of the Aqua on just the chip the Aqua analog stage is superb.

This discussion is about Streamers both the PS audio and the Lumin are streamers the Aqua Hifi is not a streamer so you can't really bring up one in the same conversation also the new La Voice MK III is $4,750 add in a good server and you are in the $7k or so catagory so not a valid comparison unless you are talking one $7k package vs another.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ 

jackd:

The Aqua La Voce S2 uses PCM1704-K which is an R-2R ladder that also is used in the renowned Theta and some Wadia DACs. I much prefer this to any Saber-based DAC that I've heard. 

Yes Uberwaltz those are all valid points, in terms of value that is only determined by the listener.

We would recommend that the OP listen to a T2 and decide for himself. We are willing to believe he will find the T2 to match the PS and perhaps may even enjoy it more, only the OP will know for himself.

In our store we sell a lot of digital products, from Mytek, Ifi, Naim, Lumin, Innous, Baetis, NAD, Light Harmonic, T+A, Rega, Aqua Hifi,and a few others.

We agree with you on that Lumin will not work for everyone, that is why we don’t sell only Lumin. A person has to consider what their needs are.

If you think about it locking down the system is generally very effective at eliminating any noise entering the piece along with the digital signal, but it does limit you if you want to spin a CD as well as stream.

For many of our clients the world of Tidal and Qbouzz are eliminating the desire to play a CD, howerver, if you have a rare CD or an artist not available via streaming that could be an issue. You can also rip a CD to a computer on your network and play the disc that way, we know that isn’t for everybody.

We are big proponents of the Lumin products because they sound and work wonderfully well and are among the best sounding products in their price range.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ

Audiotroy
I understand completely.
However it is still a consideration to be made if one needs other than a USB input IMHO.
One can claim it is stripped down for audio purity agreed.
One could also claim the PS costs more because it offers more.

Just depends on your point of view.

Over and out.

If your looking for a DAC only the closest you make come to the DS at a lower price may be a used Aqua La Voce S2.  I own both and they are both in a similar vein.  My S2 is headed back to Italy for the S3 upgrade after the Munich show. 

Jburden,

You are free to make any claim you like. However saying that you don't like a particular dac chip is an erronous statement.

You are not listening to a dac chip, it is one part of the equation, you have an input board, power supplies, clocking technology andof course  the analog output stage, all of these contribute the sound that a dac
produces.

The Lumin T2 uses dual ESS 9028pro dac running in mono which means you have 8 cores per each chip running differential computations this lower noise dramatically and gives you better dynamic range, many companies use only a single dac chip, two sounds and measures better.

One issue that some people have is being forced to listen to DSD on the Direct Stream series, DSD in general has a softer sound than PCM and the Lumin can be set to output everything in DSD as well. 

You can also listen to upsampled PCM which generally has a more incisive sound with greater dynamic snap than DSD.

As per analog like their are fans of the Direct Stream and people who don't like it it is a good dac among many good dacs sometimes one person's analog like is another persons rolled off. YMMV.

Uberwaltz, the Lumin is designed to be a streaming dac, it has always been a 100% purposeful device. The engineers directly ommited digital inputs as they felt that it can introduce noise into the product. 

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Lumin dealers

The Auralic Vega G1 is $2k less and the Auralic Altair is less than a third the cost of the PS Audio. Both great digital products.

The Lumin T2 is based on the Saber ES9028PRO chip. I haven't heard one, but in general I don't care for Saber chips which sound digital to me. However, I know people who like them and YMMV. 

The sound of DirectStream Sr. is like analog as you know from your own audition. It can be had for USD $3k to $4k used, and as I said, there will be a glut of used units when the TSS is released this summer. Wish I could afford a TSS :(

Not a dealer.

Fair point, I must admit my mind was stuck on junior! Doh!

But the T2 only has network and USB input correct?
So if the OP needed any additional digital inputs he would SOL.

Just something to consider in the long run as far as flexibility goes.

Back to my vinyl corner now.

Uberwaltz the OP is talking about the direct stream digital not the Junior as there are no Juniors available which means the Direct Stream Digital with Bridge card is $6,995.00 is it not?

$6k or $7k is not $4.5k now is it?

Most of the $3k streamers will not compete with the more expensive gear, the Mytek Brooklyn Bridge Plus is very nice at $3k but it does not sound as good as the Lumin and PS units.

Also look at the statement from the OP where he says he wants to audition one which would probably mean the the T2 would be in his price range.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Lumin and Mytek dealers

Actually my take on the OP was that he was looking for a comparable experience but at a LOWER price point.

Read his first paragraph.

"I have borrowed a DirectStream DAC from my dealer very nice of him because he knows that I can't afford it"

So if the Lumin is comparable but similar price them it does not fit the OP.

I will try to see if I can audit the T2. I have promised that I will never buy a product with out trying it in my system first

Jes wasnt the Op looking for an alternative in a similar price point that is available?

As per sound quality a T2 is more than a match for the Direct Stream digital

PS Jr. has been discontinued.

As usual Audio Doctor promoting its products. In this case he ignores, deliberately, what the OP wants to hear: a comparison between the PS Audio Stream Dac and others Dacs. Poor selling technique.

Yes Fdpdk yes our point exactly.

We have been working with Lumin for years and we have never seen a product that is as loved once people get one in their systems.

Musical, great feature set, reasonable cost, many available price points. easy to use app, Roon and Mqa, and in most cases they are usually considered the best sounding products in their price points.

We sell a lot of digital products and the Lumin gear always stands out.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ Lumin dealers

Not really sure about the price point , but i would for sure look into Lumin streamers. They are a Hong Kong Based company that decided they wanted to go into HiFI , they have been serving and still do commercial TV broadcasters. so they do know a thing or 2 .
Their streamers are musical , engaging , and updated for free.

I hope that the new PS junior will be as god as the current senior

Denafrips received some bad reviews IIRC.

I suggest you wait until PS Audio releases the TSS DAC, at which time you should be able to find a reasonably priced used DirectStream Sr.

The price of the Denafrips Terminator are close to the PS in europe

The answer is the Denafrips Terminator DAC. Many reviews and even a few comparisons to the DS DAC out there.