I might add that if given more time with the Lore, you could have very well tweeked out a better sound from it also. |
05-07-11: Gpowered
Now, from your to the point review, it is obvious that the Lore gets the edge, but can you tell me, is the differences you are talking about extremely obvious, or subtle?"
In my small room with 'mellow' music, the differences were what I would call subtle. But even in my room when I started to rock out a bit the differences became more pronounced. In the larger room as we pushed the speakers harder I would call them obvious.
"Also, interesting there are these differences, since both speakers use the SAME Eminence driver! Zu modifies it by cutting out the whizzer cone and installing its proprietary phase plug. Were you aware of this???"
You mean the big silver thing hanging off the front? Yeah, I was aware LOL!
The fact that they use the same driver and they sound so different was a surprise to me. What do I know about speaker design? Not much because I didn't realize that the cabinet would make such a total difference.
The other thing I didn't hit on was the highs. One of the guys that was there has a music background (played in numerous bands) and commented on the highs a lot. He said that with the Lores he could tell how close to the bell the drummer was hitting the cymbal or high hat, and that he could hear differences in each strike. He said with the Omens it just sounded like a stick hitting a cymbal.
As I have them back in my room, back in familiar environment, I'm also hearing a lot more imaging. The Katz are probably the best speakers I've had in here for projecting a holographic image, and I'm getting some of that with the Lores. Keep in mind that I've only had the Lores for about a week and I have only started to fine tune positioning so I'm hopeful that that will come. It took me a few weeks to get the Katz dialed in (I got a job and a family you know). |
Hi,
Just want to make one observation regarding the Omens. BTW..thanks for the review on the Lores, they sound like great speakers!
First, when I had the regular Omens ( I now have Omen Defs)
I found that the height of the spikes made a difference in the sound of the speaker (mostly in the bass) in that if to low or to high, it could make the bass less solid, and a
tad ragged sounding, and it could sound a bit congested.
Once I got that right, no problems.
Also, I played with tilt, but also found that they sounded best "level". Not sure why, but
maybe something to do with the finger ports at the bottom
loading the speaker differently from front to back?? Again
not sure why, but that is what I heard. They are not a plop
& play speaker for sure and require a little experimentation
to get just right. I have solid tight & deep bass, but have
heard them "not at their best also".
Anyway, I have never heard the Lores so cannot compare but
may have a buddy who expressed interest in a pair of Lores
and if he gets them, I will check them out.
BTW...It would be nice to see Tekton come out with a version
similiar to the Omen Defs. The change from my reg Omens to the Defs was ....WOW!!!! |
Hi everyone, I'm one of Mike's (Sebrof) friends who joined in comparing the Zu Omens and the Tekton Lore speakers last night. I'd like to offer to you my impression of both speakers. I tried to not have any expectation bias affect my judgements, but I must say that I had heard the Omens and Mike's Katz Meow V1 a few weeks ago and I preferred the Katz in Mike's relatively small listening room. I told Mike then, that I thought the Omens were too boxy sounding to me. Regardless, I tried my best to be honest to myself with what I would be listening to last night.
First up were the Lores. I'm not going to comment on how they sounded with the first amp, but I was not impressed. Once we changed amps, the sound improved tremendously. Now, the Lores sounded great! They didn't have the deepest bass, but what bass they had was very musical. The midrange and treble were beautiful and the staging, both width and depth, were very good. I thought drums sounded very authentic and had the correct snap. The vocals were very good, with good air and texture, which gave a believability to the sound. What impressed me most about the speaker was the overall presentation was coherent, that is, one aspect didn't take away from the rest of the sound. I believe the designer made the correct trade off regarding bass extension with musicality for this speaker. In my opinion, this speaker is definitely worth the money asked for it and I believe that one would have to spend one or two multiples of the Lore's asking price to approach its performance.
Next, we listened to the Omens. The first thing I noticed was the the sound came from a darker place, like it was escaping. It didn't seem to be as open and airy as the Lores. But, it still seemed nice, with the first musical selection. As we listened to more and more music, it became apparent to me, that the bass sounded too "one-notey" or "thudy" (how do you like my technical terms?) Though the bass was deeper, it was not as musical as with the Lores. This same type of sound also appeared on a specific drum beat, that became annoying to me. In other words, it detracted from the overall coherency of the sound. To my ears, the designer of this speaker opted for maximum frequency range of the bass and bass wallop, instead of more musical, less deep bass, as in the Lore. I also believe the enclosure needs more stiffening, as it does have a somewhat boxey sound that it never quite escapes. The midrange and treble did not seem quite as revealing as with the Lores, but they were quite good. Imaging seemed good, also.
It may look I am being hyper critical of the Omens, but I'm just trying to be as honest as I can with my personal review of these speakers and to pinpoint the differences that I heard. Also, we set both speakers in the same position and this position may not have been optimal for the Zu. Also, the Zu is a bottom ported speaker and we did not play with the spikes to see what differences we may have heard. It is entirely possible that with much more time for placement and adjustment, the Zus may have sounded better to me. |
Sebrof: this is excellent! Thank you so much for your time and effort and comparison here. You have put my curiosity to rest now, finally!
Now, from your to the point review, it is obvious that the Lore gets the edge, but can you tell me, is the differences you are talking about extremely obvious, or subtle?
Also, interesting there are these differences, since both speakers use the SAME Eminence driver! Zu modifies it by cutting out the whizzer cone and installing its proprietary phase plug. Were you aware of this??? I find it interesting that you said the Omen filled the room a little more, but quality is not on par with the Lore. Sounds to me like Zu made a decision to compromise quality for more SPL. Someone I know that understands this stuff better than I do, warned me that this practice could cause issues elsewhere.
If this is true and from your review it seems it is this is some discovery. |
I have an update on the Omen vs. Lore thing.
If you guys go back over my posts in this thread youll read that last year I received a pair of Tekton Katz Meow V1. My first full rangers and I loved them, still do. In December I received a pair of Zu Omens. Love them too. I could easily live with either pair. I received* a pair of Lores about a week ago and after breaking them in I compared them to my Omens.
In my small room (12 x 13) with my 2A3 SET, I played a variety of music on both speakers. There was plenty of bass from both (not unusual in my small room), but the bass from the Lores sounded tighter and a little more tuneful. It was easier to follow bass lines in songs, the notes were more distinct. Also on the Omens, at times it seemed as if the bass was wandering into the midrange and interfered with the clarity of vocals in particular. The Omens sounded very full, but not quite as clear as the Lores. When I played complex music loud, the Lores held together and gave a real solid presentation, they were fun to listen to. They seemed to be an easier load for my amp.
Last night I brought the Omens and the Lores to a friends house (oh, my back!) that has a bigger room at about 18 x 14 or so. We first hooked the Lores up to his tube preamp and Carver amp (400+ watts into 8 ohms or something ridiculous). It was not a good match, so after a couple of songs we decided to swap in a 100 watt EL34 beast. Much much better. We played a bunch of music and took mental notes. We swapped the Omens in and played the same music. A lot of my notes from my small room applied here as well. The difference in bass was more noticeable in the larger room, with the Omens able to fill the space a little better. But as in my room, the bass on the Lores was tighter and also more musical. Also, I suspect because we were playing louder to fill the larger room, the differences in cabinets became more apparent. Vocals on the Omens were not as smooth as the Lores. For example Norah Jones sounded silky smooth on the Lores, but not on the Omens.
All in all I am very impressed with the Lores. I tried to give each speaker a fair shake and put them in different systems, rooms, and playing different music. Myself and my 2 audio friends all had pretty much the same impressions. We all liked both speakers but there were a few things the Lores did that we liked a little better.
*In the interest of full disclosure - Eric heard that I had Katz and Omens and that I liked them both, and asked me if he could send me a pair of Lores because he was curious to get my impressions of both speakers. He said that after I broke them in and compared, I would send them back or if I wanted I could buy them at market value (this pair is B Stock due to a small blemish on the top of one speaker). |
More pics will be back on tektons site shortley |
Anyone else wanna send me some pics of their systems with the lores? :) |
$250 extra for a gloss - he said it adds quite a but of labor. Again, same paint, just adds multiple coats of the gloss. |
How much extra is the gloss? |
I'm pretty sure one of the videos shows him making one of the cabinets with walnut finish... |
You can get the black, red, white and blue in satin as a standard no charge option. Same paint as in the gloss finish pictures but without the gloss coating. You can also pick any color you want and just send Eric the color palette, and he can mix it. I believe he charges and extra $50 to mix though. Not that bad.
You can email me if you want to see pics of the white satin. |
Lots of pics of the black around.
Someone posted pics of the white satin on audiocircle dot com
There was a bunch of pics on the Tekton site until yesterday when they changed the website |
Does anyone have any pictures of the satin options? I really wish he had more pictures of the lores in the different color options. |
No problem here either. Too bad about the price going back to $1000. I called Eric not too long ago to see how long the $850 price would be happening and he told me it would be at that price for a good bit longer. Looks like he changed his mind on that. Too bad I didn't pull the trigger then. Was waiting to see more pics of the veneer options... |
I got on early this morning and noticed the new layout. Nice.
Also noticed the new price of the Lore.
I just got on with my phone no problem |
I noticed that I can't enter the website either. It says the DNS is not responding. |
I am not having any trouble accessing the new Tekton website. Man those Katz 3's look nice!! A true 94db speaker that is supposed to compete with some of the more expensive offerings at B&W. Interesting... |
Hi. I need your help kind of. I can't seem to get onto tektondesign.com my internet service provider says they can't either. Also it does not seem to work on my phone.
At my work I can see the site just fine. I called tekton and they seem to be able to see it also. So I was just wondering if anyone else had had any issues! It could be my isp is goofing up.
Also if you can get onto the site I went down and shot some extra video at tekton and made a new intro video. |
Yeah, my standard Omens are not perfect, but almost the opposite of bright. |
MT,
Sounds like it as mine are on the warmer side of
neutral to neutral. Toe in/out changes that dramatically.
And/or electronics. |
Could be a setup issue. I found them I bit bright too. |
Omens congested suggest they were probably not set up right.
The only time I had them sounding congested was when there were no spikes under them, and when they were on spikes but set to low. They are bottom ported and very sensitive to
floor distance. When right, they are very electrostatic like
and not boxy or congested sounding at all. Just saying! :o) |
Interesting enough, gpowered having Kirksaeters. I use the 220s (92db) with my little Sophia Electric Baby (10 watts) in a 35 x 17 room to loud conversation levels. Yesterday, I took my amp to a dealer friend to listen to Zu Omens and Cain Abbeys. I really liked the Abbeys, although bass shy. The Omens were just far too congested sounding. I'll stick with my Kirks. I got mine as demos for about $1000.00. I play vinyl 75 percent of he time, tuner 20 percent and cd 5 percent approximately. |
OK Gpowered I guees I should have added a :) after my attempt at a joke . Let me state now THAT GPOWERED AND ERIC ARE NOT THE SAME PERSON . My apologies to Eric if I caused any harm to his reputation.
Getting back to Gpowered . I post on here to get info , not to be lectured at. I am sorry if I did not drink the same koolaid as you , I just find , the LORES a bit brighter then I thought they be . Not that they are not a good speaker , they are , just , like any other speaker ,,, not perfect .The brightnes may well be my electronics , but how can you state that , when by your own admission you are not familiar with my amps/preamps???So spare me the the lack of experince comment . I did talk to Eric before I bought the speakers , told him what I have and he said they would be no problem.I am not griping about the speakers , as you have commented. Just stating MY opinion ,as you have stated yours. I will say this for the last time , so Gpowered listen,,, I like the LORES , like there finish , are they perfect ,,no but NO speaker is . I listen to the speaker ,, not to there finish Gpowered so that does not affect my expectations of the speaker, as you have previously noted.
OK so with this post , it will be my last on this subject ,,thanks, its been great. |
Hey Sebrof,
I started with the Omen, then got a pair of Omen Defs, and it was "WOW". The Omens on steroids without sacrificing
anything. Just more of everything. Then traded them with
about 300 hours for a pair in Ghost black, and now have about
80 hours or so, and they are coming around just like the first pair! I love speakers, and kind of hate the idea of not playing with any more, but these are so amazing I don't want any other speakers. I will only move up the Zu line if my ship ever comes in. |
Individual taste and expectations have a lot to do with perception. I love the Lore, but I also respect others opinions on them also.
If I had bought the Omen instead of the Lore, Chances are I'd be writing great things about Zu.
The fact that we can have such great speakers at prices that almost anyone can afford is thrilling to me.
Have fun in the hobby.
John |
04-22-11: Gpowered
"Sebrof... I am fine with diverse views - that's what makes the hobby so much fun. I enjoy seeing it through the eyes of others. The issue was the comment about me being Eric, and all of the other negative comments here and there that have no substance. Wondering if he even owns a pair of Lores..."
Fair enough. I think he was joking about you being Eric but who knows.
I see 99 guys raving about the Lores, there's got to be a few guys who say different. Life is never that cut and dry. |
"04-15-11: Cwazz
I have a Counterpoint with a Hafler preamp . I have to admit I think the pre amp is on the bright side."
I didn't see this post from earlier, so my bad on that. It sounds like your expectations are a little different, perhaps because of spending the money on the finish? But after reading this, i think your electronics may be part of your problem. I am not sure about these electronics. You may want to try a more refined preamp like a Conrad Johnson, but i think you would really fare well with a pair of Quicksilver mini's also - i am using them and not lacking bass at all.
Or if you just want to do a preamp fo with the Vincent preamp. I heard Vincent electronics at Axpona this past weekend and they were one of the best rooms for the money.
Lastly, move the speakers around in your room and if bass is still not cutting it, then add the new inexpensive REL T5 sub to the system. That ought to do it. |
Sebrof... I am fine with diverse views - that's what makes the hobby so much fun. I enjoy seeing it through the eyes of others. The issue was the comment about me being Eric, and all of the other negative comments here and there that have no substance. Wondering if he even owns a pair of Lores... |
I meant an Epik Phoenix sub!! That's what I had not a Legend lol. |
Cwazz said he likes the Lores but he doesn't find them to be the holy grail...What's the issue? He is relaying his experience with them, which is what he should be doing. Better than commenting on something he's never heard, which happens all the time on these forums.
The Lores seem to be real good speakers. But don't get bent out of shape every time someone says they aren't the best speaker ever in the world ever. Different people have different tastes, rooms, music preferences, etc. etc. Jeez. |
Jarrett,
Your placement sounds great to start. You may want to experiement with toe in. I have mine in toed in a bit. Also, loosen the front spikes and get the speaker tilting back a bit - zman told me about this tweak for single driver speakers and it makes the bass sound even more natural. It is good that you have them off the back wall! If you sit a little but close to them, you should get an amazingly deep sound stage. Also, allow 150 hour for break in! Enjoy! |
Hahaha. Nice one guys. That would be dishonest, and as a follower of Christ, it would not be feasible nor righteous for me to go about deceiving people like that.
Let's see: I live in Bradenton, FL. Eric is from Utah. I am a Financial Analyst for Cox in Saint Pete. Eric is speaker builder in Utah. I am a Cost Accountant from FL - hardly affiliated.
Cwazz - please don't take this as disrespect, but since you are the only one so far on this thread that has griped about the Lores, and now this funny accusation, I feel compelled to point out that your posts have been inconsistent in nature and contradictory to what most of us are reporting. I am afraid this screams that it is likely you and your setup, and not the speaker. Did you know that up to 60% of the sound you hear is room especially when turned up!! I have 8, 69x24 sound panels setup strategically in my room, and believe me, it is night and day with and without! It seems like you either have a room issue or electronics issue or both. Also, it could be that you just dont prefer the way the Lores present the music? That would be ok also. The Lore is a very natural sound with a tremendously deep and layered soundstage if set up correct. They are not loudest, or the most bass, or the warmest, or most colored. Some people just prefer a more colored presentation. The Lores are very revealing of a lesser front end remember this is a 98db sens. speaker so it is naturally going to reveal what is upstream. Cwazz if your Lores are setup right, then a guitar pluck should sound that guitar is in the room! A big box brand speaker will likely not do that.
You say you mainly use a 100 watt ss amp, and also 35 watt tubes. Not all amps are created equal, and if your source is lacking, you are really going to hearing a lesser refined sound. You may have a bad match on the front end. You have also been told about damping factor and have been given many suggestions on this thread. Still, your comments are still negative.
If it is big bass over quality bass that you desire, then you bought the wrong speaker. If the highs sound bright to you, then look at your source, or an easy fix would be to damp the room a bit or try different cables. I am willing to bet, it is your placement in the room and electronics. Try setting up some bass traps in the corners and see if it improves. I had an 18 Epik Legend sub once in a different home and room, and bass was weak due to nulls and suck out at certain frequencies in the room.
Please stop misleading people with one or two sentence adverse comments do nothing but scream that you lack experience and quite frankly, that would be perfectly ok but then take some suggestions and lets move on.
The Joy of the Lord to all of you! |
I also just got a pair of Lore's. They sound very good right out of the box. My temporary apartment is a truly horrible space and can't be acoustically treated right now.
What kind of positioning are the rest of you using? I have them equilateral sitting position, about 8 feet apart, 4 feet from back wall and pointed straight ahead (no toe). |
Telescope - That's really saying something 'cause as a fellow Texan I've noticed your many speaker sales.
I feel the same way about my standard Omens as you about the Defs and these other guys about their Tektons. I believe there's a lot to be said for the simplicity these speakers allow. |
I am to extremely happy with my Lore. Just added a cayin tube integrated amp and the sound is amazing. I found myself listening to my vinyl collection a lot more then cd or even sacd thanks to the lore and the way it make analogue sound magical |
Maybe just on the payroll. |
ok , I am now convinced that Gpowered is really Eric!!! |
Ya know, I have to chime in here and say, I to am happy as a clam with my Zu Omen Defs. I am on the same page as Gpowered
with his Lores!
I have heard many systems, and even though I am a speaker
W----, I cannot see myself buying another speaker (Unless it's a bigger & better Zu). In fact, I am on my second pair
of Omen Defs, breaking in with about 70 hours on them now.
Amazed every day! That's something that wore off after a week with most every other speaker I have ever owned! |
Exactly sebrof!! And when I shared this w/ some people there, they just looked at me like I had 3 heads i.e., 'surely a $3K system can't stand up to this' ... lol.
Too bad it took me 15 systems to figure this out. But hey, wisdom comes at a cost sometimes... especially for those of us that choose to learn the hard way :o( |
04-21-11: Gpowered
"I am happy to report that my Lore/Quicksilver combo presents the music much more realistic and even better then many $30-40K systems I heard!!"
I have no trouble believing this.
Amazing how a well thought out system puts a wrench into the law of diminishing return.
Enjoy! |
Just got back from Axpona in ATL, and while I heard some really good systems... it was a '180' from what I experienced last year when I came home realizing my VSA Jr Mk II / Parasound combo was just not cutting it.
I am happy to report that my Lore/Quicksilver combo presents the music much more realistic and even better then many $30-40K systems I heard!! Those systems had more spl and deep bass, but there is no way they could match the level of realism of instruments, soundstage depth, and beautiful articulation that my system has.
I bought nothing!! I long for nothing!!! This is a huge win for me! |
It has been almost a month now since i picked up my Lore from Eric in Orem Utah. I would love to call myself "Audiophile" but i guess i still have a lot to learn and maybe so many systems to listen to before i can call myself Audiophile.At this point i really don't see the need to listen to many systems in fact after listening to the Lore in my system i would rather be an audio lover then audiophile. Several audiogoner said it early in this forum Do not waist time and any more money and go do yourself a favor and order the LORE..What you will get with the Lore is an absolutely amazing soundstage, fullness awith tons of clarity, details and lovely focus. I used Eminent Technology a while ago and yes you get the sense of more air flowing around the notes but you will not get all the other benefits that the Lore can deliver. So many talk about comparing the Lore to other speakers Well i am glad i didn't have to compare speakers to each others and made a great decision by buying the Lore.. |
Actually for improved bass response, if you are considering the FirstWatt amps, I'd go for the F1, F1J, F2 or F2J. These are current source amps, which do not work with most speakers with crossovers, but I believe will work with the type of crossover the Lore employs (check with Lore & FirstWatt to confirm this!). But an advantage of current source amps is the greater extension in the low frequencies, in addition to the ability to customize this bass response by adding resistors at your speaker inputs.
(Must resist temptation to mention damping factor....Just see my above posts on it, since I have found that this can drastically affect the speaker's bass response). |
Cwazz: I would call Eric and speak with him, but it would be worth a try if you want to stay SS, to try a First Watt F3 or F5 or a clone of them. They have great tone, great bass, and are just fun to listen to, but If you really want to go to the kick a** level, then try the Pass XA 30.5. Huge soundstage, great bass, great tone, and a perfect match for high efficient speakers. They pair very well with my Zu Omens and I can't imagine they would be too different for you.
Would you mind shooting me a photo of the Bubinga finish? I was considering a pair to compare to my Zu's and that is the finish I was
considering. What was the added cost for that finish?
As for the pre, you might want to get a tubed pre to bring in a little warmth and also you can roll in different tubes to suit your taste. Having been in a bright system for way too long myself, that really helped me. |
I have a Counterpoint with a Hafler preamp . I have to admit I think the pre amp is on the bright side. I just want to clarify ,, I do not think these are bad speakers , they are 850 dollar speaker , I have the bubinga finish wich really makes them so much more expensive. Eric did a great job with them . My issue is ,and I even used a 35 watt tube amp , that in my taste the bass is ,,soso, not that there is not any , just not what I thought is advertised or claimed by Eric . If I really thought they were bad , they would have been sent back by now . I have about 100 hrs of time on them so I am still hoping they improve . Any suggestions for a "less brighter" preamp,amp would be appreciated . Thanks. |
Jedinite24,
I am thinking of moving fro Audio Nirvana 12" to the Lores. Do let us know how the two compare if/when you have a chance to compare them. |
Outlaw 1070 integrated-
http://www.outlawaudio.com/products/1070.html
I've been very happy with it |
CWazz: What was the 100 watt SS amp that you were trying to use with the Tekton Lores? I'm just curious becuase I have a re-built Hafler DH-220 that I was thinking of using with Tekton speakers. I tried using the DH-220 with an Audio Nirvana 12" FR but in a JE Labs open baffle set-up. I didn't have bass issues but I had imaging issues. Everything seemed low but I don't know if it was due to my preamp at the time or the nature of the OB set-up.
311mph: Glad to hear you got the Lores. Can't wait for the follow-up review after you break them in. I'm interested in your thoughts as the audio equipment I plan to use with Tekton speakers isn't the most expensive.
Sebrof: From a previous post I saw that 311mph was going to use a Outlaw Audio 1070 receiver to power them at first. |
