Got mine a few weeks ago. Installed it with a high-output Benz Ace H cartridge. Loved the sound but there was a hum when I turned the preamp volume past the 10 o'clock position. Later changed to a Clearaudio Concerto, the hum was quieter, but wouldn't go away no matter what I tried.
Then I read the manual closely, and it said something about using shielded interconnects. So I tried a pair of Rega Couple wires, which are made from Klotz cable, and are shielded.
And you know what, the hum just vanished! Now I'm at peace ...
Just to share with those have hum issues with the Classic. Do share your solutions.
Vinyl ..lover, both the DV and Zepher are shielded and I haven't noticed hum from either carty. I would circle back to your dealer. He should know what to do. But if you get stuck, try a Dynavector or SS VPI Zephyr.
I emailed Mike from VPI and he responded back saying that the problem should be resolved by proper grounding and using shielded interconnects. I have a ground wire running from the table to phono stage and using JPS Labs ultraconductor interconnects that the dealer confirmed they are very well shielded. Thanks for reply
After several tests that Mike asked me to do with VPI, he diagnosed the problem. Either the cartridge is picking up electro-magnetic field from the motor or some mechanical vibrations. I've shipped the VPI base unit to him for repair.
I am also getting a hum from my VPI Classic 1. When I touched the Interconnect at the junction box on the TT I get the hum, and also touching the interconnect at the phono stage I get the hum. I ground the TT to the phono stage and also to the preamp and I still get the hum no matter what combination of ground I use. My interconnect is from Audio Art Cables, and I confirmed with him that the interconnect is shielded. I also tried several different interconnect and I still get the hum. In taking it a bit further, I tried two other phono stages in the system and I still get the hum when playing a record or not playing a record. As a last resort I wrapped a piece of aluminum foil aroung the interconnect and the ground terminal on the TT junction box and the hum was reduced significantly. I have to turn up the preamp about 70% to hear the hum. I do not think this is the best way to solve this issue, so I am still up the creek. I will give VPI a call. Anyone tried the VIP phono cable yet or any other phono cable?
Vinyl..lover, how did you make out with the TT. VPI finish yet? You must be frustrated as heck.
As I said above, I use the SS VPI Zephyr (MI) and DV 20X2 H (MC). Both are well shielded and both sound well, although I think the Zephyr is better. Macdadtexas and I drive the same front-end and share similar views about the Zephyr's performance. I am very pleased now because I stopped fussing with the carty set up, resonance and hum issues.
I hope Mike can pin-point the issue for you AND resolve it. Let's face it, from the tip of the stylus up to the input of your phono stage. how much is there to "drey" over. Ask Mike what "drey" means.
I am using the balanced (XLR) connection out of my VPI junction box. I can turn the preamp's volume control to its limit without hum or noise. The background is totally black
Wayne.., how well does yhour Ortofon 2M Black mate with the Classic 1's 10.5i SE arm? I tried it several months ago and had problems. Still not sure if my problems related to compatibility, or the carty's output voltage, or even a defective carty.
I found the 2M to be very bright and analytical to the point of listening fatigue. In addition, the output distorted (hissed and crackled) when the sylus tracked record grooves with high-dynamic music. I have since switched over to the DV 20X2H and the SS VPI Zephyr and am quite satisfied.
I've got a reply from Mike they are going to replace my table with the brand new one. Mike pointed out in his response that "the motor had a eccentricity in the shaft causing it to vibrate more than it should. Probably happened in shipping the first time, very rare when the rotor cracks!!!" Hopefully, I'll get it next week. My original one was in black. I asked Mike to replace it with the walnut one which was not available at the time of my initial purchase. He approved it. So I am in a waiting mode... Keep you posted.
Exactly the issue I have. That being said, I have not had much time to work on this. But a bunch of research finds that this cart., needs the arm down 2 degrees headshell to pivot point. I had gotten this from a few people, and then also checked with VPI, as I know they tested all the 2M cartridges. Mike tells me that the 2M Black is an excellent match, as they have run them, but also said the arms needs to be dropped down about 2 degrees down towards the pivot point. Digging further, 2 degrees lower at the pivot is quite a bit, when you realize how much it takes to lower the arm 2 degrees. So I need to work on this a bit.
Mike should know better. If not Mike, then Harry. It's Yiddish and mean obsessing about something to the point the victim gets a head-ache or very aggravated. The full expression is "don't drey my kupf." Don't give me a headache.
Wayne..., sorry I'm a little confused. In setting up VTA for the 2M, does this 2 degree adjustment mean the back side of the carty should be raised a little via the VTA mechanism. If VTA is raised that way, then the back end of the carty will ride just a little higher than the front end. So, if one could actually measure the position of the tone arm, it would not be horizontal. Instead, the tone arm would ride at a slight angle -- 2 degrees as measured from the stylus tip.
Thanks for reminding this phrase. As being Jewish I should have known it. I am originally from Russia so know this expression in Russian but did not know its English variation.
VPI sent me a brand new Classic 1 table and it was humming exactly same way as my own. The cartridge picked up the motor noise. VPI exchanged Classic for Aries 3. It arrived last week. NO HUM at all with Aries 3 and the table is just amazing.
I have the cursed hum, and I just ordered a DV-10X5 from the NeedleDoc to see if this will rectify the problem. If it doesn't then I'm going to try a SoundSmith cartridge.
I own a classic 1 and am using a soundsmith boheme. I have no hum at all and it sounds great on the classic. People also report having good success with the soundsmith zephyr as it was designed for JMW arms.
Macster, I own a VPI Classic 1 (w/Classic 3 wand upgrade). My "primary" carty is a Sound Smith Zephyr. No hum and not even using a ground wire from the TT to the phono pre. My back-up is a Dynavector 20X2 (H). No hum with that carty either.
I've also used a Clearaudio Maestro and Ortofon 2M Black. Those carties didn't work out for me because of compatibility issues, which may have been my fault. But no hum with either of these carties.
Check Macdadtexas comments above. I tend to agree with him. I think it's the motor and the fix is using a well shielded carty like a Sound Smith or DV. I don't know if Clearaudio or Ortofon carties are well shielded, but as stated, no hum problem for me.
I have read elsewhere that Grados are susceptible to hum, but VPI mounts them as options. Maybe the VPI Grados are special order??? Dunno.
Thanks for the info, I have been following this thread for a long time. I tried to see if I could do a low "cost fix" myself. So far I have spent $500.00 which was my budget for "self fixes." Since I need one of the cartridges that you mentioned (my dealer carries both) I am going to buy it from him and let him do the install. Most likely I will go with the Soundsmith, because it will probably last longer with the way I handle cartridges.
Macster, in light of your problems, I think letting your dealer install a new cartridge is a good idea. But before taking it out of his premises, I would ask him to plug it into a system to check it out for hum. Also, I would bring your VPI alignment jig and a digital weight meter to check for yourself that the carty is set up correctly. It should take all of 5 minutes to check alignment and weight. If there's a problem, I would insist the dealer resolve it on the spot. I offer these suggestions because the da*n tables weighs a ton. Why schlepp it around if you can avoid it??
The dealer who BTW is a great guy, immediately started working on the table as soon as I brought it in, he and I did all of the listening through headphones and after trying various things and talking to the guys at VPI, Bruce narrowed it down to the interconnects. Bamm 98% resolved, I won't say 100% until I've lived with it for awhile. He replaced my interconnects with a pair of AQ King Cobra's and now things are very good. Again, I'm going to live this for a bit and try various records before I buy off on this. The hum "appears" to be gone and it is definitely not as pronounced as it was. To be clear, I'm not hearing it. I'm cranking the volume up to 12'clock and nothing.
The downside: I've spent almost $500.00 on cartridges that could have been spent somewhere else. As a matter of fact I'm breaking in the 10X5 right now along with the new ICs.
Thanks to everyone for their help re" Bifwynne and Sbrownw" and also especially Bruce at Stereo Unlimited here in San Diego for patiently working through with me. Next upgrade will be the Zephyr or the AQ Columbias.
If you ran your tonearm/cartridge in balanced mode, you would be able to turn up your volume control to the max and not hear hum. (if indeed you have a grounding grounding issue) As I read trough the above posts, I still think that Bearpaws would eliminate lost of the feedback you are getting (putting the cartridge (just above the record without noise) and touching the record (noise). There seems to be some subsonics coming through the supporting structure, the turntable, the arm that from which you are hearing the harmonics. Also, VPI sells a small weight that can be attached to the head of the arm to change the mass...but I wouldn't readily go there before trying the Bearpaws.
I have a CJ PV5 which doesn't have a balance mode. The last time that I turned my volume up to check for hum and noise, I blew out one of the drivers in my Vandersteens. It cost me $950.00 for that experience. As a result I would be hesitant to recommend that anyone do that. The hum only happened when the stylus touched the record and the motor was running. Now nothing is happening, :-).
I've had my Classic I with the Valhalla wiring, and a Lyra Delos for over two years now, and after three or four different interconnects across my system, three different speaker cables, two different phono preamps, a line preamp and power amp upgrade, I have not experienced any hum so many posters here complain of. I run tube line preamp and monoblocks so I do have what I'd describe as "hiss" when I turn the volume up to about a 90 dB level, but it has no effect on the sound; record imperfections are way more obvious than any hiss during quiet passages. So I'm puzzled by this mysterious hum problem and why the turntable would need any fixing or looking at. It's most likely poorly shielded cartridges than might be picking up some interference. I'm not sure how VPI or a VPI dealer can possibly fix the problem.
Btw, Macster, I also bought my Classic and the rest of my system from Stereo Unlimited in San Diego. If you want to get in touch, feel free to email me at actusreus13@hotmail.com.
I never a problem until I had the bright idea to detoix my Goldring GL2500. The result was a nightmare and I ended up klutzing the stylus.After that I made some interconnect changes and from there I got on the cartridge merry go round to try to solve the problem. Now I'm going back to square one.
Actusreus
IMHO that hiss is a normal tube by product, but I'd talk to Bruce about it. Thanks for the contact info.
Another thing peter lederman at soundsmith told me was that the wire coming out of the tonearm of the classic that plugs into the junction box is un-shielded wire. This wire can pickup interference. I took a single strand of copper wire about the size of a human hair, then spiral wrapped it around the tonearm wire. I left a long piece near the base that I connected to the ground lug on the turntable. I then wrapped both wires in PTFE tape. This did eliminate a small hum issue I had. Those of you with the valhalla wiring, I think valhalla is shielded already so this would be no help to you.
One way or the other, I'm going to resolve this today. I'm taking the table back with my preamp and cassette deck and going through the trouble shooting process with my bud. What I've found is that if I disconnect the belt from the motor (let it wrap it's self around the platter). Then place a record on the table with the arm down touching the record and after that select source monitor on my Nak and plug in a set of head phones to the deck I can clearly hear the motor noise (hum) when I turn the motor on and off. This same hum is what I hear on the tapes that I'm making and now it's really bothering me. So I'm going to take Bifwynne's and Macdadtexas advice and get a Soundsmith Zypher or Dyna 20X2H.
The motor and I know that it's a "duh." But I will elaborate more after my parts are in. I would "highly" recommend that anyone who has this problem to work with VPI and the dealer to resolve it. Once my table is finished, we'll be certain of the "fix" as I have my Goldring GL2500 in it and it was humming with the motor turned on, with the arm down on the record. When you turn the motor off the hum stopped.
Again, the whole approach on this is to find the problem and fix it. If you think about it installing a shielded cartridge does not solve the problem. If you want you can email me @ blkmacster@nosapam.cox.net, of course remove the nosapam.
96% of the hum is gone. No hum at all just listening to records through the phono section. I still get some (albeit at a very low tolerable level through my headphone jack) Cost $140.00 for a new motor. I'm still in the process of listening to a variety of records and checking things out.
Vibration, which is picked by the stylus and transmitted through the phono section. If you remove the motor from its mount the hum (resonance) goes away. My motor vibrated a lot compared to the other motors that we checked. We had gotten it to the point that you couldn't hear the resonance through the phone stage, however when we connected my tape deck and monitored the source it was very audible. It was also very audible on the tapes that I made. I'm thinking that a stethoscope would be very useful in trouble shooting this. A shield cartridge may mask the resonance problem. If nothing else it cost very little to check the motor vibration out before springing for a cartridge.
Get out -- motor vibration. Wow. Now that's a first for VPI. The underlying premise of the Classic is that the machine is built like a tank and weighs like one too. The permitted inference is that the motor on your Classic must have been defective. If so, that would be disappointing because I would expect better QC from VPI.
If my inference is off base please advise because I would very muck like to be wrong.
Can anyone here explain why the Classic motor, when you turn it by hand you can feel cogging, just like a stepped attenuator. I have never noticed this before on any other tt motor.
Last suggestion: if you want to go the Sound Smith or DV 20X route, maybe the dealer will lend the carty to you, or at least install it for you in his shop. Then check the TT for hum. Btw, is using a tape deck to check for hum really a valid way to assess the problem? For all you know, the tape deck may have a hum problem.
Look . . . fortunately, the Classic TT is not an old fashioned Swiss watch with gears, cogs and a main-spring. There simply aren't that many parts that can be defective. It's either the motor or the carty -- period. If you still have a hum in your system, it has to be somewhere or something else -- 60 Hz inductance from a power line, I/Cs, or other electronic gear.
As I said, try the Zephyr at your dealer's shop. If there's a little hum, ask yourself if it's OCD? Otherwise, plug the Classic in, turn up the juice and enjoy. Here's another suggestion. Pick up Linda Rondstat's "Living in the USA" record. The first track is the Check Berry standard, "Back in the USA." Turn the volume up -- a lot --listen to the track and look at the album cover pic of Linda wearing her roller skating shorty-shorts. She was in her prime back in the 70s -- one big time adorable cutie-pie. Aaahh, youth is wasted on the young. Sigh.
IMHO, the hum is a mechanical hum, and is the result of the motor vibrations being transferred through the plinth. If you take the motor out. You can turn it on and off all day with no hum whatsoever. This was verified by using the tape monitor and listening through a set of headphones and was the reason for going with the 300 RPM motor (less vibration). Keep in mind that Im still getting hum when listening through the phono-stage in my system. Actually using the source monitor on the tape deck is great for this in that it allows you to amplify whatever is coming through the cartridge. There are things that are going on that are covered up by the music. By using the tape monitor with belt disconnected from the platter, and the arm down on the platter you can heard the noise (mechanical hum) from the motor when it's turned on and off quite clearly. Normally on this table, what happens is that when everything is connected the cartridge acts like a microphone and the mechanical hum is picked up along with the music from the LP. I may not be explaining this quite right, but I never had this problem with my LP12. There was never any hum at all on the tapes made on my Naks or Revox machines. All of the tapes made on those machines are dead quiet. Also, I have a Project table here and no hum. Also, there is a possibility that you guys may still have the hum, but are not noticing it because you arent recording. Still, I'm open. I think that in my case, we may have to go with an outboard motor configuration of some kind or change the table to an Aries which has an outboard motor assembly. But right now I'm not in the mood to be spending a lot of money on this. Where I'm at now. I have the Classic 300 RPM motor with the new pulley with a set of Audioquest King Cobra cables and a Dyna 10X5. The hum is lower (tolerable) but still aggravating. I talked to Peter of Soundsmith about the shielding on his cartridges and he said that all of his cartridges are six sided shielded and were shielded in the same fashion. So the shielding is the same on a Zephyr as a Carmen. So I ordered a Carmen. I will contact my dealer later in the week to let him know how the 300 RPM motor is working out and to inform him that I still have my problem. Im not as frustrated as I was earlier because there are people who have real problems (food, clothing, shelter) and here I am blessed to be dealing with turntable hum. It got me back on track, Im just going to see this through. However, I dont feel that this is my problem if you get my drift.
Final thought: if you haven't advised VPI about this yet, please do. If indeed, there is a mechanical hum from the motor, it sounds like the motor needs to be redesigned. The Classic is supposed to be dead quiet, so this is quite unfortunate. But again, maybe my ears or rig just isn't as discriminating as your set up. I'm used to the usual hiss sound from the stylus tracking in the grooves, so maybe I'm just ignoring what you hear. Please let us know what Mike and Harry at VPI say.
I'm working with my dealer on this. I know that we'll get it figured out. It may just my setup, I use my Classic to record cassette tapes. My setup CJ PV5, MF2500A Vandy 3A sigs, Nak CR7A, Dragon, Revox B-215, not the greatest but it allows me to enjoy the music. If you get a chance, record something and listen to the play back.
I received my new styled Carmen on Wednesday and installed it. It's a great looking cartridge and sounds wonderful. Now to the point, the hum is still there. If you weren't aware of it before, you probably wouldn't notice until you listen to a recording made from table via a set of headphones. Well that's not good enough for me, so the table will be upgraded to an Aries 3 next year. Don't get me wrong, this thing simply rocks with the Soundsmith Carmen. I have the arm set to level, VTF @1.394gm, and am using the 3gm VPI headshell weight. It has it all, separation, depth, explosiveness and just flat out enjoyable. I'm staying with the Soundsmith line and will move up incrementally. This cartridge is seriously good for the price.
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