How much gain is needed in a Phono Preamp for a 0.2 to 0.3mv low output moving coil?

How much gain for 0.2 mv MC ?  It depends on the gain in your line stage and your amplifier, but I would say 60 db is a good starting point....I wouldn't go any lower, unless your line stage has 15 db of gain or better itself.  If you use a buffer / unity gain line stage (First Watt B-1, etc.), then you need more like 75 db.  The Pass Phono (XP-15 and XP-25) stages can provide that much gain with very low noise.  

Most toob phono stages give 50-60 db, and the quietest ones either use a step-up transformer or JFET's on the input stage (like the Pass solid state designs).  55 db is enough for a normal 0.5-0.6 mv MC, but marginal for a lower output cartridge.

Dynavector or Ortofon MC. The best you can reasonably afford. You will be set for years. As I recall the LOMC versions of each are 0.30mV++++ for both.

Thanks again, I keep reading all the good words regarding the AT Art9. When I owned audio stores years ago we sold AT cartridges along with Grado, Denon, and Shure. The best one AT made was $150 and had a Shabata stylus. Compared to the others we sold and got in for demo the AT sounded the worst. I would prefer a LOMC most are around 0.3mv and 60 db of gain is max on most phono preamps and you have no room to upgrade to a cartridge with lower output. I emailed VPI and Marc sent me back a nice email about cartridges on the Prime. He said the Ortofon, AT, or Dyna are good matches for the TT. There are probably others but I only asked about the 4 mentioned.  Didn't have any experience with the Benz on the 3D arm. I wish the Manley had more ourput. One just popped up for $1500 for an older one. It might end up being the Herron only because it gives me more options.

I have the Chinook and upgraded the tubes to Phillips NOS. Just bought my second Soundsmith Cart -  the original Zephyr is on my VPI Scout 1.1 now (Zephyr is made for unipivot arm) and it sounds great. Have Primaluna pre and Dialogue Premium power amp, Martin Logan ESLs. Got the Zephyr MIMC Star MC at .4 output but have not mounted it yet. Hope it all works out. Not sure what output the PL pre and power amp provide. I did notice a little more gain when I replaced the Chinook stock Electro Harmonix tubes. I may be asking you some questions sbank. Juke4u let us know what you end up doing! Great thread.

I use a Dynavector XX2 MKII (.28 mv) with the ARC PH-7 (57.5 dB). My line pre is the ARC REF 3 (11.6 dB balanced) and the amp is an Ayre V5xe (26 dB). Noise and gain are not an issue. When the volume control gets past 50 (out of 104) my Vandersteen 3A Sigs (87dB) are at party. Normal levels for me are 25 -45. Even though the DV works well, no complaints, I can’t help but wonder if could work better with more gain. I would recommend carts from .4 to .6 mv. There are outstanding carts in that range.