What's up with Innuos?

Innuos Sense app is a mess. All sorts of issues, and often times unusable (the dreaded spinning wheel). I quit using it with my new ZENith MK3. Strictly Roon now. If I would change any settings I go to the browser (my.innuos.com). 

Yup, my experience has been the same as @thyname. 
Sense 2.0 is finicky. Even if it were stable, the usability aspects of Roon are still far superior. Also, I might be in the minority here, but I kinda prefer the SQ from Roon. It’s more full bodied and has slightly more bass. 

@arafiq 

 I might be in the minority here, but I kinda prefer the SQ from Roon

Maybe minority, but certainly not alone

@thyname Just curious, what's your take on it? Which one do you prefer?

@arafiq : Roon. I posted my first impressions on another thread.

@thyname Thanks, I probably missed it but will read it today.

I moved on from the Innuos and went with a Esoteric N-05 and haven’t regretted it. The Innuos application stinks and I like the other responders used mine strictly with Roon.  

But @cfarrow you need to have the server (Roon Core) somewhere, right? I am familiar with Esoteric. I have the N-01XD

Yes I have a Roon core…

Just to provide a contrasting opinion, I like the sound quality and operation of Innuos Sense in my system. I have not experienced any major bugs in 2.0.8, so I have not attempted to report any to Innuos.

My experience may be different than users who are used to Roon. I have never been a Roon subscriber and have no plans to become one in the future. For those currently experiencing bugs, I hope you get things worked out soon. 

Very surprised by some of the comments on here.  For me with a Zenith Mk3 the SQ with Sense is significantly better versus Roon even in experimental mode.  The minor bugs since the initial release of Sense (to be expected with a new software) continue to be progressively worked out and I couldn’t be happier.  Support from Innuos has also been great.  Call me confused!

For whole house stereo to Riva Wand Airplay speakers on my first and second floors, I put Roon core on an Apple mini.  For casual listening that works fine.

I prefer Sense SQ over Roon by a wide margin.  I get a wider sound stage, a more full bodied sound, and I think it sounds more natural.  Detail and instrument separation is about the same.

The Sense app is flawed in many ways. The Qobuz integration works fairly well; Tidal not so much. I plan to stick with Sense a while longer, hoping Innuos will improve it as they’ve promised.  

The. 2.08 update has been 100% problem free for me. Still find the sound quality on par with Roon at worst. I actually use Sense for critical listening as the sound quality is often better than Roon.  

I am in agreement with the latter half of this thread. Once i made the change to Sense and listened, there is no going back to Roon. I don't know enough to understand why the SQ is better, but it is noticeably so. I am also a Qobuz user and have had very few problems with Sense, except that it is a lot clunkier than Roon.

I set Roon up on my original PC and use that for the rest of the house streaming and browsing.

I have had no issues with using the Innuos Sense app.I have been using it pretty much full time. I actually have found the Sense to have better SQ than Roon. I find that Sense is more full bodied and more bass. I have never had any issues with contacting Innuos and receiving a response from them.

Yup, got rid of mine and bought a Bryston. Rock solid software. (Much less hardware) even if the manic mouse is less than stellar looking it seems to be bulletproof.

I love the app, honestly there are a few minor issues but nothing that’s deal breaking. I find the sound quality excellent. I’m just bothered that I can no longer submit bugs which I always do just to let them know for future updates. And secondarily now that I’m trying to email customer support with my bugs that I’m experiencing utilizing the most recent version of Sense I’m getting a failure notice. It’s just kind of unnerving to think that once before I was having some type of back and forth customer support, but now I’m not able to submit bugs, nor am I able to email them.

Appreciate everyone's feedback on the matter.

Based on feedback on this thread, I thought I'd give Sense another chance. I updated Zenith to the latest 2.0.8 release. It seems to be more stable now. I listened for a few hours yesterday and the app (iPad) did not stop responding even once. So that's definitely good news.

I'm not sure if it's due to improvements in the latest release, or perhaps my unit has more hours on it, but I'm going to agree with others that it does sound better than Roon at this point. Key differences I noticed: blacker background, more balanced sound, tighter bass, and an overall more refined sound. I listened to about 10 songs and went back and forth between Sense and Roon for each song. These differences were obvious on pretty much any song I listened to. Once I got used to Sense's sound signature, Roon does sound a bit less refined -- it has more bloom (not in a good way), the bass is looser (comparatively speaking), and vocals are more forward sounding (which might not be a problem for some).

Having said that, the user interface -- specifically the additional info on artists, albums, recommendations, etc. is still far, far superior to Sense. Also, Roon Radio is a killer feature that I hope Innuos is working on for their next release.

I appreciate the thoughtful comments on this thread.

You nailed it! Correct on all points based on my experience. Yes, 2.08 has solved near all the issues. Wish they had a radio or DJ feature also!

 

I find myself using Roon for most background listening, to find new music, and when I want to learn more about a certain artists and like artists. When I critically listen to a whole CD, then I use Sense  

 

@grannyring & @arafiq ​​​​good points and agree!

Found the opening of this thread extraordinary. If the majority of users are content then any issues are down to individual set up. I’ve had Sense from day 1 and also done a little beta testing. 2.0.8 is the first stable iteration. A few factual observations:

- it finally solves the connectivity issues which arose when you minimised the app. I’m not a fan of the splash screen reappearing each time you bring it back from minimised but others don’t seem bothered and I’m already used to it.

- absolutely no issues reporting bugs or feature requests. Known issues if you use a VPN; haven’t configured your firewall properly pr are using some older iOS and Android devices. 

- I’m not sure why there is comment about Tidal integration. It is currently inferior to the full Qobuz integration but Innuos were upfront from the off that full Tidal integration was planned but was a way away. A recent comment from the engineers at Naim detailed just how complex and frustrating achieving that integration is. 
 

- If Roon sounds better then any iteration of 2 then you have a system issue. I make no claim on golden ears or such things but it’s obvious to say the least. Ives friend with little limit on their ability to spend and tweak their system. They’ve a lifetime membership of Roon and have tweaked all manner of things in an attempt to get it to once more sound better. It’s yet to happen. 

Well fortunately the bug reporting issue has resolved, but still having the "updating library" spinning wheel after uploading USB files. Have to reset my unit in order to clear it.

At least Innuos knows about it now 😉

Side note pulled the trigger on a Phoenix... Excited to test it out and put a bow on my system for the holidays and thereafter.

Which Phoenix did you order? The NET or the USB?

USB

I have had issues using the the Sense app. My system can't seem to locate it on some days. However, I discovered that you can nearly always access it via the browser interface. Looks exactly the same. No issues regarding usability thus far.

 

Hmmm, none of those issues here (thankfully). Innuos seemed to iron out some of the PITA functional issues early on and server connectivity has been much better since 2.0.6. I'd sent them feedback on at least one occasion and they responded directly in a couple of days and subsequently made the fix so I am generally happy with their responsiveness. I only updated to 2.0.8  ten or so days ago but haven't seen many changes from 2.0.7. Right now I am very satisfied with the SQ and functionality is more than acceptable....from here every incremental improvement they make is icing on the cake IMO and keeps adding to their value proposition but my perspective is narrow. The only other integrated streaming app I am familiar with is Bluesound and that was a few years back but I believe Sense has surpassed that even now. In terms of comparing to Roon, well, Sense is clearly not there and I am not sure they will ever be, but it is almost like comparing apples to oranges from the point of view that Roon's first product released more than 10 years ago and Sense was released less than 10 months ago. Sense is free and Roon is a sperate subscription based product that can require extra HW. I'm elated that Innuos has prioritized Sense as part of their product and appear to be pushing both SQ and the UX experience forward. I feel like they've made a lot of progress in a short time and hope the train keeps rolling. 

+1 @chilehed

Sense works very well on my ZEN and the SQ was better than Roon when I fired up Sense in July 2021 (don't know if there's a new version of Roon that sounds better). Roon functionality was awesome, but it costs money and I can get a lot of what Roon does via an internet browser (album/artist info, etc.).

@sebrof 

I like Roon very much and it sounded great in my rig until I started messing with DSP. I do miss the review info and credits/liner notes Roon provides. Most of all I miss the machine learning they implement to play similar music when your selection ends which others have also mentioned. I'd be interested to know if Roon owns the album/artist information or if they subscribe or pay a royalty to access it? If it is payed for it's unlikely Sense will ever reach that level of sophistication and remain free unless they figure out a way to push ads or market Sense as a payed for service. In any case it will be interesting to see where this goes; it's good to know Roon is there as an alternative.

Running 2.0.8 for a while with no issues.  There was an earlier version that was glitchy but it was updated pretty quickly and all has been well since.

 

Sounds night and day better than Roon to me.